Replacement theology.

[Guojing]

Yet he is dead wrong, in context of what we are discussing,

His argument is a tautology, which is true by definition.

If you want to convince him otherwise, you must understand that first.

 

[Guojing]

No replacement, only continuation. One people of the Most High. One covenant in Christ.

This sophisticated version of replacement theology is indeed alive and well.

https://christianchat.com/threads/replacement-theology.195824/post-4417770

 

[eternally-gratefull]

His argument is a tautology, which is true by definition.

If you want to convince him otherwise, you must understand that first.

His argument is based on a false ideology and false understanding of dispensationalism.
you can’t base truth on facts which are not true, and an understanding which is not there

no one can convince him, only God, that’s why I stopped trying

 

[Guojing]

His argument is based on a false ideology and false understanding of dispensationalism.
you can’t base truth on facts which are not true, and an understanding which is not there

no one can convince him, only God, that’s why I stopped trying

I think if more of us treat discussion forums as a way to understand why others form the doctrine they form, rather than a way to convince others of wrong doctrine, it will be a more pleasurable experience for all.

 

[Guojing]

Great, Romans 11 says they will. So you can quite acting like the Jews are more an enemy of the Gospel than any other unsaved person. And no Jew today is a "Christ killer".

So if you are willing to take a step back, both of you are actually making the same point.

Once anyone, Jew or otherwise, at anytime, now or during the Tribulation, repent and believe in the gospel, they will be saved.

 

[KJV1611]

My argument is that God has never chosen any person at any time because of their earthly lineage. Gods chosen people are and always have been those who have put their faith in Christ.

 

[Guojing]

My argument is that God has never chosen any person at any time because of their earthly lineage. Gods chosen people are and always have been those who have put their faith in Christ.

As a consequence of that doctrine, I think you would also not believe that, during the Tribulation, God will supernaturally be feeding the Israelites as they flee to the mountains during the Tribulation right?

Plus you will also not believe that God will also be protecting them during that time, thru promises like the famous Psalms 91?

And talking about Ps 91, I find it rather interesting that so many churches insist on applying that Psalm to themselves instead.

 

[KJV1611]

As a consequence of that doctrine, I think you would also not believe that, during the Tribulation, God will supernaturally be feeding the Israelites as they flee to the mountains during the Tribulation right?

Plus you will also not believe that God will also be protecting them during that time, thru promises like the famous Psalms 91?

And talking about Ps 91, I find it rather interesting that so many churches insist on applying that Psalm to themselves instead.

God was finished with the nation of Israel at the cross.

Amo 8:2 (KJV) And he said, Amos, what seest thou? And I said, A basket of summer fruit. Then said the LORD unto me, The end is come upon my people of Israel; I will not again pass by them any more.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I think if more of us treat discussion forums as a way to understand why others form the doctrine they form, rather than a way to convince others of wrong doctrine, it will be a more pleasurable experience for all.

If only

it would also be a great service if people stopped telling others what they believe when it’s clearly obvious they have no clue what they believe,

 

[Guojing]

God was finished with the nation of Israel at the cross.

Amo 8:2 (KJV) And he said, Amos, what seest thou? And I said, A basket of summer fruit. Then said the LORD unto me, The end is come upon my people of Israel; I will not again pass by them any more.

I see, thanks for sharing.

 

[Guojing]

If only

it would also be a great service if people stopped telling others what they believe when it’s clearly obvious they have no clue what they believe,

Everyone has a right to voice their opinion, that is the beauty of discussion forums.

 

[tribesman]

If only

it would also be a great service if people stopped telling others what they believe when it’s clearly obvious they have no clue what they believe,

You do have a point there, e-g. We need to be mindful, especially as to professing christians but also whomsoever it may be. Richard Louw (from calvin.edu) even told the mormons that "we have told you what you believe rather than ask you what to believe". There were too many times we went headlong into debates, tilting at windmills. Btw, long time no see, bro. Cheers!

 

[tribesman]

This sophisticated version of replacement theology is indeed alive and well.

https://christianchat.com/threads/replacement-theology.195824/post-4417770

Would you see as a reality that some that are being in the covenant community, having the outward sign and seal of the covenant, yet are unregenerate?

 

[Guojing]

Would you see as a reality that some that are being in the covenant community, having the outward sign and seal of the covenant, yet are unregenerate?

Well, as Paul explained in Romans 11, the nation Israel is beloved for the sake of their fathers.

Pretty much the entire bible, from Genesis 12 all the way to Acts, followed by Hebrews to Revelations, is written to them and about them.

 

[KJV1611]

Well, as Paul explained in Romans 11, the nation Israel is beloved for the sake of their fathers.

Pretty much the entire bible, from Genesis 12 all the way to Acts, followed by Hebrews to Revelations, is written to them and about them.

Rom 11:28 (KJV) As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.

Romans 11:28 says exactly the opposite of what you said. It says that the nation Israel is the enemy of the gospel but GODS ELECT are beloved of the Father.

 

[Guojing]

Rom 11:28 (KJV) As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.

Romans 11:28 says exactly the opposite of what you said. It says that the nation Israel is the enemy of the gospel but GODS ELECT are beloved of the Father.

You are correct, the current nation of Israel has fallen, so they are currently an enemy of God.

But for my case, I don't define the Body of Christ as Israel, unlike you. I keep the 2 separated.

Israel as a nation has a destiny with God during the Tribulation.

 

[tribesman]

Well, as Paul explained in Romans 11, the nation Israel is beloved for the sake of their fathers.

But that does not make all of them regenerate. Does it? So, the one/s who will turn away from God with uncircumcised hearts, even if bearing the covenant signs and seals, will end up cut-off. Yet God is able to graff them in again, should they turn from unbelief.

Let's have a look at Romans 11 for a while:

7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained
it, and the rest were blinded 8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber,
eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear; ) unto this day. 9 And David saith,
Let their table be made a snare, and a trap, and a stumblingblock, and a recompence unto them: 10 Let
their eyes be darkened, that they may not see, and bow down their back alway. 11 I say then, Have
they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto
the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy. 12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and
the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?
13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:
14 If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them.
15 For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be,
but life from the dead? 16 For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so
are the branches. 17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert
graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree; 18 Boast
not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. 19 Thou
wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. 20 Well; because of unbelief
they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: 21 For if God spared
not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. 22 Behold therefore the goodness
and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his
goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off. 23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief,
shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.

 

[KJV1611]

You are correct, the current nation of Israel has fallen, so they are currently an enemy of God.

But for my case, I don't define the Body of Christ as Israel, unlike you. I keep the 2 separated.

Israel as a nation has a destiny with God during the Tribulation.

Romans 11:28 gives two separate groups of Israel. One group is the enemies of God which is the unsaved Jews and the other group is Gods elect, the saved Jews.

 

[Guojing]

Yes. But that does not make all of them regenerate. Does it? So, the one/s who will turn away from God with uncircumcised hearts, even if bearing the covenant signs and seals, will end up cut-off. Yet God is able to graff them in again, should they turn from unbelief.

Let's have a look at Romans 11 for a while:

Yes, but as I discussed with KJV1611, Israel will have some special privileges during the Tribulation, that the unbelieving gentiles during that time won't.

God promised to feed them and to protect them during that time, aka the famous Psalms 91. He is only requiring them to stand firm during the Tribulation period and not take the mark of the beast.

During the Tribulation, once again, those gentiles who bless the Jews with food and shelter, will be blessed too (Matthew 25:31-46).

 

[Guojing]

Romans 11:28 gives two separate groups of Israel. One group is the enemies of God which is the unsaved Jews and the other group is Gods elect, the saved Jews.

Currently, the saved Jews are in the Body of Christ, where they are equal to the rest of us.