Not By Works

[calibob]

I don't believe that.

You don't believe what? That is was taught to ignore, disregard or consider as opinion all teachings by all teachers that came after John's revelation? I taught only to believe the teachings published in bible ONLY and to decide for my self with the help of the Holy Spirit what the truth really is, and that all men are liars. Including me. The truth of the human condition is that humans believe there own lies. It's called D.E.N.I.A.L. As in Don't Even No I Am Lying!

 

[Noose]

Trust you over Jesus? NEVER.

Good thing you are doing, a step in the right direction but the understanding is questionable.

 

[Noose]

I reiterate, love is fruit (of the Spirit)

Spirit is 'understanding' and understanding is knowledge of truth.
Yes, you love from understanding, not when some force takes control of you.

 

[Smooth]

It is a fruit that you have to work out with persistence and patience.

The Lord does not command and then keeps the command for you, then it wont be a command. A command is something that you willfully obey or disobey.

Adam willfully disobeyed and death/sin reigned; Christ willfully obeyed and righteousness reigned. We also must obey so that we become one with Christ.

Love is the essence of God. If His essence is in you, you don’t have to work at anything, it comes forth naturally.

When you walk, you don’t look down at your legs and say now I’m going to move this leg and then the other; you just walk without thinking. It comes naturally. Same thing regarding love.

Now of course, if you’re handicapped and have to make a conscience effort to walk, then you must think about it. If you’re spiritually handicapped and believe salvation is not afforded via grace through faith, then of course you’ll feel the need to work for your salvation. I thank God I’m not spiritually handicapped.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

I reiterate, love is fruit (of the Spirit)

16 And so we know and rely on the love God has for us. God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in him.
1 John 4

1 Follow the way of love and eagerly desire spiritual gifts, especially the gift of prophecy.
1 Cor 14

22 Now that you have purified yourselves by obeying the truth so that you have sincere
love for your brothers, love one another deeply, from the heart.
1 Peter 1

2 My purpose is that they may be encouraged in heart and united in love, so that they may have the full riches of complete understanding, in order that they may know the mystery of God, namely, Christ,
3 in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.
Col 2

12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold,
13 but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.
Matt 24

3 The LORD your God is testing you to find out whether you love him with all your heart and with all your soul.
Deut 13

Love is innate within people even before the Holy Spirit dwelt in the hearts of man.

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness
Gal 5

Without love we cannot claim to know God. So can we be born again unless love has not
truly dwelt in our hearts?

 

[Smooth]

Good thing you are doing, a step in the right direction but the understanding is questionable.

Your arrogance is eclipsed only by your misunderstanding of God’s grace.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Love is the essence of God. If His essence is in you, you don’t have to work at anything, it comes forth naturally.

When you walk, you don’t look down at your legs and say now I’m going to move this leg and then the other; you just walk without thinking. It comes naturally. Same thing regarding love.

Now of course, if you’re handicapped and have to make a conscience effort to walk, then you must think about it. If you’re spiritually handicapped and believe salvation is not afforded via grace through faith, then of course you’ll feel the need to work for your salvation. I thank God I’m not spiritually handicapped.

Not a good analogy with walking.
Babies have to learn to walk, it does not come naturally. And yes when you are learning to walk, you have
to put one leg in front of the other and learn how to do it. If you have anything to do with babies and
their development this is obvious. They also have to learn how to use their hands, which is fascinating
watching how they discover their hands and slowly learn how they work.

 

[Smooth]

Not a good analogy with walking.
Babies have to learn to walk, it does not come naturally. And yes when you are learning to walk, you have
to put one leg in front of the other and learn how to do it. If you have anything to do with babies and
their development this is obvious. They also have to learn how to use their hands, which is fascinating
watching how they discover their hands and slowly learn how they work.

It’s an excellent analogy. I commend you for admitting your failure to understand.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Your arrogance is eclipsed only by your misunderstanding of God’s grace.

Got to say babies are programmed to love their parents, hard wired in.
But apart from this love has to be chosen and worked on.

Smooth what you demonstrate is this over bearing attitude and criticism which is obviously not
based on very much. Arrogance of those who understand little is vastly greater than those who know
how much there is to learn and how little any of us truly grasp it.

But I am happy to shine the light on your approach expressed here and how flawed these expressions are.
It reflects back on your ability not to restrain yourself and learn some grace you claim to know. God bless you.

 

[calibob]

Spirit is 'understanding' and understanding is knowledge of truth.
Yes, you love from understanding, not when some force takes control of you.

Love is the first fruit of the Holy Spirit when we receive it. It is not education that circumcises the heart. Without love we are nothing.

NIV
If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing.

 

[UnderGrace]

Have you dried up? I am a little surprised as this event by your own description is more important
than your walk with Jesus.

When I was in my late teens, I read a book on the sacrifice of Jesus. It was meditations on His sufferings.
It profoundly broke me. To know how deep and dedicated the Lord was to show us His love and purchase
us as His people, astounding. It was like a switch got flipped inside me, and things go reset. I would do
anything for this King, share His word, speak His love, demonstrate the depths of the promise He has given.
It changed me. Now I was already a believer, witnessed to people, filled with the Spirit, knowing His blessing
but still another step along the path.

So I know this is a path and not an arrival, because each step is a new step into our future.
Each revelation is another glorious truth, except there are so many more to go, and so much others can
share in with ourselves that we can listen to and wonder at the Lords plan and will at work in His people
Amen

So then you are not open.... you are looking to your work not the work of Jesus. Those are not His terms.

Most people will recognize they are sinners, the hard part dying to self effort..... that is how we come to God and are born again.

4Now the wages of the worker are not credited as a gift, but as an obligation. 5However, to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness.…

My being born again was not recognizing only I was a sinner but more importantly accepting I could do nothing to effect my personal salvation ... it was all Jesus and not me.

Go to Him on His terms... the "Imitation of Christ" is not salvation.

 

[Noose]

Love is the essence of God. If His essence is in you, you don’t have to work at anything, it comes forth naturally.

When you walk, you don’t look down at your legs and say now I’m going to move this leg and then the other; you just walk without thinking. It comes naturally. Same thing regarding love.

Now of course, if you’re handicapped and have to make a conscience effort to walk, then you must think about it. If you’re spiritually handicapped and believe salvation is not afforded via grace through faith, then of course you’ll feel the need to work for your salvation. I thank God I’m not spiritually handicapped.

Matt 11: 30For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.”

1 John 5:3For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome,


The command being light does not mean it is weightless, it still has weight but a weight that you can manage.
Obeying is not natural, it requires your effort.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

It’s an excellent analogy. I commend you for admitting your failure to understand.

Unfortunately you think spirituality comes naturally. God help you. No child ever does not
have to learn from scratch. Jesus said we have to become like children to enter the Kingdom.
This is learning everything again, which clearly you want to ignore because you are so far above
this.

Let us go to James for our first big spiritual lesson

7 Submit yourselves, then, to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
8 Come near to God and he will come near to you. Wash your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded.
9 Grieve, mourn and wail. Change your laughter to mourning and your joy to gloom.
10 Humble yourselves before the Lord, and he will lift you up.
James 4

To approach God to any degree we need to know our standing. Arrogance comes when acceptability
is assumed.

19 You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in."
20 Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but be afraid.
21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either.
Rom 11

These are words spoken to believers about their attitude to God.
So many have no clue what this means, which illustrates the common lack of spiritual reality.

 

[VCO]

The bible does not preach conditional life, it teaches eternal life. Which the apostle john says we can KNOW WE HAVE IT.

For those who do not KNOW THEY HAVE IT, They need to read the epistle of John, WHo said he wrote those things so they can KNOW they have it. Or his gospel. Where he says being born again means having eternal life. Or asking God and he will give you rivers of living water flowing to eternal life. Or the bread of life, which whoever eats will never die, live forever, and HAS eternal life..

Is that how we spell epistle. Oh my, and all this time I thought it was epistol.

 

[Smooth]

Got to say babies are programmed to love their parents, hard wired in.
But apart from this love has to be chosen and worked on.

Smooth what you demonstrate is this over bearing attitude and criticism which is obviously not
based on very much. Arrogance of those who understand little is vastly greater than those who know
how much there is to learn and how little any of us truly grasp it.

But I am happy to shine the light on your approach expressed here and how flawed these expressions are.
It reflects back on your ability not to restrain yourself and learn some grace you claim to know. God bless you.

Shine light on maintaining my salvation? You offer a complete and total oxymoron.

 

[VCO]

Not everyone who knows OSAS is the gospel/truth is a Calvinist, so please do not conflate one with the other.

I FAILED the Calvinist Test, as I only got three answers right, according to them.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Is that how we spell epistle. Oh my, and all this time I thought it was epistol.

Do not know really, lol

 

[UnderGrace]

I FAILED the Calvinist Test, as I only got three answers right, according to them.

Praise God!!

 

[calibob]

I FAILED the Calvinist Test, as I only got three answers right, according to them.

Oh, theres a test? I might take it for laughs when I get bored.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

So then you are not open.... you are looking to your work not the work of Jesus. Those are not His terms.

Most people will recognize they are sinners, the hard part dying to self effort..... that is how we come to God and are born again.

4Now the wages of the worker are not credited as a gift, but as an obligation. 5However, to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness.…

My being born again was not recognizing only I was a sinner but more importantly accepting I could do nothing to effect my personal salvation ... it was all Jesus and not me.

Go to Him on His terms... the "Imitation of Christ" is not salvation.

Hi UnderGrace,

I think you miss-understand basic spiritual revelation and how it works. I can share my acceptance of Christ
and my embracing Him as my saviour and learning through His grace to walk in His ways.

You take this to mean I am working to prove something, which is not what I am saying. It is a complete response
of service to Jesus because of who He is, out of gratitude from my heart.

Now you claim this is where your heart is also, and many others except when you actually get to talking about it
it is something different. So a part of your experience in Christ is too superficial and not foundational.

If Jesus is just an added extra, you do not know Him. To grasp what God declares in the first commandment,
it is God is my all in all.

For me it is odd to have someone tell me I have to love Jesus more, when He is my life and my all.
It is like saying think of Him, morning, noon and night, read His words, meditate on His laws, think on
His will and His moving, and I respond I do. So my friend, as there seems to be no real communcation here
God bless you.

Still no actual moment of spiritual rebirth mentioned. But then was not actually expecting such a thing,
because it sounds much more real than when you actually go back and talk about it.