Has the Gospel been preached in all the world?

[DLM]

I think the tares are burned up when the Wheat is gathered in that parable, its the Judgment of mankind, not their souls 1000 years later, thus the end of the age, IMHO, is Satan losing his kingdom of wickedness and deception over mankind, and being locked up for 1000 years. The New Beginning so to speak is Jesus ruling on this earth for 1000 years of "Sabbath Rest" so to speak.

In Rev. 10 we see when the 7th Thunder Sounds (7th Trump) time will be no more [as we know it].

Men will no longer desire to sin on earth, those who do live and have kids will still be living under sin flesh, but the only sins will be sins of omission. Thus Willful sins we be no more.


Off the cliff there bud....

The Last Days - End of The Age
Jesus and His Apostles lived in the "LAST DAYS" The "END OF THE AGE".

All of the Age's represent time.

The Patriarchal Age
FROM CREATION TO MOSES - 4004 B.C. TO 1500 B.C.)

The Mosaic Age
MOSES TO THE DESTRUCTION OF JERUSALEM 1500 B.C. TO 70 A.D. (End Of The Age)

The Christian Age
70 A.D. TO HAS NO END (Ephesians 3:20-21)

The Apostle Paul taught that all of the people in his generation were living at the "end of the age" 1 Corinthians 10:11 Paul told Timothy to avoid certain people in the LAST DAYS. If the last days were generations to come, Timothy would have to be alive today.

Hebrews 1:1-2 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these LAST DAYS has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom He also made the world.

Matthew 24:3 And as He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, "Tell us, WHEN will these things happen, and what will be the sign of Your COMING, and of the END OF THE AGE?"

Matthew 13:39-40 - There are only two ages spoken about at this time in the bible "this age" and "new age" which is The Old Covenant Age and the The New Covenant Age.

The text "end of the age" is not the end of the earth. It's about the end of the Old Covenant Age. The Old Covenant Age ended in AD 70 when the temple was destroyed. See Luke 21:20-24

Jesus made a coming during the last days of the age that was the Old Covenant age, the Jewish age. That age came to an end with the destruction of the temple in AD 70.

Do you not know when the End came? The Age we live in has no End (Ephesians 3:20-21) In fact! The New Covenant is eternal (Hebrews 13:20) and the gospel is eternal (Revelation5:13; 14:6)

The text "end of the age" is not the end of the earth. It's about the end of the Old Covenant Age. The Old Covenant Age ended in AD 70 when the temple was destroyed. See Luke 21:20-24

 

[DLM]

I know we DIE when we are Raptured, so did Elijah when God took him because sin flesh CAN NOT enter Heaven. but that is wat the whole CHANGES in the Twinkling of an eye means, those living will be TAKEN via their Spirits, to Heaven and their bodies will thus be left on earth, thus they become INNCORUPTIBLE like those raised from the grave without sin flesh bodies. So, we indeed are Raptured/Taken by force/Harpazoed/Snatched, or what ever you wish to call it, at the same time as the Dead n Crist go to Heaven, when people die they do nit go straight to heaven, that is a myth. Just like the Jews had a HOLDIG PLACE called Paradise, we also do not go straight to heaven, the very verses you cited to us that.

1 Cor. 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption(Sin Flesh) inherit incorruption(Heaven).

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump(The LAST TRUMP always ended the Summer Harvest): for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible(With NO sin flesh), and we shall be changed(From men living in a flesh body to Spirit Men, just like those RAISED from the dead, at the SAME TIME). 53 For this corruptible(Sin Flesh) must put on incorruption(Spirit Man), and this mortal(Flesh body) must put on immortality(Spirit man, which will eventually get an Eternal Glorified Body in Heaven).

People take verses that tell us our souls will go back t be with the Lord when we die OVERTLY TOO LITERAL, of course our bodies will go back t be with the Lord, but in His TIMING, not ours. The holy word above says SPECIFICALLY that the Dead in Christ are raised at the very END, and the Living in Christ are CHANGED at the same time. But the statement is true, when we die we will go back to be with the Lord in eternity, but just not until God's Judgment time arrives. Scripture interprets scriptures, the one passage is interpreted in this above passage as per the TIMING of us going to be with the Lord Jesus told the Thief on the Cross that he would be with him that day in Paradise (and Jesus was in the earth THREE DAYS), thus we know the Jewish peoples had a holding place for spirits in the earth. We also know when Jesus was raised 3b days later He told Mary touch me not for I have not yet ASSCENDED unto the Father, thus this is further proof that Paradise is in the earth, not in Heaven, thus the Souls of the Righteous do not go straight to Heaven. In another place Jesus called this holding place the Bosom of Abraham in his Luke 16 parable.

Luke 16:22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; 23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.

25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

So, Abrahams bosom is the Paradise spoken of, but it is not un Heaven.

The rapture teaching is an heresy

Nobody will fly into the sky. That is mans teaching. It is not biblical.

Have you ever read why Darby started teaching about the so called rapture? It comes from a demonic possessed girl, Margaret McDonald. I hope you take the time and research it.

Actually he excerpted from her testimony only what supported his teaching. You should read what she testified because it is totally against Scofield's rapture teaching.

Yes. Margaret McDonald I believe had a true prophecy which Scofield twisted

Now that we admit the rapture teaching is only about 200 years old, I think that's about 1,800 years to late for what really happened in 70AD.

Most of us believe everything in the Bible points to the Cross. It's all about the Body of Christ and being IN Him. When I was raptured or caught up into the Body of Christ I debunked the 21st century rapture theory, as far as I'm concerned.

 

[DLM]

Well that is news to everyone other than yourself.

The Last Days - End of The Age
Jesus and His Apostles lived in the "LAST DAYS" The "END OF THE AGE".

All of the Age's represent time.

The Patriarchal Age
FROM CREATION TO MOSES - 4004 B.C. TO 1500 B.C.)

The Mosaic Age
MOSES TO THE DESTRUCTION OF JERUSALEM 1500 B.C. TO 70 A.D. (End Of The Age)

The Christian Age
70 A.D. TO HAS NO END (Ephesians 3:20-21)

The Apostle Paul taught that all of the people in his generation were living at the "end of the age" 1 Corinthians 10:11 Paul told Timothy to avoid certain people in the LAST DAYS. If the last days were generations to come, Timothy would have to be alive today.

Hebrews 1:1-2 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these LAST DAYS has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom He also made the world.

Matthew 24:3 And as He was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, "Tell us, WHEN will these things happen, and what will be the sign of Your COMING, and of the END OF THE AGE?"

Matthew 13:39-40 - There are only two ages spoken about at this time in the bible "this age" and "new age" which is The Old Covenant Age and the The New Covenant Age.

The text "end of the age" is not the end of the earth. It's about the end of the Old Covenant Age. The Old Covenant Age ended in AD 70 when the temple was destroyed. See Luke 21:20-24

Jesus made a coming during the last days of the age that was the Old Covenant age, the Jewish age. That age came to an end with the destruction of the temple in AD 70.

Do you not know when the End came? The Age we live in has no End (Ephesians 3:20-21) In fact! The New Covenant is eternal (Hebrews 13:20) and the gospel is eternal (Revelation5:13; 14:6)

The text "end of the age" is not the end of the earth. It's about the end of the Old Covenant Age. The Old Covenant Age ended in AD 70 when the temple was destroyed. See Luke 21:20-24

 

[DLM]

Abraham's Bosom was the place of the righteous dead in Hades (in the lower parts of the earth). But Paradise is in the New Jerusalem (in Heaven). So Christ took all the OT saints from Hades to Paradise when He rose from the dead.

Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men. Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth? He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things. (Eph 4:8-10)

"Heavens" here is plural since Christ rose through the first and second heavens to reach the third heaven (which is God's Heaven), which is "far above all heavens".

Prior to Jesus' ascension to heaven no one went to Heaven. They went to Sheol (Old Testement) and Hades (New Testament.) John 3:13 They waited for the atoning work of Christ and the resurrection from the dead.

In the Old Testament, the Hebrew word for where they were prior to the resurrection is Sheol. In the New Testament the Greek word is Hades. This place was a waiting area for disembodied spirits.

Hades is was also known as "Abraham's bosom" the faithful Israelite was said to be "gathered unto his fathers." it was not Heaven.

The Bible tells us the resurrection was to be at the end of the Old Covenant age. We know this happened in AD 70 with the destruction of the Jewish Temple. The disciples clearly knew that the fall of the temple and the destruction of the city meant the end of the Old Covenant age and the beginning of a new age. (New Covenant) There was only one resurrection to take place and that was in AD 70. After that when a Christian dies he/she goes directly to heaven.

If the TIME of the resurrection is seen as AD 70, then we know that the NATURE of the resurrection was spiritual, rather than physical. It is a fundamental fact of eschatology that TIME DEFINES NATURE. Since we know that the resurrection is past, we know that it was spiritual and not physical. The resurrection of the dead that took place at the end of the Old Covenant in AD 70 and was not a biological resurrection of dead decayed bodies, but a release from Sheol and Hades of all who had been waiting through the centuries to be reunited with God in the heavenly kingdom.

Christ Jesus, went to Hades at death. When he was resurrected from Hades, He had His original body, then was transformed into His heavenly form.
Psalms 16:10 ; Acts 2:31 Jesus was resurrected from both, spiritual death (the soul in Hades) and physical death.

Jesus' body had to be resurrected not only to fulfill prophesy but to how His disciples that His soul had been to Hades and had been resurrected. A key point is the resurrection of Jesus had to be shown otherwise the spiritual would not be known. Another words, the physical resurrection of our bodies would have no point, you cannot see it, we will not be on the earth anymore at that point we would be in heaven.

The resurrection was a one time event in which the Old Testament saints were brought out of Hades and finally overcame death to be with the Lord. We have put on immortality and will put on our immortal body when we die physically. As believers, we live in the presence of God, and in physical death, we simply drop the flesh and dwell only in the spiritual realm, which will seem as thought it were physical, but with more dimensions and much better!

 

[Rondonmon]

Abraham's Bosom was the place of the righteous dead in Hades (in the lower parts of the earth). But Paradise is in the New Jerusalem (in Heaven). So Christ took all the OT saints from Hades to Paradise when He rose from the dead.

Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men. Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth? He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things. (Eph 4:8-10)

"Heavens" here is plural since Christ rose through the first and second heavens to reach the third heaven (which is God's Heaven), which is "far above all heavens".

Jesus indeed went to preach to those souls, but they are not raised until the VEEY END. Daniel 12:1-2 tells us that.

Dan. 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up(Rev. 12, we know this), the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble(1260), such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

We have to use scriptures to direct us where other scriptures confuse us or conflate doctrine unclearly.

People miss this last verse also....

Dan. 12:13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest,(Sleep) and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

No one goes to Heaven until the Pre Trib Rapture, save Elijah and Moses and maybe a couple of others who were taken. The bible wouldn't say not all shall SLEEP id we went straight to heaven. We go to Paradise or Sheol, which is why its sometimes also called Hades because hades means The Grave.

 

[DLM]

Jesus indeed went to preach to those souls, but they are not raised until the VEEY END. Daniel 12:1-2 tells us that.

Dan. 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up(Rev. 12, we know this), the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble(1260), such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

We have to use scriptures to direct us where other scriptures confuse us or conflate doctrine unclearly.

People miss this last verse also....

Dan. 12:13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest,(Sleep) and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

No one goes to Heaven until the Pre Trib Rapture, save Elijah and Moses and maybe a couple of others who were taken. The bible wouldn't say not all shall SLEEP id we went straight to heaven. We go to Paradise or Sheol, which is why its sometimes also called Hades because hades means The Grave.

Did Elijah, Enoch, and Mosses ascend to heaven before Jesus? NO

Jesus said No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven. John 3:13

No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him. John 1:18

So how can Elijah, Enoch, and Moses ascend to heaven?

Elijah, Enoch, and Moses went from Paradise in Hades then to Heaven after Jesus became the first to return.

Since Jesus descended to heaven first, everyone that dies goes to Heaven instead of Hades.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Jesus indeed went to preach to those souls, but they are not raised until the VERY END.

Sorry but you are somewhat confused. Those souls are presently in Heaven, but their Resurrection is DEFINITELY NOT at the very end. The Resurrection/Rapture will take place some time before the Tribulation and the reign of the Antichrist. And it many not be too far off. It is only the resurrection of damnation that is at the very end (Rev 20).

 

[DLM]

Jesus indeed went to preach to those souls, but they are not raised until the VEEY END. Daniel 12:1-2 tells us that.

Dan. 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up(Rev. 12, we know this), the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble(1260), such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

We have to use scriptures to direct us where other scriptures confuse us or conflate doctrine unclearly.

People miss this last verse also....

Dan. 12:13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest,(Sleep) and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

No one goes to Heaven until the Pre Trib Rapture, save Elijah and Moses and maybe a couple of others who were taken. The bible wouldn't say not all shall SLEEP id we went straight to heaven. We go to Paradise or Sheol, which is why its sometimes also called Hades because hades means The Grave.

Daniel 12:1-7 It tells the prediction of end of the Age. And the Resurrection would occur when the old covenant age came to an end. What do you think "the power of the holy people has been completely shattered" means? The only power Israel ever had was a covenant relationship with the Lord.

The Apostle Paul taught that all of the people in his generation were living at the "end of the age" 1 Corinthians 10:11

Matthew 13:39-40 - There are only two ages spoken about at this time in the bible "this age" and "new age" which is The Old Covenant Age and the The New Covenant Age.

The text "end of the age" is not the end of the earth. It's about the end of the Old Covenant Age. The Old Covenant Age ended in AD 70 when the temple was destroyed. See Luke 21:20-24

The Bible tells us the world will NEVER End
Ecclesiastes 1:4 A generation goes and a generation comes, But the earth remains forever.
See (Genesis 8:21-22, Psalms 72:17 78:69, 89:36-37, 93:1, 96:10, 104:5, 119:90, 148:4-6, Isaiah 45:17, Ephesians 3:21)

Daniel 12:1-7 tells us WHEN the END OF THE AGE would be. Most people understand that the Resurrection would occur at His Coming. With that said then

Read Daniel 12:1-7

Verse 2 is the Resurrection

Verse 5 the question is asked How long...

Verse 7 It would occur "when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered".

Daniel's "holy people" was Old Testament Israel. And her only power was, her covenant relationship with the Lord.

So, the resurrection would happen, when Israel and her covenant relationship was "completely shattered"

The only power Israel ever had was a covenant relationship with the Lord.

Chapter 12 is the source for the "end of the age", "resurrection doctrine", the resurrection of the just and the unjust doctrine. It's the comparison between Daniel and the New Testament. The New Testament confirms Daniel 12. It confirms the resurrection and the coming of Christ.

Notice Daniel 12 to Matthew 13

Daniel 12:2 (resurrection) - Matthew 13:39 (Harvest)

Daniel 12:3-4 (time of the end) - Matthew 13:39-40 (end of this age)

Daniel 12 is the Judgment, Life and condemnation - Matthew 13:24-30 (Judgment, wheat and the tares)

Daniel 12 righteous shine - Matthew 13:43 (Then shall the righteous shine) This comes from Daniel 12

Daniel 12 is the resurrection and the harvest of Matthew 13.

Keep in mind Jesus said the resurrection would take place at the end of the age Matthew 13:39 this means the first century.


Daniel 12 (Time of the end) 1 Corinthians 15 (Then comes the end)

Daniel 12 (resurrection) 1 Corinthians 15 (resurrection)

Daniel 12 (Everlasting life) 1 Corinthians 15 (immortality)

Daniel 12 (Righteous shine in the Kingdom) 1 Corinthians 15 (Entrance into the Kingdom)

Daniel 12 (Righteous shine in the Kingdom) 1 Corinthians 15 (We shall not all sleep)

Again "when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered" all these things will be fulfilled.

The resurrection of Daniel 12 is the resurrection of 1 Corinthians 15.

Both predicted the resurrection of everlasting life, the Kingdom and the end of the age. This would all take place at the end of Moss's Law. And Paul confirmed that. Romans 7:6-12


Now let's look at Revelation 11 by now you can see all these New Testament texts that are taught from Daniel 12.

Daniel 12 (Time of the end) Revelation 11 (Seventh trump) Last trump 1 Corinthians 15:50

Daniel 12 (when the power of the holy people shattered) Revelation 11 (Judgment of the city where the Lord was slain)

Daniel 12 (Time of the kingdom and Mt. 13:43) Revelation 11:16 (Time of the kingdom)

Daniel 12 (resurrection) Revelation 11:16 (Time of the dead they should be judged )

Now we have the time of the end at the sounding of the seventh trumpet. The sounding of the last trumpet is what Paul says is the time of the resurrection in 1 Corinthians 15:15

So, 1 Corinthians 15:15 is the resurrection at the last trumpet. And in Revelation 11, the resurrection at the seventh trumpet, which is the last trumpet. So both are the same .

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Has the Gospel been preached in all the world? (Matthew 24:14)

Romans 1:8, Romans 10:18, Romans 16:26, Colossians 1:6, Colossians 1:23, Titus 2:11

Does the world expand as time goes on ?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Sorry but you are somewhat confused. Those souls are presently in Heaven, but their Resurrection is DEFINITELY NOT at the very end. The Resurrection/Rapture will take place some time before the Tribulation and the reign of the Antichrist. And it many not be too far off. It is only the resurrection of damnation that is at the very end (Rev 20).

“The Resurrection/Rapture will take place some time before the Tribulation”

“For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect. But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things.

But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.

And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory. And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭13:22-27‬ ‭KJV‬‬

that pre trib rapture thing really has absolutely no scripture to back it up brother

 

[ewq1938]

The text "end of the age" is not the end of the earth. It's about the end of the Old Covenant Age. The Old Covenant Age ended in AD 70 when the temple was destroyed. See Luke 21:20-24

The old covenant age and that covenant ended at the death of Christ, not decades later.

 

[soberxp]

I think the Bible has touched many people. You can't believe how many people, including those who don't believe the Bible. They think the Bible is childish and deceptive.

 

[ewq1938]

The rapture teaching is an heresy

Nobody will fly into the sky. That is mans teaching. It is not biblical.

Of course it is. Have you never read this part of the bible??

1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The book has 5 chapters. I recommend starting at the beginning then you uill find the rapture up into the clouds in the 4th chapter.

 

[Nehemiah6]

that pre trib rapture thing really has absolutely no scripture to back it up brother

You are quoting from Matthew 24, which has ABSOLUTELY no bearing on the Rapture. Do you even know anything about these "elect" after the Second Coming of Christ WITH His saints and angels?

 

[ewq1938]

You are quoting from Matthew 24, which has ABSOLUTELY no bearing on the Rapture.

Actually in that chapter is where Christ first spoke of the rapture which is called the gathering of the saints.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Actually in that chapter is where Christ first spoke of the rapture which is called the gathering of the saints.

The reality of the matter is that the saints are gathered to Christ at the Resurrection/Rapture long before the Second Coming described in Matthew 24. Therefore they come with Him from Heaven. That is also when He sends out the angels to gather the "elect" -- the believing Jewish remnant -- to Israel: And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God. (Zech 13:9)

 

[Pilgrimshope]

You are quoting from Matthew 24, which has ABSOLUTELY no bearing on the Rapture. Do you even know anything about these "elect" after the Second Coming of Christ WITH His saints and angels?

I don’t mind hearing theory from you or anyone if you’d like to use some scripture to back it up that’s the best way to find the truth


But my belief based on scripture lord of it is there is no pre tribulation “ rapture” there’s just the last day when Jesus returns like he said he would and gathers his people this day

“For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God:

and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”
‭‭1 Thessalonians‬ ‭4:15-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

this is how they’ll be gathered

“Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭24:29-31‬ ‭KJV‬‬

There’s just the one time gathering is my point that same event is all that’s repetitively taught in scripture

Jesus clearly told his disciples they were going to go through the tribulation and whoever was left on earth in the end would be saved when he returns.

He’s preparing them ahead of time to be strong in The coming tribulations until the end and be saved warning then not to be deceived. Because they would go through these Things

“And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.

For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

All these are the beginning of sorrows.

Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.

And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. Behold, I have told you before.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭24:4, 7-13, 23-25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

he’s actually teaching them tribulation is a certain thing on earth for many Christians and earning them not to fall away or forget to keep Loving each other in deed and truth

My point is Theres no scripture to support or even suggest pre tribulation rapture but tons of it explaining that well Go through tribulation in this world and enter glory in the next so we should keep heart if we suffer or are tried

but brother that’s just my belief and you Then have your own beliefs. My point was that it’s not a scriptural thing it seems to have been invented somewhere along the way by people writing a book and needing a revolutionary idea or something I heard it before when I was a kid too but then I looked for the scriptures d it clearly teaches a post tribulation gathering of the church ( Christs disciples baptized into his name )


Some will be gathered from heaven those who had went before, me gathered from earth those Paul says will be caught up to meet those gathering from heaven on the day Jesus returns at the end of the world right before he destroys it and ushers in the new world

 

[ewq1938]

The reality of the matter is that the saints are gathered to Christ at the Resurrection/Rapture long before the Second Coming described in Matthew 24.

Not according to scripture. Both Paul and Christ place the rapture at the same timeframe, after the Great Tribulation.

 

[Rondonmon]

Did Elijah, Enoch, and Mosses ascend to heaven before Jesus? NO

Jesus is Eternal, maybe you didn't know that, so he's always been in Heaven. Whenever we get raptured we will leave our bones somewhere, or a body that will turn to bones. If God TOOK them, them they were never in the grave.

Jesus said No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven. John 3:13

We al came from God, our Spirits came from the life giver. I don't know where God TOOK them to but they never saw the grave, an they were on the Mount of Transfiguration with Jesus. A lot of time I see you guys take scriptures out if context. I don't always have tome to rub down all of your misinformation every day, but suffice it to say since you do not understand the timing of the Rapture I already don't have a lot of trust in your overall ability to discern things.

No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him. John 1:18

So how can Elijah, Enoch, and Moses ascend to heaven?

Elijah, Enoch, and Moses went from Paradise in Hades then to Heaven after Jesus became the first to return.

Since Jesus descended to heaven first, everyone that dies goes to Heaven instead of Hades.

God TOOK THEM, we know therefore they are not in a holding place like everyone else. You do the math.

Daniel 12:1-7 It tells the prediction of end of the Age. And the Resurrection would occur when the old covenant age came to an end. What do you think "the power of the holy people has been completely shattered" means? The only power Israel ever had was a covenant relationship with the Lord.

NO....Man cn you guys nit discern ANYTHING? You need to read before you talk/post. When does Michael STAND UP adv save Israel? 70 AD (Diaspora) or during the very end times? This stuff isn't hard to add up, but you guys are like someone caught in a fib, the tale gets bigger and bigger each time. You aren't lying, but because you are misled, you go down rabbit holes, and to straighten stuff out you go down deeper rabbit holes. Is a never ending cycle.

I don't have time tonight, been bust all day. I will try t9 read it all tomorrow.

 

[Rondonmon]

Sorry but you are somewhat confused. Those souls are presently in Heaven, but their Resurrection is DEFINITELY NOT at the very end. The Resurrection/Rapture will take place some time before the Tribulation and the reign of the Antichrist. And it many not be too far off. It is only the resurrection of damnation that is at the very end (Rev 20).

The Rapture of the Church and the Raising up of the Saints of Israel are not the same thing, they already married God, they thus do not go to the wedding supper (Armageddon). The Jews are raised at THE END, just like Dan. 12:1-2 says.

The Spirits are in a holding place on earth, that's why Jesus went into the earth for 3 days. In Paradise.

I see the Rapture as the Fall of 2025, I see Apophis as the Revelation chapter 8 Asteroid/Trumpet Judgments. Thus Apophis hits on April 13, 2029, and thus the rapture has to be in the Fall of 2025, 3 1/2 years before the middle of the week Wrath falls.