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2 Timothy 3:[SUP]12 [/SUP]Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution. [SUP]13 [/SUP]But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived. [SUP]14 [/SUP]But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; [SUP]15 [/SUP]And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. [SUP]16 [/SUP]All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: [SUP]17 [/SUP]That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.
Ephesians 4: [SUP]11 [/SUP]And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; [SUP]12 [/SUP]For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: [SUP]13 [/SUP]Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: [SUP]14 [/SUP]That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; [SUP]15 [/SUP]But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
Ephesians 4: [SUP]11 [/SUP]And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; [SUP]12 [/SUP]For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: [SUP]13 [/SUP]Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: [SUP]14 [/SUP]That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; [SUP]15 [/SUP]But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
But if I say, "I will not mention his word or speak anymore in his name," his word is in my heart like a fire, a fire shut up in my bones. I am weary of holding it in; indeed, I cannot.
(Jeremiah 20:9)
faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
(Romans 10:17)
i don't know where you get the idea that the Scripture was never meant to be shared.
(Jeremiah 20:9)
faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
(Romans 10:17)
i don't know where you get the idea that the Scripture was never meant to be shared.
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if they don't accept it or want to hear it now and if all it does is drive them away from the faith than what have you accomplished other than pushing another soul so far from Christ that they end up in the hands of the devil. i have known faithful homosexuals friends and family alike that have been on the path to salvation and God was leading them to a better life and then zealots like yourself start quoting and then my heart breaks they walk away from faith because the torment they endure at the hands of people just like you. you are wrong in your actions but right in you motivations show love not hate(because what you do IS HATE) love is the only way to save i pray you all will come to understand that
and speaking of quoting the bible what your doing is taking things out of context you cant get a proper understanding of it with on verse because that's part of a subplot witch is part of a plot witch is part of a theme witch is part of a megatheme witch is part of a chapter witch is part of a book witch is The Holy Bible its taking from there understanding and skewing the message its like giving a movie spoiler you see a little bit of it and it can either paint what your "spoiling" in good or bad light even if its the best thing that will ever happen in your life if you read it but hey who am i go ahead keep driving people into hell great job guy's your some real "good" christians
Same can be said for fornicators, and churches have looked the other way when it comes to about knowing members living together with the opposite sex that are not married to each other.
Paul taught excommunication of those brothers & sisters that do not repent in the hopes that God will lead them to repentance. If they do, they are allowed back in, but excommunication is taught at this link below.
1 Corinthians 5 KJV - It is reported commonly that there is - Bible Gateway
Too many churches preach from the pulpit and have their fingers crossed that the members will get the message, but all the errant believers will do is see that as just an opinion and that what they are doing is not that serious after all when it is.
Better to hear correction now before God comes to judge His House to excommunicate those not found abiding in Him to lead them into repentance even if it means being left behind to face the coming great tribulation.
Revelation 2:[SUP]21 [/SUP]And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. [SUP]22 [/SUP]Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. [SUP]23 [/SUP]And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.
Is it love to not warn the person you love that they are running towards a cliff? No. They have to know sooner or later and tomorrow may never come. Then they will wish you had told them so that they would take it to Jesus in prayer for deliverance.
Paul taught excommunication of those brothers & sisters that do not repent in the hopes that God will lead them to repentance. If they do, they are allowed back in, but excommunication is taught at this link below.
1 Corinthians 5 KJV - It is reported commonly that there is - Bible Gateway
Too many churches preach from the pulpit and have their fingers crossed that the members will get the message, but all the errant believers will do is see that as just an opinion and that what they are doing is not that serious after all when it is.
Better to hear correction now before God comes to judge His House to excommunicate those not found abiding in Him to lead them into repentance even if it means being left behind to face the coming great tribulation.
Revelation 2:[SUP]21 [/SUP]And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. [SUP]22 [/SUP]Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. [SUP]23 [/SUP]And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.
Is it love to not warn the person you love that they are running towards a cliff? No. They have to know sooner or later and tomorrow may never come. Then they will wish you had told them so that they would take it to Jesus in prayer for deliverance.
^ok go with that but your gonna end up having to excommunicate more then them because you cant just look at on sin you have to look at them all from fornicates that masturbate,thieves that take a pen without asking, lairs that tell white lies, people who really like and actor of musician for idolatry, kids rebelling there parents, wanting that nice shinny car your neighbor has to covet, all the overweight people for there gluttony, being greedy and obsessing and hoarding anything, being lazy, To get angry even for little reason, to think highly of yourself for good that you have done Pride....
be quite no one would be in the churches if we thought that way it doesn't work you cannot live without sinning thats why the lord came to save use from the sin the only way to help them is to lead them to Christ and let them find out there transgression and repent for them in gods time not there yours or mine overcoming sin isn't instant its a journey and we will never fully rid ourselves of it all we can do is turn to Christ in temptation and forgiveness
be quite no one would be in the churches if we thought that way it doesn't work you cannot live without sinning thats why the lord came to save use from the sin the only way to help them is to lead them to Christ and let them find out there transgression and repent for them in gods time not there yours or mine overcoming sin isn't instant its a journey and we will never fully rid ourselves of it all we can do is turn to Christ in temptation and forgiveness
Those saints excommunicated are the ones that will not repent and thus not asking for forgiveness.
Matthew 18:[SUP]10 [/SUP]Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. [SUP]11 [/SUP]For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. [SUP]12 [/SUP]How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray? [SUP]13 [/SUP]And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray. [SUP]14 [/SUP]Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish. [SUP]15 [/SUP]Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. [SUP]16 [/SUP]But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. [SUP]17 [/SUP]And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.
Even Jesus taught the believers to take care of their own, and not neglect nor despise any one that is new and growing in the Lord. Paul taught the same care for one another.
1 Corinthians 12:[SUP]25 [/SUP]That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another. [SUP]26 [/SUP]And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it. [SUP]27 [/SUP]Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
Matthew 18:[SUP]10 [/SUP]Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. [SUP]11 [/SUP]For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. [SUP]12 [/SUP]How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray? [SUP]13 [/SUP]And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray. [SUP]14 [/SUP]Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish. [SUP]15 [/SUP]Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. [SUP]16 [/SUP]But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. [SUP]17 [/SUP]And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.
Even Jesus taught the believers to take care of their own, and not neglect nor despise any one that is new and growing in the Lord. Paul taught the same care for one another.
1 Corinthians 12:[SUP]25 [/SUP]That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another. [SUP]26 [/SUP]And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it. [SUP]27 [/SUP]Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure the bible tells us that all sin is equal in Gods eyes. God hates all sin, not just homosexuality. So I get really frustrated when people call out specifically homosexual people. There are adulterers in the church, because even looking at a woman and lusting after her is the same as acting upon it. People at church lie, and people at church steal and people at church sin by hating others.
God didn't create people to be homosexual the same way he didn't create people to be lustful or lying or hateful. Because sin has entered the world we are all born broken, every last one of us, and not all of us are broken in exactly the same way. Some of us have a tendency to anger some to lust some to deceitfulness and and I believe some to homosexuality.
The kicker is recognizing this and making the choice (because hello free will got us into this mess in the first place) to repent and turn our hearts toward God. I'm not saying it's easy, it's going to be so very, very hard. I can't even count the times in the day that I am tempted to lie (and over stupid little things, this is my temptation) and I do and I have to crawl back before Gods throne and ask for forgiveness. I can't even imagine how hard that would be for someone who has their sin thrown constantly back in their face and told they are going to hell.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not condoning homosexuality but I think people need to cool their hate cannons a moment and embrace these people who are having one hell of a struggle. Sexual sins are especially hard with the world screaming its normal, your body has needs, no one wants to be alone.
And I'm no saying to repent you've got to go find your opposite sex sweet heart and have 30 babies. Maybe God calls you to singleness, maybe you are "alone" and maybe God finds you a partner of the opposite sex. That's his call, but the first step is to recognize that sin is sin and my swearing and using Gods name in vain at my autocorrect is just as bad as sleeping around or stabbing someone or being gay.
God is never going to stop loving us, it's a question when am I going to love him enough to repent.
God didn't create people to be homosexual the same way he didn't create people to be lustful or lying or hateful. Because sin has entered the world we are all born broken, every last one of us, and not all of us are broken in exactly the same way. Some of us have a tendency to anger some to lust some to deceitfulness and and I believe some to homosexuality.
The kicker is recognizing this and making the choice (because hello free will got us into this mess in the first place) to repent and turn our hearts toward God. I'm not saying it's easy, it's going to be so very, very hard. I can't even count the times in the day that I am tempted to lie (and over stupid little things, this is my temptation) and I do and I have to crawl back before Gods throne and ask for forgiveness. I can't even imagine how hard that would be for someone who has their sin thrown constantly back in their face and told they are going to hell.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not condoning homosexuality but I think people need to cool their hate cannons a moment and embrace these people who are having one hell of a struggle. Sexual sins are especially hard with the world screaming its normal, your body has needs, no one wants to be alone.
And I'm no saying to repent you've got to go find your opposite sex sweet heart and have 30 babies. Maybe God calls you to singleness, maybe you are "alone" and maybe God finds you a partner of the opposite sex. That's his call, but the first step is to recognize that sin is sin and my swearing and using Gods name in vain at my autocorrect is just as bad as sleeping around or stabbing someone or being gay.
God is never going to stop loving us, it's a question when am I going to love him enough to repent.
What a web we weave. Although there might be many on this post who are gay bashing. I believe the question is Gay Christian? Now, what do that question mean? The very first post that started all of this, seems to be trying to justify the act of being Gay in continuing living the life style and wanting to still be called a christian. That would lead me to believe there is no shame in the actions. Nor is there any practice of self control. Just as if i was to murder someone and have no remorse or care in what i have done. Then to continue doing it. Maybe even lying to myself in believing that it was by God's grace that i haven't got caught and that I'm still alive. I'm not here to say any sin is greater then another. But I'm also not here to try and justify one sin other another. Which is what i have been seeing from those who call themselves Gay Christians, trying to do.
J
Our God is a God of love and forgiveness. Of course it's okay for homosexuals to be Christians.
I honestly believe this belief that it is a sin is meaningless. There are so many other "laws" from that part of the Bible that we ignore now, what makes that one any more special? It just doesn't apply to us anymore. There is nothing wrong with being gay.
I honestly believe this belief that it is a sin is meaningless. There are so many other "laws" from that part of the Bible that we ignore now, what makes that one any more special? It just doesn't apply to us anymore. There is nothing wrong with being gay.
God is not so simple to be only a God of love and forgiveness. God is Father, Son and Holy Spirit in mysterious union and fellowship from everlasting to everlasting yet one God. He is a God of justice as well as mercy. God's wrath was poured upon Jesus at the cross for those who will be heirs of mercy. The remainder of humanity will face God's righteous wrath against sin and injustice on their own for eternity.
The righteous are scarcely saved.
God's wrath is treasured up and not on display now. Sight of God's wrath will come later when it is too late for salvation from the wrath of God. Walk by faith now.
Repent and believe. Pick up the cross daily and follow Jesus.
Make disciples who will obey all that Jesus commanded and make disciples themselves. Baptize disciples.
God made them male and female for a reason and it was good.
Remember the destruction of Noah's flood. Remember Sodom and Gomorrah. Ponder the natural disasters of our own time. In the future, the elements of the physical universe will melt with a fervent heat. Earth and sky as we know them shall pass away.
God is everywhere and knows everything. God is holy and pure and righteous. God dwells in unapproachable light.
God sees sin in us that we do not see.
If God would mark out every sin, who could stand?
There is forgiveness with Him that He might be feared. God is Sovereign to grant pardon and to withhold pardon.
The fear of God is the foundation for wisdom.
Jesus is a Savior if we continue to the end in faith and relationship with Him (that includes obedient response to His Word).
Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
The righteous are scarcely saved.
God's wrath is treasured up and not on display now. Sight of God's wrath will come later when it is too late for salvation from the wrath of God. Walk by faith now.
Repent and believe. Pick up the cross daily and follow Jesus.
Make disciples who will obey all that Jesus commanded and make disciples themselves. Baptize disciples.
God made them male and female for a reason and it was good.
Remember the destruction of Noah's flood. Remember Sodom and Gomorrah. Ponder the natural disasters of our own time. In the future, the elements of the physical universe will melt with a fervent heat. Earth and sky as we know them shall pass away.
God is everywhere and knows everything. God is holy and pure and righteous. God dwells in unapproachable light.
God sees sin in us that we do not see.
If God would mark out every sin, who could stand?
There is forgiveness with Him that He might be feared. God is Sovereign to grant pardon and to withhold pardon.
The fear of God is the foundation for wisdom.
Jesus is a Savior if we continue to the end in faith and relationship with Him (that includes obedient response to His Word).
Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
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The ungodly won't be able to stand in the judgment...Sinners are contrasted with the righteous. Sheep shall be separated from goats.
"The ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous." (Psalm 1:5)
"And before him shall be gathered all nations: and He shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats" (Matthew 25:32)
"...these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal." (Matthew 25:46)
"The ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous." (Psalm 1:5)
"And before him shall be gathered all nations: and He shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats" (Matthew 25:32)
"...these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal." (Matthew 25:46)
For me it , my life began to change when I saw and understood this God just loves me, it is what my Brothers last words were to my Sister before he past away. My brother was very legalistic in to how one must act and be and behave and repent over and over every time one sins, and just stop that sin.
He said this to my Sister that he has spent his whole life on to please God by what he was doing, he worked for Campus Crusade for Christ, had a nervous breakdown over trying to be perfect in and before God. A nervous break down over this effort so sincere. Came home for a while.
Then was leaving back to Campus Crusade, and before left that is what he said to my Sister, GOD JUST LOVE ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now three days after gone he was found two miles above the Sanctuary past away with a Bible in his hand. They did three Autopsies and found no physical cause of death, It is written on his death certificate that they could not find any physical cause of death
So I was 21 at that time and responded to this miracle knowing God lives and Christ is the Savior to Father period end of story.
Then when my Sister told me what John said, My changes in life started, and through God just love me also, Things changed, stopped drinking, smoking, drugs, and went into reading more of the Bible asking God to teach me about this amazing love.
It is a personal relationship for every individual to choose to believe or not, no more a works issue.
Thank you
He said this to my Sister that he has spent his whole life on to please God by what he was doing, he worked for Campus Crusade for Christ, had a nervous breakdown over trying to be perfect in and before God. A nervous break down over this effort so sincere. Came home for a while.
Then was leaving back to Campus Crusade, and before left that is what he said to my Sister, GOD JUST LOVE ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now three days after gone he was found two miles above the Sanctuary past away with a Bible in his hand. They did three Autopsies and found no physical cause of death, It is written on his death certificate that they could not find any physical cause of death
So I was 21 at that time and responded to this miracle knowing God lives and Christ is the Savior to Father period end of story.
Then when my Sister told me what John said, My changes in life started, and through God just love me also, Things changed, stopped drinking, smoking, drugs, and went into reading more of the Bible asking God to teach me about this amazing love.
It is a personal relationship for every individual to choose to believe or not, no more a works issue.
Thank you
how is one righteous? by Faith in Christ's finished works or by what one does, flesh works?
Can any flesh other than Christ's ever please God?
So how are we to walk, by flesh or the Spirit of God?
Does one have to be born again or not in the Spirit of God to see the kingdom?
how does this born again life take place? By trust in God through the cross of Christ or of self efforts?
Can any flesh other than Christ's ever please God?
So how are we to walk, by flesh or the Spirit of God?
Does one have to be born again or not in the Spirit of God to see the kingdom?
how does this born again life take place? By trust in God through the cross of Christ or of self efforts?
J
nl, my friend, I'm very sorry that we don't understand God the same way, but if you really think that He is a being of wrath, than I can't help but to feel sorry for you.
You say that homosexuals can not be allowed to enter Heaven because they aren't "righteous", but who among us is? If God didn't love us, none of us would be permitted into Heaven. It is only through His love, forgiveness, and understanding that we can pass through the gates into our paradise. If we can be forgiven of what we do wrong, why can't they? We all do things the Bible explicitly says not to, but expect Him to share his love with us.
Christianity should not have strict guidelines about who can join or not. We should accept all, just as He would.
You say that homosexuals can not be allowed to enter Heaven because they aren't "righteous", but who among us is? If God didn't love us, none of us would be permitted into Heaven. It is only through His love, forgiveness, and understanding that we can pass through the gates into our paradise. If we can be forgiven of what we do wrong, why can't they? We all do things the Bible explicitly says not to, but expect Him to share his love with us.
Christianity should not have strict guidelines about who can join or not. We should accept all, just as He would.
Homewardbound,
JakeTheHawk,
Thank you for your replies.
Jesus calls people who are sinful and depraved. His messages to them include: Repent, the kingdom of God is at hand, have faith in God, pick upon your cross, come follow Me. When people begin to hear, then God sends his Spirit and grace. He transforms lives and through a process of sanctification changes those lives into conformity to Himself (Romans 8:29). Saving Christianity depends upon the supernatural power of God in changing a life.
Our sins at the start can be as subtle as pride, vanity and conceit or as blatant as murder, theft and adultery. The Apostle Paul was the chief of sinners and persecuted the early church and supported the martyrdom of Stephen. Almighty God called the Apostle Paul and changed him. There are many types of sinful conditions but God's power transforms them all. God's love for us transforms us so that we in turn demonstrate a love for God and neighbor. God's love expressed itself in the sufferings of Jesus Christ on the cross. As we follow in His steps, we should expect that we will also suffer at times in the expression of our love for God and others.
God is dishonored and people are hurt when sin happens. Calling sinners to a new life is an expression of God's love. Lives that continue unchanged in a sinful condition would be contrary to genuine faith in the person and genuine love in Almighty God.
God makes distinctions. In the end, God will be glorified in both vessels of wrath (Romans 9:22) and vessels of mercy (Romans 9:23). He will be glorified from both sheep and goats (Matt 25:31ff). Psalm 101:1 - Of mercy and of justice, I will sing. God's love and mercy are very attractive and they are real. However, God's justice and wrath are also part of who God is and will remain essential attributes of God for eternity.
JakeTheHawk,
Thank you for your replies.
Jesus calls people who are sinful and depraved. His messages to them include: Repent, the kingdom of God is at hand, have faith in God, pick upon your cross, come follow Me. When people begin to hear, then God sends his Spirit and grace. He transforms lives and through a process of sanctification changes those lives into conformity to Himself (Romans 8:29). Saving Christianity depends upon the supernatural power of God in changing a life.
Our sins at the start can be as subtle as pride, vanity and conceit or as blatant as murder, theft and adultery. The Apostle Paul was the chief of sinners and persecuted the early church and supported the martyrdom of Stephen. Almighty God called the Apostle Paul and changed him. There are many types of sinful conditions but God's power transforms them all. God's love for us transforms us so that we in turn demonstrate a love for God and neighbor. God's love expressed itself in the sufferings of Jesus Christ on the cross. As we follow in His steps, we should expect that we will also suffer at times in the expression of our love for God and others.
God is dishonored and people are hurt when sin happens. Calling sinners to a new life is an expression of God's love. Lives that continue unchanged in a sinful condition would be contrary to genuine faith in the person and genuine love in Almighty God.
God makes distinctions. In the end, God will be glorified in both vessels of wrath (Romans 9:22) and vessels of mercy (Romans 9:23). He will be glorified from both sheep and goats (Matt 25:31ff). Psalm 101:1 - Of mercy and of justice, I will sing. God's love and mercy are very attractive and they are real. However, God's justice and wrath are also part of who God is and will remain essential attributes of God for eternity.
That's possibly the most idiotically ridiculous charge I've EVER heard made! So-called "Catholics" who advocate for a "married priesthood" use the sex abuse scandal as ammunition. The FACTS, however, show that the percentage of priests who commit some acts is no different from those in the Protestant ministry, rabbis in Judaism, and OTHER professions like lawyers, doctors, etc. Shoot, in my area a couple or so years ago, there was even an Islamic imam who was busted for sexually abusing a child. So to claim that Catholic priests have some topheavy monopoly on sexual abuse couldn't be further from the truth, and to claim that Catholics have some sort of monopoly on homosexuality is merely a strong indicator of a childhood spent eating large quantities of lead-based paint chips!