Speaking in Tongues

[2ndTimothyGroup]

And David was GIVEN POWER to kill a lion with his bare hands, and kill a giant with a sling shot, and Samson was GIVEN POWER tobring an entire building down with his bare hands, and Elijah was GIVEN POWER to stop rain, and call fire down from Heaven, and Moses was GIVEN POWER to split the Red Sea. Oh, and Balaam's donkey was GIVEN POWER to speak Hebrew, and the fish was GIVEN POWER to get a coin, and give it to the disciples to pay taxes with. And there was the Axe Head that was GIVEN POWER to swim.

Nothing new there. The person/animal MEANS NOTHING. God's POWER given to whom/what HE PLEASES means everything.

Ok champ. You win. Let's stop talking to each other. I don't play grade school word games. Good luck to you.

 

[Cameron143]

But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us....2 Corinthians 4:7

 

[Cameron143]

Nope. My entire post was "stop lying."

I'm a bad, bad man! It's a good thing I didn't call anyone a Brood of Vipers, etc.

I was referring to my post.

 

[VARob]

No. And Paul was also clear when he wrote, just a couple verses earlier . . .

"Let love be your highest goal!"

"Love" is in the pit, isn't it? Do you Love me, your enemy? Are you feeding me, your enemy?

I do

Nope. Instead of "food," I got banned. How's that for utterly backward?

You got banned for calling someone a liar.

You people think that I am struggling, so you ban me?

I had nothing to do with it. I'm not a moderator.

That is absolutely perfect, and I love how the True character of this site has shown through. Thank you!

...

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

You got banned for calling someone a liar.

Its a good thing I didn't call someone a whitewashed tomb. Wait . . . I didn't call anyone any names as you have stated. Can you explain why you would say that I called someone a name when I actually didn't?

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

You people can contrive all kinds of stories and not get banned? Is there some "club" status that I'm missing out on?

Uh oh . . . did I just call you guys liars again?

 

[VARob]

Its a good thing I didn't call someone a whitewashed tomb. Wait . . . I didn't call anyone any names as you have stated. Can you explain why you would say that I called someone a name when I actually didn't?

Accusing someone of lying is calling them a liar.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

I'm done with this thread.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

Accusing someone of lying is calling them a liar.

At this site, people have inferred that I am mentally ill. They weren't banned. All of you have inferred all kinds of things about me.

Look, if you people can't get yourselves together, then there's no reason for me to be here. If you people can't play fair, then what's the point?

Goodbye!

 

[VARob]

At this site, people have inferred that I am mentally ill. They weren't banned. All of you have inferred all kinds of things about me.

Look, if you people can't get yourselves together, then there's no reason for me to be here. If you people can't play fair, then what's the point?

Goodbye!

You might want to check if there is a "poor me!" section of this site.

 

[Wansvic]

Can you show me where I entered into a "tirade," a long, angry speech of criticism or accusation?

Thanks.

My comment was in response to your post# 297 that seemed to convey anger.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

First, I read all that you wrote, and thank you. I appreciate your level-headed approach to this drama. Again, thank you.

I am with you, should anyone have taken the time to ask. I am a mere human being. . . what do I know (compared to our God?) I am a mere human who is doing his best to understand things in a right manner. That said, God can do absolutely whatever He desires. If God wants me to speak in Tongues, it's going to happen, and I won't argue one bit. All that I am saying is that we should use our brains and ask ourselves, "Who has the Power and Authority from God to replace legs from the men and women of the world who have lost them? Who has the ability to give eyesight to a person born blind? Who is doing this today? There isn't anyone capable of these kinds of miraculous healings, but our God is completely capable of restoring a missing leg, eyes, teeth, hair, or anything else wrong with a human body.

All that I am saying is that we need to think in more simple and rational terms . . . yet I am banned. Classic. Absolutely classic.

banned what do you mean ? Not really sure

yeah brother to be clear I absolutely accept and believe the gift of tongues is a spiritual gift from God for the church. I just think most of us don’t really understand it and we can learn what a gods intent for it is , if we read the scripture explaining it

I don’t speak in tongues, in my lifetime I’ve known many Christian’s who do have that gift, I’ve spoken to them about it inquiring what they understand about it
But all I myself know about tongues is what the scripture presents and explains

in most any case I’ve learned the scriptures just say what they say and they always turn out to be truth from God

my only nite t in chiming in here in this thread was to o traduce the concept of a group of us Lear ong from and discussing the scriptures pertaining to these many subjects we have so many ideas about that seem to conflict with each other regarding the same issues and subjects

the way we can all agree is to learn what the scripture says and agree with that

I’m a basic person I began as a basic person then got complex got in my own way and then . Later was humbled and became simple and basic again what I mean is I believe the scriptures ready explain it all To us and our part is to adjust what we thought to what he said

regarding tongues brother as everything I write here it’s just one persons opinion who doesn’t himself have the first of tongues and is based only on what the scripture says about it

truly intention to discuss the Bible and what it says because thats what I believe even if I don’t understand it all I’m learning and believing

It seems to me the idea of tongues is a practical ministerial gift there has to be a way for Israelites tomoresch the gospel to all nations who had many languages so even at the start they are speaking in known earthly tongues miraculously d the people from those places heard it and it became a sign that there’s something to it

so we know one point of tongues is a sign for unbelievers

“Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭14:22‬ ‭KJV‬‬

this doesn’t mean that’s all tongues is but clearly we have learned one aspect one point tonthe gift of tongues being a sign for unbelievers like this note how the gift of tongues catches thier attention and they pay attention

“And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language. And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilæans? Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God. And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:4, 6-7, 11-

this is how my thinking works I now have a single point I know is true about tongues it’s a sign for unbelievers

also in just this one example we can see that it’s not Babel or incoherent heavenly language but the spirit has given them power to speak the gospel in all Languages so the people could hear the gospel from all nationalities

we see the spirit giving them power to speak coherently in all those many languges this caused many of those who hears to pay attention “ they marveled and wondered what does this mean ?”

I’m positive tongues is more than this one point but I can file this one away now and know this one aspect and then I can move on and learn more from other scripture

I’m simple

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

banned what do you mean ? Not really sure

I received a short-term ban for saying "stop lying." But I have been berated and belittled horribly since I arrived nearly two years ago. Not a problem.

I absolutely accept and believe the gift of tongues is a spiritual gift from God for the church.

And you could very well be right!

I’m simple

And, as far as I have been able to determine, you've managed to keep a fairly level-head about yourself. This is commendable.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I received a short-term ban for saying "stop lying." But I have been berated and belittled horribly since I arrived nearly two years ago. Not a problem.



And you could very well be right!



And, as far as I have been able to determine, you've managed to keep a fairly level-head about yourself. This is commendable.

haha oh I see I didn’t even realize you were temporarily banned I’m glad you’ve been liberated “viva la forum ! “

well I appreciate that brother and I do my best these days to keep an even keel but this now definately a learned behavior from many many mistakes and falling short which I may do again tomorrow but today is the day relevant d I try as I’m sure everyone else here does to stay level and not offend anyone haphazardly

 

[Beckie]

I'm done with this thread.

good

 

[shittim]

"But I have been berated and belittled horribly since I arrived nearly two years ago."

I don't recall anyone but you saying this, is there just a smidgen of a chance it isn't everybody else picking on you?

 

[Polar]

One can have it and not be using it, not ever tried it, I recall the NT scripture of those who said "We have not even heard there be a Holy Ghost since we have believed".

this is true. as for myself, even though I did receive that gift when I prayed, I did not use it for a few years

and then one interesting evening, during a ministry a group of believers had going in a church, a bus broke down outside the church.

it turned out to be a youth group from a Lutheran church who had been on some kind trip....and for some reason when I looked out the window, I started to speak in tongues...after not doing so for a number of years!

but get this.....it wasn't any Lutheran church...it was the one where I had been baptized as an infant (let's not go down that road tho...I wasn't asked about it)

the youth group all came into the church while they waited for help to show up and we witnessed to them (Lutheran does not necessarily mean you are saved) and basically had a wonderful time sharing... I know what impact on a permanent basis that had, but God knows

they were about the same age as us (late teens early 20's). it was almost like God ordained that time and I think maybe He did

anyway, about tongues, when I do pray in tongues, almost always I will then pray in English and I find that fruitful

God is good! All the time!

 

[Polar]

 

[CS1]

Good grief... I said I wasn't going to say anymore, but I need to address these notions.

My story, which I've told before, in previous "tongues" discussions is that about 40 years ago, I met a group of folks that were going about the country, preaching and reaching out, mostly to young folks. I was a young person then... well, young-ER.... mid 20's....
They strongly taught speaking in tongues. I had heard of it, being brought up in the church, baptized at 11, father was an elder in the church, went to a Christian school... etc...
After attending some of their worship sessions, I was convinced that I was somehow missing something, as I did not speak in tongues. We had several discussions, and I was convinced that I simply had to fully give in and accept it, pray for it earnestly, etc. We even had two sessions of 8-10 of them surrounding me and laying hands on me.... I WANTED to have that gift....
I didn't receive it. Never. They even said I need to just open my mouth and start making noises, and it would just "flow".... Didn't happen.
After a few weeks of serious prayer and meditation on the subject, I came to the conclusion that either I was "unworthy" or that just perhaps, the Spirit decided I didn't need that gift. Over the past 40 or so years of reading, studying, praying, I've come to the conclusions that I have put forth in this (and other) threads.

So.... don't try to tell me that I WILL speak in tongues, if I just pray for it, and want it bad enough.
If the Spirit decides I NEED that gift, He will give it to me.... and I will NOT have that gift before that happens.... if it ever does.

When I pray to God, I KNOW that the Spirit is also interceding in my behalf, using words that I just don't have. That is good enough for me... I've seen prayers answered, not always the way I was asking, but always for the best. That is the work of the Spirit...

The teaching of initial evidence as Tongues or Prophecying when one is empowered by the Holy Spirit. In every case where the Holy Spirit empowered, they spoke in tongues or Prophesied.

“I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.” (Matthew 3:11, also in all the other Gospels: Mark 1:8; Luke 3:16; John 1:33)

this happens in the following chapters of Acts
Acts chapter 2:4-8, 8:15-17,
Simon the Sorcerer Acts 8:18 saw something happen when hands were laid on people. What did he see and hear?

Acts 10 and 11

Baptism and the Holy Spirit of the Twelve Ephesians, Acts 19:1-7

All spoke in tongues of supernatural empowerment by the Holy Spirit.

You say, " You still have shown no scripture that says that EVERY one that receives the Spirit MUST show it by speaking in tongues."

Can you tell me how it is to be known that one is empowered by the Holy Spirit from the Word of God?

No one is saying they must speak in tongues. The word of God shows us everyone who was Baptized in the Holy Spirit Did speak in tongues or Prophesied. You were given much scripture to prove that.

Your experience, I understand, but that doesn't make what the word of God shows null in void.

You said :

• I WANTED to have that gift....I didn't receive it. Never. They even said I need to open my mouth and start making noises, and it would just "flow".... Didn't happen.

That was wrong for them to do that, and they were ignorant. Yet the Holy Spirit will never force you or make you speak in tongues.

• After a few weeks of serious prayer and meditation on the subject, I concluded that either I was "unworthy" or that, just perhaps, the Spirit decided I didn't need that gift. Over the past 40 or so years of reading, studying, and praying, I've come to the conclusions that I have put forth in this (and other) thread.

The devil is a lying devil, and, so you know, the feelings are not faith or truth about you. The devil doesn't want anyone to be empowered with the Holy Spirit. I have seen many empowered with the Holy Spirit just like you who have had the same bad experience. Those people were wrong And although they had good intentions, they were still in error. But that doesn't mean the empowering of the Holy Spirit is not for you or needed today.

• So.... don't try to tell me that I WILL speak in tongues if I just pray for it, and want it bad enough. If the Spirit decides I NEED that gift, He will give it to me.... and I will NOT have that gift before that happens.... if it ever does.

I am not going to tell you that. I will tell you that speaking in tongues is the Cause but an effect of the Holy Spirit of one who has been empowered by the Holy Spirit. You are a child of God, and you do not have to beg, wait, or hope.

Jesus said you being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children. How much more will your Father in Heaven give the gift of the Holy Spirit if you ask Him. In times past, you and I have had odds on its topic.

I have never said you were not saved or did not have the Holy Spirit; you do. The work of the Holy Spirit in you was to save you and have you bear witness that you are CHILD OF GOD.

Jesus said you will receive POWER after the Holy Spirit comes UPON you. The Disciples already had the Holy Spirit in them when Jesus said this in ACTS 1:8 and Luke CHAPTER 24:49.

If they had the Holy Spirit, why would they have to wait for the Holy Spirit unless Jesus had to leave earth first? John chapters 14 and 15 speak to this. The Holy Spirit comes alongside to help. Lead, guide, and bring into remembrance the words Jesus Spoke. Lead into Truth. And to have the power to be a witness.


Don't seek tongues. Just ask the lord if you have been empowered to be a witness. Tell the Lord I want all you want me to have, and get me out of the way so I can receive. You will never speak in tongues because the Word of God says the Holy Spirit gives the ability. Still, you do the speaking, Jesus, as the Holy Spirit leads us to witness you got to speak; you got to pray for the sick; the Holy Spirit WILL NOT MAKE YOU DO any of that. HE will call you to preach, but if you don't answer, that is you, not HIM.

You go to your prayer room or private Location, no one is around, and as Jesus baptizes you in the Holy Spirit, step out of the Boat and do what the Holy Spirit leads you to do. Know this the devil will make you feel unworthy. Is it true? No! The devil will say you are mocking to ask God for what HE said to ask HIm for. Are you? NO! You tell the devil to Shut up in the name of Jesus and press in.

You who are saved will not have the devil slip into you when you are calling on the Lord. That is a lie from the pit of Hell.

I make no apologies. Every perfect gift comes from the Lord, and all must be received by Faith, not feeling.

In every Biblical account, The man or women of God had to humble themselves, obey, ask then receive. We must come boldly in faith, not feeling or from the position of past bad experiences. I want more of Jesus. I would have been ok without tongues, but it did happen, and it was wonderful other tongues were the highlight experience;. However, I pray in tongues almost every day; I thank him for the many people Him to the Lord through the ministry God called me too. I have seen healing, salvation, deliverances, miracles, additions, broken marriages restored lives changed by God and His word. I have also seen the gifts of the Holy Spirit found in 1cor chapters 12 thru 14 used today to God be all the Glory.

Those who may read this and are inspired but have never had what is known as the empowering of the Holy Spirit That Jesus said to us we are to have any desire to have but maybe were offended by good initial people but were wrong, Forgive them and move on.

But you say I still would like to experience this but have no one to help me. I want to pray for you, and as I believe the Holy Spirit will meet you right where you are if you take a step of faith, NOT feelings, you will be blessed and wonderfully surprised.

There is only one requirement. You have to know Jesus as your Lord and savior. That it.

Go to a place alone. You don't need hands laid on you, but the Lord will lead you to a person when that is needed.

Pray this :

Dear Father, I come to you in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, my Lord, and Savior. I ask you to be empowered with your Holy Spirit to witness you and your resurrection as you said I would be. I don't understand all there is to be with the gifts of the Holy Spirit; I know you will not force on me anything I am not ready to receive. I desire all you want me to have from the Holy Spirit. Empower me, Lord, that I may do all you have called me to do. I forgive those who have offended me, but I ask in faith, knowing you hear me and desire to give me all that you have for me to be more Like you each day. In Jesus' Name amen.

Lift your hands and begin to thank Him for the Gift of the Holy Spirit, and Tell the devil you cannot stop me from receiving what my Lord wants me to have. I am worthy because of the Blood of Jesus, I have no condemnation, I am not mocking my Lord, and Lift up my hand to you Lord, and I open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel; Lord empowers me. Amen.

You will be filled, you will be empowered, and you will do all the Lord enables you to do. You will speak, cry, shout, and be silent; however, your experience is it is a personal one, and it will be wonderful, powerful, and of God.

 

[Polar]

Ok champ. You win. Let's stop talking to each other. I don't play grade school word games. Good luck to you.

it is this attitude that people do not have to tolerate

it is not Christian, no matter how many times you cite Paul or anyone else in scripture that legitimately gave people what for

your attitude is not anointed. in fact, you create a ripple effect of people getting angry at each other

and you can quote me