Do SDA believe Michael is God?

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JesusLives

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Amazing Fact Part 4 Michael.

Is Michael Only One of Many?
Daniel 10:13 is probably the most difficult verse regarding Michael: "But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me." It appears at first glance that Michael is only "one of" the chief princes. This is an unfortunate translation in the King James. The word "one" comes from the Hebrew word "echad," which is also frequently translated as "first," as in the president's wife being called "first lady." (See Genesis 1:5; 8:13.) This changes the whole meaning of the verse to Michael being first of, greatest or highest of, to the chief of princes—again a reference to Jesus. The prince of the kingdom of Persia who withstood the angel was no doubt the devil who frequently appears working in the shadow of earthly monarchs such as the king of Babylon, the king of Tyre, and the Roman power (Isaiah 14:4, Ezekiel 28:2, Revelation 12:4). And remember that Jesus calls Satan "the prince of this world" (John 12:31).

Daniel 10:21 says, "But I will show thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince." Notice here that the angel refers to Michael as your Prince. Who was Daniel’s prince? In the previous chapter, we see the answer. In Daniel 9:25, Daniel’s Messiah is called the prince, which is another clear indication of Michael’s identity! So Gabriel is saying that Michael the archangel is Jesus, who knows all the truth of Scripture. Michael Stands Up

The final reference to Michael in Daniel is in chapter 12: "And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people." Notice here that Michael is not called a great prince but "the great prince." Is there any prince greater then Jesus? He is also identified as the one who "standeth for the children of thy people." This means that He intercedes, defends and even stands as a substitute. Who could this be other then Jesus?

Commenting on this verse, Matthew Henry states: "Michael signifies, 'Who is like God,' and his name, with the title of 'the great Prince,' points out the Divine Savior. Christ stood for the children of our people in their stead as a sacrifice, bore the curse for them, to bear it from them. He stands for them in pleading for them at the throne of grace." Jesus is clearly the one who always stands in our place and for our defense.

Michael standing up is also a reference to the Lord preparing to come. Notice that Michael is so exalted and powerful, his standing launches the great time of trouble. This in turn is followed by the second coming of Jesus and the resurrection (Daniel 12:2).


The Voice of Michael
If we isolate and examine the word "archangel," we see another interesting match. The only other passage in the Bible that uses the word "archangel" is 1 Thessalonians 4:16. And note its context: "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first." It is the voice of the archangel that raises the dead in Christ, and the Lord Himself who shouts it. This indicates that they are one and the same. Jesus is the one who shouts with the voice of the archangel, or "greatest messenger," to raise the dead!

Obviously, angels don't have the power to resurrect the dead. Only God who gives life has the power to restore it. "For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself. … Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth" (John 5:26, 28, 29).

In Jude, we see the archangel contending with the devil for the body of Moses, who, incidentally, was resurrected and taken to heaven from whence he appeared on the mount of transfiguration to encourage Christ (Mark 9). In 1 Thessalonians, the apostle Paul describes the resurrection as happening in response to the voice of the archangel. Again we see the parallel between these two verses; both describe the archangel in the act of resurrecting.


Worshiping the Commander
In Revelation, Michael is portrayed as leading the heavenly hosts, or armies, in the war against the rebellious Lucifer that took place. "And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels" (Revelation 12:7). Here the term "dragon" is a symbolic name for Satan, the leader of evil (verse 9), so it is very safe to assume that Michael is another emblematic name for Jesus, the embodiment and leader of good. But there is more evidence.

Just as Israel was preparing for its first battle after crossing into the Promised Land, Joshua had an encounter with an unusual warrior. "And it came to pass, when Joshua was by Jericho, that he lifted up his eyes and looked, and, behold, there stood a man over against him with his sword drawn in his hand: and Joshua went unto him, and said unto him, Art thou for us, or for our adversaries? And he said, Nay; but as captain of the host of the Lord am I now come. And Joshua fell on his face to the earth, and did worship, and said unto him, What saith my lord unto his servant? And the captain of the Lord's host said unto Joshua, Loose thy shoe from off thy foot; for the place whereon thou standest is holy. And Joshua did so" (Joshua 5:13-15). Not only did Joshua worship this being, but the heavenly captain received his worship. If he had been a mere angel, he would have rebuked Joshua just like the angel rebuked John for trying to worship him (see Revelation 19:10; 22:8, 9).

In each case in which the angel of the Lord accepts worship, it is clearly the Son of God. But where regular, created angels are worshiped, they refuse it! Even Jesus reminded Satan in the wilderness, "For it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve" (Luke 4:8).

In fact, all the created angels are commanded to worship Jesus as they did during His first advent. "And again, when he bringeth in the first begotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him" (Hebrews 1:6). The devil is infuriated because he knows that someday even he will be compelled to acknowledge Jesus as king and worship Him. "That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father" (Philippians 2:10, 11).

Notice the striking connection that even Paul makes between an angel of God and Jesus. "You received me as an angel of God, even as Christ Jesus" (Galatians 4:14). The phrase "Lord of hosts" appears 245 times in the Bible, and it refers to the "commander of God's angelic army." So the "captain of the Lord's host" that Joshua saw was not an angel, but Jesus Himself. That explains why He demanded that Joshua remove his shoes. The place was holy because Jesus was there, just as Jesus' presence at the burning bush made that ground holy for Moses. So Michael, the captain of the Lord's host, or army, is another title for Jesus.



Who is as God!
When Philip asks Jesus to show the disciples the Father, Christ responded: "Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father" (John 14:9). Some think that God's Son waited 4,000 years to personally intervene in the affairs of man. Not so! Though it is true that the incarnation occurred 4,000 years after man's fall, God the Son has been personally involved in the history and affairs of His people. This is why Jesus said; "Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad" (John 8:56). Jesus appeared personally to Abraham when the Patriarch interceded for Lot (Genesis 18:26).

What a wonderful truth that Jesus, God's eternal Son, has ever been actively occupied in watching over, providing for, and protecting His children! He spoke face to face with Abraham and Moses and wrestled with Jacob. He led the Israelites through the wilderness, providing food and water and victory against their enemies.

Remember that the title "Michael the archangel" means "The greatest messenger who is as God." It was Jesus, "the image of the invisible God" (Colossians 1:15), who brought the greatest message of hope, the gospel, to our perishing world!


Conclusion
In conclusion, we see this majestic and mysterious being, sometimes called Michael, sometimes the angel of the Lord, sometimes the commander of the Lord’s army, veiling His divinity and appearing in the form of a humble angel. Yet this same enigmatic being has the power, authority and attributes that belong only to God. He evicts the devil from heaven; He resurrects the dead; He intercedes for the saints; He judges and then stands, launching the great time of trouble. He redeems the saints and receives their worship. He offers us a new name.

Now you may know who Michael is, but the devil knows too, and it won't save him. The big question is: Do you know Him as Jesus your personal Lord and savior?
 

Pilgrimshope

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I noticed that too a few years ago. If Michael was Jesus then he would not be just 'one' of the chief princes but 'the' chief prince.
in the ot I would say Michael is probably here

“Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭23:20-21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I say that because of this

“And he shewed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to resist him. And the Lord said unto Satan, The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan; even the Lord that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?

And the angel of the Lord protested unto Joshua, saying, Thus saith the Lord of hosts; If thou wilt walk in my ways, and if thou wilt keep my charge, then thou shalt also judge my house, and shalt also keep my courts, and I will give thee places to walk among these that stand by.

Hear now, O Joshua the high priest, thou, and thy fellows that sit before thee: for they are men wondered at: for, behold, I will bring forth my servant the BRANCH. For behold the stone that I have laid before Joshua; upon one stone shall be seven eyes: behold, I will engrave the graving thereof, saith the Lord of hosts, and I will remove the iniquity of that land in one day.”
‭‭Zechariah‬ ‭3:1-2, 6-9‬ ‭

“Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭3:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬


Jesus isn’t the angel he is the stone promised the branch of righteousness promised with seven eyes foretold should come after

“And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭5:6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the angels were speaking for God in the ot until he was made flesh and spoke himself in Christ who was promised all along

Christ is on the throne and commands the angels including Michael
 

Nehemiah6

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in the ot I would say Michael is probably here
“Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him.” ‭‭Exodus‬ ‭23:20-21‬ ‭KJV
‬‬
This cannot possibly apply to Michael the Archangel. No angel, no archangel, and no man can "pardon your transgressions". And only Christ has the name of YHWH in Him. So the pre-incarnate Christ appeared to men as "the Angel of YHWH (the LORD)" and was worshipped as God. The holy angels would be angry with anyone who substituted them for the living God. And the Angel of the LORD identified Himself as the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob when He met Moses at the burning bush (Exodus 3).
 

Pilgrimshope

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This cannot possibly apply to Michael the Archangel. No angel, no archangel, and no man can "pardon your transgressions". And only Christ has the name of YHWH in Him. So the pre-incarnate Christ appeared to men as "the Angel of YHWH (the LORD)" and was worshipped as God. The holy angels would be angry with anyone who substituted them for the living God. And the Angel of the LORD identified Himself as the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob when He met Moses at the burning bush (Exodus 3).
how can it not possibly apply to Michael ?

Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭23:20-21‬ ‭

why is Joshua standing before the angel and not before the lord ? Because God set an angel over the law .

“No angel, no archangel, and no man can "pardon your transgressions". And only Christ has the name of YHWH in Him”

so your saying the scripture is wrong ?

Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him.”

it seems kinda clear. But I understand you think you understand it all so I’m not gonna argue with you about such an obvious thing
 

tourist

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Did Ellen White Teach “A Different God”?

https://www.nonsda.org/egw/egw68.shtml
First that I have heard that. I have attended many Sabbath services with my wife and the SDA absolutely believe in the Holy Trinity, the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit - three separate unique entities comprising one God. Some do believe that the archangel Michael is Jesus, but the majority, at least in the congregation that I attended, believe that Michael is only an archangel but not Jesus. I certainly don't believe that Michael is Jesus but then again, I am not an SDA.
 

Nehemiah6

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how can it not possibly apply to Michael ?
I already gave you the answer. No angel can be substituted for the Lord God Almighty (Christ). And those who do this commit idolatry.
 

Nehemiah6

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Please take the time to read if you want to know how SDA view Michael.
Since it is all BALONEY why should anyone read this nonsense? Michael would probably cut down the Michael worshippers since he is loyal to God. He disputed with the devil but then said "The LORD rebuke thee". If Michael was God he need not have said this.
 

tourist

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Since it is all BALONEY why should anyone read this nonsense? Michael would probably cut down the Michael worshippers since he is loyal to God. He disputed with the devil but then said "The LORD rebuke thee". If Michael was God he need not have said this.
@JesusLives was responding to @TheLearner.
 

Pilgrimshope

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I already gave you the answer. No angel can be substituted for the Lord God Almighty (Christ). And those who do this commit idolatry.
no you didn’t answer anything you have your opinion that apparently scripture has it wrong which I disagree with

“Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made;

and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.

Now a mediator is not a mediator of one,

but God is one.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

The angels spoke for God after they worshipped the calf that’s what Godnis explaining to Moses there telling him he wasn’t going with them but was going to send his angel instead to lead them to the promised land and he would come later

he did come in Christ the creator angels aren’t creators they are the created less than Christ they serve him

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men. And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

…And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1:1-5, 14‬ ‭KJV‬‬


Christ is not and never has been an angel He is and always has been God who created and commands angels which he gave ordination of the law of Moses
 
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First that I have heard that. I have attended many Sabbath services with my wife and the SDA absolutely believe in the Holy Trinity, the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit - three separate unique entities comprising one God.
Actually:

JEHOVAH Elohiym is the eternal family/relationship. JEHOVAH is the singular eternal family name, while Elohiym (Gods, trio) are the individual Persons/Beings that exist in that eternal family/relationship, Matt. 28:19; 1 Jhn. 5:7,8.

1. JEHOVAH, "the LORD" (Gen. 19:24b.; Zec. 3:2b.), "the Ancient of days" (Dan. 7:9,13,22) is "the only true God" (Jhn. 17:3; τὸν μόνον ἀληθινὸν θεὸν), "God" (Jhn. 1:1b.; τὸν θεόν), "thy God" (Heb. 1:9; ὁ θεός σου), "God the Father" (2 Jhn. 1:3; θεοῦ πατρός) the "person" (Job 13:8; Heb. 1:3) identified in the beginning as the "God said" (Gen. 1:6), for it was by Him that Revelation says, "Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created." (Rev. 4:11).

2. Jesus JEHOVAH (Gen.49:18; Exo. 14:13; 2 Chr. 20:17; Jon. 2:9; Psa. 119:174 HOT) or JEHOVAH Immanuel (see Psa. 46:7,11 HOT)), "the LORD" (Gen. 19:24a.; Zec. 3:2a.), "the son of man" (Dan. 7:13), "the only begotten" (Jhn. 1:14,18, 3:16,18; Heb. 11:17; 1 Jhn. 4:9, is basically monogene (μονογενῆ; Jhn. 3:16; Heb. 11:17; 1 Jhn. 4:9) or monogenes (μονογενὴς; Jhn. 1:18) or monogenous (μονογενοῦς; Jhn. 1:14, 3:18)), "the Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father" (2 Jhn. 1:3; Κυρίου Ἰησοῦ Χριστοῦ τοῦ υἱοῦ τοῦ πατρός) is not "the only true God" (Jhn. 17:3), but is "the express image of his person" (Heb. 1:3; χαρακτὴρ τῆς ὑποστάσεως αὐτοῦ), being "the Word was God" (Jhn. 1:1c.; θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος), who is "O God" (Heb. 1:9; ὁ θεός), the "just person" (Matt. 27:24, "person", 2 Cor. 2:10) indentified in the beginning as "God made" (Gen. 1:7) on behalf of the Father's direction (Pro. 8:22-36; Exo. 20:12), for it was by him (the Son) that John says, "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made." (Jhn. 1:3), that Ephesians says, "And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:" (Eph. 3:9), that Colossians says, "For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:" (Col. 1:16), that Hebrews says, "Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;" (Heb. 1:2), the very, "I AM THAT I AM" (Exo. 3:14), the great "I am" (Jhn. 8:58; ἐγὼ εἰμί), the very "fellow" (Zec. 13:7) of the Father's person, and who comes in the name of His Father (Jhn. 5:43).

3. The Holy Spirit of JEHOVAH (Luk. 4:18), "his Spirit" (Isa. 48:16), "the LORD" (Zec. 3:2c.), the "another Comforter" (Jhn. 14:6), even "he", "the spirit of truth" (Jhn. 14:17, 15:26, 16:13), "God" (Acts 5:4), identified in the beginning as "the Spirit of God moved" (Gen. 1:2) and "God saw" (Gen. 1 throughout, the eternal Witness who inspired the scriptures; 2 Tim. 3:16-17; 2 Pet. 1:21), by which/whom everything is "created" (Psa. 104:30) and "made" (Job 33:4), whose nature is a mystery left unspoken of in scripture, but is the person who does "not speak of himself" (Jhn. 16:13), but comes in the name of the Son (Jhn. 14:26).

The eternal Heavenly Trio - family JEHOVAH Elohiym, over all creation as "Godhead".

If I were to try to present this idea in a limited humanistic fashion, it might go something like this:

Father Jones

Son Jones Jr.

Cousin Jones.

The trio "Jones", or "Jones" family.

Three Persons/Beings working together as united family without dischord, but rather thinking and acting as harmonious chord.

Owning "Jones" Construction, they are all "Boss" (like "God") over their employees.

In fact the Father "Jones" can be "with" Son "Jones" Jr at a construction site, and an employee come up to them two, and say "Boss", and both would respond together, because "Boss" (Son) was with the "Boss" (Father) at that moment, thus in John 1:1 "God" was "with" "God".

Even in maths, this works, because of something called "set theory".

Father, Son and Holy Spirit (Set Deity)

Angels, mankind & lesser creatures (Set creation)

Set Deity is Head over Set creation. Yet Set Deity is not a single Person/Being, but a group, as all individuals together which are creation is not a single person/being but a group.

Yet, in (Set Deity) as (Head) are three Persons/Beings which individually or together are "Head" over creation.

Yet in (Set Deity) there is also heirarchy (Gen. 41:40).

Set Father

Set Son

Set Holy Spirit.

Now for "only true God" and "only begotten":

Mono

Gene

Mono is simply "one", "only".

Mono is used in conjunction or connection, gene.

Gene refers to race or nature (that which makes up the content of essence), that which comes about or exists through/from another.

It's used this way even coming down to our English:

"gene (n.) 1911, from German Gen, coined 1905 by Danish scientist Wilhelm Ludvig Johannsen (1857-1927), from Greek genea "generation, race" (from PIE root *gene- "give birth, beget"). De Vries had earlier called them pangenes. Gene pool is attested from 1946." - https://www.etymonline.com/word/Gene

That is why the Father is called:

monon alethinon theon, ton theon

And because the Son is in the express image of the Father, is called:

monogene, logos en o theos

The Father's nature is His own, underived ("true"*), but the Son, because He is the Son has that same nature because of the Father.

True - https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/true

Authentic - https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/authentic

Original - https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/original

It means underived.

So monogene in connection with monon alethinon theon means that the nature of the Son is of the Father and he is the only Son of the Father with that nature of the Father.

Created Angels and humans are sons, but not of that same nature as the Father and Son are.

In other words:

The Father is "The only true (underived in nature) God"

The Son is "The only begotten (derives His nature from the Father because He is the Son) God"

Remember, "only begotten" has nothing to do with time, or creation, or coming into existence in these contexts, but and only deals with the existing nature of the Son in relation to the Father.

I know what people think when I say that, but they need to understand the definition of what is said by saying it.

Another thing that needs to be discussed that shows the error of the Catholic "trinity" is the following:

The Father is not a perfume, not an aethereal essence pervading the universe. That is pantheism, or panentheism, both of which are gross heresies and destroys the Gospel itself and would even place God in the sinner, including satan himself, which is a violation of Revelation 3:20, etc. God is omnipresent through omniscience (Psalms 139).

Mat_6:9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.

Mat_16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

Luk_11:2 And he said unto them, When ye pray, say, Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, as in heaven, so in earth.

He, the Father, is a "Person", even His person (Job 13:8; Hebrews 1:3), of which Jesus (the Son) is the "express image" of.

As for the rest, see "His person" (Job 13:8); "form of God" (Philippians 2:6), "shape" (John 5:37), "image" (Genesis 1:26,27; Hebrews 1:3), "likeness" (Genesis 1:26,27), "being" (Acts 17:28), has a very real movable "Throne" on which He sits (Daniel 7:9-10; Revelation 4-5, &c), has "the hair of his head like the pure wool" (Daniel 7:9), "whose garment was white as snow" (Daniel 7:9), has a "right hand" (Revelation 5:1; Acts 7:55-56), able to be looked upon, "to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone" (Revelation 4:2), having His own "nature" (Galatians 4:8).

God has hairs on His head, Daniel 7:9; and has hands, Exodus 33:22; and has feet, Exodus 24:10; and loins [H4975; waist to upper thighs, see 1 Kings 18:46, etc], Ezekiel 1:27; a face, Matthew 18:10; a heart, Genesis 6:6; parts, Exodus 22:32; a form, Philippians 2:6; shape, John 5:37; is a Person, Hebrews 1:3; is a Soul, Jeremiah 5:9; and is a Spirit, thus has a mind, Matthew 12:28.

See also "back parts" (Exodus 33:23), and even a "divine nature" (2 Peter 1:4), see also "under his feet" (Exodus 24:10).

The angels are also called 'spirits' and "persons" ("fellows"; Hebrews 1:9), "young man" (Mark 16:5; Daniel 9:21; &c), and yet have real celestial (Heavenly) "bodies" with unfallen angelic "flesh" (1 Corinthians 15:35-58; Jude 1:7, Genesis 17-19, &c) an unfallen heavenly "nature" (Hebrews 2:16), where as we have bodies terrestrial (dust).

The Son is also a "person" (Hebrews 1:3; 2 Corinthians 2:10; Matthew 27:24; Deuteronomy 27:25; &c).

So is the Holy Ghost (John 14:16; &c)

Mankind are also called 'spirits' (1 Peter 3:19; Hebrews 12:23) and yet are real tangible beings, with bodies (made of dust).

Philippians 2:6; Daniel 3:25; Genesis 18:4, 19:2; Exodus 24:10-11; Psalms 18:9; John 5:37; Exodus 33:23,20,22; Daniel 7:9-10,13; Ezekiel 1:1,8,26-28; Acts 7:55-56; Psalms 24:1-10; John 20:17; 1 Peter 3:22; Matthew 18:10; Revelation 1:13-20, 2:1, 4:1-11, 5:1-14; Hebrews 1:13; Colossians 1:3-6; Numbers 12:8; Isaiah 45:23, 48:3; Revelation 3:16; Psalms 89:34; Psalms 104:33, 146:2; Acts 17:28; Genesis 1:26-27; Colossians 1:15; &c.
 

TheLearner

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my, this seemingly innocent statement brings up some interesting questions!


how long does it take God to 'deal with the devil' ?
is that an hard problem for God?


He will destroy Him with the breath of His mouth - He was slain from the foundation of the world, and lives forever
so before time He has already done it

so, ok, Gabriel needed enough time for Christ to exhale a single molecule - the One who created all things by His breath
how long is that?
can we put some numbers to this?


Christ is infinite Creator God - how quickly can infinity exert zero effort?
 
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He disputed with the devil but then said "The LORD rebuke thee". If Michael was God he need not have said this.
Zechariah 3:1-2 in parallel to Jude 1:9.

Zechariah 3

1 And he shewed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to resist him.

2 And the Lord said unto Satan, The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan; even the Lord that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?

Jud 1:9: "Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee."
 

TheLearner

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This cannot possibly apply to Michael the Archangel. No angel, no archangel, and no man can "pardon your transgressions". And only Christ has the name of YHWH in Him. So the pre-incarnate Christ appeared to men as "the Angel of YHWH (the LORD)" and was worshipped as God. The holy angels would be angry with anyone who substituted them for the living God. And the Angel of the LORD identified Himself as the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob when He met Moses at the burning bush (Exodus 3).
Exodus 23
Easy-to-Read Version
23 “Don’t tell lies against other people. If you are a witness in court, don’t agree to help a bad person tell lies.

2 “Don’t do something just because everyone else is doing it. If you see a group of people doing wrong, don’t join them. You must not let them persuade you to do wrong things—you must do what is right and fair.

3 “In court, don’t treat a person in a special way simply because that person is poor.

4 “If you see a lost bull or donkey, then you must return it to its owner—even if the owner is your enemy.

5 “If you see an animal that cannot walk because it has too much to carry, you must stop and help that animal. You must help that animal even if it belongs to one of your enemies.

6 “In court, don’t let anyone take advantage of a person simply because that person is poor.

7 “Be very careful if you say that someone is guilty of something. Don’t make false charges against a person. Never allow innocent people to be killed as punishment for something they did not do. Whoever kills an innocent person is evil, and I will not treat a guilty person as innocent.

8 “If someone tries to pay you to agree with them when they are wrong, don’t accept that payment. A payment like that can blind judges so that they cannot see the truth. It can make good people tell lies.

9 “You must never do wrong things to a foreigner. Remember, you know what it is like to be a foreigner because at one time you were foreigners in the land of Egypt.

The Special Festivals
10 “Plant seeds, harvest your crops, and work the ground for six years. 11 But the seventh year must be a special time of rest for the land. Don’t plant anything in your fields. If any crops grow there, allow the poor to have it. And allow the wild animals to eat the food that is left. You should do the same with your vineyards and with your fields of olive trees.

12 “Work for six days, but on the seventh day, rest! This will allow your slaves and other workers a time to rest and relax. And your bulls and donkeys will also have a time of rest.

13 “Be sure that you obey all these laws. Don’t worship false gods. You should not even speak their names!

14 “You will have three special festivals each year. You must come to my special place to worship me during these festivals. 15 The first festival is the Festival of Unleavened Bread. This is as I commanded you. During this time you will eat bread that is made without yeast. This will continue for seven days. You will do this during the month of Abib, because this is the time when you came out of Egypt. Everyone must bring a sacrifice to me at that time.

16 “The second festival will be the Festival of Harvest. This festival will be during the early summer when you begin harvesting the first crops that you planted in your fields.

“The third festival will be the Festival of Shelters. This will be in the fall, when you finish gathering the rest of the crops from your fields.

17 “So three times each year all the men will come to the special place to be with the Lord God.

18 “When you kill an animal and offer its blood as a sacrifice, you must not include anything that has yeast in it. And when you burn the fat from my sacrifice, don’t let any of it remain until morning.

19 “When you gather your crops at harvest time, you should bring the first of everything you harvest to the house[a] of the Lord your God.

“You must not eat the meat from a young goat that is boiled in its mother’s milk.”

God Will Help Israel Take Their Land
20 “I am sending an angel before you to protect you along the way and to lead you to the place that I have prepared for you. 21 Obey the angel and follow him. Be careful in his presence, and don’t rebel against him. The angel will not forgive the wrong things you do to him. He has my power in him. 22 If you listen to what he says and do everything I tell you, then I will be an enemy to all of your enemies. I will be against everyone who is against you.

23 “My angel will lead you through the land. He will lead you against many different people—the Amorites, Hittites, Perizzites, Canaanites, Hivites, and Jebusites. But I will defeat all of them.

24 “Don’t worship their gods. Don’t ever bow down to those gods. You must never live the way those people live. You must destroy their idols. And you must break the stones that help them remember their gods.[c] 25 You must serve the Lord your God. If you do this, I will bless you with plenty of bread and water. I will take away all sickness from you. 26 Your women will all be able to have babies. None of their babies will die at birth. And I will allow you to live long lives.

27 “When you fight against your enemies, I will send my great power before you.[d] I will help you defeat all your enemies. The people who are against you will become confused in battle and run away. 28 I will send the hornet[e] in front of you. He will force your enemies to leave. The Hivites, Canaanites, and Hittites will leave your country. 29 But I will not force all of them out of your land quickly. I will not do this in only one year. The land will be empty if I force the people out too fast. Then all the wild animals would increase and control the land. And they would be much trouble for you. 30 So I will force them out of your land very slowly. I will do this as you grow and eventually take the land to be your own.

31 “I will give you all the land from the Red Sea[f] to the Mediterranean Sea,[g] and from the desert of Sinai to the Euphrates River. I will let you defeat the people living there and force them all to leave.

32 “You must not make any agreements with any of those people or their gods. 33 Don’t let them stay in your country. If you let them stay, they will be like a trap to you—they will cause you to sin against me. And you will begin worshiping their gods.”
 

TheLearner

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Zechariah 3
Easy-to-Read Version
The High Priest
3 The angel showed me Joshua the high priest, standing in front of the angel of the Lord and Satan was standing by Joshua’s right side. Satan was there to accuse Joshua of doing wrong. 2 Then the angel of the Lord said, “The Lord says that you are wrong, and he will continue to correct you! The Lord has chosen Jerusalem to be his special city. He saved that city—it was like a burning stick pulled from the fire.”

3 Joshua was wearing a dirty robe as he stood in front of the angel. 4 Then the angel said to the other angels standing near him, “Take those dirty clothes off Joshua.” Then the angel spoke to Joshua. He said, “Now, I have taken away your guilt, and I am giving you a new change of clothes.”

Zechariah 3:2

New Living Translation
And the LORD said to Satan, “I, the LORD, reject your accusations, Satan. Yes, the LORD, who has chosen Jerusalem, rebukes you. This man is like a burning stick that has been snatched from the fire.”

Contemporary English Version
But the LORD said, "Satan, you are wrong. Jerusalem is my chosen city, and this man was rescued like a stick from a flaming fire."

GOD'S WORD® Translation
The LORD said to Satan, "I, the LORD, silence you, Satan! I, the LORD, who has chosen Jerusalem, silence you! Isn't this man like a burning log snatched from a fire?"

Zechariah 3:1-2 in parallel to Jude 1:9.

Zechariah 3

1 And he shewed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to resist him.

2 And the Lord said unto Satan, The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan; even the Lord that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?

Jud 1:9: "Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee."
 

GRACE_ambassador

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op: Michael is Jesus?
Did anybody post ALL the verses about "Michael" and ask questions?:

Dan_10:13 "But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood​
me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes,​
came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia...​
Dan_10:21 ...But I will shew thee that which is noted in the​
Scripture of Truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in​
these things, but Michael your prince."​
1) The LORD JESUS CHRIST is not Michael, "one of the princes,"
But IS "THE Prince Of Peace!" (Isaiah 9:6)

Dan_12:1 "And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great​
prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there​
shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a​
nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall​
be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book."​
2) Is this the single ONE "connection" that Speculates that Michael is Jesus?

Jud_1:9 "Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the​
devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring​
against him a railing accusation, but said, The LORD rebuke thee."​

3) Where, In Scripture, Has THE LORD JESUS CHRIST, Ever "Disputed with
anyone about anything," considering He Has ALL Authority/Power Over Everything (Matthew 28:18)?

4) Michael, IF he "was God" would have said: "'I' rebuke thee," Correct?

Rev_12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels​
fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,​

5) In 500 Verses there is not one mention of "Michael" as JESUS, Or God!"
"Complete" Case JESUS CHRIST Is Almighty God!

GRACE And Peace...