Repentance , the Salvation journey part two .

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
P

Pisteuo

Guest
#61
#61
luigi said:
I would guess step 4 being our adoption as Gods children where the promises of God to them who believe on Christ apply, able to do the miracles and greater miracles that those the Lord did; our being caught up spiritually with Christ.

John 14:12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
Click to expand...
Ok Luigi , let's keep going . Step four is not being adopted or recieving the Spirit of Christ . We must go through what Christ describes as the " parable of the sower " first .

This is the testing ground or where Christ plants his seed ( Himself ) into the soil , ( our surrendered life ) . 3 out of the four soils will fail here . So you can see how there is no way we could have the Spirit of Christ yet . Our faithing or surrendered life must be tested first . And because those three that fail didn't have the Spirit of Christ , they can start the process over again as long as the Father continues to draw them .

Step 5 , the one soil that produces a crop , or makes it through the testing or grafting phase , will have the Spirit of Christ sealed into them . At this point , it is harder to get out of God's will , than it is to stay in it.

The entire church world has been taken onto a wide path because of a mistranslation . Please ask some questions .
 
P

Pisteuo

Guest
#62
#62
LPT said:
I mean no harm but (pisteuo) is the lowest form of the expression, the Hebrew word (Aman) is a better expression.
Click to expand...
The Hebrew has only two words for Faith , both pictorial .
1) "running to the shelter of a mother birds wings .". Emphasis on the continual running towards something .

2) " the leaning on a staff , with all your weight behind it " . Emphasis on the continual surrendering of the entire being .

There's no such thing as " believing " in any language .
 
L

LPT

Guest
#63
#63
Pisteuo said:
The Hebrew has only two words for Faith , both pictorial .
1) "running to the shelter of a mother birds wings .". Emphasis on the continual running towards something .

2) " the leaning on a staff , with all your weight behind it " . Emphasis on the continual surrendering of the entire being .

There's no such thing as " believing " in any language .
Click to expand...
Here's what I've learned

...The Hebrew root word [for faith] is aman which means "to support, to foster as a parent, to render firm and permanent, to go to the right hand."

The Greek word for "faith" is pistos, and means to "trust, to trust in."
This completely fails to see the words on the page, and does not carefully distinguish the word meanings. To render something 'firm' as aman conveys a meaning of pisteuo that is more than simply a belief, and probably more than even simple trust.

Aman conveys one is now a follower, one steadfastly following God, and not simply intellectually assenting something is true or will happen.
 
P

Pisteuo

Guest
#64
#64
The bad news or good news , however you see it , is that all those who think they have received the Spirit of Christ at the very beginning by " believing " in what God did or said ( His Word ) are accually still stuck at that beginning stage . God is waiting for that first act of pisteuo or faithing to be fulfilled , a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender .
 
L

LPT

Guest
#65
#65
Aman in the Hebrew OT wasn't pictorial at all.

English trans below
Isaiah 28:16
Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste
 
L

LPT

Guest
#66
#66
Then there's this other word, first used in the Torah about Abraham (Emunah)

Greeks are Greeks but greeks were no word Gods, to think the Greek language is to end all language meanings of the bible would be nuts.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#67
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,771
113
#67
Pisteuo said:
And as for denying my username , I would be shocked if you new what it truly means .
Click to expand...
Really? And why's that? You think you are the only one who knows Greek?

Strong's Concordance
pisteuó: to believe, entrust
Original Word: πιστεύω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: pisteuó
Phonetic Spelling: (pist-yoo'-o)
Definition: to believe, entrust
Usage: I believe, have faith in, trust in; pass: I am entrusted with.

So if you were really trusting God and Scripture, you would understand that salvation is supernaturally accomplished immediately.
 
P

Pisteuo

Guest
#68
#68
LPT said:
Aman in the Hebrew OT wasn't pictorial at all.

English trans below
Isaiah 28:16
Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste
Click to expand...
Nehemiah6 said:
Really? And why's that? You think you are the only one who knows Greek?

Strong's Concordance
pisteuó: to believe, entrust
Original Word: πιστεύω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: pisteuó
Phonetic Spelling: (pist-yoo'-o)
Definition: to believe, entrust
Usage: I believe, have faith in, trust in; pass: I am entrusted with.

So if you were really trusting God and Scripture, you would understand that salvation is supernaturally accomplished immediately.
Click to expand...
Then why wouldn't you answer the question to step 3 ?
 
L

luigi

Junior Member
#69
Dec 6, 2015
1,222
216
63
#69
Pisteuo said:
Ok Luigi , let's keep going . Step four is not being adopted or recieving the Spirit of Christ . We must go through what Christ describes as the " parable of the sower " first .

This is the testing ground or where Christ plants his seed ( Himself ) into the soil , ( our surrendered life ) . 3 out of the four soils will fail here . So you can see how there is no way we could have the Spirit of Christ yet . Our faithing or surrendered life must be tested first . And because those three that fail didn't have the Spirit of Christ , they can start the process over again as long as the Father continues to draw them .

Step 5 , the one soil that produces a crop , or makes it through the testing or grafting phase , will have the Spirit of Christ sealed into them . At this point , it is harder to get out of God's will , than it is to stay in it.

The entire church world has been taken onto a wide path because of a mistranslation . Please ask some questions .
Click to expand...
If step four is when the Lord sows Himself into our surrendered life, then how have the first 3 soils ((1)who have no root in the Word, (2)are worldly concerned, (3) and who retreat from the Word when confronted and are offended), passed the first three steps?
 
P

Pisteuo

Guest
#70
#70
Nehemiah6 said:
Really? And why's that? You think you are the only one who knows Greek?

Strong's Concordance
pisteuó: to believe, entrust
Original Word: πιστεύω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: pisteuó
Phonetic Spelling: (pist-yoo'-o)
Definition: to believe, entrust
Usage: I believe, have faith in, trust in; pass: I am entrusted with.

So if you were really trusting God and Scripture, you would understand that salvation is supernaturally accomplished immediately.
Click to expand...
Pisteuo was mistranslated into the English by using the words believe believer and believing . Because of this , those words have infected not only our understanding of Faith , but dictionary definitions . That is why the Strongs gives the specific disclaimer " pisteuo means NOT just to believe ."

And because pisteuo was mistranslated into the English language , and by the same token mistranslated back out of the English , and stamped back onto the Greek .

The Greek doesn't even have a word in its language for " believing " . That is because the Greek language didn't allow a state where of being where one was only believing in something . They only allow pisteuo , faithing forward towards God , or faithing away from God , apisteuo . No such thing as believing in the Greek language .
 
P

Pisteuo

Guest
#71
#71
luigi said:
If step four is when the Lord sows Himself into our surrendered life, then how have the first 3 soils ((1)who have no root in the Word, (2)are worldly concerned, (3) and who retreat from the Word when confronted and are offended), passed the first three steps?
Click to expand...
Many are called , few are chosen .

Luigi , ide like to email you something , is there a way we can make that happen .
 
L

LPT

Guest
#72
#72
Pisteuo said:
Then why wouldn't you answer the question to step 3 ?
Click to expand...
Maybe I'm not quite understanding your step theology sort of sounds like a 12 steps to salvation preaching of Sort not sure but my belief is a person is either stepping towards him or stepping away from him.
 
L

luigi

Junior Member
#73
Dec 6, 2015
1,222
216
63
#73
Pisteuo said:
Many are called , few are chosen .

Luigi , ide like to email you something , is there a way we can make that happen .
Click to expand...
Yes Pisteuo, email: louisdiedricks@gmail.com

If I do not respond immediately, it is because I have had a long day and am about ready to retire for the evening.
It has been good communique with you today Pisteuo.
God bless.
 
P

Pisteuo

Guest
#74
#74
luigi said:
Yes Pisteuo, email: louisdiedricks@gmail.com

If I do not respond immediately, it is because I have had a long day and am about ready to retire for the evening.
It has been good communique with you today Pisteuo.
God bless.
Click to expand...
I wrote your email down so if you want to remove it from your post go ahead . I'll send you a detailed explanation of what I'm talking about .

Thanks
 
L

LPT

Guest
#75
#75
Well Pisteuo I did find your thread interesting and I learned from it, which is a good thing and I hope you find the answer your looking for...

peace out.
 
P

Pisteuo

Guest
#76
#76
Hevosmiles ,

Fitting 32 years of Studying God Word at a Stanford University level is harder to communicate than the topic itself . I hope you will reread each of my posts and look forward to answering any questions . Hope I didn't disappoint your expectations .
 
P

Pisteuo

Guest
#77
#77
LPT said:
Well Pisteuo I did find your thread interesting and I learned from it, which is a good thing and I hope you find the answer your looking for...

peace out.
Click to expand...
Sounds good LPT. What I'm looking for is a better way to deny self , take up my cross , and follow Him .

" My cross ", is helping others with theirs . Helping them find the answer .
 
fredoheaven

fredoheaven

Senior Member
#78
Nov 17, 2015
4,108
960
113
#78
Pisteuo said:
Yes , recieving the Spirit of Christ is being finally adopted by the Father . And it happens the same way, " by Faith ".

Salvation is by Grace , through Faith .

Luigi , I don't think you realize how close you are to the truth .

At this point of the Salvation journey , when we have yet to receive the Spirit of Christ , and as such Christ , His Word , and His promises are not ours yet , how does one move forward in the process without violating God and His Word ?

The answer is simple , " by Faith " ! But explaining this is a little more difficult .

Did you know that the Greek has two words for Faith ? The noun " pistis " and the corresponding verb " pisteuo " Did you also know. , That pistis is where we get our English word , the noun , " Faith " , and the corresponding verb " pisteuo" could not be translated into the English language , because the English language has no verb form of the noun Faith .

Here is the exact definition of " pisteuo " from the Vines Greek dictionary . " A personal surrender to Him , and a life inspired by such surrender ."

This is the third step , but is done outside of God and His Word . This first act of faithing or pisteuo is simply done to be accepted as genuone by Christ . Still no Spirit of Christ yet , and Christ , His Word , and promises there in are not ours yet either .

If Christ deems our surrendered life genuine , we move forward to step 4 , any thoughts on what that would be ?
Click to expand...
You just misunderstood God’s Holy words! Your very purpose defeated your claim. You started to believe that the word believe is mistranslation and does not carry the same meaning with faith. You inject Vines meaning of the Greek which is a definition of the Greek word pisteou and not the translation, perhaps for the reason that it cannot be translated in the English language as you say. Even Vine’s says pisteou is “to believe”. Translators of different versions of the Bible translated pisteou as “believe”
To depend on Vine’s meaning is to depend on one man’s opinion. Your personal surrender does not even carry the weight in its meaning of the Greek pisteou when it comes to salvation. The concept of salvation is that one is in need of help, deliverance or a rescue. It has nothing to do with surrender.
 
Hevosmies

Hevosmies

Well-known member
#79
Sep 8, 2018
3,612
2,633
113
#79
Pisteuo said:
Step 5 , the one soil that produces a crop , or makes it through the testing or grafting phase , will have the Spirit of Christ sealed into them . At this point , it is harder to get out of God's will , than it is to stay in it.

The entire church world has been taken onto a wide path because of a mistranslation . Please ask some questions .
Click to expand...
I already knew that the word faith is faithfulness, obedience, firmness, steadfastness in some places.

But finally we are getting somewhere! Spirit of Christ is received through repentance and faith is what you are saying? RECEIVING the word, surrendering your life.
Thanks now we know what you believe.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.