Two posters say their opinion is from God, yet disagree. Now what?

[Locutus]

I feel singled out.

 

[OneFaith]

What should readers conclude when two posters claim they got their position from God, yet they disagree?
1) One of the posters is right and the other is wrong? Which one?
2) Both of the posters are right? How can that be?
3) Both of the posters are wrong? Entirely possible.

I tend to go with number three.
But not having to do with what was said, but the fact that they said it.
If one claims to speak for God they are declaring themselves to be a prophet.
You better be 100 percent sure of what you are saying if you go there.

They can only say it's from God if it is scripture.

 

[Demi777]

I feel singled out.

Huggles

 

[dcontroversal]

The word heretick comes from 2 Greek words and means opinionated one.......the word of God is absolute in what it teaches.....when we fade into the opinion area we are bordering on being a heretick........HONESTY with context, verbiage, definitions, historicity and verb tense leads to solid conclusions based upon absolute truth instead of opinion......just saying and we are all guilty at times........

 

[lightbearer]

The word heretick comes from 2 Greek words and means opinionated one.......the word of God is absolute in what it teaches.....when we fade into the opinion area we are bordering on being a heretick........HONESTY with context, verbiage, definitions, historicity and verb tense leads to solid conclusions based upon absolute truth instead of opinion......just saying and we are all guilty at times........

Where did you come up with that?

From Thayer
αἱρετικός
aihretikos
Thayer Definition:
1) fitted or able to take or choose a thing
2) schismatic, factious, a follower of a false doctrine
3) heretic
Part of Speech: adjective
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from the same as G140
Citing in TDNT: 1:184, 27
Total KJV Occurrences: 1
heretic, 1
Tit 3:10

From LSJ

αἱρετ-ικός , ή , όν , ( αἱρέω ) able to choose , Pl. Def. 412a ; due to choice , οἰκείωσις Hierocl. p.41.5A. , Anon. in Tht. 7.40.
2. factious, Ep.Tit. 3.10.
3. Astrol., belonging to the 'condition' , Paul.Al. Q. 2.
4. Adv. -κῶς from choice , D.L. 7.126 , Hierocl. p.41.7 A.

From BDAG

αἱρετικός, ή, όν (in Ps.-Pla., Definit. 412a; Aelian, NA 6, 59; Hierocles Stoic. [I/II A.D.] Eth. 9, 5; here 7 and Diog. L. 7, 126 also the adv.; subst. pl. οἱ αἱ. Iren. 5, 13, 2 [Harv. II 356, 8] al.) pert. to causing divisions, factious, division-making. ἄνθρωπος αἱ. division-maker Tit 3:10 (s. αἵρεσις 1b, c).—TW.

From Vines

<1,,141,hairetikos>
akin to the above, primarily denotes "capable of choosing" (haireomai); hence, "causing division by a party spirit, factious," Tit 3:10, RV, "heretical."

 

[Sketch]

They can only say it's from God if it is scripture.

Don't you believe that God speaks to us today?

 

[7seasrekeyed]

I feel singled out.

better than being ignored

I know you are made of sterner stuff

 

[7seasrekeyed]

This is a tricky subject, and the reason I launched this topic.
On one hand I believe that the Holy Sprit guides us into truth, and that God speaks to people.
On the other hand we are not supposed to use those things as weapons against each other.

here here

major problem with the 'God told me to tell you crowd'

a very manipulative tool

 

[dcontroversal]

Where did you come up with that?

From Thayer
αἱρετικός
aihretikos
Thayer Definition:
1) fitted or able to take or choose a thing
2) schismatic, factious, a follower of a false doctrine
3) heretic
Part of Speech: adjective
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from the same as G140
Citing in TDNT: 1:184, 27
Total KJV Occurrences: 1
heretic, 1
Tit 3:10

From LSJ

αἱρετ-ικός , ή , όν , ( αἱρέω ) able to choose , Pl. Def. 412a ; due to choice , οἰκείωσις Hierocl. p.41.5A. , Anon. in Tht. 7.40.
2. factious, Ep.Tit. 3.10.
3. Astrol., belonging to the 'condition' , Paul.Al. Q. 2.
4. Adv. -κῶς from choice , D.L. 7.126 , Hierocl. p.41.7 A.

From BDAG

αἱρετικός, ή, όν (in Ps.-Pla., Definit. 412a; Aelian, NA 6, 59; Hierocles Stoic. [I/II A.D.] Eth. 9, 5; here 7 and Diog. L. 7, 126 also the adv.; subst. pl. οἱ αἱ. Iren. 5, 13, 2 [Harv. II 356, 8] al.) pert. to causing divisions, factious, division-making. ἄνθρωπος αἱ. division-maker Tit 3:10 (s. αἵρεσις 1b, c).—TW.

From Vines

<1,,141,hairetikos>
akin to the above, primarily denotes "capable of choosing" (haireomai); hence, "causing division by a party spirit, factious," Tit 3:10, RV, "heretical."

hairetikós (an adjective, derived from 138 /hairéomai, "to choose, have a distinctive opinion") – a factiousperson, specializing in half-truths and misimpressions "to win others over" to their personal opinion (misguided zeal) – while creating harmful divisions (used only in Tit 3:10).

 

[calledoutones777]

What should readers conclude when two posters claim they got their position from God, yet they disagree?
1) One of the posters is right and the other is wrong? Which one?
2) Both of the posters are right? How can that be?
3) Both of the posters are wrong? Entirely possible.

I tend to go with number three.
But not having to do with what was said, but the fact that they said it.
If one claims to speak for God they are declaring themselves to be a prophet.
You better be 100 percent sure of what you are saying if you go there.

A Prophetic word unto your statement. I will never speak outside of what is written, and I will alway bring scripture, for I have come not to change My FATHER'S WORD, but to FULFILL THEM, saith YAHOSHUA, who is the Christ meaning the ANOINTED ONE, unto the GENTILE NATIONS/NATIONALITIES of the WORLD, called MANKIND, and unto the JEWS, that did not RECEIVE ME, when I CAME unto them, I AM, MESSIAH, have you not READ? Fulfilling the FATHER Scripturesa.. John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

I said not to trust MAN, because I AM SENDING YOU A WOMAN, who KNOWS, HER HUSBANDS NAME, Do you, I ASK? Saith YAHOSHUA, who is Christ unto YOU, who are of the GENTILE NATIONS of the WORLD, called MANKIND, and unto the JEWS, I AM, MESSIAH. This is why I said to try the SPIRIT by the SPIRIT to see who you are following.. For I come within My FATHER'S WORD, NOT AGAINST THEM, fulfilling the FATHER Scriptuers.. 1 John 4:1-5 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of the FATHER: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. Hereby know ye the Spirit of the FATHER: Every spirit that confesseth that YAHOSHUA Christ is come in the flesh is of the FATHER: And every spirit that confesseth not that YAHOSHUA Christ is come in the flesh is not of the FATHER: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.Ye are of the FATHER, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

For this WHOLE WORLD have been TERRIBLY DECEIVED, into WORSHIPING a "GOD through a son, who is NOT ME, saith YAHOSHUA..



Shalom

Shalom

 

[lightbearer]

hairetikós (an adjective, derived from 138 /hairéomai, "to choose, have a distinctive opinion") – a factious person, specializing in half-truths and misimpressions "to win others over" to their personal opinion (misguided zeal) – while creating harmful divisions (used only in Tit 3:10).

You said, "The word heretick comes from 2 Greek words and means opinionated one."
As you can see your post says the word in question comes from two Greek words and means opinionated one. Your post with the citation does not substantiate either one of your claims. The section you highlighted in bold is the authors commentary on what He think about the word. "To choose" is the definition dcontroversal not opinionated one.

As Thayer cited in his first citation, "fitted or able to take or choose a thing" And LSJ confirmed, "able to choose".
Obviously it has a negative cogitation by it's use in Titus. Hence Thayer and LSJ continuing in there second citations, schismatic, factious, a follower of a false doctrine; factious, respectively.

Where is that citation from any way dcontroversal?

 

[lightbearer]

here here

major problem with the 'God told me to tell you crowd'

a very manipulative tool

For one to make that proclamation, Tis rather bold statement. If they are Prophets; in today's age they do not and will not have an easy go at it.

 

[tourist]

What should readers conclude when two posters claim they got their position from God, yet they disagree?
1) One of the posters is right and the other is wrong? Which one?
2) Both of the posters are right? How can that be?
3) Both of the posters are wrong? Entirely possible.

I tend to go with number three.
But not having to do with what was said, but the fact that they said it.
If one claims to speak for God they are declaring themselves to be a prophet.
You better be 100 percent sure of what you are saying if you go there.

You can only speak for God if God specifically tells you to do so and even then God will tell you exactly what to say, when to say it and to who you will say it too. I would not believe anyone that claims to speak for God. I agree with your answer.

 

[dcontroversal]

You said, "The word heretick comes from 2 Greek words and means opinionated one."
As you can see your post says the word in question comes from two Greek words and means opinionated one. Your post with the citation does not substantiate either one of your claims. The section you highlighted in bold is the authors commentary on what He think about the word. "To choose" is the definition dcontroversal not opinionated one.

As Thayer cited in his first citation, "fitted or able to take or choose a thing" And LSJ confirmed, "able to choose".
Obviously it has a negative cogitation by it's use in Titus. Hence Thayer and LSJ continuing in there second citations, schismatic, factious, a follower of a false doctrine; factious, respectively.

Where is that citation from any way dcontroversal?

Sure it does....study further..... schismatic and opinionated.....exactly what it means....

 

[blueluna5]

That's fine. But I am talking about two people claiming God directed insight that is 180 degrees opposite.

Well if it's contradicting the Bible then no. Otherwise there's a lot happening and it's very hard to box God in and understand all of his ways. I honestly don't understand 90% of the time.

I will say though that I've experienced God when near death. That I continue to experience God. I've heard bits of stories from other Christians and in think it's a lot more common then we're led to believe.

Where I once might say no way God did that. Now I would be more open to the possibility. Plus I figure if I have experience with it, there are probably many others too.

So I guess I would ask if it's contradictory to God's word and what is the fruit of the person (though he tends to work more with the heart). You'll still see signs.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

For one to make that proclamation, Tis rather bold statement. If they are Prophets; in today's age they do not and will not have an easy go at it.

mheh

if they actually are, they will not have to run around advertising it and too many think a prophet means OT prophet but it does not

in my experience, those who use those terms, are manipulative and not prophets

I certainly believe God can have a 'word' for someone...like the prophet who came to Paul...but this is a very divisive subject...as you prob know

 

[Zmouth]

Two posters say their opinion is from God, yet disagree. Now what?

Determine whether the issue being discussed requires a subjective or objective response.

What should readers conclude when two posters claim they got their position from God, yet they disagree?
1) One of the posters is right and the other is wrong? Which one?
2) Both of the posters are right? How can that be?
3) Both of the posters are wrong? Entirely possible.

If their opinion is regarding a matter which is subjective, then they could have two different opinions without either one being wrong.
However, if their opinion is regarding a matter which is objective, then the correct answer would have objective evidence to prove it is the correct answer.

 

[Sketch]

mheh

if they actually are, they will not have to run around advertising it and too many think a prophet means OT prophet but it does not

in my experience, those who use those terms, are manipulative and not prophets

I certainly believe God can have a 'word' for someone...like the prophet who came to Paul...but this is a very divisive subject...as you prob know

The church seems to readily accept the testimony of someone that says God spoke to them about something.
Or that God brought a miraculous healing when someone prayed for them. But at the same time deny that the miracle gifts are in operation today. Cognitive dissonance.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

The church seems to readily accept the testimony of someone that says God spoke to them about something.
Or that God brought a miraculous healing when someone prayed for them. But at the same time deny that the miracle gifts are in operation today. Cognitive dissonance.

I see your point haha

but the pendulum swings both ways...well, I think I mentioned that already

 

[lightbearer]

Sure it does....study further..... schismatic and opinionated.....exactly what it means....

You originally said, "The word heretick comes from 2 Greek words and means opinionated one." It does not come from two Greek words dcontroversal it comes from one (Strong #138 αἱρέω). And it does not mean opinionated. Please Look at the LSJ below. Plato used the root of the word (Strong's#138) in the sense of "able to choose". It is a choice not opinionated.
Due to the context in Titus 3:10 this choice can have negative cogitation causing division; hence the second entry factious; schismatic, a division maker; however not opinionated.

From the LSJ
αἱρετ-ικός , ή , όν , ( αἱρέω ) able to choose , Pl. Def. 412a ; due to choice , οἰκείωσις Hierocl. p.41.5A. , Anon. in Tht. 7.40.
2. factious, Ep.Tit. 3.10.
3. Astrol., belonging to the 'condition' , Paul.Al. Q. 2.
4. Adv. -κῶς from choice , D.L. 7.126 , Hierocl. p.41.7 A.

Apparently this factious nature of the word as used in Titus is all that Bauer deemed worthy of noting.
From the BDAG
αἱρετικός, ή, όν (in Ps.-Pla., Definit. 412a; Aelian, NA 6, 59; Hierocles Stoic. [I/II A.D.] Eth. 9, 5; here 7 and Diog. L. 7, 126 also the adv.; subst. pl. οἱ αἱ. Iren. 5, 13, 2 [Harv. II 356, 8] al.) pert. to causing divisions, factious, division-making. ἄνθρωπος αἱ. division-maker Tit 3:10 (s. αἵρεσις 1b, c).—TW.

Mounce concurs in his work.
G141
αἱρετικός hairetikos 1x
one who creates or fosters factions, Tit_3:10

As does Thayer in his unabridged work
G141
αἱρετικός, (ή, (see αἱρέω);
1. fitted or able to take or choose a thing; rare in secular authors.

2. schismatic, factious, a follower of false doctrine: Tit_3:10.


Incidentally HELPS Word-studies is not lexicon used in any seminary or College that I know of. And it does not say the word means opinionated, it says it means A factious person. nor does it cite that the words comes from two Greek words.

Cognate: 141 hairetikós (an adjective, derived from 138 /hairéomai, "to choose, have a distinctive opinion") – a factious person, specializing in half-truths and misimpressions "to win others over" to their personal opinion(misguided zeal) – while creating harmful divisions (used only in Tit 3:10).See 139 (hairesis).