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Let's not be so vague. Which errors are you admitting to? Please humbly name them, then I can move forward with you. So far your understanding of Romans 8 is incorrect, it is not speaking of a person on a journey of salvation, it is contrasting the lost and saved.
That is one error you can admit to so that we can go on. You understand you've taken the word of God there, out of context, to support your teaching, correct?
That is one error you can admit to so that we can go on. You understand you've taken the word of God there, out of context, to support your teaching, correct?
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So you don't acknowledge Rom. 8:9 applies to us today at certain times in our Salvation journey ? I don't agree with that . I didn't provide the exact Scripture , and you were right to call me on it , that's on me .
You know you can't answer my questions , I thought you said you could've honest with yourself .
That passage deals with man in his lost state, not in his salvation journey, therefore you're misusing Scripture.
I know, and you're in error.
Rabbit trail and your apology is pretense, there is nothing in our conversation that has a thing to do with a wrong passage.
Now you're moving back towards arrogance.
Cult-like attempt to shame another person.
I know, and you're in error.
Rabbit trail and your apology is pretense, there is nothing in our conversation that has a thing to do with a wrong passage.
Now you're moving back towards arrogance.
Cult-like attempt to shame another person.
P
Bumped for serious discussion .
Disclaimer : as I try to share and discuss my understandings of Christ and the Salvation process , you might sense my shortcomings and errors . Please know there are even more you don't know about . So try to avoid the easy temptation to beat up the material vessel , and stick to the topic presented in the OP .
Disclaimer : as I try to share and discuss my understandings of Christ and the Salvation process , you might sense my shortcomings and errors . Please know there are even more you don't know about . So try to avoid the easy temptation to beat up the material vessel , and stick to the topic presented in the OP .
Yep, your behavior is cult-like; you shame others who won't agree with you, you won't admit to errors accurately, hold a pretense of humility, will not discuss with anyone until they buy in step by step with your teaching, and misusing Scripture.
You've misused Romans 8 to propagate your teaching. I've shown you this and you won't own it. And don't worry, I won't be changing my mind (i.e. blindly follow you and your error.)
You've misused Romans 8 to propagate your teaching. I've shown you this and you won't own it. And don't worry, I won't be changing my mind (i.e. blindly follow you and your error.)
P
Ya this is usually what happens , I don't mean for it end up this way . It's hard communicate this truth . When I ask a question like , " do we have the Spirit of Christ sealed into us before repentance " , there's only one answer , no .
When I ask , " because we don't have the Spirit of Christ, as per Rom. 8:9 , Christ , His word , and the promises in His word are not ours to claim yet ." Do you agree ? There's also only one answer , " I agree " because it can't be disagreed with .
When I ask , " are we in this same state of being after repentance ?" The answer can only be yes . Repentance is only a mental turning from our way to His way . Still no Spirit of Christ here yet .
When I ask , " what does our first act of Faith look like at this beginning stage of the Salvation journey ? " And someone replies , " believe in His Word , and claim the promises there in , and recieve the Spirit of Christ ." That can only be responded to in one way , No! Because we have yet to receive the Spirit of Christ . Christ , His word , and His promises are not ours yet . So claiming anything of God at this point is error .
So my point is , my questions are just a formality to help those who truly desire to know Him better . My questions could be seen as declarations , but that would be seen as arrogant .
This basic understanding of the beginning of the Salvation journey has a huge stumbling block that is taking out most called out ones . All I can do is make this problem known , the rest is up to you .
This is the part where you need to overcome the anger that wants to see me torn apart , and instead , ask the right questions .
L
I have a question so in this salvation journey as its being called here in the thread, are there any people today at the latter stages of the fore mentioned steps of salvation per say and are at this stage below.
1 John 4:13
By this we know that we remain in Him, and He in us: He has given us of His Spirit.
1 John 4:13
By this we know that we remain in Him, and He in us: He has given us of His Spirit.
But you've misused Romans 8, which I've shown you.
Of course the lost can't make any claim. They're in their lost state, unable to please God, without hope, under God's wrath, incapable of repentance &c.
Repentance isn't something man does. That's just one of your errors.
I disagree with you here due to the fact you haven't substantiated this opinion of yours with Scripture. You're making a declarative statement, yet deny you are doing so below, because that would be "arrogant." But you have in fact made such a statement.
You haven't proven your point, and you've made declarative statement number two. I also disagree with your position at this point.
No, they're declarative statements alright, with an emphatic "no!" added in.
There is no such problem, you're stacking the deck by making assumptions as truth, and making pretense as though they're not declarative statements.
Quite disingenuous on your part.
Now you're making not only false assumptions, but inflammatory and untrue comments on my person while I'm addressing the things you say and teach, showing contradictions and unproven claims, while pointing out your behavior that is in fact cult-like. Don't agree with you, and you write people off. That is cultic.
It is a bit arrogant of you to place yourself here as someone others need to come to and ask questions. Sorry if that offends you, but it is in fact true nonetheless.
Of course the lost can't make any claim. They're in their lost state, unable to please God, without hope, under God's wrath, incapable of repentance &c.
Repentance isn't something man does. That's just one of your errors.
I disagree with you here due to the fact you haven't substantiated this opinion of yours with Scripture. You're making a declarative statement, yet deny you are doing so below, because that would be "arrogant." But you have in fact made such a statement.
You haven't proven your point, and you've made declarative statement number two. I also disagree with your position at this point.
No, they're declarative statements alright, with an emphatic "no!" added in.
There is no such problem, you're stacking the deck by making assumptions as truth, and making pretense as though they're not declarative statements.
Quite disingenuous on your part.
Now you're making not only false assumptions, but inflammatory and untrue comments on my person while I'm addressing the things you say and teach, showing contradictions and unproven claims, while pointing out your behavior that is in fact cult-like. Don't agree with you, and you write people off. That is cultic.
It is a bit arrogant of you to place yourself here as someone others need to come to and ask questions. Sorry if that offends you, but it is in fact true nonetheless.
P
I accept your apology ..
And I also forgive you for the names your calling me and the misrepresentations your sculpting on my behalf .
But just as a sidebar , dang ! I've seen some good thread derailers , people that are master's at misrepresenting others , and at the same time never address the topic . But you are by far the best I've ever seen . Congrats on that .
And I also forgive you for the names your calling me and the misrepresentations your sculpting on my behalf .
But just as a sidebar , dang ! I've seen some good thread derailers , people that are master's at misrepresenting others , and at the same time never address the topic . But you are by far the best I've ever seen . Congrats on that .