Not By Works

[FollowHisSteps]

Get off it dude,
It is obvious you have no understanding of what I believe, or you would not make such ridiculous statements.
But you can continue to try to earn your forgiveness. I will not stop you.

What happens when someone shifts their language and not their heart?
You get this disconnect.
If few understand what another believes they are clearly not a christian, as this is a christian
forum, discussing christian theology and belief. If one cannot see the 99% of commonality,
or even admit this, then rational thought is not part of the interaction.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Anyway we have discussed this before and I found no peace in Lordship salvation doctrine so I will not go back to it.

This is a very revealing statement. Is our theology based on our peace in our hearts?
To a degree our peace reflects our relationship with Jesus, so is important.

But each step of the road is not defined by other groups but by Jesus himself.
For me I start in a place of peace, my heart before the Lord and explore how this is expressed
in His word and His people.

It takes time for us to resolve certain issues and we often discount how this works through.
For instance God blesses His people, yet I am not a prosperity gospel follower, though I know
love is the source of life and blessing.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Disagree again, James was writing to Christians and must be read through that lens.
I know you want agreement, but I know that salvation/saving faith is completely and wholly apart from the outward works we do.
To state that works are necessary part of salvation, comes dangerously close to making works part of salvation however unintentional.
This is it ...
John 5:24: Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
Done.

This appears to be a statement of faith without works, or passive faith is real faith, and active faith
is works salvation.

If I was to say my father loves me, yet when I trip and fall, potentially to my death, he does nothing
to reach out and catch me, what value is that love if it has no expression. It would be the same as
no love at all or even hatred. This very reality is part of the temptations of Christ.

The cross is the Fathers expression of the depth of His love, to take real pain and hurt, to humble
Himself and take the form of a man, and to die at the hands of sinful people because of their hatred
and sin, not His own. This expression demonstrated Gods love, active, dynamic and real.

Yet here is a connection between passive belief with no action, which is claimed to have value.
It is by its nature the opposite of who God is and where His heart is. Gods heart has always been in
action, as we are literally the creation of His desire and action, and His maintaining existence is again
the demonstration of His action, from eternity to eternity. Life itself is also only exists as action, the
burning of energy to allow movement and provide life. No action, we are dead.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Let me just clue you in a bit....the only people I light up are those that reject truth, deny scripture, twist or skew scripture, peddle a false losable or gained, self maintained salvation....You do not know me, you do not know what I have done in my life, how many people I have led to the LORD or witnessed to, how I am one on one in person, the places and countries I have witnessed in etc. etc. etc....YOU guys assume that just because I lay some heat down, or use sarcasm or cut some no slack that I am some angry guy with no love or compassion and or insight....

NOW...having said that...THE BIBLE does not promote selling out the truth under some banner of oooey gooey love and or compromise for the sake of unity....TWO cannot walk together unless agreed....and make NO MISTAKE.....there are more gospels on this site than a Baskin Robbins Ice Cream Parlor and more skewed and twisted ideologies than Heinz 57 steak sauce....

ONE and only one GOSPEL has the power to save men....the rest are fraudulent, have no power to save and will lead the one espousing them straight to the pit.......

Summary
1. You do not know me
2. I have depth and love, compassion and insight
3. I hate oooey gooey love and compromise
4. My gospel is the only one to save man
5. All other expressions send the preachers to the pit

"I lay some heat down" - I think you deal with people you do not agree with the same way you
deal with mobile phones that annoy you

Me a Samsung 8 Active......I make calls, text, viber, skype, caculator, alarm and pics.....the rest of it...I have no clue.....Two phones ago....target practice with a JM Tactical 12 guage and a 3 inch turkey load #4s

Anyone who has been interacting with you for more than a few days knows you very well.
And most know this "do not like, blast away" approach, it is plastered all over hollywood films, and
should stay in that arena permanently.

Jesus gave us a caring, careful, humble approach, with timidity and quietness.
Have you not noticed the beatitudes and their intent and direction?
Have you not listened to Peter and Paul.

8 Finally, all of you, live in harmony with one another; be sympathetic, love as brothers, be compassionate and humble.
9 Do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult, but with blessing, because to this you were called so that you may inherit a blessing
1 Peter 3

29 Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.
30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.
31 Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice.
Eph 4

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Think on this if you will and many problems will be solved with regards to faith and works

God doesn’t drag people down the path of obedience.

He gives them all things that pertain to life and godliness, precious promises, the indwelling Holy Spirit, the seed of divine life (our regenerate nature), He will chasten, discipline, direct, encourage, etc., but He will not drag someone down the path of obedience because love does not operate that way.

Practical sanctification (not positional) is the synergistic activity of God and the Christian.

If the Christian does not do his part, he will not demonstrate his/her positional sanctification.

God has promised rewards for those who obey, and loss and discipline for those Christians who do not!

You think about it..

God drags a person to obedience? First off. Where does this thinking come from? Do you think people actually teach that?

Faith causes works. You do not have faith in someone and NEVER do a thing they say. SOMETHING in your life will change (not only because you are made a new creature, but because you now have the HS in you)

You WILL NOT live exactly like you did before. If you did. You are not saved, If you said some sinners prayer, and have no change, you have not yet repented. That is the thrust of James’ teaching. And Jude’s.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Salvation is a gift from God-the recipient can do nothing to gain it, nor lose it. the recipient can do nothing to lose
Salvation is a gift offer from God the recipient can do nothing to gain it, but can do something to lose it.

I don't believe you can earn a gift, but I do believe you can throw one away.

Even if you throw it away it is yours.

But who throws away such a precisou gift as salvation? Unless they do not understand what it is?

 

[DeighAnn]

He can not deny Himself but Him being the main vine, cuts those brunches from Him that are not fruitful and throws them in fire.

What changes if salvation "can" be lost? Those who don't deserve it don't get it? The eternal kingdom doesn't end up with a bunch of souls who don't love and appreciate all our Creator the Lord God has done and given us.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

What changes if salvation "can" be lost? Those who don't deserve it don't get it? The eternal kingdom doesn't end up with a bunch of souls who don't love and appreciate all our Creator the Lord God has done and given us.

I think the issue has never been about salvation, lost or found.
The issue has always been about love and the heart.

Satans approach to existence is power and domination taken because of desire.
Altruism is just weakness because he who can get should take, only fear stops greed.

God declares love rules, love is life, despite loss or pain or hurt, love conquers all.
And God is so confident He has founded creation on this debate.

So you see people defining faith with absolutes, boundaries, us and them, qualifications, rules,
exclusions, and fight to the death if needed against the evil other.

But when love founds a heart, when a heart desires to see need and meet it, equally in community,
then things start to blossom and grow, harmony and reality become apparent and what was impossible
is just the outflow of ones desires. Accepting doctrine or concepts are not disputed because in loves
light it is obvious, and life style is not hard and fast, you know what responsibility and consequences
lead to, so things flow appropriately.

So much gnostic theology is founded because love is not allowed in, hurt is kept, sin allowed to continue,
and the flesh scape goated as the cause, which God alone will resolve at the resurrection.
But once love is shut out, then the Kingdom does not reign or is ever established and all the words and
ideas spring from a heart searching for excuses. God bless you.

 

[UnderGrace]

What changes if salvation "can" be lost? Those who don't deserve it don't get it? The eternal kingdom doesn't end up with a bunch of souls who don't love and appreciate all our Creator the Lord God has done and given us.

I read nowhere in the bible that salvation is based on our appreciation, but this does make salvation based on personal merit which it is not.

 

[Smooth]

What changes if salvation "can" be lost? Those who don't deserve it don't get it? The eternal kingdom doesn't end up with a bunch of souls who don't love and appreciate all our Creator the Lord God has done and given us.

No one DESERVES salvation. No you, not me, not anyone. Salvation is a free GIFT.

 

[DeighAnn]

No one DESERVES salvation. No you, not me, not anyone. Salvation is a free GIFT.

Then why doesn't everyone have it?

 

[Smooth]

Then why doesn't everyone have it?

Because not everyone asks for it. You don’t receive it if you don’t have faith in Jesus.

 

[preston39]

No one DESERVES salvation. No you, not me, not anyone. Salvation is a free GIFT.

You are correct except qualifications established for salvation ....can be lost.
Once salvation is G-d's judgement...after physical death....it cannot be lost.

 

[Smooth]

You are correct except qualifications established for salvation ....can be lost.
Once salvation is G-d's judgement...after physical death....it cannot be lost.

Thank you for sharing. Please elaborate on the qualifications.

 

[UnderGrace]

No one DESERVES salvation. No you, not me, not anyone. Salvation is a free GIFT.

It is also a gift because we do not contribute to in any way.

 

[Smooth]

It is also a gift because we do not contribute to in any way.

Amen, beloved.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Because not everyone asks for it. You don’t receive it if you don’t have faith in Jesus.

This sounds like it is just a free sweet shop handing out goodies.
Is there no catch or conditions involved?
Is it just you like the nice guy giving out the gifts and thats it?

 

[FollowHisSteps]

It is also a gift because we do not contribute to in any way.

So this gift, what is it actually?
Is it something like a swimming pool, its part of where you live, you use it as necessary,
or is it more fundamental?

 

[Smooth]

This sounds like it is just a free sweet shop handing out goodies.
Is there no catch or conditions involved?
Is it just you like the nice guy giving out the gifts and thats it?

You seem upset that God is so gracious to everyone who asks for forgiveness, and upon that instantaneous forgiveness, comes salvation.

 

[Smooth]

So this gift, what is it actually?
Is it something like a swimming pool, its part of where you live, you use it as necessary,
or is it more fundamental?

What’s the matter pookie? Why are you so snarky? Is it because you’re upset that God is gracious?