I believe the phrase "the Day of the Lord" is not merely a singular 24-hr day, and I believe that it always and ever takes place "on the earth" (in contrast to "the Day of our Lord Jesus Christ" [and similar phrasing], which pertains to "the Church which is His body" [and our Rapture, "IN THE AIR" (for other specific purposes)]), and that it [the DOTL] is the equivalent of Hosea 5:15-6:3's "['after two days'] IN THE THIRD DAY" (meaning, the third Day since He did the verse 15 thing of "I will go and return to my place UNTIL..."; So, aka "the 7th Day," aka the "sabbatismos [of Heb4:9]"/the Day of Rest [i.e. the 7th Millennium], aka the Last Day, aka the promised and prophesied EARTHLY Millennial Kingdom, promised to Israel [not to "the Church which is His body"]).
Did Enoch Not Die?
- Thread starter Nebuchadnezzer
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We are told everything in the word that we need to know or are capable of knowing. That leaves many things we can only wonder about.
I think there is a possibility that Christ was manifested in others before His appearance in Bethlehem.
In the OT death is never spoken of as going to heaven, but as being with the Fathers or as sleep. It isn't until Matt 27:51 that they are spoken of as living in heaven after death when the curtain was split after the crucifixion. It makes the way Enoch and Elijah were taken more of a mystery.
I think there is a possibility that Christ was manifested in others before His appearance in Bethlehem.
In the OT death is never spoken of as going to heaven, but as being with the Fathers or as sleep. It isn't until Matt 27:51 that they are spoken of as living in heaven after death when the curtain was split after the crucifixion. It makes the way Enoch and Elijah were taken more of a mystery.
John 3:13 is frequently misused. It is a reference to the UNIQUE descent and ascent of Christ (the Son of Man), who is omnipresent (which is in Heaven). It has no bearing on Enoch and Elijah going to Heaven without dying.
In Hebrews 11:5 we are EXPLICITLY TOLD "that he should not see death" or experience death, so Enoch was automatically excluded from those who died.
In Hebrews 11:5 we are EXPLICITLY TOLD "that he should not see death" or experience death, so Enoch was automatically excluded from those who died.
Right. And the same goes for (the following):
--the "we which are alive and remain unto..." (of which the 2Cor5:3-4 specifically speaks ["that mortality might be swallowed up of LIFE" (the ONE aspect of 1Cor15:51-54)])
--also, the second part of Jesus' words in John 11:25-26, where in verse 26 He says, "AND whosoever LIVETH and believeth in Me SHALL NEVER DIE. Believest thou this?" (which I believe pertains equally [or perhaps especially] to those still-living persons (having come to faith, of course) at the end of the tribulation period, who will ENTER the MK time period in mortal bodies [capable of bearing children/reproducing] yet who WILL NEVER DIE *because* HE HIMSELF will be present and ruling there! "THE Resurrection AND THE LIFE," HIMSELF!)
--the "we which are alive and remain unto..." (of which the 2Cor5:3-4 specifically speaks ["that mortality might be swallowed up of LIFE" (the ONE aspect of 1Cor15:51-54)])
--also, the second part of Jesus' words in John 11:25-26, where in verse 26 He says, "AND whosoever LIVETH and believeth in Me SHALL NEVER DIE. Believest thou this?" (which I believe pertains equally [or perhaps especially] to those still-living persons (having come to faith, of course) at the end of the tribulation period, who will ENTER the MK time period in mortal bodies [capable of bearing children/reproducing] yet who WILL NEVER DIE *because* HE HIMSELF will be present and ruling there! "THE Resurrection AND THE LIFE," HIMSELF!)
I don't know what Blik is thinking, but Israel did experience what many Hebrew experts call the Memra or Imrah. Imrah is in the Hebrew translation of the words," and the Word of the Lord". Not all places, some.
The Memra is believed to be the Son taking on human form. Is why it's in that phrase.
Is interesting to search out.
The Memra is believed to be the Son taking on human form. Is why it's in that phrase.
Is interesting to search out.
I agree that Enoch is a "type" of the "Rapture" (which pertains SOLELY to "the Church which is His body" ["ONE BODY"]) BEFORE "judgment" (the flood judgment) came on the earth (i.e. BEFORE Jesus will "STAND to JUDGE" Isa3:13, Lam2:3-4 [which resembles the wording in 2Th2:7b-8a], Rev5:6); whereas Noah is a "type" of those [plurals] who will go THROUGH the tribulation period [judgment], AFTER the Church is "caught up," but safely through to the end (per Lk21:36 and other passages) to STAND [in a judicial sense] before the Son of man (His Second Coming to the earth, to judge and to reign [the earthly MK, "throne of His glory"]), and will enter the MK time period in mortal bodies capable of bearing children/reproducing...
(in view of that ^ , compare Gen9:1 with Daniel 2:35 "fill/filled the [whole] earth," Matt24:37-41 [also Lk17:26-37(18:8)] where in the Olivet Discourse Jesus is answering the disciples' Q regarding "the end [singular] of the age [singular]" which He had ALREADY spoken to them about in Matthew 13:24,30,39,40,49-50 (when the angels will "REAP" [WHEAT harvest (I believe Scripture shows that the 144,000 will be the "firstfruit" of THAT harvest)]);
So the SUBJECT in the OD is not our Rapture, Jesus had not yet spoken anything regarding Rapture at the time He gave His Olivet Discourse (which is covering the subject of the promised and prophesied EARTHLY Millennial Kingdom and the very specific, limited time period LEADING UP TO that, which MK will commence upon His "RETURN" to the earth); The "Church which is His body" will not be "on the earth" when He "RETURNS" but will be returning "WITH" Him, at that point (the distinction btw Rev19:7 [the "Bride/Wife [SINGULAR]" and the "MARRIAGE" itself, aorist, in Heaven] and 19:9 [the "INVITED guests [PLURAL]" having been invited to the earthly MK all DURING the trib-yrs on the earth and still located there upon His "RETURN" there [Lk12:36-37,38,40 "when he will RETURN FROM the wedding..." THEN the meal! (the earthly MK)])
The SEQUENCE revealed both in 2Th2 (3x) and 1Th4-5 agrees with this.
(in view of that ^ , compare Gen9:1 with Daniel 2:35 "fill/filled the [whole] earth," Matt24:37-41 [also Lk17:26-37(18:8)] where in the Olivet Discourse Jesus is answering the disciples' Q regarding "the end [singular] of the age [singular]" which He had ALREADY spoken to them about in Matthew 13:24,30,39,40,49-50 (when the angels will "REAP" [WHEAT harvest (I believe Scripture shows that the 144,000 will be the "firstfruit" of THAT harvest)]);
So the SUBJECT in the OD is not our Rapture, Jesus had not yet spoken anything regarding Rapture at the time He gave His Olivet Discourse (which is covering the subject of the promised and prophesied EARTHLY Millennial Kingdom and the very specific, limited time period LEADING UP TO that, which MK will commence upon His "RETURN" to the earth); The "Church which is His body" will not be "on the earth" when He "RETURNS" but will be returning "WITH" Him, at that point (the distinction btw Rev19:7 [the "Bride/Wife [SINGULAR]" and the "MARRIAGE" itself, aorist, in Heaven] and 19:9 [the "INVITED guests [PLURAL]" having been invited to the earthly MK all DURING the trib-yrs on the earth and still located there upon His "RETURN" there [Lk12:36-37,38,40 "when he will RETURN FROM the wedding..." THEN the meal! (the earthly MK)])
The SEQUENCE revealed both in 2Th2 (3x) and 1Th4-5 agrees with this.
1Thess 4:16 says, "the dead in christ will rise first".
My Question:
Is this a once and only once event?
does this happen periodically like a seasonal harvest?
Or is this what happens each and every time a person in Christ dies?
And does Thess 4:16 refer to the resurrection of the soul, or to the resurrection of the body?
My Question:
Is this a once and only once event?
does this happen periodically like a seasonal harvest?
Or is this what happens each and every time a person in Christ dies?
And does Thess 4:16 refer to the resurrection of the soul, or to the resurrection of the body?
It seems logically that it is an ongoing event as God is not bound by time...and comparable to a harvest....for example, Christ and the wave offering of the firstfruits began with the resurrection of Christ and ends with the over all harvest described in the parable of the wheat and tares and general resurrection/change of the saved described in Matthew 24, Luke 21, Mark 13, 1st Corinthians 15, 1st Thessalonians 4, 5 etc....
Like a field of wheat or a garden or a field of corn etc....there are always a few plants that produce FIRST with the over all field ripening in the end.....
Christ and the firstfruits FIRST
growing season 2000 years
General REAPING of the whole field in the end
Like a field of wheat or a garden or a field of corn etc....there are always a few plants that produce FIRST with the over all field ripening in the end.....
Christ and the firstfruits FIRST
growing season 2000 years
General REAPING of the whole field in the end
"the dead IN CHRIST" is that part of "the Church which is His body" who [will have] DIED at some point before the Rapture takes place.
So, yes. When it says "the dead in Christ shall rise first," it is talking about a certain point in time when ALL of "the dead in Christ shall rise first" and then "we [the STILL-LIVING part of "the Church which is His body"] which are alive and remain shall be caught up TOGETHER WITH THEM in the clouds, to the meeting the Lord IN THE AIR..." ["together with them" means at one moment]
--"the dead IN CHRIST" corresponds with 1Cor15:53a's "THIS CORRUPTION must put on incorruption"
--"we which are alive and remain" corresponds with 1Cor15:53b's "THIS MORTAL must put on immortality" which portion is ALSO covered in 2Cor5:3-4;
[In THAT context (2Cor5:3-4), the "unclothed" means a person/believer who has DIED (they are "apart from a body" for a time, upon death), and "clothed upon" refers to a LIVING/STILL-ALIVE person/believer still-alive at the time of our Rapture, getting our "changed/glorified" bodies APART from having to DIE first. (Paul is saying this is what we are EAGER [earnestly desiring] for, but he is also WILLING to die first ['absent from the body'] if the Lord so wills, because either way we are "present with the Lord")]
Regarding "the Church which is His body" (of whom the Rapture SOLELY pertains), this is a ONE TIME EVENT (at a particular point in time). Once only.
No, that is the "unclothed" part of the CONTEXT of 2Cor5:3-4 (when a believer/member of the ONE BODY "dies" and is apart from a body for a time [until our Rapture, of course]).
Body.
Paul's 2 epistles to the Thessalonians is covering the subject of an "eschatological salvation" (pertaining to "the Church which is His body" / those "IN CHRIST"); not to all other saints of all OTHER time periods.
Hope this helps.
So, yes. When it says "the dead in Christ shall rise first," it is talking about a certain point in time when ALL of "the dead in Christ shall rise first" and then "we [the STILL-LIVING part of "the Church which is His body"] which are alive and remain shall be caught up TOGETHER WITH THEM in the clouds, to the meeting the Lord IN THE AIR..." ["together with them" means at one moment]
--"the dead IN CHRIST" corresponds with 1Cor15:53a's "THIS CORRUPTION must put on incorruption"
--"we which are alive and remain" corresponds with 1Cor15:53b's "THIS MORTAL must put on immortality" which portion is ALSO covered in 2Cor5:3-4;
[In THAT context (2Cor5:3-4), the "unclothed" means a person/believer who has DIED (they are "apart from a body" for a time, upon death), and "clothed upon" refers to a LIVING/STILL-ALIVE person/believer still-alive at the time of our Rapture, getting our "changed/glorified" bodies APART from having to DIE first. (Paul is saying this is what we are EAGER [earnestly desiring] for, but he is also WILLING to die first ['absent from the body'] if the Lord so wills, because either way we are "present with the Lord")]
Regarding "the Church which is His body" (of whom the Rapture SOLELY pertains), this is a ONE TIME EVENT (at a particular point in time). Once only.
No, that is the "unclothed" part of the CONTEXT of 2Cor5:3-4 (when a believer/member of the ONE BODY "dies" and is apart from a body for a time [until our Rapture, of course]).
Body.
Paul's 2 epistles to the Thessalonians is covering the subject of an "eschatological salvation" (pertaining to "the Church which is His body" / those "IN CHRIST"); not to all other saints of all OTHER time periods.
Hope this helps.
Oh, but they did die. Maybe not experiencing it physically, but they are gone (see the next post). God does not, and will not, reuse humans for a specific purpose. He will raise up new ones prepared just for that work. Like John the Baptist was in the spirit and power of Elijah and not the actual resurrection of that prophet (see Luke 1:17).
Where are Enoch and Elijah?
Enoch was translated that he should not see death. Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven. Yet the Bible reveals they are not in heaven today. Enoch was "translated." Where did he go? Was he immediately taken to heaven? Jesus Himself said: "No man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man" (John 3:13). Here are Jesus’ own words that no man, except Himself, had ascended into heaven! And how did He know? Why, He came from there! Then where is Enoch? Let’s see what the Bible says.
At the age of 65 Enoch had a son named Methuselah. "And Enoch walked with God after he begat Methuselah three hundred years, and he begat sons and daughters" (Genesis 5:22). Enoch had to have faith, for in Hebrews 11:6 the Apostle said, "But without faith it is impossible to please Him: for he that cometh to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him." Enoch walked with God. He obeyed God and followed Him in faith. No one can walk with God unless he is in agreement with the will of God and doing it. Amos the prophet said: "Can two walk together, except they be agreed?" (Amos 3:3.) So, in his generation Enoch was the only recorded person who followed the ways of God—even though it possibly took him sixty-five years to learn to walk with God!
But how long did Enoch walk with God? The Scripture says that he walked with God after he begat Methuselah three hundred years. So, Enoch followed God’s ways for three hundred years. Notice that Moses did not record that Enoch is still walking with God. The Scripture says that Enoch walked with God for three hundred years and not one year more! Then Enoch is not still walking with God! Why? Because "all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty-five years" (Gen. 5:23). All the days of Enoch were three hundred and sixty-five years. Not just part of his days, but all his days. As he lived only for this length of time then he must have died. But what about his translation? Does that mean he didn’t die?
Enoch’s Translation
Remember, Moses didn’t write that Enoch did not die. Rather Moses wrote that "Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him" (Gen. 5:24). Paul records the same event by saying that he "was not found, because God had translated him" (Heb. 11:5). The Scripture records that Enoch was not found because God took him, or "translated" him. The Bible does not say that Enoch went to heaven. when he was translated. Instead it says he was not found. Certainly Enoch was "translated," but what does the word "translate" mean? Strange as it may seem, nowhere in all the Bible does "translate" mean to make immortal. The original Greek word for "translate" is [metatithemi]. According to Strong’s Concordance it signifies: transfer, transport, exchange, change sides. The same Greek word is rendered "carried over" in Acts 7:16. Here we read that after Jacob died his body was "carried over" transported, translated to Sychem where he was buried. That’s what your Bible says. Jacob was transported or translated to the place of burial.In Deuteronomy 34:6 we read also how God took Moses from the people after which he died and was buried by God. "But no man knoweth his sepulcher unto this day." God removed Moses—God translated him—and he was not found either. So, Enoch was not made immortal after all. He was taken away and was not found. All his days were three hundred and sixty-five. That’s as long as Enoch lived.
Didn’t Receive the Promise
Enoch is included by Paul (in Hebrews 11) among the fathers who obtained a good report through faith; but "all these, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise" (Heb. 11:39). What promise? The "hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began (Titus 1:2). Enoch therefore is one of "all these" who have not yet obtained the promise of eternal life and inheritance. Enoch and all the patriarchs of old will receive the promise of eternal life at the return of Christ, the same time Christians obtain it (Heb. 11:40). That is yet future.
What about Paul’s saying that Enoch "should not see death"? Which Death Did Enoch Escape?
Enoch lived only three hundred sixty-five years. Then what could Paul possibly have meant by saying: "By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found because God had translated him?" This verse nowhere says that Enoch did not die. Rather, it says that Enoch "should not see death." But what does it mean? Remember, there is more than one death mentioned in the Bible. There is a first death, and there is a second death (Rev. 20:6). Which death did Paul mean? The first death is appointed unto men (Heb. 9:27). That death cannot be humanly evaded. It is inevitable. That death Enoch died, as we have already proved. But Paul was not writing about that death. The phrase "should not see" is in the conditional tense of the verb, having reference to a future event. It is not in the past tense, that he "did not see" death—but that he "should not see death." So, this death that Enoch escaped by being translated is one that he can escape in the future on certain conditions. Did Jesus ever speak of a death that might be escaped? He certainly did! In John 8:51: Jesus said, "Verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man keep my sayings, he shall never see death." He shall never see the second death. And again, in John 11:26, "Whoso liveth and believeth in me shall never die"—or shall not die forever.
This death is one that can be escaped on condition that men keep the sayings of Jesus and believe Him. This death is not the first death, because Christians who keep Jesus’ sayings die this first death. Then the death which Enoch should escape must be the second death which will never touch those that are in the first resurrection (Rev. 20:6). And Enoch will be in the first resurrection because he met the conditions. Enoch had faith. He believed God and walked with God, obeying Him. In keeping the sayings of God, Enoch kept the sayings of Jesus too; because Jesus did not speak of Himself, but spoke what the Father commanded Him (John 14:10). Enoch met the conditions so that he should not see death. The second death shall never touch Enoch, because of his faith and obedience. Now we can understand Hebrews 11:5: "By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him; for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God."
This translation—removal, transference—was on condition of faith. Now what translation mentioned in the Bible is on condition of faith? Why, the one we read about in Colossians 1:13. The Father "hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of His dear Son." This is a figurative translation—a figurative removal or transference from the spiritual darkness of this world to the light of the family or kingdom of God and Christ. In verse 10 Paul shows that to abide in this kingdom we must "walk worthy of the Lord unto all pleasing." This is exactly what Enoch did. He walked with God, and pleased God. Then Enoch, the same as Christians, was delivered from the power of sin and darkness in which he had been living for sixty-five years. He was removed (translated) from the ways of the world and lived three hundred years according to God’s ways so that he might inherit eternal life at Christ’s return, and should not suffer the second death. By faith Enoch was separated—removed or translated—from the world, the same as Christians who are not to be a part of the world, although living in the world.
Where are Enoch and Elijah? [continued]
There are three heavens mentioned in the Bible, not just one. And if, as Jesus said, no man, which included Elijah, had ever ascended to the heaven where He came from, then the heaven into which Elijah was taken was a different heaven. Which one was it? The third heaven is the heaven of God’s throne, where Jesus is today. Jesus, being the High Priest of God, is the only one who has the right to be in that heaven with the Father. Notice why! Hebrews 8:1-5 explains that the original earthly tabernacle under the Old Covenant, with its most holy place, or compartment, was the type of the throne of God in heaven. Only the high priest—type of Christ as High Priest now—was allowed to enter!
The second heaven represents the expanse of this great universe—the space where we find the sun, moon, stars, comets and planets. How often do we find the Psalmist admiring the "heavens, the work of Thy fingers, the moon, and the stars, which Thou has ordained" (Psalm 8:3; Genesis 1:15-17). Beside the heaven of the stars, we find that the atmosphere, the air that surrounds this world, is also called heaven. Birds fly in the midst of heaven—certainly not God’s throne in heaven—for we read in Genesis 1:20 of "fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven." In blessing Jacob, Isaac said; "God give thee of the dew of heaven:’ and Moses joyed that the "heavens shall drop down dew" (see Gen. 27:28 and Deut. 33:28). This first heaven, from which dew comes, means the atmosphere, where the clouds and the wind roam. Every one of us is right now breathing the air of heaven.
Since Elijah could not have gone to the heaven of God’s throne, then to which heaven did he go Scripture reads: "and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven" (II Kings 2:1, 11). The answer ought already be quite obvious! Elijah "went up by a whirlwind into heaven"—not to the heaven of God’s throne, but into this earth’s atmosphere, the first heaven. There could be no whirlwind in any other place but in the atmosphere surrounding this earth—in the first heaven, in which the birds fly. You certainly have seen the great lifting power of a whirlwind, haven’t you?
So, Elijah was not to be made immortal—for that would give him pre-eminence above Jesus. But what does the Bible reveal as the reason for his removal? II Kings 2:3 and 5 has the answer. Notice now what the sons of the prophets said to Elisha: "Knowest thou that the Lord will take away thy master from thy head today?" Or as the Smith and Goodspeed translation has it, "Do you know that today the Lord is about to take away your master from being your leader?" Christ is the head of the Church today as Elijah was the head or leader of the sons or disciples of the prophets in that day. God had sent Elijah as His prophet to wicked king Ahab and to his son Ahaziah. Now God wanted Elisha to direct His work, as Ahaziah the king had died (II Kings 1-18) and a new king was ruling. So, what did God do?
He could not allow Elijah to be among the people with Elisha directing the work now. That would have been the same as disqualifying him! God never takes an office from a man when that man has been performing his duty well, the only thing God could do would have been to remove Elijah so that another would fulfill the office. This God did do. When he was taken up, Elijah’s mantle dropped from him and Elisha picked it up. See II Kings 2:12-15. And what did the "mantle" mean? In Clarke’s Commentary we note that a mantle was worn by prophets and priests as the simple insignia of their office." (Vol. 2, page 484.) The purpose of God in removing Elijah was to replace him with another man who would occupy Elijah’s office in Israel for another fifty years. This work had to start under a new king, for Ahaziah had just died. And Elijah was already aging. So as not to disqualify Elijah in the sight of the people, God took him away from the sons of the prophets and the people, allowing the mantle which signified the office of Elijah to drop into the hands of Elisha. Thus, God preserved the name and office of His prophet.
This has been the perplexing problem to so many. He did not ascend to the throne of God. Jesus said so! Yet he couldn’t remain in the air forever. And God did not say that Elijah was to die at that time. If he were, Elisha could have assumed his new office without the removal of Elijah, for we know that Elisha died in office after fulfilling his duty (II Kings 13:14). The sons of the prophets who knew that their master was to be removed also that Elijah was not to die then. That is why they were fearful that the Spirit of God might have allowed him to drop "upon some mountain, or into some valley" (II Kings 2:16). Elisha knew that God would preserve Elijah from falling, but at their insistence he permitted men to go in search for him—to no avail. Elijah was gone!
Did Elijah Go to Heaven?
You have been told that Elijah went to heaven. Yet over 900 years after Elijah was taken up by a whirlwind Jesus Himself said. "No man ascended up to heaven, but He that came down from heaven, even the Son of man" (John 3:13). Is this a Bible contradiction? Did Elijah really ascend to the heaven where God’s throne is—even though Jesus said he didn’t? If Elijah is not in heaven today, then where did Elijah go?
There are three heavens mentioned in the Bible, not just one. And if, as Jesus said, no man, which included Elijah, had ever ascended to the heaven where He came from, then the heaven into which Elijah was taken was a different heaven. Which one was it? The third heaven is the heaven of God’s throne, where Jesus is today. Jesus, being the High Priest of God, is the only one who has the right to be in that heaven with the Father. Notice why! Hebrews 8:1-5 explains that the original earthly tabernacle under the Old Covenant, with its most holy place, or compartment, was the type of the throne of God in heaven. Only the high priest—type of Christ as High Priest now—was allowed to enter!
The second heaven represents the expanse of this great universe—the space where we find the sun, moon, stars, comets and planets. How often do we find the Psalmist admiring the "heavens, the work of Thy fingers, the moon, and the stars, which Thou has ordained" (Psalm 8:3; Genesis 1:15-17). Beside the heaven of the stars, we find that the atmosphere, the air that surrounds this world, is also called heaven. Birds fly in the midst of heaven—certainly not God’s throne in heaven—for we read in Genesis 1:20 of "fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven." In blessing Jacob, Isaac said; "God give thee of the dew of heaven:’ and Moses joyed that the "heavens shall drop down dew" (see Gen. 27:28 and Deut. 33:28). This first heaven, from which dew comes, means the atmosphere, where the clouds and the wind roam. Every one of us is right now breathing the air of heaven.
Since Elijah could not have gone to the heaven of God’s throne, then to which heaven did he go Scripture reads: "and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven" (II Kings 2:1, 11). The answer ought already be quite obvious! Elijah "went up by a whirlwind into heaven"—not to the heaven of God’s throne, but into this earth’s atmosphere, the first heaven. There could be no whirlwind in any other place but in the atmosphere surrounding this earth—in the first heaven, in which the birds fly. You certainly have seen the great lifting power of a whirlwind, haven’t you?
Why Taken Up?
What was the reason for this unusual act of God? Why did He take Elijah up into the atmosphere? Was it to make him immortal? No! The Scripture says no word about that. The ancient prophets—including Elijah—did not receive any promise of immortality prior to or apart from us. Notice it in Hebrews 11:13 and 39: "These all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise." And we shall not receive it until Christ returns (Heb. 11:40).
So, Elijah was not to be made immortal—for that would give him pre-eminence above Jesus. But what does the Bible reveal as the reason for his removal? II Kings 2:3 and 5 has the answer. Notice now what the sons of the prophets said to Elisha: "Knowest thou that the Lord will take away thy master from thy head today?" Or as the Smith and Goodspeed translation has it, "Do you know that today the Lord is about to take away your master from being your leader?" Christ is the head of the Church today as Elijah was the head or leader of the sons or disciples of the prophets in that day. God had sent Elijah as His prophet to wicked king Ahab and to his son Ahaziah. Now God wanted Elisha to direct His work, as Ahaziah the king had died (II Kings 1-18) and a new king was ruling. So, what did God do?
He could not allow Elijah to be among the people with Elisha directing the work now. That would have been the same as disqualifying him! God never takes an office from a man when that man has been performing his duty well, the only thing God could do would have been to remove Elijah so that another would fulfill the office. This God did do. When he was taken up, Elijah’s mantle dropped from him and Elisha picked it up. See II Kings 2:12-15. And what did the "mantle" mean? In Clarke’s Commentary we note that a mantle was worn by prophets and priests as the simple insignia of their office." (Vol. 2, page 484.) The purpose of God in removing Elijah was to replace him with another man who would occupy Elijah’s office in Israel for another fifty years. This work had to start under a new king, for Ahaziah had just died. And Elijah was already aging. So as not to disqualify Elijah in the sight of the people, God took him away from the sons of the prophets and the people, allowing the mantle which signified the office of Elijah to drop into the hands of Elisha. Thus, God preserved the name and office of His prophet.
How and Where Did Elijah Go?
Having crossed Jordan near Jericho, Elijah was taken up by a whirlwind in what appeared to be a chariot and horses of fire. The violent motion of the wind pulled the mantle off the prophet as he was seen to ascend into the sky. You probably remember reading the promise of Elijah that Elisha would have a double portion of the Spirit of God if he would be allowed by God to see Elijah taken up (II Kings 2:9). All this meant that Elisha was to be the leader, the new head of the sons of the prophets. Having ascended into the air, Elijah was borne away out of the sight of the new leader—beyond the horizon. And where to? Certainly, the whirlwind used by God could not take him beyond the earth’s atmosphere. Neither does the Bible account leave Elijah in the air!
This has been the perplexing problem to so many. He did not ascend to the throne of God. Jesus said so! Yet he couldn’t remain in the air forever. And God did not say that Elijah was to die at that time. If he were, Elisha could have assumed his new office without the removal of Elijah, for we know that Elisha died in office after fulfilling his duty (II Kings 13:14). The sons of the prophets who knew that their master was to be removed also that Elijah was not to die then. That is why they were fearful that the Spirit of God might have allowed him to drop "upon some mountain, or into some valley" (II Kings 2:16). Elisha knew that God would preserve Elijah from falling, but at their insistence he permitted men to go in search for him—to no avail. Elijah was gone!
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Where are Enoch and Elijah? [continued]
Let us notice the next few years and see what further events the Scripture records. The new king of Israel was another son of Ahab, Jehoram, or Joram as he is sometimes called. The beginning of his reign marked the year of the removal of Elijah (II Kings 1:18 and 3:1). During this king’s reign Elisha was the recognized prophet of God (II Kings 3:11). In the fifth year of Joram king of Israel, the son of the king of Judah began to reign along with his father in Judah (II Kings 8:16). His name also was Jehoram. The first thing he did to establish his kingdom rule was to put his relatives to the sword lest they should claim the throne from him (11 Chronicles 2 1:4). For nearly six years he followed the ways of the nations about him and did evil in God’s sight. Almost ten years had now expired since Elijah was taken from the people. But what do you think was about to happen?
A Letter Comes from Elijah. Yes, after this wicked rule by the Jewish king, God chose Elijah to write a letter and have it sent to the king! The contents of the letter are found in II Chronicles 21:12-15. In part it reads: "Because thou hast not walked in the ways of... thy father... but hast walked in the way of the kings of Israel... and also hast slain thy brethren of thy father’s house, which were better than thyself... thou shalt have great sickness by disease." From the wording of the letter, it is clear that Elijah wrote it after these events had occurred, for he speaks of them as past events, and of the disease as future. Two years after the king became diseased the king died—having reigned only eight short years (II Chronicles 21:18-20). This proves that the letter was written about ten years after Elijah had been taken to another location by the whirlwind. God used Elijah to convey the message because he was the prophet of God in days of the present king’s father—and the son was not going in the ways of his obedient father, Jehoshaphat. The letter he had others deliver was recognized as his—proving that he was known to be alive someplace. Just how much longer he lived, the Bible does not reveal. But in that "it is appointed unto men once to die" (Hebrews 9:27). Elijah must have died somewhat later. All human beings born of Adam, and that includes Elijah, must die—for we read: "In Adam all die" (I Corinthians 15:22). Elijah was a man "subject to like passions as we are" (James 5:17) subject to human nature and death. The prophet, being mortal flesh as we are, could not have lived much beyond his seventy years.
To suppose that God gave him the power of an endless life of nearly three thousand years is to read into the Bible what is not there! He was mortal, subject to death, and after being lifted into the atmospheric heavens, spent the remaining years of his separate life at some little-known location on the earth, living as every human being, before he naturally died.
The only remaining texts that puzzle people are those relative to the appearance of Moses and Elijah on the Mount of Transfiguration with Jesus. The record of the event is found in Matthew 17:1-9; Mark 9:2-10; Luke 9:28-36. Leaving the mountain, Jesus told his disciples: "Tell the vision to no man” (Matt. 17:9). A vision is not a material reality but a supernatural picture observed by the eyes. Moses died, and was buried (Deut. 34:5-6). Both he and Elijah were still dead in their graves, but in vision both they and Jesus were seen in the glory of the resurrection—an event to which Moses and Elijah have not yet attained (Heb. 11:39). The vision was granted the disciples after Jesus had spoken of the glory of immortality in the coming kingdom. How plain the Bible is! Elijah is dead in the dust of the earth awaiting the resurrection of the just. Elijah, some years after being removed in the whirlwind, went to the grave, but will rise again to live forevermore.
The Answer Unfolds
Let us notice the next few years and see what further events the Scripture records. The new king of Israel was another son of Ahab, Jehoram, or Joram as he is sometimes called. The beginning of his reign marked the year of the removal of Elijah (II Kings 1:18 and 3:1). During this king’s reign Elisha was the recognized prophet of God (II Kings 3:11). In the fifth year of Joram king of Israel, the son of the king of Judah began to reign along with his father in Judah (II Kings 8:16). His name also was Jehoram. The first thing he did to establish his kingdom rule was to put his relatives to the sword lest they should claim the throne from him (11 Chronicles 2 1:4). For nearly six years he followed the ways of the nations about him and did evil in God’s sight. Almost ten years had now expired since Elijah was taken from the people. But what do you think was about to happen?
A Letter Comes from Elijah. Yes, after this wicked rule by the Jewish king, God chose Elijah to write a letter and have it sent to the king! The contents of the letter are found in II Chronicles 21:12-15. In part it reads: "Because thou hast not walked in the ways of... thy father... but hast walked in the way of the kings of Israel... and also hast slain thy brethren of thy father’s house, which were better than thyself... thou shalt have great sickness by disease." From the wording of the letter, it is clear that Elijah wrote it after these events had occurred, for he speaks of them as past events, and of the disease as future. Two years after the king became diseased the king died—having reigned only eight short years (II Chronicles 21:18-20). This proves that the letter was written about ten years after Elijah had been taken to another location by the whirlwind. God used Elijah to convey the message because he was the prophet of God in days of the present king’s father—and the son was not going in the ways of his obedient father, Jehoshaphat. The letter he had others deliver was recognized as his—proving that he was known to be alive someplace. Just how much longer he lived, the Bible does not reveal. But in that "it is appointed unto men once to die" (Hebrews 9:27). Elijah must have died somewhat later. All human beings born of Adam, and that includes Elijah, must die—for we read: "In Adam all die" (I Corinthians 15:22). Elijah was a man "subject to like passions as we are" (James 5:17) subject to human nature and death. The prophet, being mortal flesh as we are, could not have lived much beyond his seventy years.
To suppose that God gave him the power of an endless life of nearly three thousand years is to read into the Bible what is not there! He was mortal, subject to death, and after being lifted into the atmospheric heavens, spent the remaining years of his separate life at some little-known location on the earth, living as every human being, before he naturally died.
The only remaining texts that puzzle people are those relative to the appearance of Moses and Elijah on the Mount of Transfiguration with Jesus. The record of the event is found in Matthew 17:1-9; Mark 9:2-10; Luke 9:28-36. Leaving the mountain, Jesus told his disciples: "Tell the vision to no man” (Matt. 17:9). A vision is not a material reality but a supernatural picture observed by the eyes. Moses died, and was buried (Deut. 34:5-6). Both he and Elijah were still dead in their graves, but in vision both they and Jesus were seen in the glory of the resurrection—an event to which Moses and Elijah have not yet attained (Heb. 11:39). The vision was granted the disciples after Jesus had spoken of the glory of immortality in the coming kingdom. How plain the Bible is! Elijah is dead in the dust of the earth awaiting the resurrection of the just. Elijah, some years after being removed in the whirlwind, went to the grave, but will rise again to live forevermore.
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