Less well-known Rapture verses. The case for the Rapture is compelling.

[Absolutely]

"""You keep challenging others about "eliminating verses". Well, what verses indicate a HUGE U-turn?

Even a tiny U-turn"""

Too funny
Both doctrines have a U-turn.
Psssssst.... The real one is in the 10 virgin parable.
.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
OK, Mr pre-trib rapture man. Please share any verse that teaches that Jesus comes down in the clouds, glorifies all believers and takes them back up to heaven. What I call the HUGE U-turn.

Where are they?

Unpack this for us;
I will wait.
25 Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.
2 And five of them were wise, and five were foolish.
3 They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:
4 But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.
5 While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.
6 And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.
7 Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps.
8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.
9 But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.
10 And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.
11 Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.
13 Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.

OK, I see several things in this passage.

First, it's called a PARABLE. Because Jesus taught by PARABLES so that:
Mark 4:10-13
When he was alone, the Twelve and the others around him asked him about the parables. He told them, “The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables so that, “‘they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding; otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!’” Then Jesus said to them, “Don’t you understand this parable? How then will you understand any parable?

So, EVEN Jesus' own disciples needed to have His parables explained to them. If you think Bible doctrine was taught by parables, you have really been deceived. If Jesus' own disciples needed explanation of Jesus' parables, so do YOU.

Second, there is NOTHING in this parable resembling Christ's return to earth, resurrecting/rapturing saints, or anything else.

So, what do you do? Spiritualize the parable, in order to defend your own opinion, or the opinion of someone else who has convinced you to believe their opinion.

Anyone can spiritualize any parable they want, to make it say what they want it so say. Big deal. That's all you've done.

So, again, I ask you: what CLEAR verses that plainly state that Jesus comes in the clouds, glorifies all believers and takes them back up to heaven? Or, the BIG U-turn, as I like to call it.

I ask for clear verses ahd you give me a parable. Figures.

Luke 8:10 -
He said, “The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of God has been given to you, but to others I speak in parables, so that,
“‘though seeing, they may not see; though hearing, they may not understand.’

You need to have your parables explained to YOU. You are unable to explain them to anyone else.

The parable is about being prepared for Christ's Second Coming. There is NOTHING about being raptured, Jesus making a HUGE U-turn back to heaven. That's just your opinion.

In fact, you have ZERO verses about Jesus taking any believers back up to heaven after glorifiying their bodies.

Why is that?

 

[FreeGrace2]

"""You keep challenging others about "eliminating verses". Well, what verses indicate a HUGE U-turn?

Even a tiny U-turn"""

Too funny
Both doctrines have a U-turn.
Psssssst.... The real one is in the 10 virgin parable.
.

How come there isn't ANY mention of a U-turn in ANY of the passages you've cited/quoted??

Esp in the 10 virgin parable.

 

[ewq1938]

Then why did you quote the verse?

Because it shows how Christ slays his enemies. The point is no fire is used. It was you that went on a tangent about a literal sword when no one believes that is a literal sword. That was your own strawman fallacy.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Because it shows how Christ slays his enemies. The point is no fire is used. It was you that went on a tangent about a literal sword when no one believes that is a literal sword. That was your own strawman fallacy.

You really aren't following this discussion very well. You claim that Christ fries people when He comes again. And the earth.

Your timing is way off.

 

[ewq1938]

You really aren't following this discussion very well. You claim that Christ fries people when He comes again. And the earth.

Your timing is way off.

And you aren't actually reading anything I have actually written or else you wouldn't have posted any of that.

 

[Truth7t7]

Yeah, that's what most people do.

I said:
"The point is; fire is used both figuratively and literally.

With discernment, one can determine which way is being used."

What you OPINE about the use of "fire" in Luke 17 is ONLY your own opinion.

What you miss is the discernment to realize that the "day of the Lord" includes everything between His return AND the GWT judgment.

Since most of humanity will have already died before He returns, they WON'T see His return. Nor will they see anything about the Millennial rule. So, just when WILL they see Him, or when WILL He be "revealed by fire"? At the GWT judgment, when they will be immediately cast into the lake of FIRE. That's when.

So, first, let's examine v.20 which is part of the whole context:

"20 Once, on being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, Jesus replied, “The coming of the kingdom of God is not something that can be observed,"

So, your whole opinion about Jesus coming in FIRE is refuted by v.20. His coming IS NOT SOMETHIONG THAT CAN BE OBSERVED.

Now, 30 “It will be just like this on the day the Son of Man is revealed."

Since most of humanity will MISS Christ's return to earth, since they have already died and are NOT on earth, v.30 refers to the GWT judgment, when ALL of unbelieving humanity WILL be present and WILL see Him in His full glory. And that's WHEN "every knee will bow" before Him. Just before he casts them all into the lake of FIRE.

That is your comment seen below and you knew it before your response in #2047 above, its behind the quote, bad

Dishonest representation of Truth7t7 below, that's your statement not mine.

Truth7t7 said:
Anyone can pick and choose just the verses they want, to defend their opinions.

 

[FreeGrace2]

That is your comment seen below and you knew it before your response in #2047 above, its behind the quote, bad

Dishonest representation of Truth7t7 below, that's your statement not mine.

Truth7t7 said:
Anyone can pick and choose just the verses they want, to defend their opinions.

Do you have a point? Yes, that is my comment.

Post 2047 is YOUR post, not mine, so whatever is in that post is YOURS, except obviously not my comments in the quotes.

Your post is confusing.

 

[Truth7t7]

Unpack this for us;
I will wait.
25 Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.
2 And five of them were wise, and five were foolish.
3 They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:
4 But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.
5 While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.
6 And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.
7 Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps.
8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.
9 But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.
10 And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.
11 Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.
13 Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.

You act as if you have some extra special revelation, the (Ten Virgin) parable is nothing more than showing the saved righteous, and the unsaved wolves in sheeps clothing.

Same teaching seen below

Matthew 7:22-23KJV
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Matthew 25:11-12KJV
11 Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.

 

[Truth7t7]

Do you have a point? Yes, that is my comment.

Post 2047 is YOUR post, not mine, so whatever is in that post is YOURS, except obviously not my comments in the quotes.

Your post is confusing.

Yes that is your quote below, and you (Knowing) posted it as if it was mine, dishonest.

Truth7t7 didnt say below, you said!

Truth7t7 said:
Anyone can pick and choose just the verses they want, to defend their opinions.

 

[Truth7t7]

Complete nonsense. You deny what "1,000 years" means.


Then please answer this: what does "when the 1,000 years ENDED" and "1,000 years ARE OVER" mean?


No, you just ignore ALL of Rev 20. So you prove that you are the denier of Scripture.


Yes, He will. AFTER the GWT judgment.

Perhaps you can help me find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) No Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) No Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) No Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist), A 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Is A Man Made Fairy Tale (Fact)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ?

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time (Fact)

(The Souls) Seen In Revelation 20:4 Below Were Beheaded, They Are (Dead)

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

[Nehemiah6]

The Above Claims (Don't Exist), A 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Is A Man Made Fairy Tale

You are the one bringing all the fairy tales to this forum. When someone fights tooth and nail against the Millennial Kingdom of God, he or she needs to ask themselves if they are merely pretending to be Christians. One of the fundamental truths of the Bible is God's real, visible, tangible, physical and spiritual Kingdom on earth. After the Second Coming of Christ.

 

[Truth7t7]

You are the one bringing all the fairy tales to this forum. When someone fights tooth and nail against the Millennial Kingdom of God, he or she needs to ask themselves if they are merely pretending to be Christians. One of the fundamental truths of the Bible is God's real, visible, tangible, physical and spiritual Kingdom on earth. After the Second Coming of Christ.

No Fundamental Biblical Truth As You Claim, A Millennium On This Earth, Is A Man Made Fairy Tale, (Fact)

Perhaps you can help me find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) No Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) No Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) No Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist), A 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Is A Man Made Fairy Tale (Fact)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ?

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time (Fact)

(The Souls) Seen In Revelation 20:4 Below Were Beheaded, They Are (Dead)

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Perhaps you can help me find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) No Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) No Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) No Physical Mortal Humans?

The Above Claims (Don't Exist), A 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Is A Man Made Fairy Tale (Fact)

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ?

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time (Fact)

(The Souls) Seen In Revelation 20:4 Below Were Beheaded, They Are (Dead)

2 Peter 3:8KJV
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Revelation 20:1-6KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

 

[Absolutely]

You act as if you have some extra special revelation, the (Ten Virgin) parable is nothing more than showing the saved righteous, and the unsaved wolves in sheeps clothing.

Same teaching seen below

Matthew 7:22-23KJV
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Matthew 25:11-12KJV
11 Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.

The foolish were virgins = saved

So you think the heathens of this world are pure and undefiled ( virgins)
Have light, oil( the Holy Spirit) and are. Waiting for Jesus?.

I remember my bar hopping days. I never saw such a thing.
We all knew we were going to hell.

Clever glossovers are a red flag.

What are virgins?
What are lamps?
What is oil?

Your cleverness cannot go there correct?

Pssssst..... you missed the U-turn. The U-turn fg2 says is non existent.

 

[Absolutely]

You act as if you have some extra special revelation, the (Ten Virgin) parable is nothing more than showing the saved righteous, and the unsaved wolves in sheeps clothing.

Same teaching seen below

Matthew 7:22-23KJV
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Matthew 25:11-12KJV
11 Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.

Ok now unpack it.
You did nothing at all. Just some wild guessing.

Btw
No Postrib except bluto ever has.

Pssssst...it has to do with a wedding, bride, groom , and rapture.

You ACTUALLY STARTED. With some wild assumption.

It helps to approach it outside your preconceived box.

 

[Absolutely]

How come there isn't ANY mention of a U-turn in ANY of the passages you've cited/quoted??

Esp in the 10 virgin parable.

Wow
IT is right there.
Right there and you CANNOT SEE IT????

WOW.

NOW THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU ARE NOT OPEN MINDED AND START FROM THE WRONG PLACE.

REREAD THE PARABLE TILL YOU SEE IT.

NOT your Postrib U-turn that men told you.

But the bible U-turn.

The church gathering has one.
Noah has one
And the Jewish gathering has one.

But you will not see it ever.
Your mind is closed off
Sad

 

[Absolutely]

Clue for postribs
Not that it matters.

Look at the Jewish wedding tradition.

But nah...you will not.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Yes that is your quote below, and you (Knowing) posted it as if it was mine, dishonest.

Are you even paying attention? The post you cited was YOUR own post, so maybe you just don't understand how to set up posts.

 

[Absolutely]

FreeGrace2 said:
OK, Mr pre-trib rapture man. Please share any verse that teaches that Jesus comes down in the clouds, glorifies all believers and takes them back up to heaven. What I call the HUGE U-turn.

Where are they?

OK, I see several things in this passage.

First, it's called a PARABLE. Because Jesus taught by PARABLES so that:
Mark 4:10-13
When he was alone, the Twelve and the others around him asked him about the parables. He told them, “The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables so that, “‘they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding; otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!’” Then Jesus said to them, “Don’t you understand this parable? How then will you understand any parable?

So, EVEN Jesus' own disciples needed to have His parables explained to them. If you think Bible doctrine was taught by parables, you have really been deceived. If Jesus' own disciples needed explanation of Jesus' parables, so do YOU.

Second, there is NOTHING in this parable resembling Christ's return to earth, resurrecting/rapturing saints, or anything else.

So, what do you do? Spiritualize the parable, in order to defend your own opinion, or the opinion of someone else who has convinced you to believe their opinion.

Anyone can spiritualize any parable they want, to make it say what they want it so say. Big deal. That's all you've done.

So, again, I ask you: what CLEAR verses that plainly state that Jesus comes in the clouds, glorifies all believers and takes them back up to heaven? Or, the BIG U-turn, as I like to call it.

I ask for clear verses ahd you give me a parable. Figures.

Luke 8:10 -
He said, “The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of God has been given to you, but to others I speak in parables, so that,
“‘though seeing, they may not see; though hearing, they may not understand.’

You need to have your parables explained to YOU. You are unable to explain them to anyone else.

The parable is about being prepared for Christ's Second Coming. There is NOTHING about being raptured, Jesus making a HUGE U-turn back to heaven. That's just your opinion.

In fact, you have ZERO verses about Jesus taking any believers back up to heaven after glorifiying their bodies.

Why is that?

You do not know what unpack means?

You are not interested in the story?????
Not interested in the rapture?????

Do not care?????
Wow.

But it is a VIVID RAPTURE PICTURE.

oh I forgot...there is no pretrib rapture correct???

Therefore we , by default, must omit the entire thing.

Go to ANY POSTRIB TEACHER...ANY OF THEM, AND SHOW ME ONE RAPTURE VERSE.

they do not go there.

Your dismissal of the Parable is classic Postrib dishonesty


You guys are openly dishonest.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Perhaps you can help me find the things claimed by those teaching a Literal 1,000 year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth in Revelation 20:1-6 below?

1.) No Physical Earthly Kingdom?
2.) No Physical Earthly Throne?
3.) No Physical Mortal Humans?

Seriously? Is this all you can do for a reply? You're just not wanting to see these things. I've pointed them all out, but it only takes "eyes to see" and "ears to hear", which you apparently lack.

And you STILL haven't explained what "when the 1,000 years HAVE ENDED" and "1,000 years ARE OVER" mean.

It's obvious to those of us who DO have ears to hear and eyes to see that the Bible is describing TIME.

The Above Claims (Don't Exist), A 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom On This Earth, Is A Man Made Fairy Tale (Fact)

Your facts are just your opinion.

Revelation 20:1-6 Is 100% In The Lords (Spiritual) Angel, Heaven, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ?

Your spiritualizing allows you to explain anything you want to mean anything you want. That's all.

100% Spiritual Realm, No "Literal" Time (Fact)

Nonsense to your spiritualizing. And please explain how 1,000 years ARE ENDED and ARE OVER.

(The Souls) Seen In Revelation 20:4 Below Were Beheaded, They Are (Dead)

Wrong again. They WERE dead, but the passage says they "came to life and reigned with Christ for 1,000 years".

v.4 - I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

The blue words show how they died. The red words PROVE that they came to life and reigned with Christ.

Since Christ is King of kings, it is obvious to those with eyes to see and ears to hear that Jesus Christ rules over people for 1,000 year

Apparently you ignore or reject Scripture.