Not By Works

[UnderGrace]

He said it is impossible for a Christian not to do good works, because it is part of the new nature. When I said “works follow salvation”, I meant as a result of the new nature. Then people started saying “justified by faith apart from works”, which I never denied. It was a red herring, like if I said “living humans breathe”, and then the choir stands up to sing, “you’re wrong, you’re wrong, because breathing had nothing to do with their conception!” 🤯

You have changed the focus, is it impossible or not?

And where is that post ? #3941403 ... this thread does not go that high?

 

[Macabeus]

You have changed the focus, is it impossible or not?

And where is that post ? #3941403 ... this thread does not go that high?

Sorry. Post 101,124

Is it impossible? You tell me. What did EG’s post say? The one you agreed to, I think.

I’ll doublecheck that

 

[Macabeus]

Sorry. Post 101,124

Is it impossible? You tell me. What did EG’s post say? The one you agreed to, I think.

I’ll doublecheck that

Ok, sorry. You did not like 101,124, but DC and GB9 did. So do you disagree with post 101,124, which EG posted, and DC, GB9 and I agreed with, but now DC says that it is possible for a Christian to not work, in direct contradiction to what he earlier agreed with

What I have been saying is no different than what EG said and DC and GB9 and4 others agreed to, but I am constantly anathematized for saying the same thing. It is rank hypocrsy

 

[UnderGrace]

Sorry. Post 101,124

Is it impossible? You tell me. What did EG’s post say? The one you agreed to, I think.

I’ll doublecheck that

I did not put a like on that post...while I agree with some the "impossible" I did not a agree with..... just so we stay honest here. and I did not uncheck it. EG and I do not agree on this, just like I do not agree with you.
We are exhorted, we implored, we are commanded, we are encouraged etc., but we do not turn into robots where our will is controlled by an outside forces completely.

Love is not compulsive.

If everything was so automatic at regeneration I am sure there would be no need for all those letters to the churches.

 

[UnderGrace]

Ok, sorry. You did not like 101,124, but DC and GB9 did. So do you disagree with post 101,124, which EG posted, and DC, GB9 and I agreed with, but now DC says that it is possible for a Christian to not work, in direct contradiction to what he earlier agreed with

What I have been saying is no different than what EG said and DC and GB9 and4 others agreed to, but I am constantly anathematized for saying the same thing. It is rank hypocrsy

The problem is not always hypocrisy, although sometimes it is..... the difficulty on this discussion board is often clarity and communication.

It is a can be difficult sometimes to put one's ideas down and have them understood they way we intended.
And this Mr. M is why there is much difficulty in understanding some, not all, of scripture.

People can be stating the exact same thing and not even realize it sometimes.

 

[Macabeus]

I did not put a like on that post...while I agree with some the "impossible" I did not a agree with..... just so we stay honest here. and I did not uncheck it. EG and I do not agree on this, just like I do not agree with you.
We are exhorted, we implored, we are commanded, we are encouraged etc., but we do not turn into robots where our will is controlled by an outside forces completely.

Love is not compulsive.

If everything was so automatic at regeneration I am sure there would be no need for all those letters to the churches.

View attachment 203901

I said I was not sure if you liked it, said I would double check it, and admitted my mistake in 106,863, so I am not being dishonest.

So what we now know is that you are consistent in what you say, and DC is not.

And no, love is not compulsive. Neither is eating ribeye steak or ice cream for me. I eat them because I love them, and I obey God because I love Him, and I love Him because I have a new nature. Just like EG said and DC agreed to😀

 

[UnderGrace]

I said I was not sure if you liked it, said I would double check it, and admitted my mistake in 106,863, so I am not being dishonest.

So what we now know is that you are consistent in what you say, and DC is not.

And no, love is not compulsive. Neither is eating ribeye steak or ice cream for me. I eat them because I love them, and I obey God because I love Him, and I love Him because I have a new nature. Just like EG said and DC agreed to😀

When you put it in these terms that you are doing "works" from love is very different than how you have stated at other times.

And you are making a choice to walk in the the Spirit... which all should do but not all do.

Being consistent would be a help.... just sayin

 

[Macabeus]

The problem is not always hypocrisy, although sometimes it is..... the difficulty on this discussion board is often clarity and communication.

It is a can be difficult sometimes to put one's ideas down and have them understood they way we intended.
And this Mr. M is why there is much difficulty in understanding some, not all, of scripture.

People can be stating the exact same thing and not even realize it sometimes.

Yes, especially when they are prejudicial against an individual. Oh, but I’m rough around the edges right. If you read the hyper adhominems of DC, I am a feather

Dc called me names from DAY 1, so don’t tell me again that people are prejudicial because I am rough around the edges. Puhleese😁

 

[Macabeus]

When you put it in these terms that you are doing "works" from love is very different than how you have stated at other times.

And you are making a choice to walk in the the Spirit... which all should do but not all do.

Being consistent would be a help.... just sayin

How is saying doing works in love inconsistent with doing works from a new nature? You guys seem to major in justification, which is good, but how do you define regeneration? Is it not a new birth and a new nature? And what is a nature if not a collection of attributes?

And are we not to put off the old and put on the new? And what bearing does the failure of others have on whether you and I do it or not. Are we shooting for the lowest denominator?

 

[UnderGrace]

How is saying doing works in love inconsistent with doing works from a new nature? You guys seem to major in justification, which is good, but how do you define regeneration? Is it not a new birth and a new nature? And what is a nature if not a collection of attributes?

And are we not to put off the old and put on the new? And what bearing does the failure of others have on whether you and I do it or not. Are we shooting for the lowest denominator?

Do you not think that even after being regenerated we still have to yield to the influence of God in us?
Regeneration is totally of God, but the fruit/manifiestation of the reality is synergistic, maybe I am being too subjective on this but it is my lived experience.

 

[UnderGrace]

@Macabeus

https://christianchat.com/threads/n...in-christ-unto-good-works.187208/post-4020125

BINGO. Exactly what I have said all along. But some folks literally say one can be saved 50 years, and never do anything. Well, what new creation would want to do that?

You see it is comments like this that really make me not want to engage you in conversation.
So I think I am done.

 

[Macabeus]

Do you not think that even after being regenerated we still have to yield to the influence of God in us?
Regeneration is totally of God, but the fruit/manifiestation of the reality is synergistic, maybe I am being too subjective on this but it is my lived experience.

Yes, we have to yield to God. Not yielding to God is walking in the flesh. What does the Bible say about walking in the flesh.

I have to yield to God. Just as I have to yield to the love of my wife when confronted by a woman trying to seduce me. Ask my wife if that is her expectation. Should God expect less?!!!

I’ve heard more than one say that one can be an unrepentant adulterer, thief or fornicator. When you mention that the scriptures say that such will not inherit the kingdom of heaven, they say “they will go and just not inherit🤨

Sanctification and fruit bearing are synergistic. That’s why the Bible gives warning passages against apathy, spiritual slumber, etc. Again, these, works, fruit bearing, etc. do not save and our preservation is not based on performance, but the Bible does not say they are optional.

Back to perseverance. What do do with Colossians 1:22-23. Exegete that for me, if you will

 

[Macabeus]

@Macabeus

https://christianchat.com/threads/n...in-christ-unto-good-works.187208/post-4020125



You see it is comments like this that really make me not want to engage you in conversation.
So I think I am done.

Well that’s what DC said. 50 year Christian/no works hypothesis. so What fault is in what I said? It doesn’t really matter if you want to talk to me. If you can’t handle a harmless critique like that against What someone clearly said, 👋 bye bye

 

[UnderGrace]

Well that’s what DC said. 50 year Christian/no works hypothesis. Did you think I was referring to you

No.. that was not my point and if you cannot see the problem with that post than I am sure there is nothing I can state except that perhaps you really enjoy "DRAMA"

 

[Macabeus]

Well that’s what DC said. 50 year Christian/no works hypothesis. so What fault is in what I said? It doesn’t really matter if you want to talk to me. If you can’t handle a harmless critique like that against What someone clearly said, 👋 bye bye

So if you disagree with a hypothesis of a Christian who does not obey God, does not keep His commandments, and has no care for neighbor, that makes you da boogeyman😱

 

[Macabeus]

No.. that was not my point and if you cannot see the problem with that post than I am sure there is nothing I can state except that perhaps you really enjoy "DRAMA"

Go back and read the post again, and yes please, don’t reply anymore, because I don’t enjoy drama, which is why I left for several months. I did not seek out DC, he came back with his ad hominem again, so I reply. Bye bye

 

[VCO]

Sorry. Post 101,124

Is it impossible? You tell me. What did EG’s post say? The one you agreed to, I think.

I’ll doublecheck that

You keep posting over, and over again a post by eternally-gratefull. BUT DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT HE SAID ? ? ?

It is impossible to CHANGE or GO BACK on the Nature of Our Born Again eternally alive Human Spirit.

IT NEVER WILL BE TO EARN SALVATION, IT ALWAYS WILL BE BECAUSE HE CHANGED OUR ONCE DEAD Human SPIRIT into

an ALIVE that always will WANT TO do what pleases our Loving LORD. LOVING OBEDIENCE has become OUR NEW NATURE.

 

[Macabeus]

You keep posting over, and over again a post by eternally-gratefull. BUT DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT HE SAID ? ? ?

It is impossible to CHANGE or GO BACK on the Nature of Our Born Again eternally alive Human Spirit.

IT NEVER WILL BE TO EARN SALVATION, IT ALWAYS WILL BE BECAUSE HE CHANGED OUR ONCE DEAD Human SPIRIT into

an ALIVE that always will WANT TO do what pleases our Loving LORD. LOVING OBEDIENCE has become OUR NEW NATURE.

You’re preaching to the choir bro. I both understand agree with EGs post, which is why I put it as my sig. UG is the one who don’t agree with it.

I never said salvation is earned. Strawman

 

[UnderGrace]

Go back and read the post again, and yes please, don’t reply anymore, because I don’t enjoy drama, which is why I left for several months. I did not seek out DC, he came back with his ad hominem again, so I reply. Bye bye

Well this is the way I look at, when I cannot converse with someone for whatever reason then I do not converse with them, I do not go to their threads and I do not speak about them, quote them, or try to belittle them in other threads, I shake the dust off my feet and move on.

You should try it.

 

[UnderGrace]

Go back and read the post again, and yes please, don’t reply anymore, because I don’t enjoy drama, which is why I left for several months. I did not seek out DC, he came back with his ad hominem again, so I reply. Bye bye

And another thing you may want to make note of, when you are speaking about someone it is good practice to actually give them notification by using this >>>> @ in front of the name like so @dcontroversal @eternally-gratefull and @gb9 know.