How do we explain these pro slavery verses in scripture?

[Cameron143]

That’s not correct. Your ideas about slavery and freedom originated from outside of scripture, not in scripture. Scripture defends and promotes it.

*Has God telling how to sell your daughter as a slave to a master. Ex 21:7-8

*Has God saying a slave owner can keep a woman slave and her children if the husband slave departs. Ex 21:4

*Has a God telling priests they can buy slaves as property. Lev 22:11

*Has a God saying you can buy male and female slaves as property and pass them off as inheritance. Lev 22:44-46

*Has a guy saying women and children can be taken as spoils of war. Deut 20:12-14

*Has a God who says women can be taken as spoils of war. Deut 21:10-14

*Has a God who says virgin women can be taken as spoils of war. Numbers 31:18

*God who says women can be taken as spoils of war. Num 31:32-35

¥ou’re confusing modern ideas about slavery with what the scripture actually says. We want to think all of our good ideas are in scripture, but anti-slavery isn’t.

I don't deny that my ideas concerning slavery don't come from what the Bible says about slavery. But my ideas about slavery still comes from the Bible because my ideas reflect biblical principles...love,mercy, grace, goodness, etc.
Whatever reasons God has for slavery in times past I'm not fully aware of except as they relate to salvation. But my views on slavery do come from the Bible.

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

Yes, but people would call that morals. That wouldn't understand our Christian speak/terms.

It's unimportant what "people" do, or don't do, or what they "call" anything. Morals are SOCIALLY BASED, and only reflect the values du jour of the society they're part of.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

It's unimportant what "people" do, or don't do, or what they "call" anything. Morals are SOCIALLY BASED, and only reflect the values du jour of the society they're part of.

Ok, let's not get lost in the weeds here. This is about answering the OPs questions, not getting hung up on definitions.

 

[Off123123123]

I don't deny that my ideas concerning slavery don't come from what the Bible says about slavery. But my ideas about slavery still comes from the Bible because my ideas reflect biblical principles...love,mercy, grace, goodness, etc.
Whatever reasons God has for slavery in times past I'm not fully aware of except as they relate to salvation. But my views on slavery do come from the Bible.

Love mercy and peace is never applied to the topic of slavery in scripture, and there is around 4000 years of scripture to say so, and it simply doesn’t

 

[Cameron143]

Love mercy and peace is never applied to the topic of slavery in scripture, and there is around 4000 years of scripture to say so, and it simply doesn’t

I never said they were applied to slavery. I said they were biblical principles for my understanding of slavery on a personal level.

 

[Off123123123]

I never said they were applied to slavery. I said they were biblical principles for my understanding of slavery on a personal level.

But which are you going to affirm? Your personal level view, or the view of scripture clear applications?

 

[Cameron143]

But which are you going to affirm? Your personal level view, or the view of scripture clear applications?

I affirm all that God has done and decrees. On a personal level I will attempt to live out biblical morality. On an intellectual level I will attempt to gain insight into the actions and decrees of God to understand what He is revealing and teaching through it.

 

[Off123123123]

I affirm all that God has done and decrees. On a personal level I will attempt to live out biblical morality. On an intellectual level I will attempt to gain insight into the actions and decrees of God to understand what He is revealing and teaching through it.

COGNITIVE DISSONANCE FOR $1000 ALEX!

 

[Cameron143]

COGNITIVE DISSONANCE FOR $1000 ALEX!

I get that you don't get it. I would tell you to go back to my original post and reread it, but that won't help either unless God gives understanding, and given your responses this seems unlikely.
You believe you have put Christians in a quandary, but you haven't. You have only served to confuse good people.

 

[Off123123123]

I get that you don't get it. I would tell you to go back to my original post and reread it, but that won't help either unless God gives understanding, and given your responses this seems unlikely.
You believe you have put Christians in a quandary, but you haven't. You have only served to confuse good people.

It’s not confusing. The Bible says what it says on these issues. It doesn’t clearly say what you want it to say.
It’s more confusing to say the bible says something clearly, when it doesn’t.

 

[JohnDB]

I notice it's all about you. You didn't say anything about what it would be like for a slave to be owned by another person.

Because scriptures are clear about how to treat slaves. A slave is still a person...and in order to care for them properly it requires a lot of work. And I can't do it all anymore like I used to.

Everyone who used to work for me was loyal beyond what I would think was a ridiculous level of loyalty. But I took care of my crews ALWAYS. I expected work...but that was all I expected. And I didn't care if you told good jokes tried to bribe me with any number of enducements...or tried to be my friend. I just wanted you to work and try your best to accomplish the work. And for so many people....it was such a relief and welcome blessing. I didnt care if you could speak English...i had interpreters pitching in when i needed them. I had people asking to be on my crew. But having a crew requires a LOT of work on my part. I have to keep them busy and supplied with tools, materials, and equipment. That requires a lot of planning on top of always being available to answer questions they had. I literally walked through 2 pairs of boots a year. I did the work of three people to take care of them....including baking cookies or buying chicken, sausage, and blueberry biscuits from Bojangles. (Treats the company would never pay for) Mostly because they performed for me when I asked.

And that's the part I think about most...what I'd need to do for them. Because that's what scriptures focus on...my performance of treating slaves/employees/subordinates well.

That's why it's all about me.

 

[JohnDB]

How can we know we’re getting what they intended, if we don’t know what they mean???

You wont....we will.

 

[JohnDB]

That’s simply not true. That is a myth, scam, and total hoax.

Being taken as a spoil of war as plunder isn’t welfare.
Deut 20
13 And when the Lord your God gives it into your hand, you shall put all its males to the sword, 14 but the women and the little ones, the livestock, and everything else in the city, all its spoil, you shall take as plunder for yourselves.

Num 31:9
And the people of Israel took captive the women of Midian and their little ones, and they took as plunder all their cattle, their flocks, and all their goods.

A daughter could be SOLD as a slave
Ex 21
7 “When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she shall not go out as the male slaves do.

Yes, it's amazing to me that even though you quote scripture you have no understanding of it. Obviously you read what you quoted and understand the words but for whatever reason you still don't get the contextual clues of kindness and mercy and grace shown to the slaves.

 

[JohnDB]

I get that you don't get it. I would tell you to go back to my original post and reread it, but that won't help either unless God gives understanding, and given your responses this seems unlikely.
You believe you have put Christians in a quandary, but you haven't. You have only served to confuse good people.

Agreed....he is as lost as last year's Easter egg.

 

[Off123123123]

Yes, it's amazing to me that even though you quote scripture you have no understanding of it. Obviously you read what you quoted and understand the words but for whatever reason you still don't get the contextual clues of kindness and mercy and grace shown to the slaves.

Ahh the old out of context argument. In context it says and means the same thing.

 

[Off123123123]

Agreed....he is as lost as last year's Easter egg.

Not really. I’m just quoting scripture. It says what it says, you’re just mad that it doesn’t mean what you want it to mean.

 

[Off123123123]

You wont....we will.

Sounds a tad gnostic to me.

 

[Off123123123]

Because scriptures are clear about how to treat slaves. A slave is still a person...and in order to care for them properly it requires a lot of work. And I can't do it all anymore like I used to.

Everyone who used to work for me was loyal beyond what I would think was a ridiculous level of loyalty. But I took care of my crews ALWAYS. I expected work...but that was all I expected. And I didn't care if you told good jokes tried to bribe me with any number of enducements...or tried to be my friend. I just wanted you to work and try your best to accomplish the work. And for so many people....it was such a relief and welcome blessing. I didnt care if you could speak English...i had interpreters pitching in when i needed them. I had people asking to be on my crew. But having a crew requires a LOT of work on my part. I have to keep them busy and supplied with tools, materials, and equipment. That requires a lot of planning on top of always being available to answer questions they had. I literally walked through 2 pairs of boots a year. I did the work of three people to take care of them....including baking cookies or buying chicken, sausage, and blueberry biscuits from Bojangles. (Treats the company would never pay for) Mostly because they performed for me when I asked.

And that's the part I think about most...what I'd need to do for them. Because that's what scriptures focus on...my performance of treating slaves/employees/subordinates well.

That's why it's all about me.

You’re grossly conflating your hired workers with what’s going on in the verses below.


*Has God telling how to sell your daughter as a slave to a master. Ex 21:7-8

*Has God saying a slave owner can keep a woman slave and her children if the husband slave departs. Ex 21:4

*Has a God telling priests they can buy slaves as property. Lev 22:11

*Has a God saying you can buy male and female slaves as property and pass them off as inheritance. Lev 22:44-46

*Has a guy saying women and children can be taken as spoils of war. Deut 20:12-14

*Has a God who says women can be taken as spoils of war. Deut 21:10-14

*Has a God who says virgin women can be taken as spoils of war. Numbers 31:18

*God who says women can be taken as spoils of war. Num 31:32-35

 

[Off123123123]

Yes, it's amazing to me that even though you quote scripture you have no understanding of it. Obviously you read what you quoted and understand the words but for whatever reason you still don't get the contextual clues of kindness and mercy and grace shown to the slaves.

Ah yes the contextual clues of kindness and mercy found in killing their husbands and dads, and taking the women captive as plunder.

Deut 20:12-14 12 But if it makes no peace with you, but makes war against you, then you shall besiege it. 13 And when the Lord your God gives it into your hand, you shall put all its males to the sword, 14 but the women and the little ones, the livestock, and everything else in the city, all its spoil, you shall take as plunder for yourselves. And you shall enjoy the spoil of your enemies, which the Lord your God has given you.


More contextual clues of kindness, mercy, and grace, by saying a slave wife and her kids can be kept from her slave husband by the master.

Ex 21:4 4 If his master gives him a wife and she bears him sons or daughters, the wife and her children shall be her master's, and he shall go out alone.

 

[ThereRoseaLamb]

Ah yes the contextual clues of kindness and mercy found in killing their husbands and dads, and taking the women captive as plunder.
.

Your status says you're a Christian. Why does it say that?