Does entering into Jesus' rest mean we're to give up the Sabbath day? Is the 4th commandment part of the moral law of God?
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Hi, I'm studying to shew myself approved unto God and I'm not certain as to whether the rest that still "remaineth therefore...to the people of God" (Heb. 4:9)--written to the Hebrews who were keeping the Sabbath day--was meant to say that they would have "another" rest as in "in addition" ("For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterwards have spoken of another day" - Heb. 4:8) or "another" as in "a different."
...Like if someone gave you one apple and then said, "I'm going to give you 'another' apple, and then they handed you a second apple ("another" apple), or if someone handed you one apple and then said, "I'm going to give you 'another' apple," and then took the original apple they gave you and then give you a different apple instead ("another apple"). Thanks
...Like if someone gave you one apple and then said, "I'm going to give you 'another' apple, and then they handed you a second apple ("another" apple), or if someone handed you one apple and then said, "I'm going to give you 'another' apple," and then took the original apple they gave you and then give you a different apple instead ("another apple"). Thanks
Hi, I'm studying to shew myself approved unto God and I'm not certain as to whether the rest that still "remaineth therefore...to the people of God" (Heb. 4:9)--written to the Hebrews who were keeping the Sabbath day--was meant to say that they would have "another" rest as in "in addition" ("For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterwards have spoken of another day" - Heb. 4:8) or "another" as in "a different."
...Like if someone gave you one apple and then said, "I'm going to give you 'another' apple, and then they handed you a second apple ("another" apple), or if someone handed you one apple and then said, "I'm going to give you 'another' apple," and then took the original apple they gave you and then give you a different apple instead ("another apple"). Thanks
...Like if someone gave you one apple and then said, "I'm going to give you 'another' apple, and then they handed you a second apple ("another" apple), or if someone handed you one apple and then said, "I'm going to give you 'another' apple," and then took the original apple they gave you and then give you a different apple instead ("another apple"). Thanks
Hebrews 4
1Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
for we which have believed do enter into the rest.
To me It mean as soon as we believe in Jesus, we are in rest every day. Rest from work for ourself, now what ever we do is for the Lord. When we work as a police we focus It for helping other, as carpenter, we do It to helping other, now we rest for Being self center, into Jesus center.
To me Verse 2 is question for sabbath keeper.
Why you keep sabbath, is gospel not give you rest?
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Fair enough - the rest that is spoken of in Hebrews which you partially quoted in your opening post has nothing to do with the 4th commandment in the decalogue.
Heb 4:8 For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not have spoken afterward about another day.
Heb 4:9 Consequently a Sabbath rest remains for the people of God.
Heb 4:10 For the one who enters God's rest has also rested from his works, just as God did from his own works.
In the above the writer is stating that although Joshua brought the Israelites into the promised land they did not receive rest (which was a shadow of the rest in Christ).
So when the full context is considered this portion of scripture can't be used to establish sabbath keeping for Christians.
Heb 4:9 really should read "Consequently a Sabbath remains for the people of God."
Heb 4:8 For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not have spoken afterward about another day.
Heb 4:9 Consequently a Sabbath rest remains for the people of God.
Heb 4:10 For the one who enters God's rest has also rested from his works, just as God did from his own works.
In the above the writer is stating that although Joshua brought the Israelites into the promised land they did not receive rest (which was a shadow of the rest in Christ).
So when the full context is considered this portion of scripture can't be used to establish sabbath keeping for Christians.
Heb 4:9 really should read "Consequently a Sabbath remains for the people of God."
Seriously?
does anyone think these things through in the SDA movement? A person lives for God their entire lives, turning from sin, progressing in sanctification, praising the Lord, having faith in His blood, fully persuaded in the faith like Abraham, dies, gets in front of Jesus and Jesus says "Sorry son, you picked the wrong day" and casts them to the lake of fire?
That is absolutely absurd
does anyone think these things through in the SDA movement? A person lives for God their entire lives, turning from sin, progressing in sanctification, praising the Lord, having faith in His blood, fully persuaded in the faith like Abraham, dies, gets in front of Jesus and Jesus says "Sorry son, you picked the wrong day" and casts them to the lake of fire?
That is absolutely absurd
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Yup im aware of this.
I've investigated into SDA beliefs quite a bit. Have you noticed that cults like SDAs and JWs always have something in common.... failed prophecies?
The SDAs prophecied that Jesus would return like two centuries ago, well He didnt, so they had to cover up and come up with that ridicilous "investigative judgment" of a coming nonsense.
There are smart deceptions out there, hard to discern, but there are some that are just so clear(like scientology, clear scam) that you just wonder HOW and WHY are people being deceived into this stuff?
I've investigated into SDA beliefs quite a bit. Have you noticed that cults like SDAs and JWs always have something in common.... failed prophecies?
The SDAs prophecied that Jesus would return like two centuries ago, well He didnt, so they had to cover up and come up with that ridicilous "investigative judgment" of a coming nonsense.
There are smart deceptions out there, hard to discern, but there are some that are just so clear(like scientology, clear scam) that you just wonder HOW and WHY are people being deceived into this stuff?
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Reading Hebrews...the rest God refers to. Six days he worked, the seventh he rested.
If you think about works vs grace. The hebrews had to work to enter that rest i.e follow all the laws so they could relax on the sabbath. But those without faith just kept right on working. They couldnt relax and were paranoid about doing all the works of the law. They couldnt enjoy the day God gave them to rest.
See 4 verse 10
I've decided not to answer anymore adventist threads. Its exhausting trying to explain to people, my advice is read Hebrews and Galatians carefully and ask God to show you what He means.
If you think about works vs grace. The hebrews had to work to enter that rest i.e follow all the laws so they could relax on the sabbath. But those without faith just kept right on working. They couldnt relax and were paranoid about doing all the works of the law. They couldnt enjoy the day God gave them to rest.
See 4 verse 10
I've decided not to answer anymore adventist threads. Its exhausting trying to explain to people, my advice is read Hebrews and Galatians carefully and ask God to show you what He means.
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I heard years back a story from a Pastor of a large congregation about marriage counseling. He stated that for years he was open to helping couples through their marital issues till he reached a point of frustration and quit doing so. He said that he gave them his best scriptural advice and they constantly ignored it.
I’ve found that people with bad theology hate to admit they’ve invested so much time in a lie, that they would rather argue than humbly submit they were wrong.
I’ve found that people with bad theology hate to admit they’ve invested so much time in a lie, that they would rather argue than humbly submit they were wrong.
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I totally disagree with you.. Millions of people have the works salvation mindset where they believe doing the Law plays a central role in them attaining eternal life with Jesus...
The number of people who actually place 100% of their faith in the Atonement of the LORD Jesus Christ for their eternal salvation is very small indeed..
The number of people who actually place 100% of their faith in the Atonement of the LORD Jesus Christ for their eternal salvation is very small indeed..
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I said -- I still need the blood of Christ today because there is a law condemning me of sin today.
Your twisting what i said...
The law is condemning me today but because i have the blood of Christ it has no power to hold me guilty. By the blood of Christ i am free from the condemnation of the law. But does that mean i can sin or transgress the law as much as i want by grace.
If you are a sinner you have transgressed the law.
If you are in Christ you are not condemned because His blood sets you free.
What i was saying is that i still need the blood of Jesus today to set me free, i still need Jesus today because sin is still a problem today.
The sin problem is present today because the law is present today.
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Your twisting what i said...
The law is condemning me today but because i have the blood of Christ it has no power to hold me guilty. By the blood of Christ i am free from the condemnation of the law. But does that mean i can sin or transgress the law as much as i want by grace.
If you are a sinner you have transgressed the law.
If you are in Christ you are not condemned because His blood sets you free.
What i was saying is that i still need the blood of Jesus today to set me free, i still need Jesus today because sin is still a problem today.
The sin problem is present today because the law is present today.
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
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I dont think the context in Heb is about grace vs works. It is showing us the pattern (type and anti-type) scripture has in God's design. The sabbath represents God's rest, not ours. (NOT that I believe we are under the law of Moses, it has been completed)
God's rest on the 7th day was/is a shadow of the reign of Christ when all authority is given to Him as he said:
Mat 28:18 And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me."
This is why Jesus is "Lord of the Sabbath," because it was created to foreshadow Him. The same sense the lamb sacrificed under the law was to testify of what was coming
Mat 12:8 For the Son of Man is lord of the Sabbath.”
We see in Hebrews their still remains a sabbath rest unto the people of God, this was shadowed by the promise land and those who entered. This has not happened yet from what I can see, but will when the shadow becomes the true image.
God's rest on the 7th day was/is a shadow of the reign of Christ when all authority is given to Him as he said:
Mat 28:18 And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me."
This is why Jesus is "Lord of the Sabbath," because it was created to foreshadow Him. The same sense the lamb sacrificed under the law was to testify of what was coming
Mat 12:8 For the Son of Man is lord of the Sabbath.”
We see in Hebrews their still remains a sabbath rest unto the people of God, this was shadowed by the promise land and those who entered. This has not happened yet from what I can see, but will when the shadow becomes the true image.
Sabbath keeping was a sign of the old covenant:
Exo 31:16 'Six days is work done, and in the seventh day is a sabbath of holy rest to Jehovah; any who doeth work in the sabbath-day is certainly put to death
Exo 31:16 and the sons of Israel have observed the sabbath; to keep the sabbath to their generations is a covenant age-during,
Exo 31:17 between Me and the sons of Israel it is a sign -- to the age; for six days Jehovah made the heavens and the earth, and in the seventh day He hath ceased, and is refreshed.'
Exo 31:16 'Six days is work done, and in the seventh day is a sabbath of holy rest to Jehovah; any who doeth work in the sabbath-day is certainly put to death
Exo 31:16 and the sons of Israel have observed the sabbath; to keep the sabbath to their generations is a covenant age-during,
Exo 31:17 between Me and the sons of Israel it is a sign -- to the age; for six days Jehovah made the heavens and the earth, and in the seventh day He hath ceased, and is refreshed.'
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