Propitiation – The Sacrifice that Atoned

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Pilgrimshope

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Sep 2, 2020
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The
Yes you are correct the word world is not rightly divided or understood, we are in the world but not of it and we do not lust after worldly things we do not live as the world lives but the world in regards to people- their souls this is where the word becomes a bit tricky, it says that Jesus died for the salvation of the world which is to say the souls of the world but even if say this all was for the regenerated people of the world what were they before they were regenrated? They were of the world.

They could not percieve or uinderstand the things of the spirit beforehand and were indeed seen by God as foolish but it all comes back to the blood of Jesus, the testimony of Jesus is the gospel but was his sacrifice sufficent? Is his grace sufficent? and is it just for a select people or did he die for the sake of the world?
perhaps to better answer this let me aks you what does it take to be saved what must you do in order to recieve eternal life?
word and the blood are the covenant they work together as the Old Testament did just on a much greater scale .
a covenant consists of first the words of God given to the people , then after they have heard the covenant the sacrifice is made or “ the blood is shed “

we’ve always been promised a new covenant Moses have his the same way first he preached all the words of the law to them and then he shed the blood
Of the covenant to purchase the sins already on them . Thier sacrofice was for the sins they brought into the covenant , thier ongoing iniquities were purged every year only once by the high priest .

the new covenant is modeled after that first Jesus preached the gospel of the kingdom and then he shed his blood to both remit sin under the old covenant and purchase the world from thier sin . It doesn’t end with the blood it starts there it was only after Jesus died for sin that his words were put into effect in place of the law of Moses that had been remitted by his blood .

the gospel that saves is about repentance and also remission of sins . That’s possible because jesusnfulfilled the requirement of death upon sinners. He paid the cost to reseem
Us from our sins beforehand so we can come near to God and hear him and be saved . As they could not through moses law he commanded them to stay far away or they would surely die .


“And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.

For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood. For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people, Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭9:15-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Jesus preached the gospel and said Many times while preaching

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬


and then said of his own blood that was about to be shed

“For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭26:28‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the law is our pattern to understand like Moses Jesus preached the gospel and then shed the blood when he did that everything he said became the covenant between God and mankind .

Jesus sacrifice is sifficient to remit sins , but it doesn’t make us repent of we just say it’s about the blood we can never hear the word of life that is the promise of God that gives inheritance of the kingdom .

his sacrifice is about remission his word is about repentance those two things work together you have the grace that Jesus died form our sins so we can have remission of sin through baptism into his death . But we have the truth which is the word God sent him to preach to the people and then the people sent to the world to preach the same gospel that is about repentance and remission of sins

“And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. And ye are witnesses of these things.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭24:46-48‬ ‭KJV‬‬

we don’t have faith in the sacrifice onlyWe have to believe the gospel because it is Gods call to repentance which is a gift through belief

“I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭5:32‬ ‭

God is willing that we hear the gospel and repent and be saved

“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”
‭‭2 Peter‬ ‭3:9‬ ‭KJV‬‬


His sacrifice is not for the purpose of us living as we will and ignoring his word , it’s sufficient for those of the covenant of promise who acknowledge and believe the gospel and come to repentance and be saved.

in the end Jesus will decide but as far as the scripture concludes in the Bible we have to accept and believe his words , in order to be purified by the his blood it’s about the better word Jesus preached that is spoken of his blood

“But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭12:22-25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

that word from heaven began here

“Now when all the people were baptized, it came to pass, that Jesus also being baptized, and praying, the heaven was opened, And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭3:21-22‬ ‭KJV‬‬

And then

“Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:14-15‬ ‭


That’s always been salvation the word and the blood of the new covenant we don’t have to know it all and don’t have to understand it all we have to hear ( consider and respectfully accept ) it believing it is the truth because it surely is .

If we walk on the light his blood purifies is from all unrighteousness we can’t take the blood or the word they are together a covenant from God that has eternal
Promises made by the lord himself
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,441
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Yes you are correct the word world is not rightly divided or understood, we are in the world but not of it and we do not lust after worldly things we do not live as the world lives but the world in regards to people- their souls this is where the word becomes a bit tricky, it says that Jesus died for the salvation of the world which is to say the souls of the world but even if say this all was for the regenerated people of the world what were they before they were regenrated? They were of the world.

They could not percieve or uinderstand the things of the spirit beforehand and were indeed seen by God as foolish but it all comes back to the blood of Jesus, the testimony of Jesus is the gospel but was his sacrifice sufficent? Is his grace sufficent? and is it just for a select people or did he die for the sake of the world?
perhaps to better answer this let me aks you what does it take to be saved what must you do in order to recieve eternal life?
A person does not have to do anything to be delivered eternally. That is why it is stated that God's grace is a gift. Yes, the elect that he choose before the foundation of the world, when they are born into this world by natural birth, they are tainted by the sin of Adam, and having no hope, and without God in the world, but sometime between our natural birth, and our natural death, God quickens those his Son died for, with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.

Yes, Jesus's sacrifice was sufficient. Yes, God's grace was sufficient No he did not die for the sake of all mankind, only those that his Father gave to him to die for.
 

ForestGreenCook

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Jul 8, 2018
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You didn't get an X because I need to tell you I do not need nor do I read LOOOOOOG posts on opinions that you already know I disagree with. No more cut and paste .... its superfluous.

So I will answer: Believers are not under judgement
John 3:18 those who believer are NOT under judgement, those who do not believe have been judged already.
WE have been justified BY CHRIST, His PROPITATION.

Galatians 2: 15-21
15
We ourselves are Jews by birth and not Gentile sinners; 16 yet we know that a person is justified* not by the works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ. And we have come to believe in Christ Jesus, so that we might be justified by faith in Christ,* and not by doing the works of the law, because no one will be justified by the works of the law. 17 But if, in our effort to be justified in Christ, we ourselves have been found to be sinners, is Christ then a servant of sin? Certainly not! 18 But if I build up again the very things that I once tore down, then I demonstrate that I am a transgressor. 19 For through the law I died to the law, so that I might live to God. I have been crucified with Christ; 20 and it is no longer I who live, but it is Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 21 I do not nullify the grace of God; for if justification comes
through the law, then Christ died for nothing.

I think you are confusing justification with sanctification.
Spiritual faith is a fruit of the Spirit, the unregenerate natural man only has faith in man, and man's accomplishments.

The regenerated person's faith can justify them as a believer, but only Christ's faith justifies us eternally.

You study from a different version of the bible than I do; Gal 2:16, in my version, says "but by the faith [OF] Jesus Christ", and yours says, "but through faith [IN] Jesus Christ.", which changes the faith mentioned to be our faith, instead of Jesus's faith.
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,441
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Spiritual faith is a fruit of the Spirit, the unregenerate natural man only has faith in man, and man's accomplishments.

The regenerated person's faith can justify them as a believer, but only Christ's faith justifies us eternally.

You study from a different version of the bible than I do; Gal 2:16, in my version, says "but by the faith [OF] Jesus Christ", and yours says, "but through faith [IN] Jesus Christ.", which changes the faith mentioned to be our faith, instead of Jesus's faith.
I was thinking that the believers receive their judgement by God's chastening, while they sojourn here in this world, and will not be judged at the last day, as the wicked are. Am I wrong? Again my version says "condemned" instead of "judgement".
 

GraceAndTruth

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Sep 28, 2015
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A person does not have to do anything to be delivered eternally. That is why it is stated that God's grace is a gift. Yes, the elect that he choose before the foundation of the world, when they are born into this world by natural birth, they are tainted by the sin of Adam, and having no hope, and without God in the world, but sometime between our natural birth, and our natural death, God quickens those his Son died for, with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.

Yes, Jesus's sacrifice was sufficient. Yes, God's grace was sufficient No he did not die for the sake of all mankind, only those that his Father gave to him to die for.
I am trying to understand where we disagree. Or are you just making a statement?