Catholic believe pope is infallible

Bladerunner · Jul 15, 2017

Hi Katy.....Are you arguing with yourself again?lol

If you want to find out about the Catholic Church from the beginning, David Hunt has done a lot of research... there are one or two things I see as wrong but the rest of it is dead on......... The name of the book is "The Woman Rides the Beast". They have it on E-kindle through Amazon for a largely reduced price.

You are correct that Peter was not their first pope. In fact, he was never in Rome or was never a Bishop. If he had been, Paul A roman citizen would have spoken of him in those capacities, yet he did not.

Katy-follower · Jul 16, 2017

FranC said:

The Holy Spirit is Christ's representative on earth, not a pope.

The pope claims the title of "Vicar of Christ," but the only one worthy to claim such a title would be the Holy Spirit. Not that we refer to the Holy Spirit by this name.

Unfortunately the pope does try to take the place of the Holy Spirit on earth.

John 14:26: "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you"

Copy/paste:

"The Holy Spirit is Christ’s “replacement” on the earth. In claiming that the pope is the “Vicar of Christ,” the Catholic Church rejects the sufficiency and supremacy of Christ’s priesthood, and grants to the pope roles that Christ Himself declared would belong to the Holy Spirit. It is therefore blasphemy to ascribe to the pope the title of “Vicar of Christ.”

onlinebuddy · Jul 16, 2017

FranC said:

Yes, I said that catholics believe that the Bible is an outdated book, and you have confirmed that they do. You too, like catholics, believe that the Bible is not a book for today(You surprise me again!).

This is exactly what's wrong with the catholics. They believe it's more important to read complicated, misleading, mysterious, watered down interpretation of what God has said rather than go to the original- The Bible. In fact, most catholics do not even bother to read the Cathechism of the Catholic Church. They happen to read catechism booklets only before receiving the first holy communion, and before receiving confirmation, as the catholic church makes catechism classes compulsory at those times.

I think the bible IS A BOOK FOR TODAY. The Bible is a book for yesterday, today and tomorrow. It will never get outdated.

Here's why:
=>This is what the Bible speaks about itself. The Bible is living and active, not outdated.
12 For the word of God is alive and active.(Heb 4:12)

=>In every generation, the Bible addresses the main problem that takes man away from God and closer to satan- Sin
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,(Romans 3:23)

=>The Bible shows how God has initiated(taken the first step) with man, in every generation and offered a solution.
24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.(Romans 3:24)

=>The Bible is useful for every good work, in every generation. We do not need man-made interpretations.
[SUP]16[/SUP] All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,[SUP]17[/SUP] so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work. (2 Tim 3:16-17)

=>The Bible addresses the issues of the heart, and convicts and changes a person. Man made teachings cannot do the same. No wonder the average catholic does not see a difference between the church and the world. This problem begins with the leaders, the priests. Priests take a vow of celibacy, and then take the liberty to break that vow. I have personally known catholic priests who have been secretly dating women. As a kid, I often saw the parish priest standing at the corner of the basement immediately after mass and smoking cigarette after cigarette. I have heard personal accounts of homosexuality being rampant in catholic seminaries. We all have heard the recent news about Pope Francis' chief financial advisor. Paul urges the young leader, Timothy, to watch his life and doctrine closely(1 Tim 4:16). If the shepherds of the catholic church have such reputations, what can we say about the flock? The laity follows suit. One can call himself or herself a catholic and yet smoke or get drunk every night or listen to satanic music or wear anything in church or have a live-in relationship or use swear words, and not feel accountable to the community of the catholic clergy or the fellow laity.This is what happens when one follows man made teaching and does not allow the Word of God to speak to them.
12 For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.(Heb 4:12)

=>We will KNOW the truth if we hold to (continue in) the teachings of Jesus(found in the Bible, not in a complicated man-made book with man-made jargon). Conversely, if one does not hold to the teachings of Jesus, one will not know the truth.
31 To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, “If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples.32 Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”(John 8:31-32)

=>In every generation, the Bible teaches us the commands of God, not the tradition of men. Catechism binds a person to tradition, and teaches them lip service. If we do not know and obey the teachings of the Bible, our worship and devotion is in vain.
7 You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you:
8 “‘These people honor me with their lips,
but their hearts are far from me.
9 They worship me in vain;
their teachings are merely human rules.(Matthew 15: 7-9)

=>In every generation, man requires spiritual food. Where does one get spiritual food from? From the Word of God- The Bible, not from the teachings of men
4 Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.(Matthew 4:4)

=>We are judged/assessed/saved/condemned/ by the very words spoken by Jesus (which are the words of God), and are found in the Bible. How will someone know the words of Jesus, if they say the Bible is not for today?
7 “If anyone hears my words but does not keep them, I do not judge that person. For I did not come to judge the world, but to save the world.48 There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; the very words I have spoken will condemn them at the last day.49 For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.50 I know that his command leads to eternal life. So whatever I say is just what the Father has told me to say.”(John 12:47-50)

onlinebuddy · Jul 16, 2017

FranC said:

Why? Why must there be a priest involved in everything? The answer is simple: The priests are trained to be in control, and not allow Jesus to be in control. The laity are kept from having a personal relationship in God and are made dependent on the clergy. Without a priest, nothing a catholic does among the community is valid. This is a form of control.

Are we saying that Jesus, the High-Priest would always act through a catholic priest, and would never interact with his loved one directly?

So you had to take the permission of the priest after all! Try starting something on your own, and you will be pulled up and stigmatized for it. At least this is how it happens in my country. Can't blame the women who did not come. Sadly, they are trained that way.

Generally, no one is allowed to teach in the catholic church without going through a rigorous seminary course. Furthermore, they must only use the catholic bible (with the apocrypha), and display compliance and adherence to the various man-made doctrines. Once the training is over, the Bishop or Cardinal will come and "commission" only a few aspirants as "Ministers of the Word" in a particular Archdiocese(why such complicated words?).

One is not free to listen to what God is personally telling him or her. One must only teach what he or she has been taught, and most of what he or she has been taught is hardly in the Bible. Theology and man-made doctrine makes up majority of the course. Even if the Bible is used, it is used out of context.

Yes, anyone can teach Sunday catechism class, and catechism class is more like a social club. Not much of the Bible is taught. Yes, children are encouraged to be active and social and take part in skits and raffles and fun times and develop their talents.

Katy-follower · Jul 16, 2017

Only Jesus is the Chief Shepherd.

1 Peter 5:1-4: "The elders who are among you I exhort, I who am a fellow elder and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that will be revealed: Shepherd the flock of God which is among you, serving as overseers, not by compulsion but willingly, not for dishonest gain but eagerly; nor as being lords over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock; and when the Chief Shepherd appears, you will receive the crown of glory that does not fade away"

Acts 20:28-31: (elders) "Therefore take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood. For I know this, that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock. Also from among yourselves men will rise up, speaking perverse things, to draw away the disciples after themselves. Therefore watch, and remember that for three years I did not cease to warn everyone night and day with tears"

Katy-follower · Jul 16, 2017

I've always remembered this scripture...

Acts 10:25-26: "As Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him and fell down at his feet and worshiped him. But Peter lifted him up, saying, “Stand up; I myself am also a man.”

onlinebuddy · Jul 16, 2017

Katy-follower said:

As in my previous post somewhere, I have agreed that there should be elders, overseers, deacons,etc. However, they must not usurp the authority of the Chief Shepherd. They must teach what the Chief Shepherd has taught, and not add man-made teachings to it. If an elder or overseer does not know what the Chief Shepherd has taught, he is nothing but a blind guide. Furthermore, he should be an example to the flock- not just an administrative head.

Jackson123 · Jul 16, 2017

Katy-follower said:

yep, since the Old Testament, originally God not interested to hired a King for Israel, Gog Hilmself want to be a King. Do not make the same mistake.

1 Samuel 8

6 But when they said, “Give us a king to lead us,” this displeasedSamuel; so he prayed to the Lord. 7 And the Lord told him: “Listen to all that the people are saying to you; it is not you they have rejected,but they have rejected me as their king. 8 As they have done from the day I brought them up out of Egypt until this day, forsaking me and serving other gods, so they are doing to you. 9 Now listen to them; but warn them solemnly and let them know what the king who will reign over them will claim as his rights.”

God said that Israel rejected Him as a King when they ask a human king

onlinebuddy · Jul 16, 2017

FranC said:

Herein lies the problem. Everyone does what he (and not God) feels is right.

[/QUOTE] Can I add to your sentence? It never hurts to do too much of what pleases God. It definitely hurts to do too much of what pleases man. Man made traditions make void the word of God, and are not recognized by God. Therefore worship in a man-made way is worship in vain.

Traditions..customs...habits!

In India, catholic churches are packed beyond their capacity.

Jackson123 · Jul 16, 2017

Katy-follower said:

unfortunately some catholic bow down before Peter statue. I watch a YouTube, in vatican people kiss toe peter statue

Katy-follower · Jul 16, 2017

onlinebuddy said:

This is why we're to be like the Bereans and constantly check all things, not put full trust in our pastor and others in the church, but always check what they teach.

The unsaved blind followers of the blind will also fall in a ditch, so there's no excuse. They can't blame their teachers (Matthew 15:14).

Katy-follower · Jul 16, 2017

Jackson123 said:

Also to the pope.

It's worship of the creature and not the Creator. Very sad

Demi777 · Jul 16, 2017

Jackson123 said:

Just shows how crazy the catholic belief is. Kissing feet that that are thousands of years old...eeek

88 · Jul 16, 2017

Demi777 said:

***maybe some bring a Clorox Wipe...

FranC · Jul 16, 2017

Demi777 said:

They're VERY clean from all those kisses.

WHY does it bother you so much that some persons want to express their love for God in their own way?

Do you think they love Peter?
Maybe they're just thanking him for promoting our faith?

I don't know why they do this... but, Quite Frankly Scarlett, I don't give a .....

What YOU SHOULD BE DOING... is loving your Brother Christians instead of showing hate for them.

FranC · Jul 16, 2017

onlinebuddy said:

Herein lies the problem. Everyone does what he (and not God) feels is right.

WHICH man-made traditions are you speaking about???

FranC · Jul 16, 2017

onlinebuddy said:

What if two elders, two chiefs, two over-seers, or two deacons don't agree?

What then?

There is ONE HEAD to EVERY Church.
EVERY CHURCH has a "Pope".

One is Jimmy Swaggart.
One is Joel Osteen.

And so on....

FranC · Jul 16, 2017

onlinebuddy said:

The priests here know me and I could start a bible study in my home without even telling them.
The problem would be that SOME would call and ask if it's OK for them to attend and it's only courteous that the priest should know what I'm doing.

second of all, you bring up too much.

I'll only say that some mistakes are happening in your country (South Africa?) and I think it's because of, MAYBE, your culture there. I cannot speak to this.

My main point is this....
Let Catholics practice their faith they way they want to. It's not YOUR BUSINESS.
Your only concern is to love your Brother Christian.

FranC · Jul 16, 2017

onlinebuddy said:

Yes, I said that catholics believe that the Bible is an outdated book, and you have confirmed that they do. You too, like catholics, believe that the Bible is not a book for today(You surprise me again!).

This is exactly what's wrong with the catholics. They believe it's more important to read complicated, misleading, mysterious, watered down interpretation of what God has said rather than go to the original- The Bible. In fact, most catholics do not even bother to read the Cathechism of the Catholic Church. They happen to read catechism booklets only before receiving the first holy communion, and before receiving confirmation, as the catholic church makes catechism classes compulsory at those times.

I think the bible IS A BOOK FOR TODAY. The Bible is a book for yesterday, today and tomorrow. It will never get outdated.

Here's why:
=>This is what the Bible speaks about itself. The Bible is living and active, not outdated.
12 [FONT=&]For the word of God[/FONT][FONT=&] is alive and active.(Heb 4:12)
[/FONT]
=>In every generation, the Bible addresses the main problem that takes man away from God and closer to satan- Sin
[FONT=&]23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,[/FONT][FONT=&](Romans 3:23)[/FONT]

=>The Bible shows how God has initiated(taken the first step) with man, in every generation and offered a solution.
24 [FONT=&]and all are justified[/FONT][FONT=&] freely by his grace[/FONT][FONT=&] through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.(Romans 3:24)[/FONT]

=>The Bible is useful for every good work, in every generation. We do not need man-made interpretations.
[SUP]16[/SUP] All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,[SUP]17[/SUP] so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work. (2 Tim 3:16-17)

=>The Bible addresses the issues of the heart, and convicts and changes a person. Man made teachings cannot do the same. No wonder the average catholic does not see a difference between the church and the world. [FONT=&]This problem begins with the leaders, the priests. Priests take a vow of celibacy, and then take the liberty to break that vow. I have personally known catholic priests who have been secretly dating women. As a kid, I often saw the parish priest standing at the corner of the basement immediately after mass and smoking cigarette after cigarette. I have heard personal accounts of homosexuality being rampant in catholic seminaries. We all have heard the recent news about Pope Francis' chief financial advisor. Paul urges the young leader, Timothy, to watch his life and doctrine closely(1 Tim 4:16). If the shepherds of the catholic church have such reputations, what can we say about the flock? The laity follows suit. [/FONT][FONT=&]One can call himself or herself a catholic and yet smoke or get drunk every night or listen to satanic music or wear anything in church or have a live-in relationship or use swear words, and not feel accountable to the community of the catholic clergy or the fellow laity.[/FONT][FONT=&]This is what happens when one follows man made teaching and does not allow the Word of God to speak to them. [/FONT]
12 [FONT=&]For the word of God[/FONT][FONT=&] is alive[/FONT][FONT=&] and active.[/FONT][FONT=&] Sharper than any double-edged sword,[/FONT][FONT=&] it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.(Heb 4:12)

[/FONT]=>We will KNOW the truth if we hold to (continue in) the teachings of Jesus(found in the Bible, not in a complicated man-made book with man-made jargon). Conversely, if one does not hold to the teachings of Jesus, one will not know the truth. [FONT=&]
[/FONT][FONT=&]31 To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, “If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples.[/FONT][FONT=&]32 Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”(John 8:31-32)

[/FONT]=>In every generation, the Bible teaches us the commands of God, not the tradition of men. Catechism binds a person to tradition, and teaches them lip service. If we do not know and obey the teachings of the Bible, our worship and devotion is in vain.
7 You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you:
8 “‘These people honor me with their lips,
but their hearts are far from me.
9 They worship me in vain;
their teachings are merely human rules.(Matthew 15: 7-9)

=>In every generation, man requires spiritual food. Where does one get spiritual food from? From the Word of God- The Bible, not from the teachings of men
4 [FONT=&]Jesus answered, [/FONT][FONT=&]“It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.(Matthew 4:4)

[/FONT]=>We are judged/assessed/saved/condemned/ by the very words spoken by Jesus (which are the words of God), and are found in the Bible. How will someone know the words of Jesus, if they say the Bible is not for today?
[FONT=&]7 “If anyone hears my words but does not keep them, I do not judge that person. For I did not come to judge the world, but to save the world.[/FONT][FONT=&]48 There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; the very words I have spoken will condemn them at the last day.[/FONT][FONT=&]49 For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.[/FONT][FONT=&]50 I know that his command leads to eternal life. So whatever I say is just what the Father has told me to say.”(John 12:47-50)[/FONT]
[FONT=&]
[/FONT]

I DID NOT CONFIRM THAT THE BIBLE IS AN OUTDATED BOOK.

YOU MISUNDERSTOOD MY POST.

FranC · Jul 16, 2017

Katy-follower said:

The Holy Spirit is Christ's representative on earth, not a pope.

The pope claims the title of "Vicar of Christ," but the only one worthy to claim such a title would be the Holy Spirit. Not that we refer to the Holy Spirit by this name.

Unfortunately the pope does try to take the place of the Holy Spirit on earth.

John 14:26: "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you"

Copy/paste:

"The Holy Spirit is Christ’s “replacement” on the earth. In claiming that the pope is the “Vicar of Christ,” the Catholic Church rejects the sufficiency and supremacy of Christ’s priesthood, and grants to the pope roles that Christ Himself declared would belong to the Holy Spirit. It is therefore blasphemy to ascribe to the pope the title of “Vicar of Christ.”

I was speaking to Notuptome.

The way you responded to me is very confusing to those reading along.

I NOW WHO THE HOLY SPIRIT IS.

But thanks for trying.

Catholic believe pope is infallible

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