Not By Works

[Cee]

You keep posting completely unrelated verses. Right now we are focusing on Jesus is our Sabbath.

You made an interesting point here:

Mat 24:20, “But pray that your flight will not be in the winter, nor on the Sabbath Day.”

Proof this is an end time prophecy is found here, for the Messiah has not yet returned;

Let's look at Matt 24:1 to understand this...

1Jesus left the temple and was going away, when his disciples came to point out to him the buildings of the temple. 2But he answered them, “You see all these, do you not? Truly, I say to you, there will not be left here one stone upon another that will not be thrown down.

Jesus is talking about the temple here. History tells us that because of the gold in the temple, Romans tore each brick apart stone by stone to get the gold. This happened in 70 AD. Just under 40 years from when Jesus spoke these words.

3As he sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”

The disciples ask Jesus when will this happen? Speaking of the temple. And the end of the age which we could debate about what that means, some say it's to come others say it happened when the Temple was destroyed. But that's a completely different topic. Let's look at "when these things will be" speaking of the temple being destroyed.

15“So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand),16then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

Now, the holy place has been destroyed (this happened in 70 AD). And v16 says that this is written to those in Judea, I can't flee to the mountains of Judea in California. This is written to the JEWS of Judea. Interestingly enough all the Christians left before Romans sacked Jerusalem because of this prophesy here.

17Let the one who is on the housetop not go down to take what is in his house, 18and let the one who is in the field not turn back to take his cloak. 19And alas for women who are pregnant and for those who are nursing infants in those days! 20Pray that your flight may not be in winter or on a Sabbath.

Notice Jesus is referring to making haste. Getting out of dodge as we say. When you see the abomination of desolation flee. Get out of there. And pray it doesn't happen on a Sabbath. Written to the Jews, that's why we don't find this in any other book. It's specifically to the Hebrews.

But why? Well not happening in Winter is obvious right. But what happened in the times of Sabbath? The gates were locked. And the Jews would police their people not allowing them to leave. This command isn't to say, we will always keep the Sabbath, or to keep the Winter, this is a warning to make haste when they see the abomination of desolation. Which is exactly what happened in 70 AD. Million of Jews were killed. The temple was destroyed. They ran out of wood because of so many crucifixions. And according to the writings of Josephus, which I've read most of during this time period, some people were claiming to be the Messiah.

So as you can see Matt 24:20 isn't saying we have to keep the Sabbath. This happened within their generation. Which is 40 years, which fits with this Scripture in Matt 24 here:

Matt 24:34 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.

 

[Shamah]

You keep posting completely unrelated verses. Right now we are focusing on Jesus is our Sabbath.

The word explains itself, other verses and other Scriptures are valid in the discussion, it is clear to me that you have no intent on an open discussion but have your mind made up.

You made an interesting point here:

Let's look at Matt 24:1 to understand this...

1Jesus left the temple and was going away, when his disciples came to point out to him the buildings of the temple. 2But he answered them, “You see all these, do you not? Truly, I say to you, there will not be left here one stone upon another that will not be thrown down.

Jesus is talking about the temple here. History tells us that because of the gold in the temple, Romans tore each brick apart stone by stone to get the gold. This happened in 70 AD. Just under 40 years from when Jesus spoke these words.

3As he sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”

The disciples ask Jesus when will this happen? Speaking of the temple. And the end of the age which we could debate about what that means, some say it's to come others say it happened when the Temple was destroyed. But that's a completely different topic. Let's look at "when these things will be" speaking of the temple being destroyed.

15“So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand),16then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

Now, the holy place has been destroyed (this happened in 70 AD). And v16 says that this is written to those in Judea, I can't flee to the mountains of Judea in California. This is written to the JEWS of Judea. Interestingly enough all the Christians left before Romans sacked Jerusalem because of this prophesy here.

17Let the one who is on the housetop not go down to take what is in his house, 18and let the one who is in the field not turn back to take his cloak. 19And alas for women who are pregnant and for those who are nursing infants in those days! 20Pray that your flight may not be in winter or on a Sabbath.

Notice Jesus is referring to making haste. Getting out of dodge as we say. When you see the abomination of desolation flee. Get out of there. And pray it doesn't happen on a Sabbath. Written to the Jews, that's why we don't find this in any other book. It's specifically to the Hebrews.

But why? Well not happening in Winter is obvious right. But what happened in the times of Sabbath? The gates were locked. And the Jews would police their people not allowing them to leave. This command isn't to say, we will always keep the Sabbath, or to keep the Winter, this is a warning to make haste when they see the abomination of desolation. Which is exactly what happened in 70 AD. Million of Jews were killed. The temple was destroyed. They ran out of wood because of so many crucifixions. And according to the writings of Josephus, which I've read most of during this time period, some people were claiming to be the Messiah.

So as you can see Matt 24:20 isn't saying we have to keep the Sabbath. This happened within their generation. Which is 40 years, which fits with this Scripture in Matt 24 here:

Matt 24:34 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.

"this generation?" you need to look again:

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]"24:34, "“Truly, I say to you, this generation shall by no means pass away until all this takes place.[/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif] What generation? The people He is speaking to? They have all passed away, so either He is a false prophet or there is another meaning. Look at verse 34 closer, “this generation shall by no means pass away until all this takes place.” Many people just look to the destruction of the temple and say, all this has taken place already, but He said “until all this takes place” So would “all this” be?[/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 24:14-15, “And this Good News of the reign shall be proclaimed in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end shall come. So when you see the ’abomination that lays waste,’spoken of by Dani’yl the prophet, set up in the set-apart place” – he who reads, let him understand.”[/FONT]



“[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]spoken of by Dani’yl the prophet” here;[/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Daniel 11:31, "“And strong ones shall arise from him and profane the set-apart place, the stronghold, and shall take away that which is continual, and set up the abomination that lays waste.”[/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Daniel 8:13-14, "Then I heard a certain set-apart one speaking. And another set-apart one said to that certain one who was speaking, “Till when is the vision, concerning that which is continual, and the transgression that lays waste, to make both the set-apart place and the host to be trampled under foot? And he said to me, “For two thousand three hundred nights, then that which is set-apart shall be made right.”[/FONT]



[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Dan 9:27, “And he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week. And in the middle of the week he shall put an end to sacrifice and meal offering. And on the wing of abominations he shall lay waste, even until the complete end and that which is decreed is poured out on the one who lays waste.”[/FONT]

 

[Cee]

Perfect. Yes this is good. Ask me about what I'm saying and I'll refer to what you're saying.

Ok 2 things, if I may.

Then what do these verses mean?

2 Thessalonians 1:5-10, “Clear evidence of the righteous judgment of יהוה, in order for you to be counted worthy of the reign of יהוה, for which you also suffer, since יהוה shall rightly repay with affliction those who afflict you, and to give you who are afflicted rest with us when the Master יהושע is revealed from heaven with His mighty messengers....”

Alright so 2 Thess 1:7 I already showed isn't the same word "rest" in Hebrews 4. It's a completely different word talking about something other than God's Sabbath rest found in Christ. Let me know if anything on that is unclear.

Revelation 14:12-13, "14:12, "Here is the endurance of the set-apart ones,c here are those guarding the commands of Elohim and the belief of יהושע. And I heard a voice from heaven saying to me: Write:

Blessed are the dead, the ones dying in the Messiah from now on! Yes, says the Spirit: because they will rest from their labors, and their works do follow them!"

Please notice in this Scripture you're posting that it says, they will rest from their labors in Christ.

Revelation 14

12 Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying, “Write this: Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on.” “Blessed indeed,” says the Spirit, “that they may rest from their labors, for their deeds follow them!”

Okay so creating doctrine out of Revelation is scary indeed. Because it's prophetic book, which means we can't create a doctrine from an unclear Scripture. I have seen a lot of doctrines created from Revelation that are very off base. I think we must remember Revelation is about the Revelation of Christ and His supremacy. Not the Revelation of the 7 mountains, the anti-christ, and etc etc. Which is what people try to do with this book.

Now upon first view it might appear He's talking about the 10 commandments, but the commandments of God are to love one another. These are the deeds that follow the saints.

John 21Beloved, if our heart does not condemn us, we have confidence before God; 22and whatever we ask we receive from him, because we keep his commandments and do what pleases him. 23And this is his commandment, that we believe in the name of his Son Jesus Christ and love one another, just as he has commanded us.

And in case you think this doesn't fit the time period of the end of our lives. Let me take another verse that Jesus spoke regarding this focus. Look what He says:

Matt 25:31“When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne.32Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.33And he will place the sheep on his right, but the goats on the left.34Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.35For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me,36I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’37Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink?38And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you?39And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’40And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’

And then we have the goats...

41“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, 43I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ 44Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ 45Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’ 46And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

So you can see Jesus is talking about the commandments of God as believe on Him who He sent. And love one another as He loves us. He so identifies with us, that how we treat one another we treat Him. These are the "deeds or works" that follow us.

and do the prophets speak of future things as if they have already happed because:

Isaiah 46:10, “Declaring the end from the beginning, and from of old that which has not yet been done, saying, ‘My counsel does stand, and all My delight I do.”

here is an example;

Ezekiyl 28:13-19, “You were in Ĕḏen, the garden of the Most High. Every precious stone was your covering: the ruby, topaz, and diamond, beryl, shoham, and jasper, sapphire, turquoise, and emerald and gold. The workmanship of your settings and mountings was prepared for you on the day you were created. You were the anointed keruḇ that covered. And I placed you, you were on the set-apart mountain of Yah. You walked up and down in the midst of stones of fire. You were perfect in your ways from the day you were created, until unrighteousness was found in you. By the greatness of your trade you became filled with violence within, and you sinned. So I thrust you from the mountain of Yah, and I destroyed you, O covering keruḇ, from the midst of the stones of fire. Your heart was lifted up because of your loveliness, you corrupted your wisdom for the sake of your splendour. I threw you to the earth, I laid you before sovereigns, to look at you. You profaned your set-apart places by your many crookednesses, by the unrighteousness of your trading. Therefore I brought forth fire from your midst. It has devoured you, and I turned you to ashes upon the earth before the eyes of all who see you. All who knew you among the peoples were astonished at you. Waste you shall be, and cease to be, forever.”



" Therefore I brought forth fire from your midst. It has devoured you"

yet satan has not yet been devoured....

 

[Shamah]

John 21Beloved, if our heart does not condemn us, we have confidence before God; 22and whatever we ask we receive from him, because we keep his commandments and do what pleases him. 23And this is his commandment, that we believe in the name of his Son Jesus Christ and love one another, just as he has commanded us.

I see you isolate. What about the rest of John?What about everything the messiah said?> Ones name is their authority, if we "beleive His name" we will do what He says

1 John 5:2-3, “By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy.”


The person who says they know Him and does not guard His Commands is called a liar in Scripture:


1 John 2:3-7, “And by this we know that we know Him, if we guard His commands. The one who says, “I know Him,” and does not guard His commands, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever guards His Word, truly the love of Yah has been perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. The one who says he stays in Him ought himself also to walk, even as He walked. Beloved, I write no fresh command to you, but an old command which you have had from the beginning. The old command is the Word which you heard from the beginning.”


Genesis 1:1, “In the beginning Elohim created the heavens and the earth.”


1 John 2:24, "As for you, let that stay in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning stays in you, you also shall stay in the Son and in the Father."


Deuteronomy 6:5, “And you shall love יהוה your Strength with all your heart, and with all your being, and with all your might.”


Leviticus 19:18, ‘Do not take vengeance or bear a grudge against the children of your people. And you shall love your neighbour as yourself. I am יהוה.”


Mat 22:37-40, “Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. (Deut 6:5) This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. (Lev 19:18) On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”

This is probably the most important prophecy in all the Word:


if we "beleive His name" we will do what He says


Acts 7:37-38, “This is the Mosheh who said to the children of Yisra’yl, ‘יהוה your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear.’ This is he who was in the assembly in the wilderness with the Messenger who spoke to him on Mount Sinai, and with our fathers, who received the living Words to give to us.”


John/Yahanan 5:46-47, "For had you believed Mosheh, you would have believed Me, for he wrote about Me*. But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?"

*Mosheh wrote:

Deuteronomy 18:18-19, “I (YHWH) will raise up for them a Prophet (Yahshua/Jesus) like you from among their brothers, and I will put My words in His mouth, and He will tell them everything I command Him. Whoever will not listen to My words, which He speaks in My Name, I will judge him for it.”

"listen" is word #8085 - שָׁמַעshama` {shaw-mah'}

Brown-Driver-Briggs (Old Testament Hebrew-English Lexicon)
A primitive root; to hear intelligently (often with implication of attention, obedience, etc.; causatively to tell, etc.)

Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar) - 1) to hear, listen to, obey


John/Yahanan 12:48, “He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day.”



Acts 3:22-23, “For Mosheh truly said to the fathers, ‘יהוה your Mighty One shall raise up for you a Prophet like me from your brothers. Him you shall hear according to all matters, whatever He says to you. And it shall be that every being who does not hear that Prophet shall be utterly


Luke 6:46, "And why call Me; Ruler! Ruler! and do not the things which I say?"

destroyed from among the people.”



if we "beleive His name" we will do what He says.. not trying to be rude, I respect you, but I see there are mant scripture you will not touch.


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]James 2:14, “My brothers, what use is it for anyone to say he has belief but does not have works? This belief is unable to save him.”[/FONT]



John/Yahanan 12:48, “He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day.”








In your view, would "believeing His name" include following what He said to do?

 

[Shamah]

Also this:

and do the prophets speak of future things as if they have already happed because:




Isaiah 46:10, “Declaring the end from the beginning, and from of old that which has not yet been done, saying, ‘My counsel does stand, and all My delight I do.”

here is an example;

Ezekiyl 28:13-19, “You were in Ĕḏen, the garden of the Most High. Every precious stone was your covering: the ruby, topaz, and diamond, beryl, shoham, and jasper, sapphire, turquoise, and emerald and gold. The workmanship of your settings and mountings was prepared for you on the day you were created. You were the anointed keruḇ that covered. And I placed you, you were on the set-apart mountain of Yah. You walked up and down in the midst of stones of fire. You were perfect in your ways from the day you were created, until unrighteousness was found in you. By the greatness of your trade you became filled with violence within, and you sinned. So I thrust you from the mountain of Yah, and I destroyed you, O covering keruḇ, from the midst of the stones of fire. Your heart was lifted up because of your loveliness, you corrupted your wisdom for the sake of your splendour. I threw you to the earth, I laid you before sovereigns, to look at you. You profaned your set-apart places by your many crookednesses, by the unrighteousness of your trading. Therefore I brought forth fire from your midst. It has devoured you, and I turned you to ashes upon the earth before the eyes of all who see you. All who knew you among the peoples were astonished at you. Waste you shall be, and cease to be, forever.”



" Therefore I brought forth fire from your midst. It has devoured you"

yet satan has not yet been devoured....



so do the prophets speak of future things as if they have already happed

 

[Shamah]

Okay so creating doctrine out of Revelation is scary indeed. Because it's prophetic book, which means we can't create a doctrine from an unclear Scripture. I have seen a lot of doctrines created from Revelation that are very off base. I think we must remember Revelation is about the Revelation of Christ and His supremacy. Not the Revelation of the 7 mountains, the anti-christ, and etc etc. Which is what people try to do with this book.

Now upon first view it might appear He's talking about the 10 commandments, but the commandments of God are to love one another. These are the deeds that follow the saints.

Revelation 14:13, "And I heard a voice from heaven saying to me: Write:Blessed are the dead, the ones dying in the Messiah from now on! Yes, says the Spirit: because they will rest from their labors, and their works do follow them!"


MMM, I see you disarmed that one ...

Mat 22:37-40, “Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. (Deut 6:5) This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. (Lev 19:18) On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”


“all” is word #G3650 - holos - Strong's Concordance, holos: whole, complete, Original Word: ὅλος, η, ον, Part of Speech: Adjective, Transliteration: holos, Phonetic Spelling: (hol'-os), Short Definition: all, the whole, entire, Definition: all, the whole, entire, complete


Greek Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)
1) all, whole, completely


Matt 5:18, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh--the smallest of the letters--will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."


Revelation 21:1-2, "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no more sea. And I, Yahanan, saw the holy city, YHWH Shammah, coming down from YHWH out of heaven, prepared as brides adorned for their husbands. And I heard a great voice out of heaven, saying: Behold, the tabernacle of YHWH is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they will be His people, and YHWH Himself will be with them, and be their Father.”

Is there any way to be loving other than the way YHWH says? In His word?


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1, "And [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]spoke to Mosheh, saying,"[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]2, "“Speak to all the congregation of the children of Yisra’yl, and say to them, ‘Be set-apart, for I [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Strength am set-apart."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]3, "‘Each one of you should fear his mother and his father, and guard My Sabbaths. I am [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Strength."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]4, "‘Do not turn to idols, and do not make for yourselves molded mighty ones. I am [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Strength."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]9, "‘And when you reap the harvest of your land, do not completely reap the corners of your field or gather the gleanings of your harvest."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]10, "‘And do not glean your vineyard or gather every grape of your vineyard, leave them for the poor and the stranger. I am [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Strength."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]11, "‘Do not steal, do not lie, do not deceive one another."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]12, "‘And do not swear falsely by My Name and so profane the Name of your Strength. I am [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]13, "‘Do not oppress your neighbor or rob him. The wages of him who is hired is not to remain with you all night until morning."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]14, "‘Do not curse the deaf or put a stumbling-block before the blind, but fear your Mighty One. I am [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Acts 20:28, "Therefore, be on guard for yourselves and the whole flock over which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to feed the called out ones of YHWH, which Yahshua has purchased with His own blood."
[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]15, "‘Do no unrighteousness in right-ruling. Do not be partial to the poor or favor the face of the great, but rightly judge your neighbor in righteousness."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]James 2:1-4, “My brothers,a show no partiality as you hold the faith in our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory. 2For if a man wearing a gold ring and fine clothing comes into your assembly, and a poor man in shabby clothing also comes in, 3and if you pay attention to the one who wears the fine clothing and say, “You sit here in a good place,” while you say to the poor man, “You stand over there,” or, “Sit down at my feet,” 4have you not then made distinctions among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts?[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Isayah 1:17, “Learn to do what is good. Seek justice. Correct the oppressor. Defend the rights of the fatherless. Plead the widow’s cause.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 5:30, “Of Myself I am unable to do any matter. As I hear, I judge, and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own desire, but the desire of the Father who sent Me."

John 7:24, “Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.”[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
You shall not go about tale-bearing or slandering among your people.

James 4:11, "Brothers, do not speak against one another. He that speaks against a brother and judges his brother, speaks against the Law and judges the Law. And if you judge the Law, you are not a doer of the Law but a judge."

Proverbs 10:18, “He who hides hatred has lying lips, And he who sends out a slander is a fool.”

Psalm 31:18, “Let lips of falsehood be silenced, which speak recklessly against the righteous, With pride and scorn.” [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]16, "‘Do not go slandering among your people. Do not stand against the blood of your neighbor. I am [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 7:12-14, "Therefore, all things you want men to do to you, do the same to them, for this is the (intent of the) Law and the Prophets. Enter in through the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and many are those who go that way. Because straight is the gate, and narrow is the way which leads to life, and few there are who find it."
[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 27:4, "saying, “I have sinned in delivering up innocent blood.” And they said, “What is that to us? You see to it!”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif](stand against the blood of thy neighbour] This expression has been differently interpreted: taken in connexion with the preceding warning against being a talebearer, it seems to forbid endangering the life of an innocent man by bearing false witness. Cp. Eze 22:9, part of a passage which describes with verbal similarity many of the evil doings which are forbidden in this ch. and the preceding one. Witnessing truly against a murderer is not forbidden, and Targ. Ps-Jon. explains this clause so as to enforce that duty; ‘be not silent about thy neighbour’s blood, when thou knowest the truth.’ Another interpretation is, ‘thou shalt not stand (without rendering help) by the blood of thy neighbour,’ i.e. when he is in peril of his life.)[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]17, "‘Do not hate your brother in your heart. Reprove your neighbor, for certain, and bear no sin because of him."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Titus 1:9, "Holding fast the teaching according to the faithful word in order that he may be able, by sound doctrine, both to exhort and to refute those who contradict."

2 Timothy 3:16, All Scripture is breathed out by Yah and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for setting straight, for instruction in righteousness.”

Proverbs 24:25-26, "But he who rebukes the wicked will be a delight, and a righteous blessing will be called upon him. A fitting; appropriate, answer is like a kiss on the lips."

Proverbs 10:17, "He who keeps instruction is in the way of life, but he who refuses reproof goes astray."

Proverbs 12:1, "Whoever loves instruction loves knowledge, but he who hates correction is brutish" [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]18, "‘Do not take vengeance or bear a grudge against the children of your people. And you shall love your neighbor as yourself. I am [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Luke 17:3-4, "So be on your guard! If your brother trespasses against you, rebuke him! But if he repents, forgive him! And if he trespasses against you seven times in one day, and seven times in that day turns to you, and says; I repent; then you must forgive him."Do not prostitute your daughter, to cause her to be a harlot; or the land will fall into harlotry, and the land will become full of wickedness. Do not turn to mediums nor familiar spirits. Do not seek after them, to be defiled by them. I am YHWH.

You shall stand up before the gray headed, and you shall honor the presence of an Elder or Teacher; thereby giving reverence to your Heavenly Father. I am YHWH.

Ephesians 6:2-3, "Honor your father and mother; which is the first commandment with a promise: That it may be well with you, and you may live long on the earth." [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]32, "‘Rise up before the gray-headed. And you shall favor the face of an old man, and shall fear your Strength. I am [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]33, "‘And when a stranger sojourns with you in your land, do not oppress him."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]34, "‘Let the stranger who dwells among you be to you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself. For you were strangers in the land of Mitsrayim. I am [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Strength."[/FONT]

 

[Shamah]

Revelation 14:13, "And I heard a voice from heaven saying to me: Write:Blessed are the dead, the ones dying in the Messiah from now on! Yes, says the Spirit: because they will rest from their labors, and their works do follow them!"

Blessed are the dead, the ones dying in the Messiah from now on! Yes, says the Spirit: because they will rest


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 11:27-30, "All things have been delivered to Me by My Father. And no one fully knows the Son except the Father, neither does anyone fully know the Father, except the Son and those whom YHWH wills the Son to reveal. Come to Me, all who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you, and learn of Me; for I am meek and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light"[/FONT]


Blessed are the dead, the ones dying in the Messiah from now on! Yes, says the Spirit: because they will rest


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 11:27-30, "All things have been delivered to Me by My Father. And no one fully knows the Son except the Father, neither does anyone fully know the Father, except the Son and those whom YHWH wills the Son to reveal. Come to Me, all who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you, and learn of Me; for I am meek and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light"

[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Jeremiah 6:9-17, “Thus said יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]of hosts, “Let them thoroughly glean as a vine the remnant of Yisra’yl; pass your hand again over the branches like a grape-gatherer. To whom shall I speak and give warning, so that they hear? See, their ear is uncircumcised, and they are unable to listen. See, the word of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]is a reproach to them, they do not delight in it. Therefore I am filled with the wrath of [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]. I have become weary of containing it. Pour it out on the children outside, and on the company of young men together, for even husband and wife shall be taken, the aged and the very old. And their houses shall be turned over to others, fields and wives together. For I shall stretch out My hand against the inhabitants of the land,” declares [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], “For from the least of them even to the greatest of them, they are all greedy for gain. And from the prophet even to the priest, all act falsely. And they heal the breach of My people slightly, saying, ‘Peace, peace,’ when there is no peace. Were they ashamed when they had done abomination? No! They were not at all ashamed, nor did they know how to blush. Therefore they shall fall among those who fall. They shall stumble at the time I visit them,” said [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], “Thus said יהוה[FONT=Times New Roman, serif], “Stand in the ways and see, and ask for the old paths, where the good way is, and walk in it; and find rest for yourselves[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif].” But they said, ‘We do not walk in it.’ “And I raised up watchmen over you, and said, ‘Listen to a voice of the trumpet!’ But they said, ‘We do not listen.’[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
[/FONT]

 

[Cee]

I think we are going in circles, but it was a fun discourse. Thanks for challenging me and I went to the Word and found an even stronger foundation to stand on as a result. Bless you my friend.

 

[Shamah]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Yah says He will not change what He has said:

Psalm 89:26-37, "He will call out to Me; You are my Father, O YHWH! You are the Rock of my salvation! And I will make Him My firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth. My mercy I will keep for Him forever and My covenant will stand fast with Him. And I will establish his Seed forever, and his throne will be as the days of heaven. Should his children forsake My Law, and refuse to walk in My judgments; Should they profane My statutes, and fail to keep My commandments; Then I will punish their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with lashes from the whip. Nevertheless, My lovingkindness I will not utterly withdraw from him, nor will I ever betray My faithfulness. My covenant I will not break, nor will I change what has gone out of My lips. Once for all, I have vowed by My holiness--I cannot lie, and I say to David: His Seed will endure forever, and his throne will endure before Me like the sun. His throne will be established forever like the moon: the faithful witness in the sky."
[/FONT]

 

[Cee]

Well one of His covenants was circumcisions and I'm sure you'd agree Scripture is clear that we no longer do that.

Yah says He will not change what He has said:

Psalm 89:26-37, "He will call out to Me; You are my Father, O YHWH! You are the Rock of my salvation! And I will make Him My firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth. My mercy I will keep for Him forever and My covenant will stand fast with Him. And I will establish his Seed forever, and his throne will be as the days of heaven. Should his children forsake My Law, and refuse to walk in My judgments; Should they profane My statutes, and fail to keep My commandments; Then I will punish their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with lashes from the whip. Nevertheless, My lovingkindness I will not utterly withdraw from him, nor will I ever betray My faithfulness. My covenant I will not break, nor will I change what has gone out of My lips. Once for all, I have vowed by My holiness--I cannot lie, and I say to David: His Seed will endure forever, and his throne will endure before Me like the sun. His throne will be established forever like the moon: the faithful witness in the sky."

 

[Shamah]

I think we are going in circles, but it was a fun discourse. Thanks for challenging me and I went to the Word and found an even stronger foundation to stand on as a result. Bless you my friend.

Be well and praiseYah, may we both walk His path.

 

[Seohce]

You absolutely cannot admit you break the law.....hilariously tragic....

HOW CAN ANYONE NOT UNDER THE LAW BREAK THE LAW?

STOP YOUR DECEPTION AND YOUR PLOY TO DIVIDE THE BELIEVERS.

YOU HAVE CLEARLY DECLARED THAT THE LORD WAS "CURSED", NOW WHO'S AUTHORITY ARE YOU SPEAKING FOR TO QUESTION SOMEONES FAITH?

"LOVE IS THE FULFILLMENT OF THE LAW." AND WHAT IS IMPORTANT IS FAITH THAT WORKS IN LOVE BECAUSE "FAITH WITHOUT WORKS IS DEAD AND A DEAD FAITH CAN SAVE NOONE.

New International Version 1984 Romans 13:11 And do this, understanding the present time. The hour has come for you to WAKE UP from your slumber, because OUR SALVATION IS NEARER NOW than when we FIRST BELIEVED.

New International Version 1984 Ephesians 5:8-14 For you were once darkness, but now you are light in the Lord. Live as children of light (for the fruit of the light consists in all goodness, righteousness and truth) and find out what pleases the Lord. Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them. For it is shameful even to mention what the disobedient do in secret. But everything exposed by the light becomes visible, for it is light that makes everything visible. This is why it is said: “wake up, O sleeper, rise from the dead, and Christ will shine on you.”


Revelation 3:1-3 To the Church in Sardis “To the angel of the church in Sardis write: These are the words of him who holds the seven spirits of God and the seven stars. I know your deeds; you have a reputation of being alive, but YOU ARE DEAD. WAKE UP! Strengthen what remains and is about to die, for I have not found your deeds complete in the sight of my God. Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you.

 

[Seohce]

dcon says;

BLAH BLAH BLAH more working for pseudo salvation.....My bible teaches salvation is a present CURRENT possession.....

Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy HAS HE SAVED US <--PAST TENSE

YES..JESUS did become SIN for us....<--Only a deceiver would reject this truth as well....

He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

JESUS was BORN of a WOMAN, BORN UNDER THE LAW and “was CURSED” when he hung on a TREE....<--Only deceivers would reject the word of God which states as much....

Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law, having become a curse for us-- for it is written, "CURSED IS EVERYONE WHO HANGS ON A TREE "

FOLKS any and all who deny the above truths have proven they are not of GOD....DO NOT BELIEVE POST 59510..HE DENIES these truths and supplants them with HALF truths and deceit just like the garden when the serpent removed and then added his own words to the bible.......

Seohce

...”JESUS was BORN of a WOMAN, BORN UNDER THE LAW and “was CURSED” when he hung on a TREE....<--Only deceivers would reject the word of God which states as much....”

THIS IS A CLEAR DECLARATION BY DCON THAT JESUS WAS “CURSED”.

I DECLARE THAT OUR LORD JESUS IS THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD, PURE, HOLY AND UNDEFILED. HE IS THE WAY, THE TRUTH AND THE LIFE AND THE WORD THAT BECAME FLESH.

SINCE WHEN HAS THE GOSPEL CHANGED?

... THAT IF YOU CONFESS WITH YOUR MOUTH “JESUS IS LORD” …...AND YOU WILL BE SAVED. (rom 10:9)

John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 Now, brothers, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand. By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain. For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,

God has said, “Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you.” So we say with confidence, “The Lord is my helper; I will not be afraid. What can man do to me?” Remember your leaders, who spoke the word of God to you. Consider the outcome of their way of life and imitate their faith. Jesus Christ is THE SAME yesterday and today and forever.(heb 13:5-8)

John 6:63 The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life.

Isaiah 5:20-24 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter. Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes and clever in their own sight. Woe to those who are heroes at drinking wine and champions at mixing drinks, who acquit the guilty for a bribe, but deny justice to the innocent. Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for THEY HAVE REJECTED THE LAW OF THE LORD ALMIGHTY and SPURNED THE WORD OF THE HOLY ONE OF ISRAEL.

WOE TO THOSE WHO CALL JESUS “CURSED".

YOU HAVE TO GIVE ACCOUNT FOR THE FF;

FOR REJECTING THE LAW OF THE LORD ALMIGHTY
FOR HAVING SPURNED THE WORD OF THE HOLY ONE OF ISRAEL
FOR CALLING JESUS “CURSED".

Matthew 12:36-37 But I tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken. For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned.”

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You are setting up a false strawman saying all obedience to His Law is "self saving"

nonsense.

1 John 4:19, “We love Him because He first loved us.”

1 John 5:2-3, "By this we know that we love the children of Yah, when we love Yah and guard His commands. For this is the love for Yah, that we guard His commands, and His commands are not heavy."

Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”

John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”

He gave Himself for me, I think I can submit to His commands.

1. The word command does nto mean law. God gave MANY commands. You set up a strawman by trying to make the word "command" mean law
2. If you read my earlier post. You would have seen I spoke of those who follow the law as a means of being morally upright, or righteous (not saved) so you destroyed your argument by trying to say I said something I never argued (that those who follow law ALWAYS do it to be saved) The context of what I just posted, and you responded, was those who DO follow law to be or maintain salvation. if that is not you, then the post was not directed at you.
3. do you believe a person who has been born again, and does not follow mosaic law is still saved? Yes or no.
3.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

This is not about the past, but rather the post you referenced and then accused him of something he neither did nor implied....why cannot you be honest....serious....for one that claims to keep the law you sure tap dance all around it regularly.....

it is amazing that those who preach obedience are some of the most disobedient people. while praising their righteousness, they show how unrighteous they are. Just like the pharisee. they can't see, nor will they admit their sin.

And for the record, He is not called a legalist because he preaches obedience. that's another false accusation and strawman that needs to be nipped..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

sure.

No I have gone back and forth with EG many times. Im talking about his overall doctrine yours too.

tell me this, is this true? this was spoken by the Messiah?

John 5:28-30, “Do not be astonished at this-for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice, and will come forth. Those who have practiced righteousness will be resurrected in order to live; and those who have practiced wickedness will be resurrected in order to be damned.”

this may help some of my disagreements with you.

I am so sick of your false accusations and attacks which are based on false precepts.

How can you say you have gone over this with us many times when you STILL PROVE you have utterly no idea what we believe or preach. You would think after years of back and forth you would have at least a simple grasp of what we believe. but every time you open you mouth in opposition to us, you prove you have but not a clue.

We have taught those verses are true, and told them to you many times. Yes, Those who practice righteousness will get to heaven, Yes those who practice unrighteousness will go to hell.

Who are they?

According to john. those who practice righteousness do it BECAUSE THEY ARE BORN OF GOD.

He who practices unrighteousness (sin) is of his father the devil. and he has NEVER SEEN GOD. or KNOWN HIM.

1 John 3: [SUP]6 [/SUP]Whoever abides in Him does not sin. Whoever sins has neither seen Him nor known Him. [SUP]7 [/SUP]Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. [SUP]8 [/SUP]He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. [SUP]9 [/SUP]Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.

As I have told you many times, You can post verses over and over and over, they do not help you. Because when people confront you to see what you actually think those verses say, They see you have a faulty interpretation of those verses. Highlighted by the fact you use them against people, as if they do not know them. When in reality, THEY KNOW THEM BETTER THAN YOU DO.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

FOLKS any and all who deny the above truths have proven they are not of GOD....DO NOT BELIEVE POST 59510..HE DENIES these truths and supplants them with HALF truths and deceit just like the garden when the serpent removed and then added his own words to the bible.......

Here you go again comparing this man to satan. You really have to stop this. IT will be your downfall.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

so is that verse true or not?

it says "practiced" "righteousness" or "wickedness"

1 John 3 tells you WHO they are. and why they do it.

End of story

 

[Endoscopy]

E....,

The Bible does not change.

The original Greek, Aramaic, and Hebrew languages don't change but current languages change over time. Look at Latin 2000 years ago. It became Spanish, Portuguese, French, Romanian, etc. 400 years has words in the KJV not existing any more and definitions of other words change. For more details about the problems with 1611 English translation here are sites discussing that issue.

KJV Issues

httpse://ehrmanblog.org/problems-with-the-language-of-the-king-james-version/

https://newrepublic.com/article/107222/making-it-new

King James Version issues

Is Your Modern Translation Corrupt? - Christian Research Institute

Why the KJV CANNOT be the only true and correct translation of God's Word.

https://www.gotquestions.org/different-gospel.html

The Use and Misuse of the King James Bible: An Interview with Mark Ward
Jonathan Petersen
March 13, 2018

https://www.biblegateway.com/blog/2...pJobID=1362532267&spReportId=MTM2MjUzMjI2NwS2


​Have fun!!!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Not really....I just want to see you in all honesty say that you break the law....just a simple outright I BREAK THE LAW....not this I don't keep it perfectly or I have sinned etc....

JUST a simple HONEST to GOODNESS....I BREAK THE LAW and then to come down off your high horse and incessant law pushing drivel and be honest with the reason the law was given and that NO AMOUNT of law keeping with justify a man before GOD!

They like to water it down. They do not understand, God does not water it down. If we break even the LEAST of all commands, we are found GUILTY of the WHOLE LAW.

There was only one person who kept the law. And he was crucified and rose again,

The law was NOT GIVEN to show us how to be righteous. It was never intended to do that. It was given to LEAD us to CHRIST.

so all they do is prove they have not yet been led to christ. Because if they did, they would not bve trying to follow some law which can ONLY CONDEMN them, they would instead follow the law of Christ (the law of love or seeking after the spirit).