Why do some people believe and some do not?

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Oct 12, 2017
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Imagine that? Numbers!
God says numbers will not come back void?

Lazy or cowards? Give the Word!!@!!!

Copy and paste...

The Lord protects the simple; I was helpless, but he saved me.
That's got to do with simple-minded believers.
God protects them...
Not about how they got saved.

Jesus said even a child can get born again.
Does a child understand the decrees of God????

So? Calvinists are superior people.
It sure seems like you folks think you are
 

Genez

Junior Member
Oct 12, 2017
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You certainly hit the nail on the head! Many were brought to faith through Paul's teaching. But that is not all that's going on here!

Paul's teaching is but the seed which must be planted in the mind and heart of those who are near. Paul is the vessel used to plant and water this seed, but only God can make the seed take root and grow.

To those who are His, this truth spoken of by Paul takes root only when they are given a new heart. Once this happens they will understand/believe and turn to God in faith.

To those who hear and do not believe, they remain without excuse.

That is why only some believe!
Paul's teaching is not simply a seed.
It's a complex fully grown plant, producing deeply nourishing fruit.

He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters.
His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant
and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.
2 Peter 3:16


Many believers today still can not understand Paul.
Peter admitted to it just before he died.
 
Sep 2, 2020
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That's the heart of the matter. Calvies hinder the lost from believing His Gospel. They push unbelievers away rather than drawing them to Christ.

Spiritual fruit is the correct doctrine which is applied in our lives. We will know them by their fruit.
Yes this was a central part of Paul’s doctrine

“This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. ….Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.


But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:16, 19-26‬ ‭KJV‬‬

But …….it seems basic and “Of course “because it was part of Jesus Paul’s lord and saviors doctrine in the gospel

Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away:

and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.”
‭‭John‬ ‭15:2-8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And now I beseech thee, lady, not as though I wrote a new commandment unto thee, but that which we had from the beginning, that we love one another. And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.

Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:”
‭‭2 John‬ ‭1:5-6, 9-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We talk often about how God is glorified it’s when believers and disciples of Jesus bear the fruits of the spirit and share Gods love outwardly towards others in deed and truth by following after Jesus the good shepherd and spreading his word

This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.”
‭‭John‬ ‭15:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
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Imagine that? Numbers!
God says numbers will not come back void?

Lazy or cowards? Give the Word!!@!!!

Copy and paste...

The Lord protects the simple; I was helpless, but he saved me.
That's got to do with simple-minded believers.
God protects them...
Not about how they got saved.

Jesus said even a child can get born again.
Does a child understand the decrees of God????


So? Calvinists are superior people.
It sure seems like you folks think you are
Who has said to be saved that a person needs to understand the outworking of salvation? You are inflating 2 related things as causal. I would daresay very few individuals understand the outworking of salvation when they are first saved.
 

HeIsHere

Well-known member
May 21, 2022
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Of course we use our intellect, our reasoning, our eyes to see, our ears to hear in order to be persuaded/convinced and believe. As John 6 says in paraphrase: God the Father is drawing men to His Son Jesus Christ by teaching them - those who hear and learn from Him come to/believe in Jesus.

Amen!
 
Sep 2, 2020
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These fruits can only come from Truth.
And abiding in it

Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away:

(It isn’t that they were never in him it’s because they didn’t bear fruit )

and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. ( they produced some fruit so he made them more fruitful tbrough a process Of removing useless parts so there was more room for fruit )

Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.”
‭‭John‬ ‭15:2-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

and so this becomes more revealed and more thoroughly explained

“For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.

… This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:13, 16, 19-26‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it,

and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:

but that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭6:7-8‬ ‭KJV‬‬
 
Sep 2, 2020
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That would be correct he stated correct doctrine = truth ... big difference.
“Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.”
‭‭John‬ ‭18:37

“Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:31-32‬ ‭

“The law and the prophets were until John:

since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭16:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For the law was given by Moses,

but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1:17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things. Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he.”
‭‭John‬ ‭4:23-26‬ ‭

“Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.”
‭‭John‬ ‭14:6-7‬ ‭KJV‬‬
 
Dec 27, 2024
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Who has said to be saved that a person needs to understand the outworking of salvation? You are inflating 2 related things as causal. I would daresay very few individuals understand the outworking of salvation when they are first saved.
It's only by the Holy Spirit providing regeneration, that we are capable of faith. The natural man cannot properly grasp the gospel at all.
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
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It's only by the Holy Spirit providing regeneration, that we are capable of faith. The natural man cannot properly grasp the gospel at all.
What does properly grasp mean? They can certainly understand the gospel. They have to understand it enough to reject it.

I do agree that regeneration precedes faith...Ephesians 2:1-5...and this is so because the carnal mind is hostile to God and not subject the law...Romans 8:7. And that's why Acts 2:37 comes before Acts 2:38.
 
Nov 14, 2024
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It's only by the Holy Spirit providing regeneration, that we are capable of faith. The natural man cannot properly grasp the gospel at all.
That is an absolute lie.

Eph 1:13
In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Hearing the word of truth, the gospel of salvation, comes first. Then comes belief in the same, and then comes the sealing of the Holy Spirit.

Now, watch as this pearl gets trampled under foot.
 
Nov 14, 2024
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The sinner is already in rebellion against God and cannot possess true faith, and those who are regenerated can't reject the gospel.
More nonsense.

Act 2:37
Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Act 2:38
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Act 2:40
And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
Act 2:41
Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

After hearing Peter's gospel proclamation, these people were pricked in their hearts, and they asked what they needed to do to be saved. Peter told them to repent and be baptized, and THEN they would receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. With many other words did he exhort them, and they who gladly received his word were baptized, and THEN they received the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Another pearl which will be trampled under foot.
 

studier

Well-known member
Apr 18, 2024
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The world through wisdom knows not God...1 Corinthians 1:21.
21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe. (1 Cor. 1:21 NKJ)

Some don't believe God's proclamation. Some do believe God's proclamation.

What you shared isn't false, but it is misleading. In salvation, man's natural faculties are certainly engaged, but the information being received through the senses isn't the source of the information being considered. For instance, revelation and enlightenment have God as both it's subject and source.
I disagree that [several] Scriptures that clearly say men were being persuaded by other men explaining God's Word is misleading.

The information being received is not the source of the information?

Who is source of God's Word speaking God's Word?
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,378
6,954
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21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe. (1 Cor. 1:21 NKJ)

Some don't believe God's proclamation. Some do believe God's proclamation.



I disagree that [several] Scriptures that clearly say men were being persuaded by other men explaining God's Word is misleading.

The information being received is not the source of the information?

Who is source of God's Word speaking God's Word?
Ok. But being persuaded in one's mind isn't the substance of salvation. Salvation involves the heart, mind and will. Me or you convincing someone is very different than the Spirit doing so.
Again, the world through wisdom knows not God. It doesn't say they can't understand some level of truth.