When was the Messiah put in the grave? and when did He resurrect?

Hizikyah · Oct 27, 2017

Except for this;

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 27:59-66, “And having taken the body, Yosĕph wrapped it in clean linen, and laid it in his new tomb which he had hewn out of the rock. And he rolled a large stone against the door of the tomb, and went away. And Miryam from Maḡdala was there, and the other Miryam, sitting opposite the tomb. On the next day, which was after the preparation, the chief priests and Pharisees gathered together to Pilate, saying, “Master, we remember, while He was still alive, how that deceiver said, ‘After three days I am raised. Command, then, that the tomb be safeguarded until the third day, lest His taught ones come by night and steal Him away, and should say to the people, ‘He was raised from the dead.’ And the last deception shall be worse than the first. So Pilate said to them, “You have a watch, go, safeguard it as you know how. And they went and safeguarded the tomb, sealing the stone and setting the watch.”[/FONT]

"[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]the tomb be safeguarded until the third day[/FONT]"

The Roman guards would not have let anyone in.

Hizikyah · Oct 27, 2017

phil36 said:

So you say;

phil36 said:

But then post his as evidence;

phil36 said:

That is time counting by pharisees "according to Jewish custom", not by YHWH, so..

Possibly you missed the post so here it is again, I believe it covers all the question or points of debate;

Hizikyah said:

Yes this is rabbinic/pharisee time reckoning, not YHWH's

Leviticus 23:32, "It is a Sabbath of rest to you, and you shall afflict your beings. On the ninth day of the month at evening, from evening to evening, you observe your Sabbath.”

If any part of a day could be a day, Scripture would have said/allowed that, Scripture clearly says, sunset to sunset is a day;

Quote from that article;
"The solution is simple when we learn that according to Jewish custom any part of a day, however small, is included as part of a full day.1 "Since the Jews reckoned part of a day as a full day, the 'three days and three nights' could permit a Friday crucifixion."

This is the resource that got the information from;
1. Jamieson, R., A. R. Fausset, and D. Brown, A Commentary, Critical and Explanatory, on the Old and New Testaments, Oak Harbor, WA: Logos Research Systems, 1997.

The Jamieson, R., A. R. Fausset, and D. Brown, A Commentary, Critical and Explanatory got the information from the Talmud. A book that says some of the most vile things I have ever heard about Yahshua/Jesus.

It is still beyond me how anyone could consult literal pharisees to prove their point, especially when what they say is in direct opposition to Yahshua/Jesus.

Mat 12:40, “For as Yahnah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.”

OK so here are 2 Jewish sources that are also using the Talmud;

The Encyclopedia Judaica, Day;
In Jewish communal life part of a day is at times reckoned as one day; e.g., the day of the funeral, even when the latter takes place late in the afternoon, is counted as the first of the seven days of mourning; a short time in the morning of the seventh day is counted as the seventh day; circumcision takes place on the eighth day, even though of the first day only a few minutes remained after the birth of the child, these being counted as one day. Again, a man who hears of a vow made by his wife or his daughter, and desires to cancel the vow, must do so on the same day on which he hears of it, as otherwise the protest has no effect; even if the hearing takes place a little time before night, the annulment must be done within that little time.

Jewish Encyclopedia, DAY (Hebrew, "yom");
In the Bible, the season of light (Gen. i. 5), lasting "from dawn [lit. "the rising of the morning"] to the coming forth of the stars" (Neh. iv. 15, 17). The term "day" is used also to denote a period of twenty-four hours (Ex. xxi. 21). In Jewish communal life part of a day is at times reckoned as one day; e.g., the day of the funeral, even when the latter takes place late in the afternoon, is counted as the first of the seven days of mourning; a short time in the morning of the seventh day is counted as the seventh day; circumcision takes place on the eighth day, even though of the first day only a few minutes remained after the birth of the child, these being counted as one day. Again, a man who hears of a vow made by his wife or his daughter, and desires to cancel the vow, must do so on the same day on which he hears of it, as otherwise the protest has no effect; even if the hearing takes place a little time before night, the annulment must be done within that little time. The day is reckoned from evening to evening—i.e., night and day—except in reference to sacrifices, where daytime and the night following constitute one day (Lev. vii. 15; see Calendar). "The day" denotes: (a) Day of the Lord; (b) the Day of Atonement; (c) the treatise of the Mishnah that contains the laws concerning the Day of Atonement (See Yoma and Sabbath).

The Talmud they sourced it from is coming up, but first lets get a little insight into who the writers of the Talmud are;

Mattithyah 15:2-3, "Why do Your disciples transgress the traditions of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat. But He answered, and said to them; And why do you transgress the Laws of Yahweh by your traditions?"

King James Bible - Mat 23:2-3, "Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat: All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not."

Shem Tob's Hebrew Mattithyah - Mat 23:2-3, "The Pharisees and Sages sit upon the seat of Mosheh. Therefore, all that he (Mosheh) says to you, diligently do, but according to their takanot (reforms) and thier ma'asim (precedents) do not do, because they talk (Torah) but they do not do."

Takanot: rabbinical reforms or enactments that falsely change or add to YHWH's Law.
Ma'asim: acts or deeds that serve as precedents for rabbinic law.
Both Takanot and Ma'asim are laws of the Talmud. The Savior said this to the Pharisees;

Mat 23:8, “But you, do not be called ‘Rabbi, (master)’ for One is your Master, the Messiah, and you are all brothers.”

Matt 23:33, "Serpents! Brood of vipers! How will you escape the sentence of Gehenna?"

Yahshua EXPOSED the Pharisees and their false religious system EVERY CHANCE HE GOT. He did not sit by and let people lies many need to re-read the words of the Messiah, and see how He tore apart the lies of the accepted religious system of that day every chance He had, Is it possible we today have the same issue, where main stream religions are teaching tradition rather than truth?

Mat 15:7-9, "Hypocrites! Well did Isayah (29:13-14)* prophesy of you, saying: These people draw near to Me with their mouth and honor Me with their lips, but have removed their hearts far from Me. But in vain they do worship Me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men."

Here is one of 3 entries that I know of that give their view which they then consider “law”

Babylonian Talmud: Tractate Nazir
Folio 15a
[Defilement] is different, for the All-Merciful Law says, And he defile his consecrated head,1 showing that [the penalty for defilement lies] wherever the nazirite ship depends on the head.2

An objection was raised: A nazirite who has completed his period is forbidden to poll, or drink wine, or have contact with the dead. Should he poll or drink wine, or have contact with the dead he is to receive the forty stripes. [This is] a refutation of R. Jose son of R. Hanina.

MISHNAH. [SHOULD A MAN SAY.] 'I UNDERTAKE TO BECOME A NAZIRITE WHEN I SHALL HAVE A SON, AND TO BE A NAZIRITE FOR ONE HUNDRED DAYS [ON MY OWN ACCOUNT],' AND A SON BE BORN TO HIM BEFORE THE EXPIRATION OF SEVENTY DAYS, HE LOSES NONE OF THIS PERIOD;3 BUT IF AFTER SEVENTY DAYS, THESE SEVENTY DAYS ARE VOID, SINCE THERE CAN BE NO POLLING FOR LESS THAN THIRTY DAYS.4
GEMARA. Rab said: The seventieth day itself is reckoned as part of both periods.5
We learnt: IF [A SON] BE BORN TO HIM BEFORE THE EXPIRATION OF SEVENTY DAYS, HE LOSES NONE OF THIS PERIOD. Now if you assume that [the day of birth] is reckoned as part of both periods, [not only does he not lose but] he actually profits!6 — Strictly speaking there should have been no mention of the period-before the seventieth day,7 but because it says in the subsequent clause [of the Mishnah], that [birth] after the seventieth day renders these seventy days void, the period before the seventieth day is mentioned in the first clause.”

These are their supposed “Scriptural” proofs for their claims, I don’t see it...

Exodus 21:21, Nehemiah 4:15-17, "4:15, Leviticus 7:15,

So if one takes this “part of a day as a day” they are actually following Ma'asim: acts or deeds that serve as precedents for rabbinic law. It is ironic too because when someone follows the Scripture people call them a “pharisee” and yet people that say this seem to have no clue what the pharisees actually did.

beta · Oct 27, 2017

MarcR said:

....nothing would have prevented the women from attending Jesus' body on friday.....
no indeed, had they had all their requirements ready to hand...but they had yet-on the friday-to go and purchase all the raw ingredients necessary for ointments and perfume- and then set about making them.
I worked for a Herbalist in my distant past and take it from me it involved much preparation and patient processing and producing of such ointments, salves and lotions...which all had to be finished by sunset for these Ladies...to rest again as per commandment.

Don't let's think they had nothing to do on that friday after the 'High Day.

And Jesus/Yahshua was not crucified on the Thursday a High Day but on the day of
'preparation...the day before.

I am sure Hizikyah will get round to more detail.

Hizikyah · Oct 27, 2017

MarcR said:

beta said:

I did!

and I want to add I actually had this same exact thought, why did they wait the 3 days? but thak Yah! Scripture shows the reason why;

Hizikyah said:

Russell310 · Oct 27, 2017

The calendar of God and Jesus Christ
https://i.imgur.com/Ovk0hkI.jpg

Hizikyah · Oct 27, 2017

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 28:1-15, “1, "But late in the sabbath, as it was dawning into day one of the week, Miryam from Maḡdala and the other Miryam came to see the tomb. 2, "And see, there was a great earthquake, for a messenger of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]came down out of heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat on it. 3, "And his appearance was like lightning, and his garments as white as snow. 28:4, "And the guards trembled for fear of him, and became like dead men. 5, "And the messenger responding, said to the women, “Do not be afraid, for I know that you seek [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהושע [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]who was impaled. 6, "“He is not here, for He was raised, as He said. Come, see the place where the Master lay. 7, "“And go quickly, say to His taught ones that He was raised from the dead, and see, He is going before you to Galil. There you shall see Him. See, I have told you. 8, "And they left the tomb quickly, with fear and great joy, and ran to report to His taught ones. 9, "And as they were going to report to His taught ones, see, [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהושע [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]met them, saying, “Greetings!” And they came and held Him by the feet and did bow to Him. 10, "Then [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהושע [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]said to them, “Do not be afraid. Go, report to My brothers, to go to Galil, and they shall see Me there. 11, "And while they were going, see, some of the guards having gone into the city, reported to the chief priests all that took place. 12, "And when they had come together with the elders and taken counsel, they gave enough silver to the soldiers, 13, "saying, “Say that His taught ones came at night and stole Him away while we slept. 14, "“And if this should be reported to the governor, we shall win him over and keep you out of trouble. 15, "And having taken the silver they did as they were instructed. And this account was widely spread among the Yehuḏim, to this day.”[/FONT]

Hizikyah · Oct 27, 2017

Job 19:25-26, “For I know that my Redeemer lives, and on the Last day He shall stand over the Earth; and after my skin has been destroyed, then in my flesh I shall see the Mighty One!”

Johnny_B · Oct 27, 2017

You still have not provided any Scripture that says that "the heart of the earth" means in the Tomb for 3 day and 3 night, when every Scripture that the disciples speak of the three day and nights only speak of what He would suffer and be killed.

Luke 24:19-21, 46 “What things?” he asked.“About Jesus of Nazareth,” they replied. “He was a prophet, powerful in word and deed before God and all the people.20 The chief priests and our rulers handed him over to be sentenced to death, and they crucified him;21 but we had hoped that he was the one who was going to redeem Israel. And what is more, it is the third day since all this took place.”

46“This is what is written: The Messiah will suffer and rise from the dead on the third day,”

No mention of Christ being in the Tomb for three days, the three days are associated with His suffering and death. There is no Scripture that says He was to be in the Tomb three day and nights. More Scripture with suffering and death being part of the three days.

Matthew 16:21 "From that time on Jesus began to explain to his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, and that he must be killed and on the third day be raised to life."

Matthew 17:22-23 “When they came together in Galilee, he said to them, “The Son of Man is going to be delivered into the hands of men.23 They will kill him, and on the third day he will be raised to life.” And the disciples were filled with grief.”

Matthew 20:18-19 “We are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be delivered over to the chief priests and the teachers of the law. They will condemn him to death19 and will hand him over to the Gentiles to be mocked and flogged and crucified. On the third day he will be raised to life!”

Luke 9:22 “And he said, “The Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, and he must be killed and on the third day be raised to life.”

Luke 18:31-33 “Jesus took the Twelve aside and told them, “We are going up to Jerusalem, and everything that is written by the prophets about the Son of Man will be fulfilled.32 He will be delivered over to the Gentiles. They will mock him, insult him and spit on him;33 they will flog him and kill him. On the third day he will rise again.”

Mark 8:31 “He then began to teach them that the Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, and that he must be killed and after three days rise again.”

Mark 9:31 “He said to them, “The Son of Man is going to be delivered into the hands of men. They will kill him, and after three days he will rise.”

Mark 10:33-34 “We are going up to Jerusalem,” he said, “and the Son of Man will be delivered over to the chief priests and the teachers of the law. They will condemn him to death and will hand him over to the Gentiles,34 who will mock him and spit on him, flog him and kill him. Three days later he will rise.”

In all of these teachings of Jesus He never once teaches that He would be in the Tomb for 3 day and nights, He teaches that He would be handed over to suffer many things. Can you provide the Scripture that teach that Jesus is to be in the Tomb for 3 days?

Hizikyah · Oct 28, 2017

Johnny_B said:

Wait so "the heart of the earth" is not Him being dead? Really? Ok What does it mean then? and it is just some coincidence that has no meaning? What are you being serious? It was the only sign of the true Messiah, for none could replicate it...

no sign shall be given to it except the sign of the prophet Yonah

Yonah 1:17, "But יהוה appointed a great fish to swallow Yonah. And Yonah was in the stomach of the fish three days and three nights."

Mat 12:39-40, “But He answering, said to them, “A wicked and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign shall be given to it except the sign of the prophet Yonah. For as Yonah was three days and three nights in the stomach of the great fish, so shall the Son of Aḏam be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.”

Zmouth · Oct 28, 2017

No matter how you define the sabbath day, it still comes out that it was less than 3 days and nights from the time he was placed in the tomb until Mary Magdalene, his mother and Salome came roll away the stone.

And now when the even was come, because it was the preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath,
Mark 15:42

The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.
John 19:31

****

The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre. John 20:1

And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun. Mark 16:2

Hizikyah · Oct 28, 2017

Zmouth said:

do you know what a "High Sabbath" is, they can be on any day of the week, so that verses you posted shows it is not guaranteed a Fri-Sat Sabbath the day after the "Preperation day" Also when they came on 1st day Sunday morning, He had already Risen.

And He did say 3 days and 3 nights...

posthuman · Oct 28, 2017

Zmouth said:

there is more than one sabbath day during Passover week. the feast of unleavened bread is also a sabbath - no matter which day of the week it falls on. of course it's frustrating trying two fit 3 days & nights in a 2-day weekend -- if you don't realize that the 7th day is not the only sabbath day.

suppose that Christ was crucified on the first day of passover: 14 Nissan, which was a wednesday that year.
the 15[SUP]th[/SUP] Nissan, a thursday that year, was the festival of unleavened bread -- a sabbath, hence the request to take down His body.
the weekly sabbath would have been on the 17[SUP]th[/SUP] Nissan, a saturday.

so perhaps Jesus spent 3 days and 3 nights in the grave - the night of the 14[SUP]th[/SUP], 15[SUP]th[/SUP] and 16[SUP]th[/SUP] - which are the beginning of the Hebrew days Nissan 15, 16 and 17 - and 3 days, the 15[SUP]th[/SUP], 16[SUP]th[/SUP] and 17th, rising just at or before dawn on the 18[SUP]th[/SUP] (a sunday).

[TABLE="class: grid, width: 600"]
[TR]
[TD]TUE night[/TD]
[TD]14[SUP]th[/SUP] of Nissan[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]WED day[/TD]
[TD]14[SUP]th[/SUP] [/TD]
[TD]crucified & entombed[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]WED night[/TD]
[TD]15[SUP]th[/SUP] [/TD]
[TD]night 1[/TD]
[TD]sabbath[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]THUR day[/TD]
[TD]15[SUP]th [/SUP][/TD]
[TD]day 1[/TD]
[TD]sabbath[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]THUR night[/TD]
[TD]16[SUP]th[/SUP] [/TD]
[TD]night 2[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]FRI day[/TD]
[TD]16[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]day 2[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]FRI night[/TD]
[TD]17[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]night 3[/TD]
[TD]sabbath[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]SAT day[/TD]
[TD]17[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]day 3[/TD]
[TD]sabbath[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]SAT night[/TD]
[TD]18[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]risen before dawn[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]SUN day[/TD]
[TD]18[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]women go to tomb[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

MarcR · Oct 28, 2017

posthuman said:

there is more than one sabbath day during Passover week. the feast of unleavened bread is also a sabbath - no matter which day of the week it falls on. of course it's frustrating trying two fit 3 days & nights in a 2-day weekend -- if you don't realize that the 7th day is not the only sabbath day.

suppose that Christ was crucified on the first day of passover: 14 Nissan, which was a wednesday that year.
the 15[SUP]th[/SUP] Nissan, a thursday that year, was the festival of unleavened bread -- a sabbath, hence the request to take down His body.
the weekly sabbath would have been on the 17[SUP]th[/SUP] Nissan, a saturday.

so perhaps Jesus spent 3 days and 3 nights in the grave - the night of the 14[SUP]th[/SUP], 15[SUP]th[/SUP] and 16[SUP]th[/SUP] - which are the beginning of the Hebrew days Nissan 15, 16 and 17 - and 3 days, the 15[SUP]th[/SUP], 16[SUP]th[/SUP] and 17th, rising just at or before dawn on the 18[SUP]th[/SUP] (a sunday).

[TABLE="class: grid, width: 600"]
[TR]
[TD]TUE night[/TD]
[TD]14[SUP]th[/SUP] of Nissan[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]WED day[/TD]
[TD]14[SUP]th[/SUP] [/TD]
[TD]crucified & entombed[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]WED night[/TD]
[TD]15[SUP]th[/SUP] [/TD]
[TD]night 1[/TD]
[TD]sabbath[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]THUR day[/TD]
[TD]15[SUP]th [/SUP][/TD]
[TD]day 1[/TD]
[TD]sabbath[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]THUR night[/TD]
[TD]16[SUP]th[/SUP] [/TD]
[TD]night 2[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]FRI day[/TD]
[TD]16[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]day 2[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]FRI night[/TD]
[TD]17[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]night 3[/TD]
[TD]sabbath[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]SAT day[/TD]
[TD]17[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]day 3[/TD]
[TD]sabbath[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]SAT night[/TD]
[TD]18[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]risen before dawn[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]SUN day[/TD]
[TD]18[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]women go to tomb[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Your scenario has Jesus rising on the evening of the forth day; but many scriptures call for Him to rise on the third day.

Nehemiah6 · Oct 28, 2017

MarcR said:

If one takes into account the Hebrew reckoning, then "the third day" can still be applied effective 6:00 p.m. on the sabbath (which is also when the fourth day began).

Hizikyah · Oct 28, 2017

MarcR said:

it is a littel off but the main principle is there/close, I didnt even notice that when I looked at it!

[TABLE="class: cms_table_grid"]
[TR]
[TD]TUE night[/TD]
[TD]14[SUP]th[/SUP] of Nissan[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]WED day[/TD]
[TD]14[SUP]th[/SUP] [/TD]
[TD]crucified & entombed[/TD]
[TD]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]WED night
[/TD]
[TD]15[SUP]th[/SUP] [/TD]
[TD]night 1[/TD]
[TD]sabbath this should read Thursday night because when the sun goes down it is the next day
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]THUR day[/TD]
[TD]15[SUP]th [/SUP][/TD]
[TD]day 1
[/TD]
[TD]sabbath thur day
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]THUR night
[/TD]
[TD]16[SUP]th[/SUP] [/TD]
[TD]night 2[/TD]
[TD]fri night
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]FRI day[/TD]
[TD]16[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]day 2[/TD]
[TD]friday day
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]FRI night
[/TD]
[TD]17[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]night 3[/TD]
[TD]sabbath sat night
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]SAT day[/TD]
[TD]17[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]day 3[/TD]
[TD]sabbath sat day
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]SAT night[/TD]
[TD]18[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]risen before dawn[/TD]
[TD]rises before sundown Sunday night, but Has to present Himself as the firstfruits the morrow after the Sabbath, that is why He does not allow Mary to touch Him but Thomas can 8 days later
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]SUN day[/TD]
[TD]18[SUP]th[/SUP][/TD]
[TD]women go to tomb[/TD]
[TD]they show up at before sunrise
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Nehemiah6 said:

I personally don't see it as Hebrew reckoning as it is Yah that mae the day,it is Scriptually explain in the 1st post. But In Yah days it does not end at 6:00 or any certain time, but at sundown, sundown occurs at different times,and they took the bodies down so they were not on the execution stakes for the High Sabbath (Unleavened bread) so it had to before sundown;

John 19:31, “Therefore, since it was the Preparation Day, that the bodies should not remain on the stake on the Sabbath – for that Sabbath was a high one – the Yehuḏim asked Pilate to have their legs broken, and that they be taken away.” TS 2009

John 19:31, “Therefore, because it was the Preparation Day, that the bodies should not remain on the cross on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath was a high day)…” NKJV

John 19:31, ‘The Jews therefore, because it was the Preparation, that the bodies should not remain on the cross upon the sabbath (for the day of that sabbath was a high day)” ASV

John 19:31, ‘Since it was the day of Preparation, and so that the bodies would not remain on the cross on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath was a high day)…” ESV

posthuman · Oct 28, 2017

MarcR said:

you're right
but Mark 8:31 for example also says "after three days" -- scripture isn't set against itself, so there's obviously some cultural reckoning of time that we have to recognize to get this right, and mathematicians start counting with "0" instead of "1"

i'm not committed to this scenario tho -- just put it there to bring up the point that we are talking about a week that has multiple sabbaths, not just the 7[SUP]th[/SUP] day.
could it be the feast of unleavened bread fell on friday? after some point in history, the Sanhedrin generally 'fixed' the calendar by adding & subtracting days from some months regardless of lunar cycle, in order to prevent multiple, sequential sabbaths. i don't know whether this was the case at that time. but if it were two sabbaths in a row, then it would address your objection, and explain why they did not go to attend to his body on the intervening day, 16 Nissan as i have it in the table i posted.

posthuman · Oct 28, 2017

Hizikyah said:

thank you;

i was trying to put the Mon/Tue/Wed etc in terms of the way we reckon days in the western world, starting the 'day' at midnight, alongside how the the Hebrew calendar reckons them, starting with sundown, represented by the numbered column.

i'm not actually aware of which days of our modern week fell on which days of Nissan in that year ((is anyone?)) and not putting that table to say it is definitely the case. just thought it would be an helpful way to arrange & 'sketch out' what we're looking at, expecting it to be corrected and refined

Hizikyah · Oct 28, 2017

posthuman said:

Thank you! Its a bit confusing just going off of Yah's day schedule because we are so used to the roman calendar, it adds an extra layer when trying to apply it to both, the first wek I ever studied this that is what I did, I drew up so many charts that week.... lots of wasted paper!

Hizikyah · Oct 28, 2017

praiseYah that we can even dwell on this!

posthuman · Oct 28, 2017

Hizikyah said:

amen!

man i hadn't even read the first 3 pages of this thread yet!

you've got it. 'good friday' is twisted: He is our Passover Lamb and He rose on Firstfruits

When was the Messiah put in the grave? and when did He resurrect?

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