It Is satanic Heresy to Deny Eternal Security
- Thread starter Atwood
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Re: Lest One Stray Off Topic, Focus on the Savior & Eternal Security
Indeed, no problem with delighting in God's word.
False. I attribute the verse to be about the gifts & the calling of God. Calling is something which applies not just to Israel, nor to Abraham. Whom (plural) he called he justified (Rom 8). That applies to many persons, hardly just Abe.
The word gifts is plural. God's gifts are irrevocable. One of those gifts is eternal life to the believer. The promises to Israel & Abe are irrevocable because they fall into the category of gifts of God, not because God only gave one gift which only Abe gets.
It isn't my doctrine & it is not one word. It is many words by which we may be assured of our salvation.
Anyone who denies that Christ is Savior & down-grades the Lord Jesus to a "chance-giver" is indeed likely to have difficulty understanding these things. If that be your difficulty understanding, you are encouraged to stop disbelieving God's word & trust the Lord Jesus as your only & sufficient Savior.
Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for
He shall save His people from their sins.
Ps 34
YHWH redeems the soul of his servants;
And none of them who take refuge in him shall be condemned.
Ps 52
But as for me, I am like a green olive-tree in the house of God:
I trust in the lovingkindness of God for ever and ever.
I will give thee thanks for ever, because thou hast done it;
1 Thes 5 end:
"And the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved entire, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. Faithful is He Who calls you, Who will also do it.
Col 3
If then ye were raised together with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated on the right hand of God. Set your mind on the things that are above, not on the things that are upon the earth. For ye died, and your life is hid with Christ in God. When Christ, who is our life, shall be manifested, then shall ye also with him be manifested in glory.
2 Thes 2:16
Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace, comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word.
End of Rom 8:
And we know that to them that love God all things work together for good, even to them that are called according to his purpose. For whom
he foreknew,
he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: and whom
he foreordained, them
he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom
he justified, them
he also glorified.
31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? 3He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not also with him freely give us all things? Who shall lay anything to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth; who is he that condemneth? It is Christ Jesus that died, yea rather, that was raised from the dead, who is at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or anguish, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? Even as it is written,
For thy sake we are killed all the day long;
We were accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
< 1 Pet 1
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
THE OVERCOMER
Revelation 3:5
The one who overcomes will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father… 1 John 5:4-5 For whatsoever is begotten of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. And who is he who overcomes the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.
And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of the throne saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he shall dwell with them, and they shall be his peoples, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God: and he shall wipe away every tear from their eyes; and death shall be no more; neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain, any more: the first things are passed away. And he that sitteth on the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he saith, Write: for these words are faithful and true. And he said unto me, They are come to pass. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. He that overcometh shall inherit these things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. But for the fearful, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and fornicators, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, their part shall be in the lake that burneth with fire and brimstone; which is the second death.
In II Thess. 3:3 “But the Lord is faithful, who shall establish you, and guard you from the evil one.”
In II Tim. 1:12 he sounds a note of rejoicing: “For I know Him whom I have believed, and I am persuaded that He is able to guard that which I have committed unto Him against that day.”
< 2 Tim 4:18
The Lord will deliver me from every evil work, and will save me unto his heavenly kingdom;
2 Tim 1:8-9
… God; who saved us, and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before times eternal,
2 thes 2:16-17 Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace, comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word.
Rm 6:23b
the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
John 10:27-29
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.
John 6:37
All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.
John 10:28
I give them eternal life, and they will never perish,
Indeed, no problem with delighting in God's word.
False. I attribute the verse to be about the gifts & the calling of God. Calling is something which applies not just to Israel, nor to Abraham. Whom (plural) he called he justified (Rom 8). That applies to many persons, hardly just Abe.
The word gifts is plural. God's gifts are irrevocable. One of those gifts is eternal life to the believer. The promises to Israel & Abe are irrevocable because they fall into the category of gifts of God, not because God only gave one gift which only Abe gets.
It isn't my doctrine & it is not one word. It is many words by which we may be assured of our salvation.
Anyone who denies that Christ is Savior & down-grades the Lord Jesus to a "chance-giver" is indeed likely to have difficulty understanding these things. If that be your difficulty understanding, you are encouraged to stop disbelieving God's word & trust the Lord Jesus as your only & sufficient Savior.
Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for
He shall save His people from their sins.
Ps 34
YHWH redeems the soul of his servants;
And none of them who take refuge in him shall be condemned.
Ps 52
But as for me, I am like a green olive-tree in the house of God:
I trust in the lovingkindness of God for ever and ever.
I will give thee thanks for ever, because thou hast done it;
1 Thes 5 end:
"And the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved entire, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. Faithful is He Who calls you, Who will also do it.
Col 3
If then ye were raised together with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated on the right hand of God. Set your mind on the things that are above, not on the things that are upon the earth. For ye died, and your life is hid with Christ in God. When Christ, who is our life, shall be manifested, then shall ye also with him be manifested in glory.
2 Thes 2:16
Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace, comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word.
End of Rom 8:
And we know that to them that love God all things work together for good, even to them that are called according to his purpose. For whom
he foreknew,
he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: and whom
he foreordained, them
he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom
he justified, them
he also glorified.
31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? 3He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not also with him freely give us all things? Who shall lay anything to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth; who is he that condemneth? It is Christ Jesus that died, yea rather, that was raised from the dead, who is at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or anguish, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? Even as it is written,
For thy sake we are killed all the day long;
We were accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
< 1 Pet 1
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
THE OVERCOMER
Revelation 3:5
The one who overcomes will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father… 1 John 5:4-5 For whatsoever is begotten of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. And who is he who overcomes the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.
And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of the throne saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he shall dwell with them, and they shall be his peoples, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God: and he shall wipe away every tear from their eyes; and death shall be no more; neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain, any more: the first things are passed away. And he that sitteth on the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he saith, Write: for these words are faithful and true. And he said unto me, They are come to pass. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. He that overcometh shall inherit these things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. But for the fearful, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and fornicators, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, their part shall be in the lake that burneth with fire and brimstone; which is the second death.
In II Thess. 3:3 “But the Lord is faithful, who shall establish you, and guard you from the evil one.”
In II Tim. 1:12 he sounds a note of rejoicing: “For I know Him whom I have believed, and I am persuaded that He is able to guard that which I have committed unto Him against that day.”
< 2 Tim 4:18
The Lord will deliver me from every evil work, and will save me unto his heavenly kingdom;
2 Tim 1:8-9
… God; who saved us, and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before times eternal,
2 thes 2:16-17 Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace, comfort your hearts and establish them in every good work and word.
Rm 6:23b
the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
John 10:27-29
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.
John 6:37
All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.
John 10:28
I give them eternal life, and they will never perish,
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Indeed they need the Love of God, which is so manifested in eternal security.
Believers do not need to fear damnation -- shame on those who would try to promote that.
Perfect love casts out fear.
God so LOVED . . . that . . . should not perish, but have everlasting life.
"My sheep . . . I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish"
Safe am I, (echo)
safe am I, (echo)
In the hollow of His hand,
Sheltered o'ver, (echo)
Sheltered o'ver, (echo)
With His love forevermore;
No ill can harm me,
No foe alarm me;
For He keeps both day & night;
Safe am I, (echo)
Safe am I, (echo)
In the hollow of His hand.
God declares the believer in the Lord Jesus to be righteous?
Who is he who condemns?
No one posting here is going to be successful at that!
Thou shalt call His name Jesus,
For He shall save Him people from their sins!
Believers do not need to fear damnation -- shame on those who would try to promote that.
Perfect love casts out fear.
God so LOVED . . . that . . . should not perish, but have everlasting life.
"My sheep . . . I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish"
Safe am I, (echo)
safe am I, (echo)
In the hollow of His hand,
Sheltered o'ver, (echo)
Sheltered o'ver, (echo)
With His love forevermore;
No ill can harm me,
No foe alarm me;
For He keeps both day & night;
Safe am I, (echo)
Safe am I, (echo)
In the hollow of His hand.
God declares the believer in the Lord Jesus to be righteous?
Who is he who condemns?
No one posting here is going to be successful at that!
Thou shalt call His name Jesus,
For He shall save Him people from their sins!
It is indeed satanic to try to demote the Lord Jesus to a mere chance-giver, to try to inhibit persons from trusting Him as Savior, the One Who loves believers, regards them as parts of His own body, declares them begotten of God, God's children.
Shame on those who would prevent sinners from trusting the Lord Jesus with their eternal destiny, telling them that Christ is a mere chance-giver.
Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins.
Put your full confidence in those nail scarred hands today.
The hands of my Savior are strong,
And the arms of my Savior are long;
Thru sunshine or rain,
In loss or in gain,
The blood flows from Calvary to cleanse every stain.
There's room at the cross for you;
There's room at the cross for you;
Though millions have come;
There's still room for one;
Yes, there's room at the cross for you.
Shame on those who would prevent sinners from trusting the Lord Jesus with their eternal destiny, telling them that Christ is a mere chance-giver.
Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins.
Put your full confidence in those nail scarred hands today.
The hands of my Savior are strong,
And the arms of my Savior are long;
Thru sunshine or rain,
In loss or in gain,
The blood flows from Calvary to cleanse every stain.
There's room at the cross for you;
There's room at the cross for you;
Though millions have come;
There's still room for one;
Yes, there's room at the cross for you.
Re: Roman 8; Who but a Blind Man Wud Not See Eternal Security Here?
You are forced to defend the notion that it is permissible for a Christian to rape babies and murder people from time to time.
You constantly argue in favour of sinning and utterly oppose righteousness.
"We can sin and not surely die" is your foundation and you use the Bible to prove it. Satan misused scripture in tempting Jesus. You misuse scripture in preaching Satan.
Jesus came to save people from sin yet you believe that Jesus came to save people from 'condemnation only' so that they could continue to serve sin and enter the kingdom.
You are forced to defend the notion that it is permissible for a Christian to rape babies and murder people from time to time.
You constantly argue in favour of sinning and utterly oppose righteousness.
"We can sin and not surely die" is your foundation and you use the Bible to prove it. Satan misused scripture in tempting Jesus. You misuse scripture in preaching Satan.
Jesus came to save people from sin yet you believe that Jesus came to save people from 'condemnation only' so that they could continue to serve sin and enter the kingdom.
Re: Roman 8; Who but a Blind Man Wud Not See Eternal Security Here?
No, he's not.
It is troubling that you think like that however. That those evil behaviors perpetrated by sinners come to mind when speaking of salvation. I shall hold you in my prayers and I hope Atwood and all Christians here would as well.
May the truth of God come into your heart.
Perhaps these scriptures will lead you to Christ:
No, he's not.
It is troubling that you think like that however. That those evil behaviors perpetrated by sinners come to mind when speaking of salvation. I shall hold you in my prayers and I hope Atwood and all Christians here would as well.
Perhaps these scriptures will lead you to Christ:
- 1 John 1:6, "If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth."
- 1 John 2:4, "The one who says, 'I have come to know Him,' and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him."
- 1 John 4:20, "If someone says, 'I love God,' and hates his brother, he is a liar; for the one who does not love his brother whom he has seen, cannot love God whom he has not seen."
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You're not going to convince anyone, no one is going to convince you, and really those who see OSAS as a license to sin were most likely going to fall anyway. Useful debate makes it's point then moves on. You guys have been stuck in this rut for over 200 pages and over 4,000 posts WHILE ACCOMPLISHING NOTHING. That is indeed useless... and crazy.
K
The scriptures also say many will fall away, and be caught back up into willful sin and these who do this will not be saved.
2 Peter 2:20-22
For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”
Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.
You must hold firm to all the teachings of Jesus to be saved;
Hebrews 3:12-14
Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end.
2 Peter 2:20-22
For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”
Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.
You must hold firm to all the teachings of Jesus to be saved;
Hebrews 3:12-14
Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end.
False teachers are determined to lead people from Christ. In the process they demonstrate what the scriptures tell us about the difference between sheep and goats. They being the goats.
The Bible tells us those who are truly born again are new creatures. Deniers of eternal salvation are actually arguing the new creature can regress to its old self. Which is impossible when one has been reborn in the blood of Christ.
Those who argue, while claiming to be Christian, that one can lose their eternal salvation because what has been called, OSAS, is a license to sin, are not only deeply ignorant of scripture, but they are actually demonstrating they are not regenerated as a new creature. They are not saved and the truth is not in them.
The true Christians here, like myself and others, pursue this discourse with the goats, at least I do, and I would presume to say other true Christians would be able to say something similar, with the intent of opening the sinners, the goats, the false teachers/xtians , eyes to the truth while they're still alive and there is still time to repent.
Those that call Jesus a liar, God a conditional Lord who revokes his grace on whim because people's will to leave his grace is stronger than his will and plan to bestow it, are pitiable at the least. And absolutely damned at worst.
Apologetics Ministries could get through. We can only hope.
The Bible tells us those who are truly born again are new creatures. Deniers of eternal salvation are actually arguing the new creature can regress to its old self. Which is impossible when one has been reborn in the blood of Christ.
Those who argue, while claiming to be Christian, that one can lose their eternal salvation because what has been called, OSAS, is a license to sin, are not only deeply ignorant of scripture, but they are actually demonstrating they are not regenerated as a new creature. They are not saved and the truth is not in them.
The true Christians here, like myself and others, pursue this discourse with the goats, at least I do, and I would presume to say other true Christians would be able to say something similar, with the intent of opening the sinners, the goats, the false teachers/xtians , eyes to the truth while they're still alive and there is still time to repent.
Those that call Jesus a liar, God a conditional Lord who revokes his grace on whim because people's will to leave his grace is stronger than his will and plan to bestow it, are pitiable at the least. And absolutely damned at worst.
Apologetics Ministries could get through. We can only hope.
K
Are you trying to say this situation does not happen:
A person accepts and follows Jesus as Lord and Savior for most of their life, then say at about 56 years old a trial or tribulation happens in their life and they either start denying Jesus and/or go back to living in willful sin.
If you say it does not happen you need to get out more, if you say they were never saved then you would be in error, if you say that they are saved and will not lose salvation you again would be in error. The scriptures make it clear if you deny Jesus you will not get eternal life, and also if you return to willful sin you will not get eternal life.
K
Yes I did because I know the answer because it is in scripture.
But there are some here who will say exactly what I posted that they were not saved, or that there is nothing that says salvation lost. These are false assumptions.
There is not just two groups, believers and non-believers.
The parable of the sower and the seed shows multiple groups and how they accept the word or not.
Then on top of that scripture shows other ways to deny Jesus besides unbelief.
But there are some here who will say exactly what I posted that they were not saved, or that there is nothing that says salvation lost. These are false assumptions.
There is not just two groups, believers and non-believers.
The parable of the sower and the seed shows multiple groups and how they accept the word or not.
Then on top of that scripture shows other ways to deny Jesus besides unbelief.
Clearly you don't know. I'm not a he. And JesusIsAll personally attacks me and claims they're in the light of Christ. Funny how you don't notice that.
Meanwhile, scripture is clear. If you don't recognize what eternal life, salvation, new creature, etc... is in scripture, it ceases to be as funny as you prescribe.
No one chooses to leave Jesus and salvation. They can have moments when they doubt their faith, but when Jesus said no one can pluck those he gives eternal salvation from his hand, that's it.
While JesusIsAll will argue that Jesus lies and people can choose to revoke grace because God can't bestow eternal life as part of his will and plan so that it sticks, since humans will is superior.
That type false teacher is damned! And their contempt for Christ and his truth doesn't change that.
Show us where Jesus says he came to give revocable salvation and that the new creature can regress to the status of the old.
Meanwhile, scripture is clear. If you don't recognize what eternal life, salvation, new creature, etc... is in scripture, it ceases to be as funny as you prescribe.
No one chooses to leave Jesus and salvation. They can have moments when they doubt their faith, but when Jesus said no one can pluck those he gives eternal salvation from his hand, that's it.
While JesusIsAll will argue that Jesus lies and people can choose to revoke grace because God can't bestow eternal life as part of his will and plan so that it sticks, since humans will is superior.
That type false teacher is damned! And their contempt for Christ and his truth doesn't change that.
Show us where Jesus says he came to give revocable salvation and that the new creature can regress to the status of the old.
Like I said... A lot of energy being spent trying to convince people to buy something they're not going to. And vice versa. What's it called when you keep repeating the same thing over and over again hoping to get a different result? That's not just useless, that's insanity.
Now, here's what truly concerns me... the words in red are committed in anger and self righteousness, not love, and gee I sure don't remember anger or self righteousness being one of the fruits of the Holy Spirit. So before you start insulting the place and commitment of people here who love God and are just as saved as you are, go tend your log so you can see a little more clearly.
Xtians??? Really... who's commitment is lacking?
Now, here's what truly concerns me... the words in red are committed in anger and self righteousness, not love, and gee I sure don't remember anger or self righteousness being one of the fruits of the Holy Spirit. So before you start insulting the place and commitment of people here who love God and are just as saved as you are, go tend your log so you can see a little more clearly.
Xtians??? Really... who's commitment is lacking?
K
How does he attack you?
If you feel like pointing out where you are in error in scripture is an attack on you, then you need to go back and see that it is not wrong to do this as long as it is done in love. Even Paul pointed out Peter when he was in the wrong.
Secondly, the eternal life is not in question. What is in question is when that is obtained. There are many scriptures that say you are not saved until you have endured to the end.
James 1:12
Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him.
Matthew 24:10-13
And then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray. And because lawlessness will be increased, the love of many will grow cold. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Matthew 10:22
And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Hebrews 10:36
For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.
Hebrews 3:12-14
Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end.
1 Timothy 4:16
Keep a close watch on yourself and on the teaching. Persist in this, for by so doing you will save both yourself and your hearers.
1 Corinthians 9:24-25
Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one receives the prize? So run that you may obtain it. Every athlete exercises self-control in all things. They do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.
Mark 13:9-13
“But be on your guard. For they will deliver you over to councils, and you will be beaten in synagogues, and you will stand before governors and kings for my sake, to bear witness before them. And the gospel must first be proclaimed to all nations. And when they bring you to trial and deliver you over, do not be anxious beforehand what you are to say, but say whatever is given you in that hour, for it is not you who speak, but the Holy Spirit. And brother will deliver brother over to death, and the father his child, and children will rise against parents and have them put to death. And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Then you got the other scriptures that say you must continue in doing His will or be cut off, and the others about falling away.
You can not fall away from something you were never a part of.
2 Peter 2:20-22
For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”
Hebrews 12:1-3
Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God. Consider him who endured from sinners such hostility against himself, so that you may not grow weary or fainthearted.
Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.
Hebrews 3:12-14
Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end.
Romans 11:19-22
Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.
You are right to say and use the scripture that nobody will pluck us away from Jesus. It is that persons personal choice if they chose to follow false doctrine, and return to a life of willful sin.
If you feel like pointing out where you are in error in scripture is an attack on you, then you need to go back and see that it is not wrong to do this as long as it is done in love. Even Paul pointed out Peter when he was in the wrong.
Secondly, the eternal life is not in question. What is in question is when that is obtained. There are many scriptures that say you are not saved until you have endured to the end.
James 1:12
Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him.
Matthew 24:10-13
And then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray. And because lawlessness will be increased, the love of many will grow cold. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Matthew 10:22
And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Hebrews 10:36
For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.
Hebrews 3:12-14
Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end.
1 Timothy 4:16
Keep a close watch on yourself and on the teaching. Persist in this, for by so doing you will save both yourself and your hearers.
1 Corinthians 9:24-25
Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one receives the prize? So run that you may obtain it. Every athlete exercises self-control in all things. They do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.
Mark 13:9-13
“But be on your guard. For they will deliver you over to councils, and you will be beaten in synagogues, and you will stand before governors and kings for my sake, to bear witness before them. And the gospel must first be proclaimed to all nations. And when they bring you to trial and deliver you over, do not be anxious beforehand what you are to say, but say whatever is given you in that hour, for it is not you who speak, but the Holy Spirit. And brother will deliver brother over to death, and the father his child, and children will rise against parents and have them put to death. And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Then you got the other scriptures that say you must continue in doing His will or be cut off, and the others about falling away.
You can not fall away from something you were never a part of.
2 Peter 2:20-22
For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”
Hebrews 12:1-3
Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God. Consider him who endured from sinners such hostility against himself, so that you may not grow weary or fainthearted.
Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.
Hebrews 3:12-14
Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end.
Romans 11:19-22
Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.
You are right to say and use the scripture that nobody will pluck us away from Jesus. It is that persons personal choice if they chose to follow false doctrine, and return to a life of willful sin.
No one is calling Jesus a liar but if you do not have an understanding scripture it is easy to be misled . For instance anyone who knows the meaning of the word abide will be assured that OSAS is false because scripture teaches it is only those who abide in Christ Gets the blessings...OSAS teaches otherwise as the acronym shows...
John 15:10
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
John 15:6
If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
Abide.... accept or act in accordance with (a rule, decision, or recommendation).
"I said I would abide by their decision"
[TABLE="class: vk_tbl vk_gy"]
[TR]
[TD="class: lr_dct_nyms_ttl"]synonyms:[/TD]
[TD]comply with, obey, observe, follow, keep to, hold to, conform to, adhere to, stick to, stand by, act in accordance with, uphold, heed, accept, go along with, acknowledge, respect, defer to "he expected everybody to abide by the rules"
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
John 15:10
If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
John 15:6
If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
Abide.... accept or act in accordance with (a rule, decision, or recommendation).
"I said I would abide by their decision"
[TABLE="class: vk_tbl vk_gy"]
[TR]
[TD="class: lr_dct_nyms_ttl"]synonyms:[/TD]
[TD]comply with, obey, observe, follow, keep to, hold to, conform to, adhere to, stick to, stand by, act in accordance with, uphold, heed, accept, go along with, acknowledge, respect, defer to "he expected everybody to abide by the rules"
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
OSAS And The Church In Sardis (Rev. 3:1-6)
Saturday, August 16th, 2014
A Bible Study by Jack Kelley
I keep getting questions from people who wonder if Rev. 3:5 denies OSAS. Usually these questions come from folks who believe in OSAS but have had Rev. 3:5 used against them by those who don’t. They write in hoping I’ll have an answer that will confirm their belief and that they can also use to defend it the next time they are confronted with this verse.
I’ve answered the question several times and posted my answer on our “Ask A Bible Teacher” page but I’ve never devoted a whole article to it. When I got the question again this week, I decided to offer an expanded answer.
This would be a good time for us to remember that the Bible, being the Word of God, cannot contradict itself. Therefore, when there are multiple verses in support of a position it’s a mistake to think any other verse could negate that position, even if at first glance it seems to be contradictory. Instead we should look more closely at the “contradictory” verse to see where we’ve misunderstood it. (Continues)
After awhile it becomes apparent the hate and animosity some have for members here precludes those hateful from reading with respect anything their target has to say.
In that vein I thought to post this article by a Bible teacher so that someone unrelated to this site might get through to the antagonists here. Those who hope to persuade Christians Salvation is conditional.
What a world it would be if an omniscient God saved souls only when they obeyed his rules being they are imperfect beings. Jesus sacrifice would have been for nothing. And the scriptures would read as follows:
For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever he approves for eternal life shall have it, as long as they jump through certain hoops and prove they've worked hard enough for it to be bestowed.
K
What else did Jesus say;
Matthew 24:10-13
And then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray. And because lawlessness will be increased, the love of many will grow cold. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Our Lord Himself says that many will fall away and be lead astray by false doctrine.
You can not fall away from something you are not a part of, and this is only one of many scriptures in the NT that talks about false teachers leading people astray.
Matthew 24:10-13
And then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray. And because lawlessness will be increased, the love of many will grow cold. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Our Lord Himself says that many will fall away and be lead astray by false doctrine.
You can not fall away from something you are not a part of, and this is only one of many scriptures in the NT that talks about false teachers leading people astray.