Fourth Charismatic Wave (of the Spirit)?

[Evmur]

Hi Evmur.

Are you talking about the book of Acts primarily? Acts describes a time of signs and wonders to be sure. But it describes something that happened in church history. It doesn't prescribe those same things for all believers in all times.

I fundamentally disagree, Acts and the apostolic epistles are the pattern for the church age until He comes ... what more could any christian desire more than what we see in Acts?

 

[Evmur]

The closer we are to the very end of this age the disproportionately greater will be the number of those who have chosen evil over good for there is anumber, finite, to be reached of those who die for the message of the cross.

This said, sadly what I have posted is true, yuet at the sasme time glorious. All glory to God, amen.

The more glorious our Lord's ministry was the more His enemies hated Him and stirred the multitudes against Him. So it will be in the last times ... because the church is glorious.

 

[Evmur]

FYI Billy Graham said that he would be delighted if 4% of the people who went out the front were genuinely born again.

I well remember as a 15 year old paperboy well into the 60s culture and the Beatles delivering a paper which carried John Lennon's remark about the Beatles being more popular than Jesus. It was a single column on the right, but the big splash was "BILLY DOES IT AGAIN" showing the 1000s streaming forward at Billy's Wembley crusade. That impacted me.

 

[ResidentAlien]

Well ... the critics call them megachurch in derogatory terms ... when people displease themselves with what God is doing they will just be displeased. I have always been opposed to altar calls and "decisions" while admitting many do get saved thereby.

If it were true that they soon fall away their churches would not be getting bigger and bigger in numerical terms, then they split up into church planting and each church plant grows into full blown assemblies.

God is doing great things.

I don't doubt a lot of them keep going to church; but, what I'm wondering out loud is: Are these churches equipping these people to become disciples of the Lord, following Him wherever He goes? Or are they feeding them junk food designed to satisfy their emotions?

The charismatic churches I've attended recently and watched online are little more than self-help centers with the preacher serving as motivational speaker. Not much teaching on the gospel of Jesus Christ.

 

[ResidentAlien]

... what more could any christian desire more than what we see in Acts?

There's a lot in Acts to desire, and a lot. . .not so much. I assume you mean the signs and wonders are the things most to be desired. I'll tell you what a Christian should desire more than signs and wonders. . .belief.

In John 4:8 Jesus said: "Unless you people see signs and wonders, you will never believe." He's voicing His frustration with the Galileans because they refused to believe without first seeing a miraculous sign. Unlike the Samaritans, who, earlier in the chapter, had believed simply because of Jesus' word.

Signs and wonders aren't to be desired. This is where the charismatic movement has seriously gone off the rails. Signs and wonders are given at different times by God for various reasons but nowhere does the Bible imply that signs and wonders are to be a continuous thing. Jesus didn't have many good things to say to those who depended on signs:

"An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign, but no sign will be given to it except the sign of Jonah. "

He didn't give them a sign but instructed them to look more closely into the scriptures.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Then presto, seemingly out of nowhere, a new wave of the Spirit is upon us.

Since Christendom has been progressively moving away from Bible truth, while false teachers and false apostles have been on the rise, it is not likely that there will be any such phenomenon. Those who make these predictions should take everything into account.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Signs and wonders aren't to be desired.

Signs and wonders were to address the unbelief of the Jews. And in spite of the hundreds of thousands of miracles of Christ, Israel still did not believe that Jesus of Nazareth was their true Messiah.

 

[ResidentAlien]

"Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few."—Matthew 7:13-14

 

[JaumeJ]

It is a sinful and evil generation that seeks a sign. They will get no sign except the sign of Johna.

All who believe have and do experience signs and wonders beginning with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, to all those events causing one to come to our Savior, Jesus Yeshua.

No, we do not seek signs and wonders yet they occur commonly for those with the faith of Abraham.

 

[AandW]

I think I replied to the wrong post butut it was to you so I figure you figured out what I did.

In speaking of the cyber generation, I remember when calculators were forgidden in classrooms. After a very short time, they came into common usage.

One day at my work one of my fellows came in while I was working out the books. He was probably in his very early 20s. He said something the piqued my curiosity about his math prowess. I asked him, "B, what is three time 7? His prompt reply, I don't know.
I could have been pushed over with a feather.. I asked him if he ever learned his multiplcation tables,s and no was the reply. He could use a calculator. Now can you imagine justhow gone those are who rely strictly on the PC and the Internet? Not to mention their work chores.

I had other experiences with specifically math situations. When I came back to the US for medical consulataqtion, I worked briely at.. Anyways at emplyee meetings the boss would speak of something to do with figures asking the group what the solution to it would be. I would come back with the reply out of just plain old ciphering... Everyone in the meeting looked at me with their mouths hanging open. How did he do that? Gee by lultiply, dividing, addin and subtrcting the appropriate figures.

After this, when there was a meeting, the boss would just ask me in front of everyone. Kind off embarraqssing. Once I actually made an error, wow.. But never using a calculator.

Good chance if you cannot times [multiply] 3 and 7 or any combination of numbers, you probably aren't reading your Bible and knowing Who God is. It's why it makes sense to me if there is an actual 4th Wave of the Holy Spirit, it's for these unfortunate illiterate technological zombies.

 

[AandW]

Since Christendom has been progressively moving away from Bible truth, while false teachers and false apostles have been on the rise, it is not likely that there will be any such phenomenon. Those who make these predictions should take everything into account.

Whether if there is a 4th Wave or not, I am willing to bet there is coming a point where the core Members of the Body of Christ are going to become more outspoken against these false teachers. But when I think of false teachers, it's not just the seeker movements, the Denomination against Denomination Doctrines, but the Body of Christ is going to run out the Homosexual and Same Sex Ministers that for the past 15 years have infiltrated Denominations like Baptist/Wesleyan/Methodist/Presbyterian, Church of Christ, and many other offshoots.

And when this happens, that will bring the Core Body of Christ closer to being unified no matter your Denomination. And it's a very good chance there will be a release that brings Revival or a quick Movement. I believe the Church Body as it sits now has literally been thwarting God from Moving like we read Him doing in our Bibles. And when we come together to root out the falseness that's leading many Churches currently, it will allow God to pour out His Spirit upon ALL FLESH!

 

[AandW]

Signs and wonders were to address the unbelief of the Jews. And in spite of the hundreds of thousands of miracles of Christ, Israel still did not believe that Jesus of Nazareth was their true Messiah.

"Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few."—Matthew 7:13-14

It is a sinful and evil generation that seeks a sign. They will get no sign except the sign of Johna.

All who believe have and do experience signs and wonders beginning with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, to all those events causing one to come to our Savior, Jesus Yeshua.

No, we do not seek signs and wonders yet they occur commonly for those with the faith of Abraham.

As much as I whole heartedly agree with each one of your assessments, I am still reminded that Christ Himself in Matthew 24 told us to watch for certain signs like weather patterns that will change and become abnormal, signs like the sun turning to darkness and moon turning to blood, signs like lightning streaking from the East to the West will happen before the Second Coming of Christ. We are even looking at signs for those who fit the antichrist spirit. And clearly Peter told us a partial sign the Jews had been looking for when God first began pouring out His Spirit upon Believers.

So, many of those Verses concerning signs contradict what Christ Himself told us to do in Matthew 24.

But the signs I do watch for, not seek after, are the signs God Himself instructed me to be looking for.

Even Joel 2 gives us signs we need to be looking for:
30 And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke.

31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.

 

[JaumeJ]

Perhaps mankind is receiving a sign of what is to come.

Rev 16:8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.

I will not say it is so, but I certainly believe what I read. If this is not the same, I fear the atual realization of what is to come. All be blessed infaith and the Love that is our Everything, Jesus Yeshua, amen.

 

[Evmur]

There's a lot in Acts to desire, and a lot. . .not so much. I assume you mean the signs and wonders are the things most to be desired. I'll tell you what a Christian should desire more than signs and wonders. . .belief.

In John 4:8 Jesus said: "Unless you people see signs and wonders, you will never believe." He's voicing His frustration with the Galileans because they refused to believe without first seeing a miraculous sign. Unlike the Samaritans, who, earlier in the chapter, had believed simply because of Jesus' word.

Signs and wonders aren't to be desired. This is where the charismatic movement has seriously gone off the rails. Signs and wonders are given at different times by God for various reasons but nowhere does the Bible imply that signs and wonders are to be a continuous thing. Jesus didn't have many good things to say to those who depended on signs:

"An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign, but no sign will be given to it except the sign of Jonah. "

He didn't give them a sign but instructed them to look more closely into the scriptures.

..they had just seen Him feed the 5, 000, they had seen the miracles which He did so quite obviously they were asking for something different, probably they were asking for Him to bring fire down and burn the people up [something alot of evangelicals would like]

Jesus said if you don't believe Me then believe the works that I do which no other man did.

The scriptures are all about the miracle working power of the Living God, it is how He made His name.

When the Baptizer sent messengers asking Jesus if He was the One or should we look for another Jesus replied go tell John what you see, the blind see, the deaf hear, the lame walk, the dead are raised and the poor have good news preached to them.

Again He said woe to you Chorazin and Chicago for if the miracles done in you had been done in Sodom and Gomorrah those cities would have remained to this day.

The religious folk increase their guilt because they SEE and yet reject what they see.

To believe the scriptures, the word of God is to believe in miracles.

 

[Evmur]

I don't doubt a lot of them keep going to church; but, what I'm wondering out loud is: Are these churches equipping these people to become disciples of the Lord, following Him wherever He goes? Or are they feeding them junk food designed to satisfy their emotions?

The charismatic churches I've attended recently and watched online are little more than self-help centers with the preacher serving as motivational speaker. Not much teaching on the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Well you go to these places and watch these people on telly, I don't. I go where I know Jesus will be lifted up and glorified and the people will be blest. There is good stuff on telly too.

 

[Absolutely]

..they had just seen Him feed the 5, 000, they had seen the miracles which He did so quite obviously they were asking for something different, probably they were asking for Him to bring fire down and burn the people up [something alot of evangelicals would like]

Jesus said if you don't believe Me then believe the works that I do which no other man did.

The scriptures are all about the miracle working power of the Living God, it is how He made His name.

When the Baptizer sent messengers asking Jesus if He was the One or should we look for another Jesus replied go tell John what you see, the blind see, the deaf hear, the lame walk, the dead are raised and the poor have good news preached to them.

Again He said woe to you Chorazin and Chicago for if the miracles done in you had been done in Sodom and Gomorrah those cities would have remained to this day.

The religious folk increase their guilt because they SEE and yet reject what they see.

To believe the scriptures, the word of God is to believe in miracles.

BINGO

While the Holy Spirit haters are focused SOLELY on their mental perception and GUIDED BY Wretched teachers denying the Power of God....the remnant simply accepts the power as normal christian life.

I am so fortunate to come into the family of God in a time where the gifts were manifest and not hated on.

The haters will get paid one day.

 

[Absolutely]

"Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few."—Matthew 7:13-14

There is story after story after story of baptist pastors failing miserably and in sin.

Ask yourself why they are not exposed and the ENTIRE BAPTIST entity driven off the globe.

BECAUSE US CHARISMATICS have NO INTEREST in attacking the body of Christ.

That is why you do not see any anti baptist treads ( even though there is a GOLD MINE OF MATERIAL)

RESEARCH the main Holy Spirit hater Hank Hannegraft.

What a gold mine of dirt.

SOUND THE ALARM. Trash your own flock for a change.

 

[Absolutely]

Well you go to these places and watch these people on telly, I don't. I go where I know Jesus will be lifted up and glorified and the people will be blest. There is good stuff on telly too.

We used to be 700 club members.

We would regularly see pat robertson taken out of context on purpose by baptists and the lost media people to falsely smear him.

It is a spirit.
Stalking charismatics.

 

[JaumeJ]

The only times I have experienced worhip being guided by the Holy Spirit has been with charismatic groups in schools and in homes with small numbers, yet very blessed.

I cannot in honesty belong to any named denomination, for many reaqsons, however I believe we are peppered about htis old and tired globe in many of them.

 

[Absolutely]

If muldoon is false because some nit wit worships his bible...what of elisha that was totally wrong when he told someone " lay my staff beside the dead child and he will live" ...or something to that effect.

Stone him?

That would be a great attacker vid!

Rip that false prophet from your bibles!!!!

Sound the alarm!!!!

People are going to hell!!!!


Jokers with nothing better to do