Not By Works
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E
Gives me a headache...I need a break...carry on EG 
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Seems I remember Jesus saying He was praying for Peter.....also I think He said something like "when you are converted" to Peter.
As Christians, we should be excited about the power of God, Christ within, keeping us pure, giving us the gift of complete victory over sin, and yet most of what is posted seems to be excusing sin, denigrating the bible truth that the gospel produces victory, over coming, in the believer. What side of the question do you think Satan is on? Answer: always the side of continuing in sin regardless of the reasons given.
E
Did Paul say works are important? (Titus 3:8)
Did I say works are necessary for salvation? Post number please.
You guys make a lot of accusations, but can back up NONE OF THEM. Except for changing the meaning of words like dishonest atheists.
None of you has made a case for me being a fruit inspector.
Keep looking, EG. You will not find a post that shows me to be a fruit inspector. It was made up by GB9 and others. But it has never been substantiated
Did I say works are necessary for salvation? Post number please.
You guys make a lot of accusations, but can back up NONE OF THEM. Except for changing the meaning of words like dishonest atheists.
None of you has made a case for me being a fruit inspector.
Keep looking, EG. You will not find a post that shows me to be a fruit inspector. It was made up by GB9 and others. But it has never been substantiated
DC said (in the context of spiritual fruit bearing) it takes a period of growth and maturity to bear ANYTHING,
Anything means of any kind. Therefore in the context of bearing spiritual fruit, to say "anything" means spiritual FRUIT OF ANY KIND
Elementary school children understand this. And elementary school kids can look up inspect in the dictionary and see what it means.
Anything means of any kind. Therefore in the context of bearing spiritual fruit, to say "anything" means spiritual FRUIT OF ANY KIND
Elementary school children understand this. And elementary school kids can look up inspect in the dictionary and see what it means.
U
Well his reply is based your prior assertion so out of context not much I can say, however yelling and comparing me or him to school children is really not necessary Mr. M.
I know that one cannot assume fruit will be automatic.
This is what scripture makes pretty clear:
1. Fruit is not needed for salvation.
2. Fruit is not always fruits of the Spirit, as the unsaved can show these fruits.
3. Fruit can be bad, as the fruit of the Pharisees sent people to hell.
4. Fruit is NOT the evidence of salvation, as Satan presents himself as an angel of light.
5. Fruit is not produced by EVERY Christian (see 1 Cor 3:11-15).
I know that one cannot assume fruit will be automatic.
This is what scripture makes pretty clear:
1. Fruit is not needed for salvation.
2. Fruit is not always fruits of the Spirit, as the unsaved can show these fruits.
3. Fruit can be bad, as the fruit of the Pharisees sent people to hell.
4. Fruit is NOT the evidence of salvation, as Satan presents himself as an angel of light.
5. Fruit is not produced by EVERY Christian (see 1 Cor 3:11-15).
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First, the worst is denying sin even matters and that is precisely what OSAS says: once your saved, sin doesn't matter any more, it has no consequence regarding salvation they say, thereby having no realistic concept of sin or the cross. Sin, EVERY sin (think of Adams sin), has within it every evil , every self centered thought, word , or deed, that has ever been thought, said/expressed, done in the history of humanity to the end. The cross is the result of what sin is.
Your first point: Never even heard of someone who denys sin...if one denys the concept of sin or the actuality of sin, how do they excuse something they deny...maybe I am not catching your meaning. If you mean one who deny's their own sin and as such excusing their own sin, again why would you have to excuse something you deny. If you mean one who denies they are capable of sinning, and as such they are excusing any sin they may do, I can only suppose they have to believe that they no longer have fallen human nature so that what they do that others may think is sin is not sin to them as they think they no longer have a fallen human nature. Whatever you may be getting at there, if there is sin there it must be confessed /repented of, forsaken, and that only can be done in Christ...but it has to be done.
Your second point. Even if one is not conscious of any unconfessed/unrepented of sin, we still fall short of God's standard because there is unknown sin in us. In our walk, as the lord brings specifics to our attention, the Christians attitude is thankyou Lord and confession repentance takes place. And that is walking with the lord, the attitude being 100% yes Lord. Should one turn away from walking with the Lord by rejecting to acknowledge sin the Lord convicts one of, or not confessing/repenting of that sin then salvation is broken...basically the knocking on the door Jesus to whom the door had been opened to is now sent packing. So what you said above is good....the problem with OSAS folks is they do not believe Jesus is a savior from sin, and they believe that once one is saved that their relationship with sin does not matter anymore, as sin (rebellious sin, big, little, unconfessed, unrepented of, etc. etc.) is no issue regarding salvation....and here they are deadly wrong, and Satan smiles.
Your first point: Never even heard of someone who denys sin...if one denys the concept of sin or the actuality of sin, how do they excuse something they deny...maybe I am not catching your meaning. If you mean one who deny's their own sin and as such excusing their own sin, again why would you have to excuse something you deny. If you mean one who denies they are capable of sinning, and as such they are excusing any sin they may do, I can only suppose they have to believe that they no longer have fallen human nature so that what they do that others may think is sin is not sin to them as they think they no longer have a fallen human nature. Whatever you may be getting at there, if there is sin there it must be confessed /repented of, forsaken, and that only can be done in Christ...but it has to be done.
Your second point. Even if one is not conscious of any unconfessed/unrepented of sin, we still fall short of God's standard because there is unknown sin in us. In our walk, as the lord brings specifics to our attention, the Christians attitude is thankyou Lord and confession repentance takes place. And that is walking with the lord, the attitude being 100% yes Lord. Should one turn away from walking with the Lord by rejecting to acknowledge sin the Lord convicts one of, or not confessing/repenting of that sin then salvation is broken...basically the knocking on the door Jesus to whom the door had been opened to is now sent packing. So what you said above is good....the problem with OSAS folks is they do not believe Jesus is a savior from sin, and they believe that once one is saved that their relationship with sin does not matter anymore, as sin (rebellious sin, big, little, unconfessed, unrepented of, etc. etc.) is no issue regarding salvation....and here they are deadly wrong, and Satan smiles.
All of this is a distraction to the real underlying belief system.
One can never walk righteously before God because of His cleansing.
The idea is to pursuade people they are sinners caught in sin and are never
free, so as sinner can only point to Jesus. It is simply denying the power of the
cross and the indwelling Holy Spirit.
And to be honest there is little problem asking people to identify their failures.
It is much harder to find people who accept they can change and overcome.
But if Christ cannot overcome, why are we following Him. If His belief in us
to be His people and know the Kingdom of Heaven is rubbish, sounds like
unbelief dressed up as faith.
Such propositions that sinners are ok, only works with nice sinners, when you
meet the lawless you know how nuts such an idea really is. But if you belong
to a legalistic church with domination as its prime motivation, not surprising
when you get ejected you think everyone is like this and its nuts.
What I speculate is have these guys really left their group or just become anti
the thing they used to love, not realising both are not what God intends for His
people.
One can never walk righteously before God because of His cleansing.
The idea is to pursuade people they are sinners caught in sin and are never
free, so as sinner can only point to Jesus. It is simply denying the power of the
cross and the indwelling Holy Spirit.
And to be honest there is little problem asking people to identify their failures.
It is much harder to find people who accept they can change and overcome.
But if Christ cannot overcome, why are we following Him. If His belief in us
to be His people and know the Kingdom of Heaven is rubbish, sounds like
unbelief dressed up as faith.
Such propositions that sinners are ok, only works with nice sinners, when you
meet the lawless you know how nuts such an idea really is. But if you belong
to a legalistic church with domination as its prime motivation, not surprising
when you get ejected you think everyone is like this and its nuts.
What I speculate is have these guys really left their group or just become anti
the thing they used to love, not realising both are not what God intends for His
people.
yeah, and every since this was said , you have been obsessed with shouting that one MUST immediately start producing fruit, until they do, they are not saved.
that stance, when there is no time frame laid out in Scripture ( actually, it says BEAR fruit, which happens when seed sprouts , breaks ground, grows, blooms , blooms turn into small fruit, fruit grows and bears ),
anyway, that stance makes you a judgemental fruit inspector, whether or not you embrace it.
that stance, when there is no time frame laid out in Scripture ( actually, it says BEAR fruit, which happens when seed sprouts , breaks ground, grows, blooms , blooms turn into small fruit, fruit grows and bears ),
anyway, that stance makes you a judgemental fruit inspector, whether or not you embrace it.
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