Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
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No, actually I am quoting Jesus, you know....the great I AM, Immanuel, The WORD, The Lion of Judah, The Only begotten Son of God, the Creator and Sustainer of ALL things, the BEGINNER and FINISHER of my faith, the savior, the messiah......
Thou shalt call his name JESUS, for he shall save his people from their sins.......
and I trust him at his word!
Thou shalt call his name JESUS, for he shall save his people from their sins.......
and I trust him at his word!
AMEN to that.....
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
Their version (the workers for)...the below is an excerpt from (we the workers for salvation crew and our guide to eternal life)
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him,
does many wonderful works, is immersed, sprinkled or got wet in a rain storm, did 98768504 works in my name, spoke in 27 different tongues while raising 18 people from the dead, accurately predicted Monday night's T.V. programming, back flipped down the isle in church while singing amazing grace and just as I am at the same time with one forward and one backward while walking on water at least once
shall not perish, but have eternal life.
How many works meet God's standard..............1, 50, 9000 and 2? There is no hope, nor foundation in faith plus works for salvation!
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
Their version (the workers for)...the below is an excerpt from (we the workers for salvation crew and our guide to eternal life)
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him,
does many wonderful works, is immersed, sprinkled or got wet in a rain storm, did 98768504 works in my name, spoke in 27 different tongues while raising 18 people from the dead, accurately predicted Monday night's T.V. programming, back flipped down the isle in church while singing amazing grace and just as I am at the same time with one forward and one backward while walking on water at least once
shall not perish, but have eternal life.
How many works meet God's standard..............1, 50, 9000 and 2? There is no hope, nor foundation in faith plus works for salvation!
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Whose faith as a work is the key?
What if some believe not the word of God (no faith) Will it make the faith of God without effect?
Grace is the reward of Christ’s work of faith a labor of His love .Not of our own selves coming from the imagination of one’s own heart. Scriptures call a faith coming from one’s own deceitful heart “no faith” it denotes natural man unconverted.
Deuteronomy 32:20 And he said, I will hide my face from them, I will see what their end shall be: for they are a very froward generation, children in whom is no faith.
It is how the word faith (the key that the gates of hell could never prevail against) is used throughout the scriptures. If we would offer our faith as a work, scripture calls it dead .
Heb 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Its not our faith coming from the imagination of our heart that we offer towards him. But the faith of Christ that works in us to both will and do His good pleasure that he freely gives to us..
We can see the work of Christ’s faith, our faithful Creator calming the sea.
And he arose, and rebuked the wind, and said unto the sea, Peace, be still. And the wind ceased, and there was a great calm. And he said unto them, Why are ye so fearful? how is it that ye have no faith?.Mar 4:39
There no faith is used to represent that which we offer towards Him (dead )
1Pe 4:19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.
Not faith in ,towards him. But faith coming from and therefore of the faithful one.
Not without works but in respect to Christ’s works, a labor of His love..this is not of ourselves .
What if some believe not the word of God (no faith) Will it make the faith of God without effect?
Grace is the reward of Christ’s work of faith a labor of His love .Not of our own selves coming from the imagination of one’s own heart. Scriptures call a faith coming from one’s own deceitful heart “no faith” it denotes natural man unconverted.
Deuteronomy 32:20 And he said, I will hide my face from them, I will see what their end shall be: for they are a very froward generation, children in whom is no faith.
It is how the word faith (the key that the gates of hell could never prevail against) is used throughout the scriptures. If we would offer our faith as a work, scripture calls it dead .
Heb 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Its not our faith coming from the imagination of our heart that we offer towards him. But the faith of Christ that works in us to both will and do His good pleasure that he freely gives to us..
We can see the work of Christ’s faith, our faithful Creator calming the sea.
And he arose, and rebuked the wind, and said unto the sea, Peace, be still. And the wind ceased, and there was a great calm. And he said unto them, Why are ye so fearful? how is it that ye have no faith?.Mar 4:39
There no faith is used to represent that which we offer towards Him (dead )
1Pe 4:19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.
Not faith in ,towards him. But faith coming from and therefore of the faithful one.
Not without works but in respect to Christ’s works, a labor of His love..this is not of ourselves .
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How long does it take an apple tree to bear? Before it bears is it an apple tree by birth (seed sprout)?
How many apples are required on the tree to prove it is an apple tree?
At the end of the season when the leaves and fruit have all fallen can you tell it was an apple tree by the dried up apple left by the deer under the tree?
Is faith a gift?
Is salvation a gift?
Is eternal life a gift?
A gift cannot be earned if it was already given BEFORE the CASTING DOWN OF THE WORLD................
How many apples are required on the tree to prove it is an apple tree?
At the end of the season when the leaves and fruit have all fallen can you tell it was an apple tree by the dried up apple left by the deer under the tree?
Is faith a gift?
Is salvation a gift?
Is eternal life a gift?
A gift cannot be earned if it was already given BEFORE the CASTING DOWN OF THE WORLD................
Faith is a gift, and it comes from hearing the Word. No man comes to the Father unless Jesus Christ leads him to Him.
I do like apple pie, apple cobbler, apple crumble, and just about any other baked apple desesert.
No man earns a gift, but once it is received by hearing the Word of God, it impels the joy9ous oul to works.
I do like apple pie, apple cobbler, apple crumble, and just about any other baked apple desesert.
No man earns a gift, but once it is received by hearing the Word of God, it impels the joy9ous oul to works.
Why is it so hard for people to understand the following....
A. Jesus takes worthless, useless sinner (such as myself)
B. He calls me, convicts me, gives me the faith I need as a gift, saves me, justifies me, sanctifies me as (useful) seals me as one of his own and then WORKS THROUGH ME AS A WILLING VESSEL AND LIVING SACRIFICE....
THE ENTIRE process is JESUS, by JESUS, through JESUS and JESUS in US dia the SPIRIT AND THE WORD....
That is WHY works DO NOT SAVE, KEEP SAVED, EMBELLISH OUR SALVATION....that is why MAN CANNOT BOAST or USE WORKS as a valid REASON to ENTER GOD'S kingdom.....
IT IS ALL JESUS and he alone deserves the GLORY and PRAISE!
A. Jesus takes worthless, useless sinner (such as myself)
B. He calls me, convicts me, gives me the faith I need as a gift, saves me, justifies me, sanctifies me as (useful) seals me as one of his own and then WORKS THROUGH ME AS A WILLING VESSEL AND LIVING SACRIFICE....
THE ENTIRE process is JESUS, by JESUS, through JESUS and JESUS in US dia the SPIRIT AND THE WORD....
That is WHY works DO NOT SAVE, KEEP SAVED, EMBELLISH OUR SALVATION....that is why MAN CANNOT BOAST or USE WORKS as a valid REASON to ENTER GOD'S kingdom.....
IT IS ALL JESUS and he alone deserves the GLORY and PRAISE!
Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees. And they reasoned among themselves, saying, It is because we have taken no bread.Which when Jesus perceived, he said unto them, O ye of little faith, why reason ye among yourselves, because ye have brought no bread? Mat 16:6
The little faith there is in respect to Christ’s faith. Rather than reasoning by scripture(the source of Christ’s faith), they reasoned among themselves (philosophy) . This was every time that did not have the spiritual understanding found in parables. .
Luke 9 provides an excellent working example .
Three times in Luke 9, using three to denote the end of the matter they misunderstood the parables. The spiritual understabnding was hid from them for that very purpose. Every time they would deny Christ and look to put their faith in men as to who is the greatest, which we know it is Christ. They missed the mark
Let these sayings sink down into your ears: for the Son of man shall be delivered into the hands of men. But they understood not this saying, and it was hid from them, that they perceived it not: and they feared to ask him of that saying. Then there arose a reasoning among them, which of them should be greatest.And Jesus, perceiving the thought of their heart, took a child, and set him by him,And said unto them, Whosoever shall receive this child in my name receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me receiveth him that sent me: for he that is least among you all, the same shall be great. Luk 9:44-48
Still confused not understanding the parables the apostles argued with Christ as what it is the makes up the true us. Again looking outward at the flesh they accused one who did not follow them in respect to their flesh .Christ defined the us, as that not seen ,the faith principle.
And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name; and we forbad him, because he followeth not with us.And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us. Luk 9:49
It continued using the apostle John and James as a example. They again walking by sight perceived that Christ was heading toward Jerusalem . He enter into a village of the Samaritans(gentiles).and they demanded He send fire to destroy all who were not Jewish . In the end He informed them they “knew not” what “manner” of spirit they are of seeing they were walking by sight, the upside down manner.
And it came to pass, when the time was come that he should be received up, he stedfastly set his face to go to Jerusalem,And sent messengers before his face: and they went, and entered into a village of the Samaritans, to make ready for him.And they did not receive him, because his face was as though he would go to Jerusalem.And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did?But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. Luk 9:51
The little faith there is in respect to Christ’s faith. Rather than reasoning by scripture(the source of Christ’s faith), they reasoned among themselves (philosophy) . This was every time that did not have the spiritual understanding found in parables. .
Luke 9 provides an excellent working example .
Three times in Luke 9, using three to denote the end of the matter they misunderstood the parables. The spiritual understabnding was hid from them for that very purpose. Every time they would deny Christ and look to put their faith in men as to who is the greatest, which we know it is Christ. They missed the mark
Let these sayings sink down into your ears: for the Son of man shall be delivered into the hands of men. But they understood not this saying, and it was hid from them, that they perceived it not: and they feared to ask him of that saying. Then there arose a reasoning among them, which of them should be greatest.And Jesus, perceiving the thought of their heart, took a child, and set him by him,And said unto them, Whosoever shall receive this child in my name receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me receiveth him that sent me: for he that is least among you all, the same shall be great. Luk 9:44-48
Still confused not understanding the parables the apostles argued with Christ as what it is the makes up the true us. Again looking outward at the flesh they accused one who did not follow them in respect to their flesh .Christ defined the us, as that not seen ,the faith principle.
And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name; and we forbad him, because he followeth not with us.And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us. Luk 9:49
It continued using the apostle John and James as a example. They again walking by sight perceived that Christ was heading toward Jerusalem . He enter into a village of the Samaritans(gentiles).and they demanded He send fire to destroy all who were not Jewish . In the end He informed them they “knew not” what “manner” of spirit they are of seeing they were walking by sight, the upside down manner.
And it came to pass, when the time was come that he should be received up, he stedfastly set his face to go to Jerusalem,And sent messengers before his face: and they went, and entered into a village of the Samaritans, to make ready for him.And they did not receive him, because his face was as though he would go to Jerusalem.And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did?But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. Luk 9:51
N
:::death::: at people quoting "this is the work of God" that you believe on him who he has sent.
and then claiming that, believing in him is their work when it clearly says it is the gift of God.
Ephesians even goes on to say not NOT TO BOAST about it and that is what people who are just claiming believe without works are doing. It even goes on to say why he gave the gift of faith or it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9not by works, so that no one can boast. 10For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance as our way of life.…
:
eath:; it then goes on to tell you about your richs and tells you WALK WORTHY OF THE VOCATION wherewith ya are called
Folks can cut and paste, and misquote one verse of the bible like the Lords mercy endureth forever, and the law is done away with, and grace all they want, and not read the other verses in the bible to find what faith, who the righteous are, and is there a difference between law and good works.
The bible is very clear about what will happen to people who take the gift of faith which was given them and have no fruit. He won't let you in the kingdom. It even tell you that you will be beaten with more stripes because you knew what he wanted you to do but didn't do those things. While the person who didn't know will be beaten with less stripes. Because ye reaped where you didn't sow.
okay I am finished this time. I pray that no one on this forum is lead astray by anyone quoting one sentence, and not fullying understanding that sentence, and saying all we must do is have faith and not realize with faith comes the calling to do good works.
But they will have to answer to God for taking verses out of the bible intentionally misleading whoever they lead stray and take the grace of God for granted. When they know exactly what ELSE THE BIBLE SAYS and omit those things and lead people to hell.
Lord have mercy..
and then claiming that, believing in him is their work when it clearly says it is the gift of God.
Ephesians even goes on to say not NOT TO BOAST about it and that is what people who are just claiming believe without works are doing. It even goes on to say why he gave the gift of faith or it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9not by works, so that no one can boast. 10For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance as our way of life.…
:
eath:; it then goes on to tell you about your richs and tells you WALK WORTHY OF THE VOCATION wherewith ya are calledFolks can cut and paste, and misquote one verse of the bible like the Lords mercy endureth forever, and the law is done away with, and grace all they want, and not read the other verses in the bible to find what faith, who the righteous are, and is there a difference between law and good works.
The bible is very clear about what will happen to people who take the gift of faith which was given them and have no fruit. He won't let you in the kingdom. It even tell you that you will be beaten with more stripes because you knew what he wanted you to do but didn't do those things. While the person who didn't know will be beaten with less stripes. Because ye reaped where you didn't sow.
okay I am finished this time. I pray that no one on this forum is lead astray by anyone quoting one sentence, and not fullying understanding that sentence, and saying all we must do is have faith and not realize with faith comes the calling to do good works.
But they will have to answer to God for taking verses out of the bible intentionally misleading whoever they lead stray and take the grace of God for granted. When they know exactly what ELSE THE BIBLE SAYS and omit those things and lead people to hell.
Lord have mercy..
:::death::: at people quoting "this is the work of God" that you believe on him who he has sent.
and then claiming that, believing in him is their work when it clearly says it is the gift of God.
Ephesians even goes on to say not NOT TO BOAST about it and that is what people who are just claiming believe without works are doing. It even goes on to say why he gave the gift of faith or it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9not by works, so that no one can boast. 10For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance as our way of life.…
:eath:; it then goes on to tell you about your richs and tells you WALK WORTHY OF THE VOCATION wherewith ya are called
Folks can cut and paste, and misquote one verse of the bible like the Lords mercy endureth forever, and the law is done away with, and grace all they want, and not read the other verses in the bible to find what faith, who the righteous are, and is there a difference between law and good works.
The bible is very clear about what will happen to people who take the gift of faith which was given them and have no fruit. He won't let you in the kingdom. It even tell you that you will be beaten with more stripes because you knew what he wanted you to do but didn't do those things. While the person who didn't know will be beaten with less stripes. Because ye reaped where you didn't sow.
okay I am finished this time. I pray that no one on this forum is lead astray by anyone quoting one sentence, and not fullying understanding that sentence, and saying all we must do is have faith and not realize with faith comes the calling to do good works.
But they will have to answer to God for taking verses out of the bible intentionally misleading whoever they lead stray and take the grace of God for granted. When they know exactly what ELSE THE BIBLE SAYS and omit those things and lead people to hell.
Lord have mercy..
and then claiming that, believing in him is their work when it clearly says it is the gift of God.
Ephesians even goes on to say not NOT TO BOAST about it and that is what people who are just claiming believe without works are doing. It even goes on to say why he gave the gift of faith or it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9not by works, so that no one can boast. 10For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance as our way of life.…
:
eath:; it then goes on to tell you about your richs and tells you WALK WORTHY OF THE VOCATION wherewith ya are calledFolks can cut and paste, and misquote one verse of the bible like the Lords mercy endureth forever, and the law is done away with, and grace all they want, and not read the other verses in the bible to find what faith, who the righteous are, and is there a difference between law and good works.
The bible is very clear about what will happen to people who take the gift of faith which was given them and have no fruit. He won't let you in the kingdom. It even tell you that you will be beaten with more stripes because you knew what he wanted you to do but didn't do those things. While the person who didn't know will be beaten with less stripes. Because ye reaped where you didn't sow.
okay I am finished this time. I pray that no one on this forum is lead astray by anyone quoting one sentence, and not fullying understanding that sentence, and saying all we must do is have faith and not realize with faith comes the calling to do good works.
But they will have to answer to God for taking verses out of the bible intentionally misleading whoever they lead stray and take the grace of God for granted. When they know exactly what ELSE THE BIBLE SAYS and omit those things and lead people to hell.
Lord have mercy..
a. False
b. Misleading
c. Not true
d. and that make you a.............!
PAY ATTENTION this time...
FAITH PLUS (+) WORKS DO NOT SAVE A MAN
FAITH PLUS (+) WORKS DO NOT KEEP A MAN SAVED
FAITH ALONE SAVES......
NO ONE HAS SAID that a SAVED person will NOT HAVE FRUIT or WORKS......so....refer to A thru D above in my quote!
N
I have been reading this board for a while, and it comes off as many are telling people to just have faith, and are pushing grace grace grace and not going into what that means nor what else you have to do like John said to bring forth fruit worthy of repentance. And anytime anyone dare tells someone to repent or to try to do those things pleasing to the Lord it is met with you are preaching law. As what happened to myself as I was telling people to bring forth fruit and was met with THAT IS LAW.
I do understand what you are saying here. However, we have to have faith in Jesus and allow him to work through us. We can’t work by ourselves. We have to wait on him and let him work. If we are not careful we can get in our own selves and try to run up ahead of Jesus. I have found when we do that, we do nothing but make shipwreck. Our own works are dead works. So we have to wait on the Lord, trust, and depend on him and let him work through us.
:::death::: at people quoting "this is the work of God" that you believe on him who he has sent.
and then claiming that, believing in him is their work when it clearly says it is the gift of God.
Ephesians even goes on to say not NOT TO BOAST about it and that is what people who are just claiming believe without works are doing. It even goes on to say why he gave the gift of faith or it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9not by works, so that no one can boast. 10For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance as our way of life.…
:eath:; it then goes on to tell you about your richs and tells you WALK WORTHY OF THE VOCATION wherewith ya are called
Folks can cut and paste, and misquote one verse of the bible like the Lords mercy endureth forever, and the law is done away with, and grace all they want, and not read the other verses in the bible to find what faith, who the righteous are, and is there a difference between law and good works.
The bible is very clear about what will happen to people who take the gift of faith which was given them and have no fruit. He won't let you in the kingdom. It even tell you that you will be beaten with more stripes because you knew what he wanted you to do but didn't do those things. While the person who didn't know will be beaten with less stripes. Because ye reaped where you didn't sow.
okay I am finished this time. I pray that no one on this forum is lead astray by anyone quoting one sentence, and not fullying understanding that sentence, and saying all we must do is have faith and not realize with faith comes the calling to do good works.
But they will have to answer to God for taking verses out of the bible intentionally misleading whoever they lead stray and take the grace of God for granted. When they know exactly what ELSE THE BIBLE SAYS and omit those things and lead people to hell.
Lord have mercy..
and then claiming that, believing in him is their work when it clearly says it is the gift of God.
Ephesians even goes on to say not NOT TO BOAST about it and that is what people who are just claiming believe without works are doing. It even goes on to say why he gave the gift of faith or it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9not by works, so that no one can boast. 10For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance as our way of life.…
:
eath:; it then goes on to tell you about your richs and tells you WALK WORTHY OF THE VOCATION wherewith ya are calledFolks can cut and paste, and misquote one verse of the bible like the Lords mercy endureth forever, and the law is done away with, and grace all they want, and not read the other verses in the bible to find what faith, who the righteous are, and is there a difference between law and good works.
The bible is very clear about what will happen to people who take the gift of faith which was given them and have no fruit. He won't let you in the kingdom. It even tell you that you will be beaten with more stripes because you knew what he wanted you to do but didn't do those things. While the person who didn't know will be beaten with less stripes. Because ye reaped where you didn't sow.
okay I am finished this time. I pray that no one on this forum is lead astray by anyone quoting one sentence, and not fullying understanding that sentence, and saying all we must do is have faith and not realize with faith comes the calling to do good works.
But they will have to answer to God for taking verses out of the bible intentionally misleading whoever they lead stray and take the grace of God for granted. When they know exactly what ELSE THE BIBLE SAYS and omit those things and lead people to hell.
Lord have mercy..
I don’t think anyone on here is saying that God won’t work good works through them. The works are of God not of ourselves. We don’t work for salvation. We are saved because we believe and have faith. Our works will get us nowhere.
Even Jesus when he was on earth said that he could do nothing of himself…and that it was the father that worked in him.
I found an article online that talks about this…It’s kind of long so I am just going to post a paragraph of it but I will link it.
The Father Abiding in Me Doeth the Work
Christ counted it no humiliation to be, able to do nothing of Himself, to be always and absolutely dependent on the Father. He counted it His highest glory, because so all His works were the works of the all glorious God in Him. When shall we understand that to wait on God, to bow before Him in perfect helplessness, and let Him work all in us, is our true nobility, and the secret of the highest activity? This alone is the true Son-life, the true life of every child of God. As this life is known and maintained, the power for work will grow, because the soul is in the attitude in which God can work in us, as the God who worketh for him that waiteth on Him.' It is the ignorance or neglect of the great truths, that there can be no true work for God but as God works it in us, and that God cannot work in us fully but as we live in absolute dependence on Him, that is the explanation of the universal complaint of so much Christian activity with so little real result. The revival which many are longing and praying for must begin with this: the return of Christian ministers and workers to their true place before God -- in Christ and like Christ, one of complete dependence and continual waiting on God to work in them.
You have made 18 posts here....and unless you have been here a while under a different banner you will find that almost everyone that teaches salvation dia grace through faith will also say that a believer will have at least one piece of fruit and or a work of God in their life.....the problem comes when saying that one MUST have works to gain, keep or facilitate salvation.....the bible does not teach that.....
The thief on the cross.....
a. He had no righteous works
b. He had no immersion of church affiliation or membership
c. He was a criminal, being put to death for thievery and murder
What did he do....He did not quote the "ROMAN ROAD" He did not jump through religious hoops, He did not quote John 3:16 or Ephesians 2:8-10 or Titus 3:5.....
HE said.....LORD, remember me when you come into your kingdom <-----FAITH and that FAITH void of any works SAVED HIM.....
THAT IS THE POINT.........
THIS is the Work of the FATHER...believe on him whom he hath sent.......
ONE who believes in JESUS has done the WORK of the FATHER....It pleased GOD by the foolishness of preaching to SAVE them that BELIEVE!