the Sabbath

Magenta · Sunday at 3:53 PM

James 1:14-15; 1 John 2:16 Each one is tempted when by his own evil desires he is lured away and enticed. Then after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death. For all that is in the world- the desires of the flesh, the desires of the eyes, and the pride of life- is not from the Father but from the world. .

ChristRoseFromTheDead · Sunday at 3:56 PM

vassal said:

You're just making stuff up

Inquisitor · Sunday at 3:59 PM

TMS said:

I have trouble understand you reference below?

G1380
to be of opinion,
think
suppose
to seem
to be accounted

The KJV translates Strong's G1380 in the following manner: think (33x), seem (13x), suppose (7x), seem good (3x), please (2x), miscellaneous (5x).

What are you doing and where did you get G1380 from?

Inquisitor · Sunday at 4:05 PM

vassal said:

First i want you to know I do not like to say to people they are wrong, in fact I detest it, but I cannot leave someone follow something that is wrong. please take the time to read what I wrote and do verify everything in your bible.

you lecture people on the importance context and yourself do not consider it, Below is the whole story with the proper context from Acts 15, I have Put in bold some important elements for comprehensions;

The elements being a burden were part of the law given by Moses, the 10 commandments are also considered the law of Moses but are different because :
1- the 10 Commandments were written by the finger of GOD directly on the tablets of stone.
2- these tablets were later put inside the ""ARK OF THE COVENANT" the 10 commandments are the contents of the COVENANT between Man end GOD! the rest of the law of Moses was put on the side of the ark, they were added later because the israelites disobeyed GOD

NOTE : the 10 commandments are the covenant

Deu 4:13 He declared to you His covenant, which He commanded you to follow—the Ten Commandmentst hat He wrote on two tablets of stone.
Deu 7:9 Know therefore that the LORD your God is God, the faithful God who keeps His covenant of loving devotion for a thousand generations of those who love Him and keep His commandments.

Now to clarify and see proper context;

Act 15:1 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved. ( they were talking mostly about circumcision)
Act 15:2 When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about this question.
Act 15:3 And being brought on their way by the church, they passed through Phenice and Samaria, declaring the conversion of the Gentiles: and they caused great joy unto all the brethren.
Act 15:4 And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them.
Act 15:5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses. ( The pharisees, here again cause trouble and wanted the gentiles to keep the whole law of Moses which they did not know being gentiles also also because many elements of this law, ordinances, sacrificial rites were no longer necessary)
Act 15:6 And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.
Act 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
Act 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
Act 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.
Act 15:12 Then all the multitude kept silence, and gave audience to Barnabas and Paul, declaring what miracles and wonders God had wrought among the Gentiles by them.
Act 15:13 And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:
Act 15:14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.
Act 15:15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written,
Act 15:16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up:
Act 15:17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.
Act 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
Act 15:19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and fromthings strangled, and from blood.
Act 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

There is more in Acts 15 but i will keep this short for now. Remember to have proper context whitous which proper understanding could be lost and wrongful assumptions could take hold.

they were discussing here some parts of the law of Moses but not the 10 commandments.

Where does it say that Acts 15 was not discussing the ten commandments?

The ten commandments are the law, the book of the law, the basis of the covenant.

Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and fromthings strangled, and from blood.

Looks as though the apostle's instruction sent to the churches was the ceremonial law above.

Now prove me wrong!!!

Why I win so much.

Inquisitor · Sunday at 4:06 PM

ChristRoseFromTheDead said:

It's worse than that, they are in some places directly contradicting the apostle Paul.

ChristRoseFromTheDead · Sunday at 4:08 PM

vassal said:

Did the scrolls not have the 10 commandments written in them? Of course they did; that's the only reason we know about them. It was all one law

ChristRoseFromTheDead · Sunday at 4:13 PM

Inquisitor said:

There were certain rules that proselytes, ie, gentile believers, had to follow in order to attend the Jewish synagogues. Those rules given by James were to prevent them from offending their synagogue hosts and thereby lose access to scripture. It has nothing to do with Christian behavior apart from that situation.

SabbathBlessing · Sunday at 4:23 PM

Sipsey said:

Since you insist, I refer you to an older commentary by Walvord:
a. The historical facts (4:21-23)
4:21. The Galatians had not yet submitted to the bondage of the Law but they desired to. Paul desperately wanted to stop them and turn them back to a life under grace. As a transition to what would immediately follow, he challenged the Galatians to be aware of or to understand what the Law really said.
4:22. By turning again to Abraham (Gen., as one of the Books of Moses, was considered a part of the Law) Paul was appealing to the founder of the Jewish nation from whose physical descent the Jews traced their blessings. John the Baptist and Jesus declared that physical descent from Abraham was not enough, however, to guarantee spiritual blessing (cf. Mt 3:9; Jn 8:37-44). Paul reminded his readers that Abraham had two sons (those born later are not important to his illustration), and that they should consider which of the two they were most like. One son, Isaac, was born of Sarah, the free woman; the other, Ishmael, was born of Hagar, the slave woman. According to ancient law and custom the status of a mother affected the status of her son.
4:23. A second contrast concerned the manner in which the sons were conceived. Ishmael was born in the ordinary way, that is, in the course of nature and requiring no miracle and no promise of God. Isaac, on the other hand, was born as the result of a promise. Abraham and Sarah were beyond the age of childbearing, but God miraculously fulfilled His promise in bringing life out of the deadness of Sarah's womb (cf. Ro 4:18-21).
In order to emphasize the contrast between Law and grace Paul next used the historical events above as an allegory, that is, he treated those two mothers figuratively (allēgoroumena). He did not in any sense deny the literal meaning of the story of Abraham, but he declared that that story, especially the matters relating to the conception of the two sons, had an additional meaning. Thus he compared the narrative to the conflict between Judaism and Christianity.
(This “allegorizing” is a far cry from the practice of “allegorical interpretation”—followed by Origen, Augustine, and many others down through the ages and into the present day—in which the historical facts are relegated to a lower, less significant level and fanciful, hidden meanings unrelated to the text, are considered vastly more important.)
4:24. First, the apostle pointed to two covenants. One, the Mosaic, had its origin at Mount Sinai. Those under this legal covenant were slaves. As Hagar brought forth a slave, so does the Law. At this point the reader is expected to understand and supply the implicit reference to the Abrahamic Covenant, a gracious system represented by Sarah which through its messianic promise brought forth children who are free.
4:25-26. Next, Paul pointed to two Jerusalems. Hagar also stood for the first-century city of Jerusalem, a city enslaved to Rome and in slavery to the Law. Sarah, on the other hand, corresponded to the Jerusalem… above, the mother of all the children of grace. This heavenly city, which one day will come to earth (cf. Rev 21:2), is now the “city of the living God” (cf. Heb 12:22), the home of departed believers of all ages.
4:27. The quotation from Isa 54:1 prophesied the changing fortunes of Israel, which Paul applied to Sarah's history. Israel before her Babylonian Captivity was likened to a woman with a husband. The barren woman was Israel in Captivity. The woman bearing more… children may have pictured Israel restored to the land after the Exile, but more particularly it portrays her millennial blessings. Paul applied this passage (he did not claim it was fulfilled) in this context to Sarah, who though previously barren, was later blessed with a child, and who would ultimately enjoy a greater progeny than Hagar.
In applying the truth from the biblical illustration, Paul made three comparisons.
4:28. First, Paul compared the birth of Isaac to that of Christians. As “Isaac” experienced a supernatural birth and was a child by means of a promise, so each believer experiences a supernatural birth (Jn 3:3,5) and is a recipient of the promise of salvation (Ga 3:9,22,29). As children of promise Christians are in a distinct category and should not live as children of bondage.
4:29. Second, the apostle compared Ishmael's persecution of Isaac to the false teachers' opposition to believers. Abraham celebrated the weaning of Isaac with a banquet. On that occasion Ishmael mocked Isaac, laughing derisively at the younger boy, since Ishmael was the elder son and assumed he would be heir to his father's estate (cf. Ge 21:8-9). That early animosity has been perpetuated in the two peoples which descended from the two sons of Abraham and is seen in the current Arab-Israel tensions. Paul likened the Judaizers to Ishmael as those who were born out of legalistic self-effort; he charged that they continued to persecute the true believers who were born by the power of the Spirit. With few exceptions Paul's persecution came from the Jews, the people in bondage to the Law.
4:30. Third, Paul compared the action of Abraham to the obligation of the Galatians. When Sarah observed Ishmael mocking Isaac, she asked Abraham to expel the slave woman and her son lest Ishmael become a joint heir with Isaac. And God granted Sarah's request (cf. Ge 21:10,12). This reminded the readers that Law observance brought no inheritance in the family of God, and it also charged them to excommunicate the Judaizers and those who accepted their false doctrines. A fundamental incompatibility remains between Law and grace, between a religion based on works and a religion based on faith.
4:31. In conclusion, Paul affirmed that he and the Galatian believers were not children of the slave woman who was driven away and was denied a share in the inheritance. Rather all believers are children of the free woman, “heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ” (Ro 8:17).

Is this yours or did you copy from someplace. If you copied can you please post the reference?

The contrast here with the covenants, is one depended on themselves to , the other on God. When Sarah thinking she was too old to conceive, had her maidservant convince a child to claim the promise, so it was based on her strength instead of God’s strength which is what the New Covenat is about- God doing based on His power, we just need to cooperate with Him.

The New Covenant is established on better promises Heb 8:6 The old covenant is based on the people doing, Exo 19:8 like when Sarah took matters in her own hand instead of trusting in God, the New Covenant is based on God doing- He will write His laws in our hearts in the New Covenant Heb 8:10 based on His strength- this is what Paul was comparing and contrasting.

ChristRoseFromTheDead · Sunday at 4:26 PM

Inquisitor said:

They think the 10 commandments in stone are eternal, yet those tablets were inseparable from the ark of the covenant; they never came out.

And it shall come to pass, when ye be multiplied and increased in the land, in those days, saith the LORD, they shall say no more, The ark of the covenant of the LORD: neither shall it come to mind: neither shall they remember it; neither shall they visit it; neither shall that be done any more. Jeremiah 3:16

Magenta · Sunday at 4:33 PM

ChristRoseFromTheDead said:

That language sounds so similar to God saying He will remember our sins no more!

TMS · Sunday at 5:02 PM

ChristRoseFromTheDead said:

I said "can" because faith is a choice.

We can choose to have faith and we can choose to not believe.

By faith (the conditional option) we are saved.

If we are in Christ we are save....

The law does condemn us when we are not covered by the grace of Jesus.

No law = no condemnation
No condemnation = no need for grace
Which means all will be saved, no grace is needed if there is no law.

Because people will not be saved = that means the law is still condemning people of sin.

TMS · Sunday at 5:12 PM

ChristRoseFromTheDead said:

by myself i can not do anything....my flesh is evil and cannot obey God. But if I crucify the flesh and allow the Holy Spirit to fill me and control me then I can do what is right. Not by my power, no glory to me but thanks to God.

I am saying.....Phi 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.

ChristRoseFromTheDead · Sunday at 5:19 PM

TMS said:

We are always covered by the grace of Jesus. Those baptized into Christ are in covenantal relationship with him. They don't fall in and out of the covenant. They may not walk in the spirit and fall out of fellowship, but they are still in Christ where there is no condemnation.

People now will not be condemned for not obeying the law of Moses, they will be condemned for not obeying Christ's words.

He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. John 12:48

ChristRoseFromTheDead · Sunday at 5:24 PM

TMS said:

God-control is not a fruit of the spirit; self-control is

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, self-control: against such there is no law. Galatians 5:22-23

TMS · Sunday at 5:27 PM

ChristRoseFromTheDead said:

You said "not needed" .... we need to remember that the law is spiritual
Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

Jesus took the commandment about killing.
Mat 5:21-22
21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: 22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, ....

Jesus explained the true depth of this commandment.

These laws are great to help us understand right and wrong. Like a definition of true love. And the sabbath law is also one of these commandments.

If we keep the with the right motives we are loving each other.

Don't remove the laws God plainly gave to help us understand how to love.

Rom 13:8-10
Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. 9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Sipsey · Sunday at 5:34 PM

SabbathBlessing said:

Is this yours or did you copy from someplace. If you copied can you please post the reference?

The contrast here with the covenants, is one depended on themselves to , the other on God. When Sarah thinking she was too old to conceive, had her maidservant convince a child to claim the promise, so it was based on her strength instead of God’s strength which is what the New Covenat is about- God doing based on His power, we just need to cooperate with Him.

The New Covenant is established on better promises Heb 8:6 The old covenant is based on the people doing, Exo 19:8 like when Sarah took matters in her own hand instead of trusting in God, the New Covenant is based on God doing- He will write His laws in our hearts in the New Covenant Heb 8:10 based on His strength- this is what Paul was comparing and contrasting.

Walvoord, as noted in the first line, along with Roy B. Zuck.

Cameron143 · Sunday at 5:37 PM

ChristRoseFromTheDead said:

We are always covered by the grace of Jesus. Those baptized into Christ are in covenantal relationship with him. They don't fall in and out of the covenant. They may not walk in the spirit and fall out of fellowship, but they are still in Christ where there is no condemnation.

People now will not be condemned for not obeying the law of Moses, they will be condemned for not obeying Christ's words.

He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. John 12:48

They are actually made a partaker in a covenant between God the Father and God the Son.

ChristRoseFromTheDead · Sunday at 5:46 PM

Cameron143 said:

The covenant is between Israel/Judah as embodied by the 11 disciples and God. The son of God was the mediator.

vassal · Sunday at 6:06 PM

ChristRoseFromTheDead said:

Since you reject scripture there is no point to continue.

ChristRoseFromTheDead · Sunday at 6:14 PM

vassal said:

What do you think James' instructions were?

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