[for me anyway) I agree this teaching misleads many into a false sense of security: it is an invention of binding together bits and pieces of scripture to enable their conclusion, while giving no heed to the actual Truth of the matter; for when any scripture comes along that is contrary to their conviction they dismiss it as pertaining to someone other than themselves.
Do you believe in this?
- Thread starter JackMack
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If a saved person blasphemes the Holy Spirit and has no forgiveness in this world, nor in the world to come, that person is no longer saved!! In fact, if it were forgivable, there would be no way to turn from the Lord in eternity. But by having an unforgiveable sin present, it allows us to choose the Lord. So that by not blaspheming the Holy Spirit when we're in the world to come; we'll be choosing the Lord for all of eternity.
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I hate to hear you say that sister. I enjoyed reading your testimony earlier, though you suffered much, God is glorified.
I do hold to the assurance of salvation, or OSAS. I believe the devil has as much reason to fight against us once we are saved as he did trying to destroy us before we got saved.
We try and do what is right because we are children of God. In His service here.
Quantrill
I do hold to the assurance of salvation, or OSAS. I believe the devil has as much reason to fight against us once we are saved as he did trying to destroy us before we got saved.
We try and do what is right because we are children of God. In His service here.
Quantrill
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But if we were osas then giving us doubt and trying toto make us leave God wouldnt make any sense.
I dont believe it is easy to loose salvation. But it is nowhere impossible.
Looking where Jesus told people he doesnt know them, eventhough they even did miracles in his name is a good example of how cautious we have to be. They said Lord Lord so they believed they were his. Yet they werent
I dont believe it is easy to loose salvation. But it is nowhere impossible.
Looking where Jesus told people he doesnt know them, eventhough they even did miracles in his name is a good example of how cautious we have to be. They said Lord Lord so they believed they were his. Yet they werent
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I don't think satan really cares how much sense it would make. I am sure satan knows the Scripture. he knows he has no chance against God. he knows how it will end. Yet he carries on his destructive ways trying to hinder God's plans, and destroy His people every chance he gets.
So, once one is saved, satan would want to hinder them in their salvation experience. he would want to make them doubt their salvation. he would want to make them doubt and fear to the point where they become immobile in their use to God.
Concerning (Matt. 7:22), remember that these were never the children of God. They were never saved. So it is not a picture of a loss of salvation. It is a description of some who were never saved. We who are Christian, have done the will of the Father which is believing on Jesus Christ. (7:21) (John 6:40)
I believe that God has so created this work of salvation on our behalf, that it is not just right that we are in heaven with Him, but that it would be wrong if we were not. Through His work of imputation and making faith the key, I believe our salvation is secure for ever.
Quantrill
So, once one is saved, satan would want to hinder them in their salvation experience. he would want to make them doubt their salvation. he would want to make them doubt and fear to the point where they become immobile in their use to God.
Concerning (Matt. 7:22), remember that these were never the children of God. They were never saved. So it is not a picture of a loss of salvation. It is a description of some who were never saved. We who are Christian, have done the will of the Father which is believing on Jesus Christ. (7:21) (John 6:40)
I believe that God has so created this work of salvation on our behalf, that it is not just right that we are in heaven with Him, but that it would be wrong if we were not. Through His work of imputation and making faith the key, I believe our salvation is secure for ever.
Quantrill
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the same can be said of believers with a false sense of insecurity, ignoring every passage that says He is faithful to keep you, that He can be trusted not to lose you.
perhaps a central issue is whether we are looking ourselves or whether we are looking at Him when we ask, 'am i really saved?'
some people present a gospel focused on the individual, whether a person meets some standard of living after an initial 'amnesty' declaration for past crimes. some people present a gospel focused on Christ, whether He is faithful to redeem and keep a person, despite their weakness and failures.
people who do not believe in a sure hope largely argue that it allows a person to live a completely wicked life even after coming to faith, and ignores or discards the need for repentance. people who do believe in a sure hope largely argue that if it is otherwise then salvation depends on human works, not grace, and makes Christ's work either ineffective or inconsequential.
to really answer this, i need to know, what is salvation, really?
is redemption my responsibility or God's?
what exactly is it that we must put our faith in?
perhaps a central issue is whether we are looking ourselves or whether we are looking at Him when we ask, 'am i really saved?'
some people present a gospel focused on the individual, whether a person meets some standard of living after an initial 'amnesty' declaration for past crimes. some people present a gospel focused on Christ, whether He is faithful to redeem and keep a person, despite their weakness and failures.
people who do not believe in a sure hope largely argue that it allows a person to live a completely wicked life even after coming to faith, and ignores or discards the need for repentance. people who do believe in a sure hope largely argue that if it is otherwise then salvation depends on human works, not grace, and makes Christ's work either ineffective or inconsequential.
to really answer this, i need to know, what is salvation, really?
is redemption my responsibility or God's?
what exactly is it that we must put our faith in?
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This half is correct, yes, with the caveat "accept for Judas," which was Biblical fulfillment.
Unless one can find a passage prophesying that they specifically will be lost I wouldn't be worried about losing salvation. Perhaps people should be way more concerned if they are converted in the first place, not if they'll lose salvation. I'd dare say there are too many in Christendom that think they are saved...
Unless one can find a passage prophesying that they specifically will be lost I wouldn't be worried about losing salvation. Perhaps people should be way more concerned if they are converted in the first place, not if they'll lose salvation. I'd dare say there are too many in Christendom that think they are saved...
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Because if we do not do this, the light which is supposed to shine through us and draw others to Christ is hindered. Our salt becomes tastless, and our walk becomes weakened. It affects many things,
what it does not affect is our position in christ, and our adoption as sons. God adopted us KNOWING all we have, are and will ever do. we do not all of a sudden suprise God by commiting a sin he did not already know we would commit in the first place. and cause him to have to admit he made a mistake and take back his GIFT,
what it does not affect is our position in christ, and our adoption as sons. God adopted us KNOWING all we have, are and will ever do. we do not all of a sudden suprise God by commiting a sin he did not already know we would commit in the first place. and cause him to have to admit he made a mistake and take back his GIFT,
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John answers the question of those who once professed to be part of the church, and then left of their own free will.
1 John 2:
19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.
20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you[e] know all things. 21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
As you can see;
1. They were never saved
2. The professed to be of us but then changed, and now deny christ
3. Their departure was to PROVE they were never saved to begin with.
1 John 2:
19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.
20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you[e] know all things. 21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
As you can see;
1. They were never saved
2. The professed to be of us but then changed, and now deny christ
3. Their departure was to PROVE they were never saved to begin with.
E
In other words. Our faith in God is misplaced. we must trust self and our ability t keep walking even when we struggle. and Satan uses this against us to doubt God, and many have walked away because of this doubt of God being able to completely save us.
Again, John stresses, It is our sense of security (our knowledge we have eternal life, not that we are trying to earn it) that keeps us holding onto faith. And as paul said, we have not been given a spirit of fear, but of sound mind, not the spirit of fear. but the spirit of adoption, Where as a child who has sinned against his father, has the ability to come to his abba and confess that sin and seek help KNOWING he is already forgiven
Again, John stresses, It is our sense of security (our knowledge we have eternal life, not that we are trying to earn it) that keeps us holding onto faith. And as paul said, we have not been given a spirit of fear, but of sound mind, not the spirit of fear. but the spirit of adoption, Where as a child who has sinned against his father, has the ability to come to his abba and confess that sin and seek help KNOWING he is already forgiven
E
A saved person has already STOPPED blaspheming the HS thats how he got saved to begin with, He stopped calling God a liar and attributing the work of God in our salvation to other things, and hubly repented and recieved the words of the HS.
Everyone else is still in danger of dieing having commited the unpardonable sin, rejection of Christ, and the HS who was sent to prove to us our need of Christ, and explain to us Gods gift.
Everyone else is still in danger of dieing having commited the unpardonable sin, rejection of Christ, and the HS who was sent to prove to us our need of Christ, and explain to us Gods gift.
E
Legalism is the perfect lack of faith which prevents the babe in christ (if he is in christ at all) from ever growing and overcoming his sin habits, It is full of false promises, It eventually will force a person to do one of two things walk away from God because they realize their work is fruitless (they have no way to live up to the standard they think they just live up to) or become like the pharisee, Proud, religious people who rant and rave against sin and sinners, while refusing like the pharisees to own up to their own sins (they basically water down Gods law to a place they can attain, then judge everyone who does not live up to that standard.)While the child of Grace learns humility, Gratitude and although their growth may be slow, they learn to overcome many sins, and grow to maturity )as long as they stop listening to satan tell them how unworthy they are)
As paul said, the law causes sin to increase, Legalism causes defeat, Which is against human thinking, which is why it is so hard to overcome.
As paul said, the law causes sin to increase, Legalism causes defeat, Which is against human thinking, which is why it is so hard to overcome.