"It is finished." What is the "it?"

[tribesman]

1 Cor 1:20-25
Where is the wise man? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?
For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well-pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.
For indeed Jews ask for signs and Greeks search for wisdom;
but we preach Christ crucified, to Jews a stumbling block and to Gentiles foolishness,
but to those who are the called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God.
Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

Praise God for this blessed foolishness.

 

[forsha]

it does not say he died for them, It says who they are (those who have faith on him, who seek the food which endures forever, who eat the bread sent from heaven, who partake of his flesh and blood)

Your adding to the word of God my friend. and again, rejecting everything else Jesus said in John 6.

Your like the roman catholic who says the eucharist is truely from God, and must be eaten at mass, He is taking one part of the passage, rejecting EVERYTHING ELSE JESUS SAID, and making a doctrine out of it.

Your both in error.

If you refuse to take John 6:39 as his work on the cross, how about your take on Heb 9:28, So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of "many"= A large part of persons or things (Webster's dictionary) Does not sound like all mankind to me.

 

[kennethcadwell]

Do the do the word of God starts with trusting the Lord Jesus Christ alone for your salvation and stop trusting your own efforts of law keeping to hopefully save you one day. In older times it was called gospel repentance. Believing on Him for your justification. If one does not do the will of God in that regard, then all other things one does to vainly try to gain God's favor are filthy rags and abominations to Him.

I do not trust in my own efforts nor do I trust in the law, so both once again are flawed accusations when it comes to me.
Second I agree with the doing the will of God, but people once again have a misconception when it comes to the word believe. They say believe and love is the will of God, which is true but both are continuation words as one who continues to love and continues to believe in the Lord will have eternal life. (Come, hear, and do)All 3 parts make up a true believer, and not just one or two..........
Like I have said to E.G. to cancel out any part of this is to show that one's faith is not truly rooted in the Lord.
And to show we must continue in the faith to receive eternal life as the Apostle Paul stated many times here are a couple scriptures again that show one after receiving the Lord can still end up not having eternal life if they fall away from that belief;



Matthew 10:28

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.


[h=1]James 5:19-20

Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, 20 let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins.[/h]

 

[forsha]

hate to burst your bible.

But that same hearing and believing statement by paul. says we were saved (born again) AFTER we heard and believed.

No. I can not take credit for my faith, because I DID NOTHING TO EARN IT!

you will not see me on the streat corner boasting of how great I am because I trusted someone else to do ALL the work to save me, I will be placed in a looney bin as a man who lost his mind.

You will always have contradicting scriptures unless you divide the eternal salvation scriptures from the timely salvation scriptures. When we commit a sin and repent and God forgives us of that sin, that is a timely salvation, not eternal. Paul is not telling them that hearing and believing will be the cause of saving them eternally.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Because those who live by all of His teachings which are in the bible will never be sent to eternal punishment, and taking communion is part of His word. We can not just pick and choose which parts we want to obey, and which ones we don't. Just because another denomination may misuse how it is done does not make it wrong to do, and therefore just cancel it out all together.
We are to live by all that He taught and not just portions of it, as we are to confirm our lives to His will and not the other way around. Communion is the outer expression of the inside faith in Christ we have, and Lord Jesus clearly said we are not to hide our faith but let it shine before the world. Denying to obey the commands of outer expression of ones faith is just as disobedient as denying the power of the Holy Spirit who works within us.

Because to say one's outer actions do not matter when it comes to salvation is living in a partial lie, as our outer actions come from the changing and working of the Holy Spirit. Which is why Jesus said no fruits produced in the believer, there is no eternal life/salvation abiding in them. Therefore those who have no fruit will be gathered and burned......

so never die does not mean never die

Never thirst or hunger, means I must continue to thirst and hunger till I die

Live forever. does not mean to live forever.

Be risen on the last day means nothing

Has eternal life means nothing.

Thanks ken, You just called Jesus a liar.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

If you refuse to take John 6:39 as his work on the cross, how about your take on Heb 9:28, So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of "many"= A large part of persons or things (Webster's dictionary) Does not sound like all mankind to me.

Until you take john 6 as a whole. Nothing you can say will convince me. If your not going to look at all john 6. and just keep looking at one verse. we have nothing to discuss.

Your no better then Ken.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You will always have contradicting scriptures unless you divide the eternal salvation scriptures from the timely salvation scriptures. When we commit a sin and repent and God forgives us of that sin, that is a timely salvation, not eternal. Paul is not telling them that hearing and believing will be the cause of saving them eternally.

there is no timely salvation.

if there is, then calvin got it wrong, and Arminian got it right, as well as the catholics and everyone else.

There is only eternal salvation.

You keep digging yourself a whole their my friend, not even your calvanist buddies are sticking up for you. Maybe you need to speak to them more..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I do not trust in my own efforts nor do I trust in the law, so both once again are flawed accusations when it comes to me.

Yes you do.

Your efforts may not initially save you, but your efforts must keep you saved or you will be lost.

That works. thats earning.

As paul said, are you a FOOL, having begun in the spirit, are you not trying to be perfected in the flesh (by what you do)

remember that, Paul called you a fool. Not me.

 

[forsha]

How do you reconcile this passage with what you claim here?

John 9, NASB
35 Jesus heard that they had put him out, and finding him, He said, "Do you believe in the Son of Man?"
36 He answered, "Who is He, Lord, that I may believe in Him?"
37 Jesus said to him, "You have both seen Him, and He is the one who is talking with you."
38 And he said, "Lord, I believe." And he worshiped Him.
​

This is the young man blind from birth. It took the miracle of his restored eyesight for his "eyes to be opened" -- to see the truth. It was when he saw the truth that he believed. The Pharisees, scribes, and council members saw the exact same thing, but their eyes remained closed.

That doesn't fit with your "gospel," Forsha. At least, it doesn't appear to me to do so.

There is a difference in being born again, and being converted. When a born again person seeks to know Christ and understand his teachings it brings about many false doctrines, But when the Holy Spirit within him reveals to him the truth of Jesus's teachings, this is called being converted.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

There is a difference in being born again, and being converted. When a born again person seeks to know Christ and understand his teachings it brings about many false doctrines, But when the Holy Spirit within him reveals to him the truth of Jesus's teachings, this is called being converted.

wow. ok. your way out there. do you make this stuff up as you go?

mind if I ask you what church you attend, or grew up in which gave you these odd beliefs? or did you make all this stuff up yourself?

 

[forsha]

Until you take john 6 as a whole. Nothing you can say will convince me. If your not going to look at all john 6. and just keep looking at one verse. we have nothing to discuss.

Your no better then Ken.

There you go again, trying to slip away without explaining Heb 9:28. If we fail to attempt to discuss scripture, then we are not fulfilling the reason of this forum.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

There you go again, trying to slip away without explaining Heb 9:28. If we fail to attempt to discuss scripture, then we are not fulfilling the reason of this forum.

we have not gotten past John 6 yet. and you want to move on? lets still to the topic at hand, before we go someplace else.

Your like people who can not back their points, when you get to the point your backed in the corner with one point,, you move to the next, trying to distract from the reality, you have not gotten the first point corrected yet.

 

[forsha]

there is no timely salvation.

if there is, then calvin got it wrong, and Arminian got it right, as well as the catholics and everyone else.

There is only eternal salvation.

You keep digging yourself a whole their my friend, not even your calvanist buddies are sticking up for you. Maybe you need to speak to them more..

My support is not to seek man's support, but to rely upon the inspired scriptures, so let's cut out the sidetracking and have a bible discussion. Consider these two scriptures; 1. Ye are saved by grace, and that not of works, lest any man should boast. 2. Save yourselves from this untoward generation. One says your works will not save you and the other says your works will save you. These two scriptures do not contradict each other, because one is eternal salvation and the other is a timely salvation.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

My support is not to seek man's support, but to rely upon the inspired scriptures, so let's cut out the sidetracking and have a bible discussion. Consider these two scriptures; 1. Ye are saved by grace, and that not of works, lest any man should boast. 2. Save yourselves from this untoward generation. One says your works will not save you and the other says your works will save you. These two scriptures do not contradict each other, because one is eternal salvation and the other is a timely salvation.

you can't even get that right.

1. is talking about eternal salvation, which is in Christ
2. the other is talking about physical rewards, and not having to go through hell from the things of this world.

they are not even the same.

If I saved myself from that generation by gettig away from it, and while I was getting away I got killed in an auto accident. is me getting away going to get me into heaven? what good did it do really?

 

[forsha]

wow. ok. your way out there. do you make this stuff up as you go?

mind if I ask you what church you attend, or grew up in which gave you these odd beliefs? or did you make all this stuff up yourself?

The church that I attend is not important for you to know, but discussing the truth in the scriptures is. Do you not believe in new birth and being converted as two different events?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The church that I attend is not important for you to know, but discussing the truth in the scriptures is. Do you not believe in new birth and being converted as two different events?

actually yes it is, if your afraid to say, I can only assume your like many in here who do not go to church, or have no faith in your church.

being born again is the result of being converted.

if your not converted, your still in sin

if your still in sin, you have not been made alive (born again)

because the penalty of sin is death, one can not be made alive while he is still under the penalty of sin.

 

[AbbeyJoy]

Our sins are forgiven, and all we have to do is turn to Jesus and repent and lose what causes us to be separated from him.

 

[forsha]

we have not gotten past John 6 yet. and you want to move on? lets still to the topic at hand, before we go someplace else.

Your like people who can not back their points, when you get to the point your backed in the corner with one point,, you move to the next, trying to distract from the reality, you have not gotten the first point corrected yet.

What verses in John 6 do you want me to address?

 

[ChristInUs]

to the OP it means that it is finished. Stating that there is nothing else. Well when your finished you don't keep working on it. It means that there is nothing you can do accept place your faith in His finished work.

 

[forsha]

you can't even get that right.

1. is talking about eternal salvation, which is in Christ
2. the other is talking about physical rewards, and not having to go through hell from the things of this world.

they are not even the same.

If I saved myself from that generation by gettig away from it, and while I was getting away I got killed in an auto accident. is me getting away going to get me into heaven? what good did it do really?

I see that you are struggling to try to place the timely salvations and the eternal salvation together and still get them to harmonize. I do understand that the only way that a person can make good sense of the scriptures, they have to be revealed by the Holy Spirit within them. Man's intellect will never be able to harmonize the scriptures.