Why Daniel's 70th week must be in the future

[cv5]

My Theory is that there was [Never] a Gap Theory in the mind of God to begin with. Theoretically speaking here, by taking the [Very Words] of Christ, Matthew 24: 15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand...let's concentrate on this portion [stand in the holy place].

stand in the holy place. This just means as simple as having Gentile person standing in the Holy Place rather than a Jewish High Priest is an Abomination. The Romans who destroyed the Temple in 70 A.D. were inside the Temple and Holy of Hollies. That classifies as an abomination because the Romans are Gentiles, not Levite High Priest.

Christ just said for this to be an abomination, it just had to STAND in the Holy Place.

That clearly would have happened during the Temple seize and then destruction.

Lets put your unbiblical theory regarding Matt 24:15 to rest RIGHT NOW shall we?
THIS dear friend, is THE BIBLICAL Abomination of Desolation. The real one. The genuine one. The description of which is so detailed, so imposing, so remarkable in its unique identity that it cannot POSSIBLY be confused with ANY act or deed or person who was involved in the 70 AD destruction of the Temple!

Dan 7:8
I was considering the horns, and there was another horn, a little one, coming up among them, before whom three of the first horns were plucked out by the roots. And there, in this horn, were eyes like the eyes of a (peculiar) MAN, and a mouth speaking pompous words.

Dan 7:21
“I was watching; and the same horn was making war against the saints, and prevailing against them, until the Ancient of Days came, and a judgment was made in favor of the saints of the Most High, and the time came for the saints to possess the kingdom.

Dan 7:25-27
He shall speak pompous words against the Most High,
Shall persecute the saints of the Most High,
And shall intend to change times and law.
Then the saints shall be given into his hand
For a time and times and half a time.
‘But the court shall be seated,
And they shall take away his dominion,
To consume and destroy it forever.
Then the kingdom and dominion,
And the greatness of the kingdoms under the whole heaven,
Shall be given to the people, the saints of the Most High.
His kingdom is an everlasting kingdom,
And all dominions shall serve and obey Him.’

2 Thes 2:3-5
Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the departure comes first, and the (PECULIAR) MAN of sin is REVEALED, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

 

[cv5]

Lets put your unbiblical theory regarding Matt 24:15 to rest RIGHT NOW shall we?
THIS dear friend, is THE BIBLICAL Abomination of Desolation. The real one. The genuine one. The description of which is so detailed, so imposing, so remarkable in its unique identity that it cannot POSSIBLY be confused with ANY act or deed or person who was involved in the 70 AD destruction of the Temple!

Dan 7:8
I was considering the horns, and there was another horn, a little one, coming up among them, before whom three of the first horns were plucked out by the roots. And there, in this horn, were eyes like the eyes of a (peculiar) MAN, and a mouth speaking pompous words.

Dan 7:21
“I was watching; and the same horn was making war against the saints, and prevailing against them, until the Ancient of Days came, and a judgment was made in favor of the saints of the Most High, and the time came for the saints to possess the kingdom.

Dan 7:25-27
He shall speak pompous words against the Most High,
Shall persecute the saints of the Most High,
And shall intend to change times and law.
Then the saints shall be given into his hand
For a time and times and half a time.
‘But the court shall be seated,
And they shall take away his dominion,
To consume and destroy it forever.
Then the kingdom and dominion,
And the greatness of the kingdoms under the whole heaven,
Shall be given to the people, the saints of the Most High.
His kingdom is an everlasting kingdom,
And all dominions shall serve and obey Him.’

2 Thes 2:3-5
Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the departure comes first, and the (PECULIAR) MAN of sin is REVEALED, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

These various bogus 70AD theories are so full of holes, so bereft of biblical substance, so aberrant and erroneous, so ludicrous, I for one have NO IDEA why they have not all gone extinct by now.

 

[AandW]

Lets put your unbiblical theory regarding Matt 24:15 to rest RIGHT NOW shall we?
THIS dear friend, is THE BIBLICAL Abomination of Desolation. The real one. The genuine one. The description of which is so detailed, so imposing, so remarkable in its unique identity that it cannot POSSIBLY be confused with ANY act or deed or person who was involved in the 70 AD destruction of the Temple!

Dan 7:8
I was considering the horns, and there was another horn, a little one, coming up among them, before whom three of the first horns were plucked out by the roots. And there, in this horn, were eyes like the eyes of a (peculiar) MAN, and a mouth speaking pompous words.

Dan 7:21
“I was watching; and the same horn was making war against the saints, and prevailing against them, until the Ancient of Days came, and a judgment was made in favor of the saints of the Most High, and the time came for the saints to possess the kingdom.

Dan 7:25-27
He shall speak pompous words against the Most High,
Shall persecute the saints of the Most High,
And shall intend to change times and law.
Then the saints shall be given into his hand
For a time and times and half a time.
‘But the court shall be seated,
And they shall take away his dominion,
To consume and destroy it forever.
Then the kingdom and dominion,
And the greatness of the kingdoms under the whole heaven,
Shall be given to the people, the saints of the Most High.
His kingdom is an everlasting kingdom,
And all dominions shall serve and obey Him.’

2 Thes 2:3-5
Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the departure comes first, and the man of sin is REVEALED, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

You do know that Matthew 24 speaks of [TWO EVENTS] don't you?

1. The Destruction of the Temple and the Seize of Jerusalem

2. The Antichrist and the Mark of the Beast


But I originated this conversation because we now know the [GAP Theory] created by [MAN] is false because the End of the Gentile Reign is over and we did not move into the next phase as the [GAP Theory] would have us to believe. And because the [GAP Theory] has been proven to be False and Incorrect, it means so is the Pre-Trib Rapture.

What we do have now is the End of the Gentile Reign and we are waiting for the period of Satan and his puppet and His Mark of the Beast!

 

[cv5]

You do know that Matthew 24 speaks of [TWO EVENTS] don't you?

1. The Destruction of the Temple and the Seize of Jerusalem

2. The Antichrist and the Mark of the Beast


But I originated this conversation because we now know the [GAP Theory] created by [MAN] is false because the End of the Gentile Reign is over and we did not move into the next phase as the [GAP Theory] would have us to believe. And because the [GAP Theory] has been proven to be False and Incorrect, it means so is the Pre-Trib Rapture.

What we do have now is the End of the Gentile Reign and we are waiting for the period of Satan and his puppet and His Mark of the Beast!

Friend....perhaps you fail to comprehend that you have erroneously conflated the 70AD event and Matt 24:15 (the A of D). In an effort to rectify your terrible mistake, I have utterly destroyed your faulty theory in about 5 minutes, proving beyond a shadow of a doubt that they cannot possibly be speaking of the same event.

 

[AandW]

Friend....perhaps you fail to comprehend that you have erroneously conflated the 70AD event and Matt 24:15 (the A of D). In an effort to rectify your terrible mistake, I have utterly destroyed your faulty theory in about 5 minutes, proving beyond a shadow of a doubt that they cannot possibly be speaking of the same event.

No, you are trying to make what Christ said by STANDING in the Holy Place with Paul's sitting on God's Throne and proclaiming to be God. Paul is speaking of a totally different and LATER event in the Future. This is where Your ERROR exists at!

 

[AandW]

Do you think Christ knows the difference between [Standing in the Holy Place] and [Sitting on God's Throne Proclaiming to be God]?

Because your answer reflects Christ is too ignorant to know the difference!

 

[GaryA]

Some continue to present the bizarre notion that the Rapture and the Second Coming are one and the same!

They are only "the same" in 'event' terms. The Rapture is the first "sub-event" of the Second Coming - which is the "overall" event.

This is similar to the bizarre notion that "the prince that shall come" in Daniel is Christ, rather than the Antichrist.

I am pretty sure NO ONE has actually said this. You have come to this very erroneous conclusion because YOU believe that the three words 'he' in Daniel 9:27 refer back to the word 'prince' in verse before it. (They do not.)

It is VERY disingenuous of you to place your personally-determined association between these words in the mouth of anyone who has not reached that conclusion themselves.

Many of the hardline pretribbers on CC do this kind of thing often.

The only place that "bizarre notion" exists is in your own mind.

Just because you believe the words 'he' refer back to 'prince' DOES NOT MEAN that someone like me - who believes the words 'he' refer back to 'Messiah' in the same verse - thinks or believes that Jesus is the Antichrist or some such nonsense!

Just because YOU believe that 'he'='prince'='Antichrist' DOES NOT MEAN that someone who says 'he'='Christ' believes that 'he'='prince'. In fact, that is part of what they are trying to get you to see - 'he' IS NOT 'prince'!

I for one am getting really tired of y'all pulling that "crap" on everthing we say!

If you are going to try to understand someone else's POV, you MUST do so in light of the understanding of the one who's view you are trying to understand.

Otherwise, you are not really wanting to truly understand the other POV.

This "crap" where you say to yourself (in your thinking):

"I will try to understand someone else's POV contingent upon it making sense if added to everything I believe - as I believe it - down to every last detail."

This "will not cut it"...

You will never understand why someone else believes that 'he' (all three) is Christ if you don't ever allow yourself to "suspend" what you believe long enough to consider the other POV.

This thing that y'all do - that "twists" everything we say into something we did not mean and never have - is reprehensible behavior unbefitting a Christian discussion.

Just remember brother(s) - if "every idle word" will be judged - so will "every typed word" also...

 

[cv5]

No, you are trying to make what Christ said by STANDING in the Holy Place with Paul's sitting on God's Throne and proclaiming to be God. Paul is speaking of a totally different and LATER event in the Future. This is where Your ERROR exists at!

Well....so now we have somebody talking about not one but TWO Abomination of Desolations eh?
Whatever they need to shoehorn their crazy 70AD theories into the Bible I guess.

But NO. There is ONLY ONE unique, specific EVENT and PERSON which TOGETHER constitute the ONE AND ONLY Abomination of Desolation spoken by Jesus in Matt 24:15.

And this event DEFINITELY has not happened yet.

 

[cv5]

Do you think Christ knows the difference between [Standing in the Holy Place] and [Sitting on God's Throne Proclaiming to be God]?

Because your answer reflects Christ is too ignorant to know the difference!

For heavens sake man READ YOUR BIBLE.......Jesus CANNOT POSSIBLY BE SPEAKING ABOUT 70AD!

Matt 24:15
Therefore when you shall see 'the abomination of desolation,' having been spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place--the one reading, let him understand--

spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel

 

[AandW]

Well....so now we have somebody talking about not one but TWO Abomination of Desolations eh?
Whatever they need to shoehorn their crazy 70AD theories into the Bible I guess.

But NO. There is ONLY ONE unique, specific EVENT and PERSON which TOGETHER constitute the ONE AND ONLY Abomination of Desolation spoken by Jesus in Matt 24:15.

And this event DEFINITELY has not happened yet.

The first Abomination in 70 had no connection to Satan! It was a prophecy to Destroy the Temple and Jerusalem.

The second Abomination is 100% Satan!


Do you believe Christ when He said just merely STANDING in the Holy Place was committing an Abomination was really saying Sitting on God's Throne Proclaiming to be God?

Do you think Christ is the Author of Confusion?

Because you are Preaching and Teaching that!

 

[AandW]

For heavens sake man READ YOUR BIBLE.......

Matt 24:15
Therefore when you shall see 'the abomination of desolation,' having been spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place--the one reading, let him understand--

spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel
spoken of by the prophet Daniel

IT SAYS STANDING LIKE CHRIST SAID!


Paul said SITTING AND PROCLAIMING TO BE GOD!


Where and when does STANDING in the Holy Place and Sitting on God's Throne ever meant the same thing?

Are you Confused?
Because your message is!

 

[cv5]

The first Abomination in 70 had no connection to Satan! It was a prophecy to Destroy the Temple and Jerusalem.

The second Abomination is 100% Satan!


Do you believe Christ when He said just merely STANDING in the Holy Place was committing an Abomination was really saying Sitting on God's Throne Proclaiming to be God?

Do you think Christ is the Author of Confusion?

Because you are Preaching and Teaching that!

You are getting close to the ignore threshold......

 

[AandW]

You are getting close to the ignore threshold......

Then ignore me because your BABBLING makes no sense to think STANDING and SITTING equal the SAME ACTION!

 

[cv5]

The first Abomination in 70 had no connection to Satan! It was a prophecy to Destroy the Temple and Jerusalem.

The second Abomination is 100% Satan!


Do you believe Christ when He said just merely STANDING in the Holy Place was committing an Abomination was really saying Sitting on God's Throne Proclaiming to be God?

Do you think Christ is the Author of Confusion?

Because you are Preaching and Teaching that!

Yea look buddy......there is not one single scrap of evidence that ANYBODY was standing, sitting or doing jumping jacks in the Holy Place of the Temple, publicly blaspheming and publicly proclaiming himself to be God back in 70 AD.

Case closed.

 

[AandW]

I am taking the Bible as IT LITERALLY READS and you are merging TWO OPPOSITE ACTIONS into one. So you are creating your own Doctrine.

 

[AandW]

Yea look buddy......there is not one single scrap of evidence that ANYBODY was standing, sitting or doing jumping jacks in the Holy Place of the Temple, publicly blaspheming and publicly proclaiming himself to be God back in 70 AD.

Case closed.

Where did I say someone proclaimed to be God in 70 A.D.?

You read my posts like the Bible. NO WONDER YOU ARE LOST in this interpretation.

 

[cv5]

Where did I say someone proclaimed to be God in 70 A.D.?

You read my posts like the Bible. NO WONDER YOU ARE LOST in this interpretation.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

^ @AandW ,

Consider a post I made on that [your Post #555], awhile back:

[quoting old post]

[...] the usage of the "abomination [singular]" that Jesus refers to (where He said in Matt24:15 "When ye therefore see the abomination [singular] of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place..."), that this points back to its usage in the singular also in Daniel, that being Daniel 12:11 "the abomination [singular] which maketh desolate SET UP [H5414]..."; so it is this "set up [H5414]" word that I think may help us when looking into The Revelation...

--"set up" - H5414 - "weletet/nathan" - [meaning] "give, put, set [established, permit, executes]"


In Revelation 13:2, it says, "And the beast [from/out of the sea, v.1] that I saw was like a leopard, and its feet like a bear's, and its mouth like the mouth of a lion. And the dragon gave [G1325] to it his power, and his throne [/seat], and great authority." With G1325 meaning, "give, put, place [set / grant / commit a thing to one / bestow / deliver]" [see also vv.4,5,7]


Could the word in Daniel 12:11 "[be] set up [H5414]" be the link between the two passages, Dan12:11 and Rev13:2 [and also connecting the two "abomination [SINGULAR]" references, Dan12:11 and Matt24:15]? I tend to believe so.

"and the abomination [singular (like Matt24:15)] that maketh desolate set up [H5414]..."



[and]

https://biblehub.com/interlinear/daniel/12-11.htm [then hover your cursor over the number 5414, here, to see the pop-up extended definition and usages]


[and]

Allow me to just add (what I've said in the past), I do believe the "flee" in Matt24:16 correlates with the "fled/fly" of Rev12:6,14 (with 1260 days remaining until His Second Coming to the earth FOR the commencement of the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom)… so there's that, to consider also.


[and]

See also Matthew 24:15's "standing [G2476 - histemi]" :

--"standing [G2476 - hestos/histemi]" … "Usage: trans: (a) I make to stand, place, set up, establish, appoint; mid: I place myself, stand, (b) I set in balance, weigh; intrans: (c) I stand, stand by, stand still; met: I stand ready, stand firm, am steadfast." [source: Bible Hub; G2476 in Matthew 24:15 is a "transitive verb" as shown defined in the bolded portion above (Hebrews 9:8 has a noun form related to this "hestos/histemi [G2476]," where it says, "...the first tabernacle yet having a standing [G4714 - stasis/stasin - noun]")]


[and]

Then see 2 Thessalonians 2:4, similarly (with different verb), and its "G2523 - kathizo/kathisai - sitteth" :
-- "G2523 - kathizo/kathisai - sitteth" … "Usage: (a) trans: I make to sit; I set, appoint, (b) intrans: I sit down, am seated, stay." [source: Bible Hub; bold and underline mine]


[this would be similar to the verse which states, "The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves [G2523 - (transitive)] in Moses' seat" Matt23:2 (meaning, "to establish, to set, to appoint" and in other contexts is used like "to confer the kingdom," and "to appoint one to act as judge"]


[end quoting from old post]

 

[AandW]

^ @AandW ,

Consider a post I made on that [your Post #555], awhile back:

[quoting old post]

[...] the usage of the "abomination [singular]" that Jesus refers to (where He said in Matt24:15 "When ye therefore see the abomination [singular] of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place..."), that this points back to its usage in the singular also in Daniel, that being Daniel 12:11 "the abomination [singular] which maketh desolate SET UP [H5414]..."; so it is this "set up [H5414]" word that I think may help us when looking into The Revelation...

--"set up" - H5414 - "weletet/nathan" - [meaning] "give, put, set [established, permit, executes]"


In Revelation 13:2, it says, "And the beast [from/out of the sea, v.1] that I saw was like a leopard, and its feet like a bear's, and its mouth like the mouth of a lion. And the dragon gave [G1325] to it his power, and his throne [/seat], and great authority." With G1325 meaning, "give, put, place [set / grant / commit a thing to one / bestow / deliver]" [see also vv.4,5,7]


Could the word in Daniel 12:11 "[be] set up [H5414]" be the link between the two passages, Dan12:11 and Rev13:2 [and also connecting the two "abomination [SINGULAR]" references, Dan12:11 and Matt24:15]? I tend to believe so.

"and the abomination [singular (like Matt24:15)] that maketh desolate set up [H5414]..."



[and]

https://biblehub.com/interlinear/daniel/12-11.htm [then hover your cursor over the number 5414, here, to see the pop-up extended definition and usages]


[and]

Allow me to just add (what I've said in the past), I do believe the "flee" in Matt24:16 correlates with the "fled/fly" of Rev12:6,14 (with 1260 days remaining until His Second Coming to the earth FOR the commencement of the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom)… so there's that, to consider also.


[and]

See also Matthew 24:15's "standing [G2476 - histemi]" :

--"standing [G2476 - hestos/histemi]" … "Usage: trans: (a) I make to stand, place, set up, establish, appoint; mid: I place myself, stand, (b) I set in balance, weigh; intrans: (c) I stand, stand by, stand still; met: I stand ready, stand firm, am steadfast." [source: Bible Hub; G2476 in Matthew 24:15 is a "transitive verb" as shown defined in the bolded portion above (Hebrews 9:8 has a noun form related to this "hestos/histemi [G2476]," where it says, "...the first tabernacle yet having a standing [G4714 - stasis/stasin - noun]")]


[and]

Then see 2 Thessalonians 2:4, similarly (with different verb), and its "G2523 - kathizo/kathisai - sitteth" :
-- "G2523 - kathizo/kathisai - sitteth" … "Usage: (a) trans: I make to sit; I set, appoint, (b) intrans: I sit down, am seated, stay." [source: Bible Hub; bold and underline mine]


[this would be similar to the verse which states, "The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves [G2523 - (transitive)] in Moses' seat" Matt23:2 (meaning, "to establish, to set, to appoint" and in other contexts is used like "to confer the kingdom," and "to appoint one to act as judge"]


[end quoting from old post]

I said to cv5 that 70 A.D. had NOTHING to do with Satan.
But he refuses to read that part so he can jump on his bandwagon.

 

[cv5]

^ @AandW ,

Consider a post I made on that [your Post #555], awhile back:

[quoting old post]

[...] the usage of the "abomination [singular]" that Jesus refers to (where He said in Matt24:15 "When ye therefore see the abomination [singular] of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place..."), that this points back to its usage in the singular also in Daniel, that being Daniel 12:11 "the abomination [singular] which maketh desolate SET UP [H5414]..."; so it is this "set up [H5414]" word that I think may help us when looking into The Revelation...

--"set up" - H5414 - "weletet/nathan" - [meaning] "give, put, set [established, permit, executes]"


In Revelation 13:2, it says, "And the beast [from/out of the sea, v.1] that I saw was like a leopard, and its feet like a bear's, and its mouth like the mouth of a lion. And the dragon gave [G1325] to it his power, and his throne [/seat], and great authority." With G1325 meaning, "give, put, place [set / grant / commit a thing to one / bestow / deliver]" [see also vv.4,5,7]


Could the word in Daniel 12:11 "[be] set up [H5414]" be the link between the two passages, Dan12:11 and Rev13:2 [and also connecting the two "abomination [SINGULAR]" references, Dan12:11 and Matt24:15]? I tend to believe so.

"and the abomination [singular (like Matt24:15)] that maketh desolate set up [H5414]..."



[and]

https://biblehub.com/interlinear/daniel/12-11.htm [then hover your cursor over the number 5414, here, to see the pop-up extended definition and usages]


[and]

Allow me to just add (what I've said in the past), I do believe the "flee" in Matt24:16 correlates with the "fled/fly" of Rev12:6,14 (with 1260 days remaining until His Second Coming to the earth FOR the commencement of the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom)… so there's that, to consider also.


[and]

See also Matthew 24:15's "standing [G2476 - histemi]" :

--"standing [G2476 - hestos/histemi]" … "Usage: trans: (a) I make to stand, place, set up, establish, appoint; mid: I place myself, stand, (b) I set in balance, weigh; intrans: (c) I stand, stand by, stand still; met: I stand ready, stand firm, am steadfast." [source: Bible Hub; G2476 in Matthew 24:15 is a "transitive verb" as shown defined in the bolded portion above (Hebrews 9:8 has a noun form related to this "hestos/histemi [G2476]," where it says, "...the first tabernacle yet having a standing [G4714 - stasis/stasin - noun]")]


[and]

Then see 2 Thessalonians 2:4, similarly (with different verb), and its "G2523 - kathizo/kathisai - sitteth" :
-- "G2523 - kathizo/kathisai - sitteth" … "Usage: (a) trans: I make to sit; I set, appoint, (b) intrans: I sit down, am seated, stay." [source: Bible Hub; bold and underline mine]


[this would be similar to the verse which states, "The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves [G2523 - (transitive)] in Moses' seat" Matt23:2 (meaning, "to establish, to set, to appoint" and in other contexts is used like "to confer the kingdom," and "to appoint one to act as judge"]


[end quoting from old post]

Yes completely agree. I really should have emphasized that the A of D is not a singular act, it is the son of perdition "setting up shop" in the Holy Place.