Are there still apostles today?

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shrume

Senior Member
#141
Jun 26, 2017
2,193
464
83
#141
OstrichSmiling said:
I'm certain that you could go on. There are no Apostles today regardless of what someone thinks or what someone chooses as a self-appointed title. There's a pastor in Philly that claims he's an Apostle. He's far from it.

As to Paul and your remark, maybe read about Saul. He meets the requirements that the learned men in the Apologetics Press article outline as what qualifies someone to be an Apostle of Christ.
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You're free to have your opinion. :)

I'm not claiming that there aren't false apostles. There are, just as there were false apostles in the first century (2 Cor 11:13). But there are also legit apostles today. Apostle means "one who is sent".

And while Jesus did witness to Saul on the road to Damascus, Saul was not an eyewitness of Christ's resurrection, which is what your article states. Also, Saul saw a light and heard a voice. He did not see Jesus.
 
S

selfdissolving

Guest
#142
#142
shrume said:
The scripture they list do not say that a requirement of being an apostle was that they had to have seen the Lord and been an eyewitness of his resurrection. If those requirements were legit, Paul was not an apostle.
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Paul met the resurrected Lord on the road to Damascus
 
S

selfdissolving

Guest
#144
#144
shrume said:
And while Jesus did witness to Saul on the road to Damascus, Saul was not an eyewitness of Christ's resurrection, which is what your article states. Also, Saul saw a light and heard a voice. He did not see Jesus.
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Acts 22: 14-18 “Then he said: ‘The God of our ancestors has chosen you to know his will and to see the Righteous One and to hear words from his mouth. You will be his witness to all people of what you have seen and heard. And now what are you waiting for? Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name.’

“When I returned to Jerusalem and was praying at the temple, I fell into a trance and saw the Lord speaking to me. ‘Quick!’ he said. ‘Leave Jerusalem immediately, because the people here will not accept your testimony about me.’

He saw the Lord in his resurrected body the same way the other apostles saw the Lord in his resurrected body
 
S

selfdissolving

Guest
#145
#145
QUESTION: how many modern day "apostles" have seen the resurrected Lord?
ANSWER: 0

which means they are not apostles
 
S

shrume

Senior Member
#146
Jun 26, 2017
2,193
464
83
#146
selfdissolving said:
QUESTION: how many modern day "apostles" have seen the resurrected Lord?
ANSWER: 0

which means they are not apostles
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You are assuming that in order to be an apostle a person must have seen Jesus.
 
O

OstrichSmiling

Well-known member
#147
Jun 17, 2018
1,027
418
83
#147
shrume said:
You're free to have your opinion. :)

I'm not claiming that there aren't false apostles. There are, just as there were false apostles in the first century (2 Cor 11:13). But there are also legit apostles today. Apostle means "one who is sent".

And while Jesus did witness to Saul on the road to Damascus, Saul was not an eyewitness of Christ's resurrection, which is what your article states. Also, Saul saw a light and heard a voice. He did not see Jesus.
Click to expand...
Yes, I know the etymology behind the word Apostle. The key I think to understand what an Apostle of Christ is in asking , by whom was the Apostle sent?
 
S

shrume

Senior Member
#148
Jun 26, 2017
2,193
464
83
#148
OstrichSmiling said:
Yes, I know the etymology behind the word Apostle. The key I think to understand what an Apostle of Christ is in asking , by whom was the Apostle sent?
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I believe apostles are sent by Christ today. He's still alive, you know... :)
 
S

selfdissolving

Guest
#151
#151
shrume said:
You are assuming that in order to be an apostle a person must have seen Jesus.
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yes that is a qualification of apostleship.
1 Corinthians 9:1-2 Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord?Are you not the result of my work in the Lord? Even though I may not be an apostle to others, surely I am to you! For you are the seal of my apostleship in the Lord.

All apostles were witnesses of Christ' resurrection and received personal instruction from him.
They laid the foundation of the Church through evangelism and the New Testament writings, and spoke binding and authoritatively on the behalf of Jesus Christ.

After they all died, they were no more apostles. The foundation has been laid and the canon closed. Now, all Christians speak binding and authoritative words on behalf of Jesus, IF they are speaking the Word of God and what they are saying lines up with what is already revealed in Scripture.

NO NEW APOSTLES! CANON CLOSED! FOUNDATION LAID!

now we build on that foundation :)
 
P

pjharrison

Guest
#152
#152
OstrichSmiling said:
Yes, other Apostles according to the writings of Paul.
There were 13 original Apostles of the Christ in that Matthias replaced Judas.
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Paul wrote half the new testament, and your going to choose that part not to believe. why did they replace Judas. They could have left him off because there was Paul. Before Jesus left he said he would send the comforter, who will lead you into all truth. The comforter is the one who does the work, and he is the who communicates with the human spirit. Spirit to Spirit. So the others didn't have to see Jesus , all they had to do was believe by faith. Jesus is the head and he left the Body to finish the work that he had started. There should be some healing the sick and casting out devils, but no one is.
 
O

OstrichSmiling

Well-known member
#153
Jun 17, 2018
1,027
418
83
#153
pjharrison said:
Paul wrote half the new testament, and your going to choose that part not to believe. why did they replace Judas. They could have left him off because there was Paul. Before Jesus left he said he would send the comforter, who will lead you into all truth. The comforter is the one who does the work, and he is the who communicates with the human spirit. Spirit to Spirit. So the others didn't have to see Jesus , all they had to do was believe by faith. Jesus is the head and he left the Body to finish the work that he had started. There should be some healing the sick and casting out devils, but no one is.
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Isn't that as Christ foretold?

Matthew 24
22 “If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened. 23 At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. 24 For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect.25 See, I have told you ahead of time.
26 “So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it.
 
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shrume

Senior Member
#154
Jun 26, 2017
2,193
464
83
#154
selfdissolving said:
yes that is a qualification of apostleship.
1 Corinthians 9:1-2 Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord?Are you not the result of my work in the Lord? Even though I may not be an apostle to others, surely I am to you! For you are the seal of my apostleship in the Lord.

All apostles were witnesses of Christ' resurrection and received personal instruction from him.
They laid the foundation of the Church through evangelism and the New Testament writings, and spoke binding and authoritatively on the behalf of Jesus Christ.

After they all died, they were no more apostles. The foundation has been laid and the canon closed. Now, all Christians speak binding and authoritative words on behalf of Jesus, IF they are speaking the Word of God and what they are saying lines up with what is already revealed in Scripture.

NO NEW APOSTLES! CANON CLOSED! FOUNDATION LAID!

now we build on that foundation :)
Click to expand...
Nothing you said proves that in order to be an apostle a person must have seen Jesus.
 
S

selfdissolving

Guest
#155
#155
shrume said:
Nothing you said proves that in order to be an apostle a person must have seen Jesus.
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it does, but you are not willing to accept it.
i think you probably have something to lose here
you either believe that you yourself are an apostle, or you are under instruction from one who claims to be an apostle
 
S

shrume

Senior Member
#156
Jun 26, 2017
2,193
464
83
#156
selfdissolving said:
it does, but you are not willing to accept it.
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No, it doesn't.

i think you probably have something to lose here
you either believe that you yourself are an apostle, or you are under instruction from one who claims to be an apostle
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I have nothing to lose. Neither of your guesses are true.
 
J

joefizz

Guest
#157
#157
selfdissolving said:
Acts 22: 14-18 “Then he said: ‘The God of our ancestors has chosen you to know his will and to see the Righteous One and to hear words from his mouth. You will be his witness to all people of what you have seen and heard. And now what are you waiting for? Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name.’

“When I returned to Jerusalem and was praying at the temple, I fell into a trance and saw the Lord speaking to me. ‘Quick!’ he said. ‘Leave Jerusalem immediately, because the people here will not accept your testimony about me.’

He saw the Lord in his resurrected body the same way the other apostles saw the Lord in his resurrected body
Click to expand...
I have never met you here before but I so far agree with all you shared!
 
J

joefizz

Guest
#158
#158
selfdissolving said:
yes that is a qualification of apostleship.
1 Corinthians 9:1-2 Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord?Are you not the result of my work in the Lord? Even though I may not be an apostle to others, surely I am to you! For you are the seal of my apostleship in the Lord.

All apostles were witnesses of Christ' resurrection and received personal instruction from him.
They laid the foundation of the Church through evangelism and the New Testament writings, and spoke binding and authoritatively on the behalf of Jesus Christ.

After they all died, they were no more apostles. The foundation has been laid and the canon closed. Now, all Christians speak binding and authoritative words on behalf of Jesus, IF they are speaking the Word of God and what they are saying lines up with what is already revealed in Scripture.

NO NEW APOSTLES! CANON CLOSED! FOUNDATION LAID!

now we build on that foundation :)
Click to expand...
You are very well read and direct and clear I respect that.
 
J

joefizz

Guest
#159
#159
selfdissolving said:
yes that is a qualification of apostleship.
1 Corinthians 9:1-2 Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord?Are you not the result of my work in the Lord? Even though I may not be an apostle to others, surely I am to you! For you are the seal of my apostleship in the Lord.

All apostles were witnesses of Christ' resurrection and received personal instruction from him.
They laid the foundation of the Church through evangelism and the New Testament writings, and spoke binding and authoritatively on the behalf of Jesus Christ.

After they all died, they were no more apostles. The foundation has been laid and the canon closed. Now, all Christians speak binding and authoritative words on behalf of Jesus, IF they are speaking the Word of God and what they are saying lines up with what is already revealed in Scripture.

NO NEW APOSTLES! CANON CLOSED! FOUNDATION LAID!

now we build on that foundation :)
Click to expand...
And on that note I believe this thread should be closed in favor of "Self dissolving" because the point has been made "with scripture" as well as "clearly and accurately" that there are no "New apostles" only "missionaries" that can be "labeled by people" as apostles.
 
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