The Rapture

[Ahwatukee]

So you believe there are seven-headed monsters flying around in space? And there was a man as tall as a cedar tree? And men actually swallow camels and have tree trunks in their eyes. (Just a few of the things you MUST believe if you say you take the Bible literally.)

Willie, why do you even bring up such things? These are all obvious symbolic and hyperbole. That doesn't mean that everything else should be interpreted the same. It should be based on the context. The word of God should be read in the literal sense unless a symbolic interpretation is obvious. After studying Revelation anyone should be able to tell what symbolic and what is literal.

If the literal sense makes good sense, then don't seek any other sense.

 

[PlainWord]

I know, I had NEVER HEARD of a Church teaching that it all happened by 70 AD, including the Second Coming. Even their term Preterism, I had to Google the Meanins about 6 months ago. HENCE I think it is all part of the great FALLING AWAY FROM TRUTH that we were warned about.

I wasn't a preterist until I read history.

 

[tanakh]

I wasn't a preterist until I read history.

Preterism was invented by Luis de Alcasar (1554-1619), a Jesuit Priest who wrote a book called Vestegatio Arcani Sensus in Apocalypsi which was published in 1614 as part of the counter reformation and was designed to counteract accusations that the Pope was the Antichrist by shoving everything into the past. He was the ''mirror twin'' of Francisco Ribera who shoved it all into the distant future with the same aim in mind

 

[Snoozy]

So you believe there are seven-headed monsters flying around in space? And there was a man as tall as a cedar tree? And men actually swallow camels and have tree trunks in their eyes. (Just a few of the things you MUST believe if you say you take the Bible literally.)

u are just playing dumb and mocking again. everyone knows the bible has symbols but da symbols are clearly explained in tha bible like da many parables of Jesus. there is a big difference in taking those as symbols but these guys symbolize 1000 year time periods and cities with specific measurements given.

 

[Bogadile]

Preterism was invented by Luis de Alcasar (1554-1619), a Jesuit Priest who wrote a book called Vestegatio Arcani Sensus in Apocalypsi which was published in 1614 as part of the counter reformation and was designed to counteract accusations that the Pope was the Antichrist by shoving everything into the past. He was the ''mirror twin'' of Francisco Ribera who shoved it all into the distant future with the same aim in mind

This is hilarious. Preterism is invented by Luis de Alcasar and pre-trib rapture by John Darby. Premillennialism is invented by Justin Martyr, amillennialism is invented by Origen and Augustine, postmillennialism was invented by the reformers.

It truly is possible to discredit any view by linking it to some man, the only way we will discover the ultimate truth is from the Scriptures themselves by harmonizing, cross-referencing, comparing and looking at the context and doing so with prayer and guidance of the Holy Spirit. Why doesn´t everyone believe the same being that the Holy Spirit is supposed to lead us into ALL truth? Or is the all truth Jesus Christ our Lord Himself and in regards to salvation?

 

[tanakh]

The truth is that no one has the complete truth about End Time Prophecy, because each individual looks at Scripture through one of the several theological ' lenses ' that are currently taught by Pastors and Theologians. Some lenses have more truth than others. The worst being Dispensationalism which is rooted in the interpretation of a Jesuit Priest and 19th Century cultists this makes the Church or the Bride as some prefer to call it a comfortable stress free future to look forward to with all the tribulation and persecution left for the Jews. Next in line is Preterism that was also rooted in the writings of a Jesuit and also leaves the Jews with all the tribulation and bad times, but also claims the second coming and everything else has happened. Which sounds something like the message the Thessalonians were getting. There is a Partial version that has some vague belief in a second coming but most Preterists go for the full blown version. I dont have the time to go through the others but any good book on the subject will fill in the rest.

 

[Snoozy]

The truth is that no one has the complete truth about End Time Prophecy, because each individual looks at Scripture through one of the several theological ' lenses ' that are currently taught by Pastors and Theologians. Some lenses have more truth than others. The worst being Dispensationalism which is rooted in the interpretation of a Jesuit Priest and 19th Century cultists this makes the Church or the Bride as some prefer to call it a comfortable stress free future to look forward to with all the tribulation and persecution left for the Jews. Next in line is Preterism that was also rooted in the writings of a Jesuit and also leaves the Jews with all the tribulation and bad times, but also claims the second coming and everything else has happened. Which sounds something like the message the Thessalonians were getting. There is a Partial version that has some vague belief in a second coming but most Preterists go for the full blown version. I dont have the time to go through the others but any good book on the subject will fill in the rest.

isnt it weird to u why u and others so fiercely attack tha pre-trib rapture the blessed hope of da church? i dont care about any of these bums in the 19th century i read the distinction between church and israel from the bible. if u dont rightly divide the word of truth when studying the bible u can study for 80 years and still be a novice. because of this distinction between israel and the church u must understand that it is the time of jacob's trouble not church's! look what it says in daniel 70 weeks are decreed upon your people (israel) and your holy city (Jerusalem).
no one is afraid of persecution this is a lie chinese christians believe in the blessed hope and are terribly persecuted same with my african brothers in sudan and other places.

 

[Willie-T]

Willie, why do you even bring up such things? These are all obvious symbolic and hyperbole. That doesn't mean that everything else should be interpreted the same. It should be based on the context. The word of God should be read in the literal sense unless a symbolic interpretation is obvious. After studying Revelation anyone should be able to tell what symbolic and what is literal.

If the literal sense makes good sense, then don't seek any other sense.

Exactly. If the Bible tells you someone says an event is to literally happen "soon", why would anyone look for some way to try and make that mean 2,000 years in the future? That particular word couldn't have been delivered more plainly.

 

[heartofdavid]

WOW, and just when I had given up on you ever understanding that. GOD amazes me again.

Woah,I just saw this.

This is huge.

He is off ignore

 

[heartofdavid]

Great to see some men of the Lord like Ahwatukee and VCO here who believe that God says what He means and means what He says in the bible. God bless, stay strong uce

Yes,I applaud them as well

 

[heartofdavid]

lol preterism came before pre tribulation millennialism. Now THAT IS the great falling away from the truth,

So,in order to be right with God,we need to believe the flying scorpions are just spirits,and the mark was not really a mark,that Israel becoming a nation is a joke,and that fiery hailstones are what?,menacing trials?
Then,I suppose we also need to believe,Jesus was having a bad day when he prophesied" such as the world....will never see again".

What a bizarre altar call.

 

[Bogadile]

It's beginning to look to me like the coming of the Son of man and the coming of Christ are 2 different things.

This sounds very interesting, could you elaborate?

 

[iamsoandso]

The truth is that no one has the complete truth about End Time Prophecy, because each individual looks at Scripture through one of the several theological ' lenses ' that are currently taught by Pastors and Theologians. Some lenses have more truth than others. The worst being Dispensationalism which is rooted in the interpretation of a Jesuit Priest and 19th Century cultists this makes the Church or the Bride as some prefer to call it a comfortable stress free future to look forward to with all the tribulation and persecution left for the Jews. Next in line is Preterism that was also rooted in the writings of a Jesuit and also leaves the Jews with all the tribulation and bad times, but also claims the second coming and everything else has happened. Which sounds something like the message the Thessalonians were getting. There is a Partial version that has some vague belief in a second coming but most Preterists go for the full blown version. I dont have the time to go through the others but any good book on the subject will fill in the rest.

Yep, many times some things start off by sounding really good and sensible and seems to fit together until we lay in bed at night and think. Then we ask ourselves "well then but that means,and then there are 3 instead of 2,but then what about?" and then it seems like were all missing puzzle pieces because we know we still have a handful but they just wont go. Eventually we will I hope think to look for a piece that we fitted into it by bending the taps a little and realize that if we took it back up and found the correct one then the rest will fall into place.

 

[heartofdavid]

It's beginning to look to me like the coming of the Son of man and the coming of Christ are 2 different things.

Thank you.

Yes it is absolutely impossible for the second coming in power to be the same event as the gathering of the bride.

If you isolate the bride/ groom gathering and study the wedding,the betrothal,the feast,the book if Ruth,and the 10 virgin parable,it is vividly clear what is on heavens agenda.
The GT is a secondary dimension.

 

[tanakh]

isnt it weird to u why u and others so fiercely attack tha pre-trib rapture the blessed hope of da church? i dont care about any of these bums in the 19th century i read the distinction between church and israel from the bible. if u dont rightly divide the word of truth when studying the bible u can study for 80 years and still be a novice. because of this distinction between israel and the church u must understand that it is the time of jacob's trouble not church's! look what it says in daniel 70 weeks are decreed upon your people (israel) and your holy city (Jerusalem).
no one is afraid of persecution this is a lie chinese christians believe in the blessed hope and are terribly persecuted same with my african brothers in sudan and other places.

Because those 'Bums'invented it thats why and are still deceiving people like yourself although they have been dead for over 150 years. You mention Chinese Christians being persecuted. Corrie Ten Boon a Dutch Christian who was sent to a concentration camp for helping Jews to escape wrote about Chinese Christians who died in their thousands under communism.
She said that many died because their Pastors told them not to worry because they would be raptured. She died in 1983. So it was those same ''Bums'' who cost them their lives

 

[tanakh]

This is hilarious. Preterism is invented by Luis de Alcasar and pre-trib rapture by John Darby. Premillennialism is invented by Justin Martyr, amillennialism is invented by Origen and Augustine, postmillennialism was invented by the reformers.

It truly is possible to discredit any view by linking it to some man, the only way we will discover the ultimate truth is from the Scriptures themselves by harmonizing, cross-referencing, comparing and looking at the context and doing so with prayer and guidance of the Holy Spirit. Why doesn´t everyone believe the same being that the Holy Spirit is supposed to lead us into ALL truth? Or is the all truth Jesus Christ our Lord Himself and in regards to salvation?

Please refer to my post 5126

 

[Bogadile]

Please refer to my post 5126

I did. Still I find it strange that we do not all share similar doctrine if the Holy Spirit teaches us all things and leads to all truth. Something is wrong.

 

[VCO]

The Earth = Israel

Mt 10:34 “Do not think that I came to bring peace on earth. I did not come to bring peace but a sword.
. . .

As my Scotch/Irish ancestors would have said: Malarkey!

 

[VCO]

I wasn't a preterist until I read history.

1 John 2:19 (HCSB)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] They went out from us, but they did not belong to us; for if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us. However, they went out so that it might be made clear that none of them belongs to us.

 

[Issachar92]

I wasn't a preterist until I read history.

Let me decode this for y'all: "I didn't arrive to preterism by reading the Bible but by reading history and forcing it to fit the Bible"