Is Messiah,(The Anointed One) the Father?
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Wait a minute here? Your the one that posted there are other books that should have been in the Bible and because of these other books we don't have a clear picture. So how do you know that these other books will clear up things? And since you made the statement it's up to you to prove your statements are correct. This is why I ask you to give some examples of what is not clear?
As far as Jude 3 believers must fight with all their strength to preserve "the faith" which has been handed down to them. The Greek "hapax" means "once for all," because the message of Christianity was given to the Church at the beginning; it had not come in installments. In other words, the content of the apostloic GOSPEL is fixed, not to be revised for each new era boy.
IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
As far as Jude 3 believers must fight with all their strength to preserve "the faith" which has been handed down to them. The Greek "hapax" means "once for all," because the message of Christianity was given to the Church at the beginning; it had not come in installments. In other words, the content of the apostloic GOSPEL is fixed, not to be revised for each new era boy.
IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
I did post that. But Jude was written when all of those possible Books were available. And he said we have adequate knowledge now. But 400 years later some of those Books were banned.
Your point can only be relevant to when Jude wrote his letter, not 400 years after when the RCC removed Books!!
Are you claiming when Jude wrote his letter he knew as a fortune teller the RCC would ban certain Books?
Because we must believe that when Jude wrote this letter, those other Books were available. Especially since Jude quoted from Enoch, and we know the RCC banned Enoch.
So, if Jude knew these Books were being banned, why would he quote from a Book going to be banned?
1 Kings 8:60 — That all the people of the earth may know that the LORD is God, and that there is none else.
Mark 12:29-34 —And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. And the second is like, namely this, thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these. And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he: And to love him with all the heart, and with all the understanding, and with all the soul, and with all the strength, and to love his neighbor as himself, is more than all whole burnt offerings and sacrifices. And when Jesus saw that he answered discreetly, he said unto him, Thou art not far from the kingdom of God. And no man after that durst ask him any question.
Paul did not teach anything like what is called the Trinity doctrine.
Mark 12:29-34 —And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. And the second is like, namely this, thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these. And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he: And to love him with all the heart, and with all the understanding, and with all the soul, and with all the strength, and to love his neighbor as himself, is more than all whole burnt offerings and sacrifices. And when Jesus saw that he answered discreetly, he said unto him, Thou art not far from the kingdom of God. And no man after that durst ask him any question.
Paul did not teach anything like what is called the Trinity doctrine.
- To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ (Romans 1:7).
- Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ (I Corinthians 1:3).
- Grace be to you and peace from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ (II Corinthians 1:2).
- Grace be to you and peace from God the Father, and from our Lord Jesus Christ (Galatians 1:3).
- Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ (Ephesians 1:2).
- Please read Philippians 1:2; Colossians 1:2; I Thessalonians 1:1; II Thessalonians 1:2; I Timothy 1:2; II Timothy 1:2; Titus 1:4; and Philemon 1:3.
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Besides the Colossians verse there is that of Revelation.
Revelation 3 Interlinear
Links
Revelation 3:14 • Revelation 3:14 Text Analysis • Revelation 3:14 Interlinear • Revelation 3:14 Multilingual • Revelation 3:14 TSK • Revelation 3:14 Cross References • Revelation 3:14 Bible Hub • Revelation 3:14 Biblia Paralela • Revelation 3:14 Chinese Bible • Revelation 3:14 French Bible • Revelation 3:14 German Bible
The firstborn of all creation, given the context of the entire chapter of Colossians, speaks of Jesus, Yeshua, Immanuel, primacy.
Blue Letter Bible Colossians 1
Revelation 3 Interlinear
Links
Revelation 3:14 • Revelation 3:14 Text Analysis • Revelation 3:14 Interlinear • Revelation 3:14 Multilingual • Revelation 3:14 TSK • Revelation 3:14 Cross References • Revelation 3:14 Bible Hub • Revelation 3:14 Biblia Paralela • Revelation 3:14 Chinese Bible • Revelation 3:14 French Bible • Revelation 3:14 German Bible
The firstborn of all creation, given the context of the entire chapter of Colossians, speaks of Jesus, Yeshua, Immanuel, primacy.
Blue Letter Bible Colossians 1
Here are verses from Thomas that can be found in the other Gospels:
AND BTW, THE DATE ON THE PAPYRUS THOMAS SCROLL IS OLDER THAN THE GOSPELS WE HAVE NOW, IN FACT, THOMAS IS THE OLDEST PAPYRUS SCROLL IN THE ENTIRE NEW TESTAMENT CONCERNING CHRIST!!
5. For there is nothing hidden that will not be revealed. [And there is nothing buried that will not be raised.]"
9. Jesus said, "Look, the sower went out, took a handful (of seeds), and scattered (them). Some fell on the road, and the birds came and gathered them. Others fell on rock, and they didn't take root in the soil and didn't produce heads of grain. Others fell on thorns, and they choked the seeds and worms ate them. And others fell on good soil, and it produced a good crop: it yielded sixty per measure and one hundred twenty per measure."
16. Jesus said, "Perhaps people think that I have come to cast peace upon the world. They do not know that I have come to cast conflicts upon the earth: (Division) For there will be five in a house: there'll be three against two and two against three, father against son and son against father, and they will stand alone."
20. The disciples said to Jesus, "Tell us what Heaven's kingdom. He said to them, "It's like a mustard seed, the smallest of all seeds, but when it falls on prepared soil, it produces a large plant and becomes a shelter for birds of the sky."
25. Jesus said, "Love your friends like your own soul, protect them like the pupil of your eye."
26. Jesus said, "You see the sliver in your friend's eye, but you don't see the timber in your own eye. When you take the timber out of your own eye, then you will see well enough to remove the sliver from your friend's eye."
31. Jesus said, "No prophet is welcome on his home turf; doctors don't cure those who know them."
32. Jesus said, "A city built on a high hill and fortified cannot fall, nor can it be hidden."
44. Jesus said, "Whoever blasphemes against the Father will be forgiven, and whoever blasphemes against the son will be forgiven, but whoever blasphemes against the holy spirit will not be forgiven, either on earth or in heaven."
46. Jesus said, "From Adam to John the Baptist, among those born of women, no one is so much greater than John the Baptist that his eyes should not be averted.
54. Jesus said, "Congratulations to the poor, for to you belongs Heaven's kingdom."
55. Jesus said, "Whoever does not hate father and mother cannot be my disciple, and whoever does not hate brothers and sisters, and carry the cross as I do, will not be worthy of me."
66. Jesus said, "Show me the stone that the builders rejected: that is the keystone."
68. Jesus said, "Congratulations to you when you are hated and persecuted; and no place will be found, wherever you have been persecuted."
69. Jesus said, "Congratulations to those who have been persecuted in their hearts: they are the ones who have truly come to know the Father.
77. Jesus said, "I am the light that is over all things. I am all: from me all came forth, and to me all attained.
90. Jesus said, "Come to me, for my yoke is comfortable and my lordship is gentle, and you will find rest for yourselves."
I COULD MORE OR PICKED ANYONE BETWEEN THE ONES I PICKED AND WE CAN FIND SAME SCRIPTURE ALREADY FOUND!!
AND BTW, THE DATE ON THE PAPYRUS THOMAS SCROLL IS OLDER THAN THE GOSPELS WE HAVE NOW, IN FACT, THOMAS IS THE OLDEST PAPYRUS SCROLL IN THE ENTIRE NEW TESTAMENT CONCERNING CHRIST!!
5. For there is nothing hidden that will not be revealed. [And there is nothing buried that will not be raised.]"
9. Jesus said, "Look, the sower went out, took a handful (of seeds), and scattered (them). Some fell on the road, and the birds came and gathered them. Others fell on rock, and they didn't take root in the soil and didn't produce heads of grain. Others fell on thorns, and they choked the seeds and worms ate them. And others fell on good soil, and it produced a good crop: it yielded sixty per measure and one hundred twenty per measure."
16. Jesus said, "Perhaps people think that I have come to cast peace upon the world. They do not know that I have come to cast conflicts upon the earth: (Division) For there will be five in a house: there'll be three against two and two against three, father against son and son against father, and they will stand alone."
20. The disciples said to Jesus, "Tell us what Heaven's kingdom. He said to them, "It's like a mustard seed, the smallest of all seeds, but when it falls on prepared soil, it produces a large plant and becomes a shelter for birds of the sky."
25. Jesus said, "Love your friends like your own soul, protect them like the pupil of your eye."
26. Jesus said, "You see the sliver in your friend's eye, but you don't see the timber in your own eye. When you take the timber out of your own eye, then you will see well enough to remove the sliver from your friend's eye."
31. Jesus said, "No prophet is welcome on his home turf; doctors don't cure those who know them."
32. Jesus said, "A city built on a high hill and fortified cannot fall, nor can it be hidden."
44. Jesus said, "Whoever blasphemes against the Father will be forgiven, and whoever blasphemes against the son will be forgiven, but whoever blasphemes against the holy spirit will not be forgiven, either on earth or in heaven."
46. Jesus said, "From Adam to John the Baptist, among those born of women, no one is so much greater than John the Baptist that his eyes should not be averted.
54. Jesus said, "Congratulations to the poor, for to you belongs Heaven's kingdom."
55. Jesus said, "Whoever does not hate father and mother cannot be my disciple, and whoever does not hate brothers and sisters, and carry the cross as I do, will not be worthy of me."
66. Jesus said, "Show me the stone that the builders rejected: that is the keystone."
68. Jesus said, "Congratulations to you when you are hated and persecuted; and no place will be found, wherever you have been persecuted."
69. Jesus said, "Congratulations to those who have been persecuted in their hearts: they are the ones who have truly come to know the Father.
77. Jesus said, "I am the light that is over all things. I am all: from me all came forth, and to me all attained.
90. Jesus said, "Come to me, for my yoke is comfortable and my lordship is gentle, and you will find rest for yourselves."
I COULD MORE OR PICKED ANYONE BETWEEN THE ONES I PICKED AND WE CAN FIND SAME SCRIPTURE ALREADY FOUND!!
Thomas scrolls date before the 4 Gospels we use now.
I provided several scriptures we already find in the 4 Gospels we use now. Thomas is full of those scriptures found in all 4 Gospels. So to say no one quoted Thomas is a LIAR!!
Thomas was not used because it's clear Christ did not teach nor believe the trinity!!
No.
Nobody quoted Thomas. Everybody quoted 4 canonical gospels.
Thomas was not used because its a fake writing. The real Thomas was in India, not in Egypt. Sayings of the gospel of Thomas are very close to gnosticism and try to sound deep, but have no real meaning. Typical for gnostics.
You should return to apostolic teaching very quickly, if you ever were there.
Nobody quoted Thomas. Everybody quoted 4 canonical gospels.
Thomas was not used because its a fake writing. The real Thomas was in India, not in Egypt. Sayings of the gospel of Thomas are very close to gnosticism and try to sound deep, but have no real meaning. Typical for gnostics.
You should return to apostolic teaching very quickly, if you ever were there.
And don't forget Enoch. The new testament contains references to Enoch and yet the book of Enoch was removed from the Canon.
The 1611 King James Version included the Apocrypha
Remember too that the convening of the Council of Nicaea in 325 A.D in what is today Iznik Turkey and by order of emperor Constantine resulted in a unified Catholic church.
Years later in 393 A.D. the Council of Hippo sanctioned 27 books of what we call the new testament. And years after that in 397 A.D the Council of Cartage affirmed that sanction and those 27 books then became the official authoritative scriptures of the Catholic church. This was intended also to discredit Gnostic scriptures.
Notice anything interesting about the list of Canonical books? Some are what were later described as Apocryphal (From that link below:
Books of the Apocrypha are named in this list: Tobit, Judith, 1 and 2 Maccabees; and the expression "five books of Solomon" implies the inclusion of the Wisdom of Solomon and Ecclesiasticus (Augustine, in his City of God and On Christian Doctrine, says that in addition to Proverbs, Song of Songs, and Ecclesiastes, the books of Wisdom and Ecclesiasticus are often ascribed to Solomon). Some have attributed the inclusion of these books to the influence of Augustine in Hippo and Carthage, because in his writings he sometimes treats them as canonical. But the canon itself purports to give a list of books which were traditionally read in the African churches: “quia a patribus ista accepimus in ecclesia legenda.”)
Third Council of Carthage (A.D. 397)
It was also determined that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in the Church under the title of divine Scriptures. The Canonical Scriptures are these: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy, Joshua the son of Nun, Judges, Ruth, four books of Kings, 3 two books of Paraleipomena, 4 Job, the Psalter, five books of Solomon, 5 the books of the twelve prophets, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezechiel, Daniel, Tobit, Judith, Esther, two books of Esdras, 6 two books of the Maccabees. Of the New Testament: four books of the Gospels, one book of the Acts of the Apostles, thirteen Epistles of the Apostle Paul, one epistle of the same [writer] to the Hebrews, two Epistles of the Apostle Peter, three of John, one of James, one of Jude, one book of the Apocalypse of John. Let this be made known also to our brother and fellow-priest Boniface, or to other bishops of those parts, for the purpose of confirming that Canon. because we have received from our fathers that those books must be read in the Church. Let it also be allowed that the Passions of Martyrs be read when their festivals are kept.
Then after all that with the forming of the official Catholic church you'd think those official books of the bible would be readily available to all devotees. No. In fact for 1,000 years after that Christians were discouraged from reading a Bible on their own. And as such the Dark Ages began.
Why Christians Were Denied Access to Their Bible for 1,000 Years
The 1611 King James Version included the Apocrypha
Remember too that the convening of the Council of Nicaea in 325 A.D in what is today Iznik Turkey and by order of emperor Constantine resulted in a unified Catholic church.
Years later in 393 A.D. the Council of Hippo sanctioned 27 books of what we call the new testament. And years after that in 397 A.D the Council of Cartage affirmed that sanction and those 27 books then became the official authoritative scriptures of the Catholic church. This was intended also to discredit Gnostic scriptures.
Notice anything interesting about the list of Canonical books? Some are what were later described as Apocryphal (From that link below:
Books of the Apocrypha are named in this list: Tobit, Judith, 1 and 2 Maccabees; and the expression "five books of Solomon" implies the inclusion of the Wisdom of Solomon and Ecclesiasticus (Augustine, in his City of God and On Christian Doctrine, says that in addition to Proverbs, Song of Songs, and Ecclesiastes, the books of Wisdom and Ecclesiasticus are often ascribed to Solomon). Some have attributed the inclusion of these books to the influence of Augustine in Hippo and Carthage, because in his writings he sometimes treats them as canonical. But the canon itself purports to give a list of books which were traditionally read in the African churches: “quia a patribus ista accepimus in ecclesia legenda.”)
Third Council of Carthage (A.D. 397)
It was also determined that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in the Church under the title of divine Scriptures. The Canonical Scriptures are these: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy, Joshua the son of Nun, Judges, Ruth, four books of Kings, 3 two books of Paraleipomena, 4 Job, the Psalter, five books of Solomon, 5 the books of the twelve prophets, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezechiel, Daniel, Tobit, Judith, Esther, two books of Esdras, 6 two books of the Maccabees. Of the New Testament: four books of the Gospels, one book of the Acts of the Apostles, thirteen Epistles of the Apostle Paul, one epistle of the same [writer] to the Hebrews, two Epistles of the Apostle Peter, three of John, one of James, one of Jude, one book of the Apocalypse of John. Let this be made known also to our brother and fellow-priest Boniface, or to other bishops of those parts, for the purpose of confirming that Canon. because we have received from our fathers that those books must be read in the Church. Let it also be allowed that the Passions of Martyrs be read when their festivals are kept.
Then after all that with the forming of the official Catholic church you'd think those official books of the bible would be readily available to all devotees. No. In fact for 1,000 years after that Christians were discouraged from reading a Bible on their own. And as such the Dark Ages began.
Why Christians Were Denied Access to Their Bible for 1,000 Years
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Scholars have proposed a date as early as 40 AD concerning the Gospel of Thomas, depending upon whether the Gospel of Thomas is identified with the original core of sayings.
[2] Almost half of these sayings resemble those found in the Canonical Gospels, while it is speculated that the other sayings were added later from tradition.
[2] Almost half of these sayings resemble those found in the Canonical Gospels, while it is speculated that the other sayings were added later from tradition.
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True. Scholars have dated the Synoptic gospels to 2nd century or 200CE.
The Gospel of Thomas one of the earliest accounts of the teachings of Jesus, is dated to earlier than that. Possibly 135CE to 200CE.
The "Infancy" Gospel of Thomas is as it sounds, accounting of the birth of the Christ child.
The Gospel of Thomas one of the earliest accounts of the teachings of Jesus, is dated to earlier than that. Possibly 135CE to 200CE.
The "Infancy" Gospel of Thomas is as it sounds, accounting of the birth of the Christ child.
trofimus,
For someone claiming to understand the tradition of the Council, you sure fight hard to preserve their lies!!
May I ask why?
Is it because they are trinitarians and even if they changed scripture you do not care because it benefits both your beliefs and these arguments?
What will you do if you get to heaven and learn you are wrong?
If I am wrong, I will apologize to every Trinitarian I ever met!!
For someone claiming to understand the tradition of the Council, you sure fight hard to preserve their lies!!
May I ask why?
Is it because they are trinitarians and even if they changed scripture you do not care because it benefits both your beliefs and these arguments?
What will you do if you get to heaven and learn you are wrong?
If I am wrong, I will apologize to every Trinitarian I ever met!!