The End, the A.C., Revelation and the rest of it.

[Nebuchadnezzer]

It is usually typical that those who know nothing about end-time events to disagree by giving a thumbs down, without any scripture to back it up. They're just protecting the false teachings that they have adopted. What I have listed above is the truth according to all releated scriptures.

Daniel 8:25
He will cause deceit to prosper, and he will consider himself superior. When they feel secure, he will destroy many and take his stand against the Prince of princes. Yet he will be destroyed, but not by human power.
------------------
The Prince of princes is Jesus of Nazareth. Antiochus Epiphanes was not present during the time of Jesus. So "he" and "his" in Daniel 8:25 cannot be Antiochus Epiphanes.

he" and "his" in Daniel 8:25 is the antichrist. Therefore the antichrist was already present during the time of Jesus of Nazareth.

he" and "his" in Daniel 8:25 is the foretelling of the rise of the Roman Emperor.

Jesus of Nazarrath defeated the powers and principalities at the cross. But this wasn't an earthly defeat. This was a spiritual defeat.

 

[garee]

People say Genesis is a myth but that doesn't account for the fact of the flood.
Facts matter. Reality matters. Observational reality matters.

When in doubt about what time it is on Gods calendar look to the nation Israel!
The biblical truth is that we are heading toward a climax. An end to this age

http://www.watchmanbiblestudy.com/BibleStudies/HIStoryOurFuture/Ezekiels430Days.html

Which Israel? The born again Israel the one he renamed as Christian in the book of Acts. or according to the corrupted flesh of a outward Jew ?.

The new name he named his bride Christian is more befitting to represent all the nations.

Christian . . .residents of the city of Christ prepared as his bride the church named after her husband Christ the founder of the city .

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Good day, Just_Jo!

First of all, I believe that the 2,300 evenings and mornings prophecy is referring to the event with Antiochus Epiphanes, (a type of antichrist. A foreshadow, if you will) when he desecrated the temple and persecuted the Jews from 171 - 165 BC. When Antiochus died, the Jews purified and rededicated the temple, just as Daniel had predicted. This is in fact is what Hanukkah is celebrating.

Daniel 8:25
He will cause deceit to prosper, and he will consider himself superior. When they feel secure, he will destroy many and take his stand against the Prince of princes. Yet he will be destroyed, but not by human power.
------------------
The Prince of princes is Jesus of Nazareth. Antiochus Epiphanes was not present during the time of Jesus. So "he" and "his" in Daniel 8:25 cannot be Antiochus Epiphanes.

he" and "his" in Daniel 8:25 is the antichrist. Therefore the antichrist was already present during the time of Jesus of Nazareth.

he" and "his" in Daniel 8:25 is the foretelling of the rise of the Roman Emperor.

Jesus of Nazarrath defeated the powers and principalities at the cross. But this wasn't an earthly defeat. This was a spiritual defeat.

JEsus of Nazerath (Throne of David) spiritual defeated the ruler of the world, the Roman Emperor (Goliath). This is foretold in Daniel 8. the rise of the Roman Empire and its spiritual defeat.

Antiochus Epiphanes was defeated by man.
Hanukkah has nothing to do with Biblical truth

 

[cv5]

Which Israel? The born again Israel the one he renamed as Christian in the book of Acts. or according to the corrupted flesh of a outward Jew ?.

The new name he named his bride Christian is more befitting to represent all the nations.

Christian . . .residents of the city of Christ prepared as his bride the church named after her husband Christ the founder of the city .

The as yet unsaved nation Israel residing now in the state of Israel since 1948.

 

[GraceAndTruth]

It's all history. We now look for His coming at the LAST trump (that signifies THE END) and then the earth is destroyed by intense heat. (2 Peter 3:12) Eath clock stops. Yes, I am "amillenianist".

Revelation is hard for some to undertstand because they do not know the symbolism used by John to convey this message to the churches in Asia (Ephesus was the church John was pastoring after his release from Patmos) He used scripture (OLD testsament as it was all he had at that time) for Jewish references and contemporary symbolism (for his time) on Rome and its part in the "great trib".

There are several provable facts that John wrote from Patmos before 65AD, before the 'great trib" he wrote of because "the time was NEAR". REV 1:3 (must shortly take place Rev 1:1) TWICE makes note that this is an event coming soon.

You can either scare yourself (and others) or relax in His peace if you are born again.

 

[Ahwatukee]

After a great deal of study, the scriptures pertaining to the end of the age basically crystallize/freeze into you are presenting.

You and I am come to almost precisely the same conclusion on these matters.
This of course is no accident.

The fact is that alternative views simply do not take into account all of the relevant scriptures, the whole counsel of God, so then they veer off into the ditch. Why and how this happens is really perfectly obvious to those who have a firm grasp on end time eschatology.

Unfortunately it is sometimes extremely difficult to get these people out of the ditch and back on the straight road!

Good day, CV5!

I totally agree with you in that the problem is that other expositors do not take into account all of the relevant scriptures. I have been saying that they come in half cocked, i.e. with only partial information. They cite certain scriptures, but leave out others and thereby come to the wrong conclusions. I think that this has to do with them adopting the teachings of all these end-time writers and then defending it tooth and nail. I suppose that it is par for the course seeing that we are living in the last days. For God did say that people would not put up with sound doctrine, but instead would gather around themselves a great number of teachers who would say what their itching ears want to hear. That they would abandon the truth and turn aside to myths.

 

[Ahwatukee]

Daniel 8:25
He will cause deceit to prosper, and he will consider himself superior. When they feel secure, he will destroy many and take his stand against the Prince of princes. Yet he will be destroyed, but not by human power.
------------------
The Prince of princes is Jesus of Nazareth. Antiochus Epiphanes was not present during the time of Jesus. So "he" and "his" in Daniel 8:25 cannot be Antiochus Epiphanes.

he" and "his" in Daniel 8:25 is the antichrist. Therefore the antichrist was already present during the time of Jesus of Nazareth.

he" and "his" in Daniel 8:25 is the foretelling of the rise of the Roman Emperor.

Jesus of Nazarrath defeated the powers and principalities at the cross. But this wasn't an earthly defeat. This was a spiritual defeat.

It is a mixture of prophecy, Nehemiah. Both the prophesies of Antiochus Epiphanes and that ruler, the antichirst, are mentioned. However to Daniel, they were both future

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

It is a mixture of prophecy, Nehemiah. Both the prophesies of Antiochus Epiphanes and that ruler, the antichirst, are mentioned. However to Daniel, they were both future

You are just hand waving it seems. Antiochus Epiphanes doesn't match at all to Daniel 8. We can go verse by verse in Daniel 8 if you would like.

Also Daniel 8:25 makes evident that the antichrist (little horn Daniel 8:9) and Prince of princes cross paths on earth.
Prince of princes Daniel 8 is the 1st coming of Christ. When he had not yet achieved full glory.
King of kings Revelation is 2nd coming of Christ. When he returns in full glory.

So Daniel 8:25 provides strong evidence that the antichrist is already present on earth during the time of Jesus of Nazerath, which is 1st century AD.

 

[Ahwatukee]

JEsus of Nazerath (Throne of David) spiritual defeated the ruler of the world, the Roman Emperor (Goliath). This is foretold in Daniel 8. the rise of the Roman Empire and its spiritual defeat.

Antiochus Epiphanes was defeated by man.
Hanukkah has nothing to do with Biblical truth

Hanukkah is the celebration of the rededication of the temple after it was desecrated by Epiphanes, which is in reference to the 2,300 days. The other reference in Daniel 9:27 is regarding that future ruler, the antichrist, when he sets up that abomination in the holy place. Furthermore, I see nothing about Roman Catholicism in Daniel 8. The two-horned ram represents the kings of Media and Persia. And the shaggy goat represents the king of Greece. Rome is not even mentioned in Daniel 8.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Hanukkah is the celebration of the rededication of the temple after it was desecrated by Epiphanes, which is in reference to the 2,300 days. The other reference in Daniel 9:27 is regarding that future ruler, the antichrist, when he sets up that abomination in the holy place. Furthermore, I see nothing about Roman Catholicism in Daniel 8. The two-horned ram represents the kings of Media and Persia. And the shaggy goat represents the king of Greece. Rome is not even mentioned in Daniel 8.

You still ignore Daniel 8:25 which places He, the little horn, on earth at the same time as the Prince of princes (Jesus of Nazerath).

You ignore this because it puts a big hole in your conjectures. I would like you to address this in Daniel 8:25.

 

[Nebuchadnezzer]

Hanukkah is the celebration of the rededication of the temple after it was desecrated by Epiphanes, which is in reference to the 2,300 days.

Again Hanukkah is not biblical.

Hanukkah, which means “dedication,” is the festival that commemorates the purification and rededication of the Temple.

There is only one way the Temple can be purified. That is through the blood of Jesus Christ. Daniel 8:14 refers to this, not Hanukkah.

The Jewish 2nd temple was devoid of God's presence even after they rededicated and "purified" the temple themselves. The 2nd temple was not occupied by God until Jesus Christ was dedicated in the temple as a baby.

 

[iamsoandso]

I think it says "revealed"
Obama was "revealed" to any believer before he ever took power.

You think 2 Thess. 2 says revealed?

 

[iamsoandso]

A solution that not a lot of people are acquainted with:
The term "the apostasy" should be correctly read "the departure" aka the Rapture!
This solves completely the problem that you have encountered.

https://www.pre-trib.org/articles/all-articles/message/the-departure-in-2-thessalonians-2-3/read

We were not speaking of the issue of an departure,rapture ect. but in regards to it's timing.

 

[cv5]

We were not speaking of the issue of an departure,rapture ect. but in regards to it's timing.

Correct. The man of sin is revealed AFTER the rapture. That is the sequence.

 

[cv5]

Again Hanukkah is not biblical.

Hanukkah, which means “dedication,” is the festival that commemorates the purification and rededication of the Temple.

There is only one way the Temple can be purified. That is through the blood of Jesus Christ. Daniel 8:14 refers to this, not Hanukkah.

The Jewish 2nd temple was devoid of God's presence even after they rededicated and "purified" the temple themselves. The 2nd temple was not occupied by God until Jesus Christ was dedicated in the temple as a baby.

The feast of dedication Hanukkah is certainly Biblical. Jesus attended the temple during that festival.

John 10:22-24
22Now it was the Feast of Dedication in Jerusalem, and it was winter.23And Jesus walked in the temple, in Solomon’s porch. 24Then the Jews surrounded Him and said to Him, “How long do You keep us in [d]doubt? If You are the Christ, tell us plainly.”

 

[iamsoandso]

Correct. The man of sin is revealed AFTER the rapture. That is the sequence.

That is indeed the question in that one group will worship the image and not partake in the rapture while the other will not and partake in it,so I watch to see who will spot it and who will not. It's all a matter of resolving the head who received the wound and it's healing but it's missing from most all eschatology at present. This is why that eighth head is hardly ever spoken of in the forums and so left out of the various explanations.

 

[49]

That is indeed the question in that one group will worship the image and not partake in the rapture while the other will not and partake in it,so I watch to see who will spot it and who will not. It's all a matter of resolving the head who received the wound and it's healing but it's missing from most all eschatology at present. This is why that eighth head is hardly ever spoken of in the forums and so left out of the various explanations.

Are you pre, mid, or post rapture? All these threads have me confused, and do apologize...

 

[iamsoandso]

Are you pre, mid, or post rapture? All these threads have me confused, and do apologize...

Sort of outside the modern camps. I suppose the best comparison would be to the early Church, 1st 2nd century but not venturing into the state run church around Constantine's time.

 

[GaryA]

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Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to Him, we ask you, brothers, 2not to be easily disconcerted or alarmed by any spirit or message or letter seeming to be from us, alleging that the Day of the Lord has already come. 3Let no one deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness—the son of destruction—is revealed.
=====================================================================

Brother, you need to study it some more...

2 Thessalonians 2:

1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

If verse 1 is the "topic of concern", why would Paul then continue to speak about something else?

Think about it...

The phrase 'the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ', the phrase 'the day of Christ', and the phrase 'that day' [shall not come] are all talking about the same thing - the Second Coming of Christ.

Paul is talking about the same singular topic in all three of the above verses. He does not "change" to something else the moment he indicates what he is going to be talking about.

If you are trying to make a point that the rapture and the second coming at the end of the 7 year gt are one and the same then you are definately not studying.

My point is simple and plain. These verses are straight-forward. The thought flow is smooth. The language is coherent and connected. The focus does not shift.

Paul did not state the center focus of what he was writing about in the first verse and then immediately change it in the next verse.

All three of the phrases that Ahwatukee made bold in his display of the three verses are indeed and in fact referring to the very same exact thing.

 

[iamsoandso]

Who is the beast that "was,and is not,and is about to ascend"? That is it had existed prior to Revelation but did not when the angel explained it to John back then in Revelation. When did it receive it's deadly wound, prior to John receiving the Revelation? https://biblehub.com/interlinear/revelation/17-8.htm