The doctrine of election and reprobation
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Eph 1:
4) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5) Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
Those verses are talking about Christianity, not individual Christians.
God's will is for all men to be saved (1 Tim 2:4), He is not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance (2 Pet 3:9). He wants the wicked to turn from their evil ways so they might live (Eze 33:11).
If those things are God's will (they are..), then why will not everyone be saved? Because they choose not to believe.
God gave men free will, the free will ability to choose.
(I am not a Calvinist, can you tell?
)
4) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5) Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
Those verses are talking about Christianity, not individual Christians.
God's will is for all men to be saved (1 Tim 2:4), He is not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance (2 Pet 3:9). He wants the wicked to turn from their evil ways so they might live (Eze 33:11).
If those things are God's will (they are..), then why will not everyone be saved? Because they choose not to believe.
God gave men free will, the free will ability to choose.
(I am not a Calvinist, can you tell?
)
Eph 1:
4) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5) Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
Those verses are talking about Christianity, not individual Christians.
God's will is for all men to be saved (1 Tim 2:4), He is not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance (2 Pet 3:9). He wants the wicked to turn from their evil ways so they might live (Eze 33:11).
If those things are God's will (they are..), then why will not everyone be saved? Because they choose not to believe.
God gave men free will, the free will ability to choose.
(I am not a Calvinist, can you tell? )
4) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5) Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
Those verses are talking about Christianity, not individual Christians.
God's will is for all men to be saved (1 Tim 2:4), He is not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance (2 Pet 3:9). He wants the wicked to turn from their evil ways so they might live (Eze 33:11).
If those things are God's will (they are..), then why will not everyone be saved? Because they choose not to believe.
God gave men free will, the free will ability to choose.
(I am not a Calvinist, can you tell?
)
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Why is this so hard to understand.. It is like God is taking something away from you???? God has already seen in eternity past what you will do with your free will. This He foreknown and predestined. SO, if you are of the mind to change, go ahead, He probably did not predestine you anyway. If on the other hand, you are a True Christian, then He Predestined you and called out to you in one form or the other. Either way, it was your free will that got you there.
Again, If you feel that you have been cheated out of your free-will, Feel free to exercise your FREE-WILL and tell HIM you do not need him.
Good luck on that one?
Blade
Again, If you feel that you have been cheated out of your free-will, Feel free to exercise your FREE-WILL and tell HIM you do not need him.
Good luck on that one?
Blade
I agree to a point. We do not know for sure about the next person salvation status but should know our own status.. If one does not know, then they got big problems they need to work out real quick.
However, even the most hardened criminal and/or sinner can change their mind and accept Jesus as their lord and savior anytime prior to their demise even if it is a few seconds before. For after death, there is no choice to be made. You are sealed from that point onward.
Blade
However, even the most hardened criminal and/or sinner can change their mind and accept Jesus as their lord and savior anytime prior to their demise even if it is a few seconds before. For after death, there is no choice to be made. You are sealed from that point onward.
Blade
Where did this come from? Having a bad day?
I never said God is taking anything away from me. I never said I was cheated out of free will. Why would I tell God I do not need him?
I never said God is taking anything away from me. I never said I was cheated out of free will. Why would I tell God I do not need him?
There are those that use this Free-Will scenario to lead people away from GOD. "He is taking your FREE-WILL away from you and is either 'saving' you or 'trashing' you." I have seen it play out before.
My apologies for being blunt to the point.
Blade
Hey, I'm cool as a cucumber.
And just to remind you, your post was a direct response to me, to what I posted.
I don't see how understanding that God gave us free will can lead people away from God.
No problem... I'm frequently blunt myself.
And just to remind you, your post was a direct response to me, to what I posted.
I don't see how understanding that God gave us free will can lead people away from God.
No problem... I'm frequently blunt myself.
Blade
I meant those who came to Jesus saying, Lord, Lord have we not done great things in your Name. Healed the sick, cast out demons and he will say, depart from me you workers of iniquity for I never knew you. It sure sounds like He was speaking to professing believers, who were actually unbelievers
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There's an old story that goes: "It's like trying to describe a "war zone", to someone who has never been in a war zone."
Each one who has been in a war zone describes it differently. Yet? All descriptions are true and factual. Yet? A person to whom one is trying to describe a war zone to, that has not been in a war zone? Hears a description from one "vet", then hears another description from another vet, which isn't "precisely" the description from the first vet. The "hearer" believes the first description, yet accuses the 2nd describer as "distorting" the meaning!
Just who is telling the truth, and who was distorting the meaning? Neither were telling the truth? Both were distorting the meaning?
This is an updated version of what Paul was trying to convey, when he used the analogy of "Looking through a dark glass dimly, when trying to describe God's "Spiritual Kingdom."
To the one who has not "seen" the Spiritual Kingdom? NO Explanation is possible!
To the one who has "seen" the Spiritual Kingdom? No Explanation is needed!
Now, having said this? The posts that I put here in CC, are My experiences, and arguments of my "born from above" inwards "self", in the converting/convincing/persuading of my outwards self. In the hopes, that "peals of truth" may resonate, from "my bell" with someone going through a "war zone." So that someone else going through something similiar, may not become dismayed, nor dissuaded, in thier own "thirstings" along their own "perfecting", or maturing of, and in the Spirit.
Or, in other words? Hopefully, by the words of my testamonying, they may be comforted in their own grafting process, from those who tend to limit the scope, and authority, of our Heavenly Father, by not merely putting themselves, in a box, but God too!
This is not to say, that God's love does not "protect" those, whom He KNOWS may not handle said "war zone." But, on the other hand? Although, being considered a "general concensus", or "normal behavior" in the accepting of the description of the "war zone?" Any descriptions, by "vets" (and yes, you may consider these as having been "predestined"), are seen as "distorting the meaning."
This may be my last posting in CC. Not for my sake. But, more for everyone in here, and may come here in the future. Because, I certainly have (for lack of a better analogy) a "habit" of attracting the enemies of the Kingdom of God, and the Kingdom of Light, like so many flies to sugar! Case in point! Do you think the Cosa Nostra, which originated in Scicily, which is situated close to Rome, which has "tattered to shreds" the Catholic Church, was an "accident?" Flies to sugar people!....Flies to sugar!
Each one who has been in a war zone describes it differently. Yet? All descriptions are true and factual. Yet? A person to whom one is trying to describe a war zone to, that has not been in a war zone? Hears a description from one "vet", then hears another description from another vet, which isn't "precisely" the description from the first vet. The "hearer" believes the first description, yet accuses the 2nd describer as "distorting" the meaning!
Just who is telling the truth, and who was distorting the meaning? Neither were telling the truth? Both were distorting the meaning?
This is an updated version of what Paul was trying to convey, when he used the analogy of "Looking through a dark glass dimly, when trying to describe God's "Spiritual Kingdom."
To the one who has not "seen" the Spiritual Kingdom? NO Explanation is possible!
To the one who has "seen" the Spiritual Kingdom? No Explanation is needed!
Now, having said this? The posts that I put here in CC, are My experiences, and arguments of my "born from above" inwards "self", in the converting/convincing/persuading of my outwards self. In the hopes, that "peals of truth" may resonate, from "my bell" with someone going through a "war zone." So that someone else going through something similiar, may not become dismayed, nor dissuaded, in thier own "thirstings" along their own "perfecting", or maturing of, and in the Spirit.
Or, in other words? Hopefully, by the words of my testamonying, they may be comforted in their own grafting process, from those who tend to limit the scope, and authority, of our Heavenly Father, by not merely putting themselves, in a box, but God too!
This is not to say, that God's love does not "protect" those, whom He KNOWS may not handle said "war zone." But, on the other hand? Although, being considered a "general concensus", or "normal behavior" in the accepting of the description of the "war zone?" Any descriptions, by "vets" (and yes, you may consider these as having been "predestined"), are seen as "distorting the meaning."
This may be my last posting in CC. Not for my sake. But, more for everyone in here, and may come here in the future. Because, I certainly have (for lack of a better analogy) a "habit" of attracting the enemies of the Kingdom of God, and the Kingdom of Light, like so many flies to sugar! Case in point! Do you think the Cosa Nostra, which originated in Scicily, which is situated close to Rome, which has "tattered to shreds" the Catholic Church, was an "accident?" Flies to sugar people!....Flies to sugar!
But that wasn't the point. A Calvinist doesn't know if he is really one of the few God has elected. You can be a good person and read the Bible, call Jesus "Lord", but in the end it was all for nothing. The Calvinist God let's those he prepared for destruction fool themselves into thinking they believe yet are the tares among wheat.
You can't because it isn't Biblical. This is Biblical:
The Lord isn’t really being slow about his promise, as some people think. No, he is being patient for your sake. He does not want anyone to be destroyed, but wants everyone to repent.
2 Peter 3:9 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/2pe.3.9.NLT
The Lord isn’t really being slow about his promise, as some people think. No, he is being patient for your sake. He does not want anyone to be destroyed, but wants everyone to repent.
2 Peter 3:9 NLT
https://bible.com/bible/116/2pe.3.9.NLT