Why did the Most High God create sin?
- Thread starter VickyK
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
You are correct in your understanding. These are your verses...
Isaiah
45:5 I [am] the LORD, and [there is] none else, [there is] no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:
45:6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that [there is] none beside me. I [am] the LORD, and [there is] none else.
45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these [things].
45:8 Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.
45:9 Woe unto him that striveth with his Maker! [Let] the potsherd [strive] with the potsherds of the earth. Shall the clay say to him that fashioneth it, What makest thou? or thy work, He hath no hands?
45:10 Woe unto him that saith unto [his] father, What begettest thou? or to the woman, What hast thou brought forth?
45:11 Thus saith the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, and his Maker, Ask me of things to come concerning my sons, and concerning the work of my hands command ye me.
45:12 I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, [even] my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded.
45:13 I have raised him up in righteousness, and I will direct all his ways: he shall build my city, and he shall let go my captives, not for price nor reward, saith the LORD of hosts.
45:14 Thus saith the LORD, The labour of Egypt, and merchandise of Ethiopia and of the Sabeans, men of stature, shall come over unto thee, and they shall be thine: they shall come after thee; in chains they shall come over, and they shall fall down unto thee, they shall make supplication unto thee, [saying], Surely God [is] in thee; and [there is] none else, [there is] no God.
45:15 Verily thou [art] a God that hidest thyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.
45:16 They shall be ashamed, and also confounded, all of them: they shall go to confusion together [that are] makers of idols.
45:17 [But] Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.
45:18 For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I [am] the LORD; and [there is] none else.
45:19 I have not spoken in secret, in a dark place of the earth: I said not unto the seed of Jacob, Seek ye me in vain: I the LORD speak righteousness, I declare things that are right.
Just keep in mind that God Himself is of light and goodness. God is love. Their is no contradiction. This is another way of describing God's omnipotence (all powerfulness.) Another term for this is "sovereignty".
Isaiah
45:5 I [am] the LORD, and [there is] none else, [there is] no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:
45:6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that [there is] none beside me. I [am] the LORD, and [there is] none else.
45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these [things].
45:8 Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.
45:9 Woe unto him that striveth with his Maker! [Let] the potsherd [strive] with the potsherds of the earth. Shall the clay say to him that fashioneth it, What makest thou? or thy work, He hath no hands?
45:10 Woe unto him that saith unto [his] father, What begettest thou? or to the woman, What hast thou brought forth?
45:11 Thus saith the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, and his Maker, Ask me of things to come concerning my sons, and concerning the work of my hands command ye me.
45:12 I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, [even] my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded.
45:13 I have raised him up in righteousness, and I will direct all his ways: he shall build my city, and he shall let go my captives, not for price nor reward, saith the LORD of hosts.
45:14 Thus saith the LORD, The labour of Egypt, and merchandise of Ethiopia and of the Sabeans, men of stature, shall come over unto thee, and they shall be thine: they shall come after thee; in chains they shall come over, and they shall fall down unto thee, they shall make supplication unto thee, [saying], Surely God [is] in thee; and [there is] none else, [there is] no God.
45:15 Verily thou [art] a God that hidest thyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.
45:16 They shall be ashamed, and also confounded, all of them: they shall go to confusion together [that are] makers of idols.
45:17 [But] Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.
45:18 For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I [am] the LORD; and [there is] none else.
45:19 I have not spoken in secret, in a dark place of the earth: I said not unto the seed of Jacob, Seek ye me in vain: I the LORD speak righteousness, I declare things that are right.
Just keep in mind that God Himself is of light and goodness. God is love. Their is no contradiction. This is another way of describing God's omnipotence (all powerfulness.) Another term for this is "sovereignty".
-
1
- Show all
You are correct. The other girl is simply driving home the point that God created the Universe and all things that exist in it... which includes Hell and the Devil. She just doesn't see how God can be love and light and good and merciful at the same time. I will admit that it is hard to comprehend the greatness of God (to be "everything".)
-
1
- Show all
... and that is why we need Jesus and the Holy Spirit to help and guide us. Someday our Lord will "glorify" us, but until then, we need Him to live Victoriously.
Romans
7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that [it is] good.
7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but [how] to perform that which is good I find not.
7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
Romans
7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that [it is] good.
7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but [how] to perform that which is good I find not.
7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
Only God can do all the things you speak of. We must be content to have just what He has granted us and no more. One of the things He has granted us is the free will to choose to accept His Salvation or reject it. This is a great thing! Let us rejoice that He has given us the opportunity to be the Children of Almighty God! Halleluiah!
-
1
- Show all
When we speak of free will in the spiritual context, we are referring specifically to the choice to choose salvation and open our heart's door. Not the ability to choose everything and be like God.
I am glad that you are bringing up all these points. You sharpen us. Thank you. We love you, VickyK. I pray that God will give you peace and joy.
I am glad that you are bringing up all these points. You sharpen us. Thank you. We love you, VickyK. I pray that God will give you peace and joy.
-
1
- Show all
VickyK said:
God is omnipotent. Therefore he can sin and can create sin.
Both of these statements are totally wrong.
God is perfect, and holy. But maybe neither of you believe that.
Perfection and holiness cannot sin. God neither sins nor tempts anyone to sin.
But the warped theology of calvin does lead to the idea that God causes sin. Even though few will admit it.
God is omnipotent. Therefore he can sin and can create sin.
Both of these statements are totally wrong.
God is perfect, and holy. But maybe neither of you believe that.
Perfection and holiness cannot sin. God neither sins nor tempts anyone to sin.
But the warped theology of calvin does lead to the idea that God causes sin. Even though few will admit it.
-
2
- Show all
I used to say that, but then I realized how much Jesus loved me. It melted my heart and I have wanted to be near Him ever since. He wants to give us more, but we are not ready to handle it yet. Just be at peace. Let Jesus come in and give you joy and peace in the midst of this world's storms. He love you sooo much, Vicky.
Revelation
3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.
Revelation
3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.
Of course not. Sin is a mark of weakness and foolishness. God is neither of these things. What God did do was create the capacity to sin and rebel and reject. This causes some to stumble, so they create Calvinism in an effort to cover up their mental nakedness. God did create the capacity to commit evil...
Isaiah
45:6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that [there is] none beside me. I [am] the LORD, and [there is] none else.
45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these [things].
Isaiah
45:6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that [there is] none beside me. I [am] the LORD, and [there is] none else.
45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these [things].
-
1
- Show all
Well, I have some news for you. The first man WAS Adam.
But, don't take my word for it. But DO believe the Bible.
1 Cor 15:45 - So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit.
Oh, I see. By spiritualizing verses, you get to make up whatever you want.
There is nothing in Gen 1-3 that is metaphorical or a parable. It is all quite literal.
I take words at their meaning.
I can't imagine how you read 1 Cor 15:45.
But, don't take my word for it. But DO believe the Bible.
1 Cor 15:45 - So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit.
Oh, I see. By spiritualizing verses, you get to make up whatever you want.
There is nothing in Gen 1-3 that is metaphorical or a parable. It is all quite literal.
I take words at their meaning.
I can't imagine how you read 1 Cor 15:45.