Diagnosing Mother Teresa

[Webers.Home]

.

what is the point of diagnosing a person ?I don't really understand.

John Q and Jane Doe pew warmer probably won't benefit much from this
thread; nor will Teresa's admirers. However, for Christians seriously
considering becoming missionaries, the Bible study that I'm in process of
conducting will prove invaluable.

But in order to get the most out of this, it's necessary to start right from
the beginning and bring one's self up to speed. When people skip a thread's
OP they typically always end up with the wrong impression; and from thence
make a nuisance of themselves with irrelevant comments and impious
quarrelling.
_

 

[tourist]

hello there Garee .The question is ,can one be catholic and saved?I think there are people who are catholic and saved

My whole family is Catholic with a firm grasp of the salvation message and are indeed saved, myself included. I agree with your estimation and find your perception of salvation regarding those of the Catholic faith to be most refreshing.

 

[tourist]

.



John Q and Jane Doe pew warmer probably won't benefit much from this
thread; nor will Teresa's admirers. However, for Christians seriously
considering becoming missionaries, the Bible study that I'm in process of
conducting will prove invaluable.

But in order to get the most out of this, it's necessary to start right from
the beginning and bring one's self up to speed. When people skip a thread's
OP they typically always end up with the wrong impression; and from thence
make a nuisance of themselves with irrelevant comments and impious
quarrelling.
_

People can serve God just by doing their humble best in the place that God has placed them using the tools and resources that He has provided. There are many ways to serve the Lord besides being a pastor or a missionary. I feel sorry for those that feel that the only way that they can serve God is to lead a church or travel to foreign lands. Regarding being a missionary, you can do this in the area where you currently live ministering to those that God has brought your way.

 

[tourist]

what is the point of diagnosing a person ?I don't really understand .I think she was a good woman ,and had a good heart and loved God .She had her fears and unbelief at times as we all do at certain times which shows we are humans in flesh and we have our issues .No one is perfect .She dedicated her life to a bigger cause which most people don't do
Her parents were albanians so there is one more reason for me to like her .I hope that she is with Jesus now .

She most assuredly is with Jesus right now.

It says in the bible that faith without works is a dead faith. Based on her lifetime of work with the least of the brothers or sisters of the Lord I would have to say that her faith was great. It far exceeds mine, that's for sure.

Her humble service to the Lord with love in her heart was exemplary and worth emulating. She tirelessly accomplished the work that her Heavenly Father had prepared for her beforehand. This was done by God's grace and at a great cost to herself.

She was an outstanding example of what being a Christian is all about.

 

[Webers.Home]

.
Rome didn't recruit Teresa to run an operation in India. No, it was wholly her
own idea; which was based entirely upon some "Interior Imaginative
Locutions" she claims to have received from Christ himself beginning in Sept
of 1946 and ending some time in 1947.

An I.I.L. is neither an apparition nor a vision: it's an imagination, i.e. a
mental fantasy. It's neither visual nor audio. Teresa never actually heard
anything with her own ears nor saw an appearance with her own eyes.

Curiously (or maybe it's far more accurate to say coincidently) when
Teresa's superiors finally caved to her incessant letter-writing campaign and
gave her permission to proceed, the I.I.L.'s stopped and she never heard
from "Jesus" again for virtually the next five decades-- which ultimately
caused her an unbearable amount of inner anguish that finally led the poor
woman to doubt not only the validity of her mission, but also to seriously
doubt the very existence of God.

Well; had I been Teresa's designated spiritual counselor I would've urged
her to never, ever, trust your imaginations are messages from God because
they could very easily be nothing more than an intense daydream, or maybe
something even much worse; for example like schizophrenia.

Anyway, Teresa's locutions didn't pan out. In no time, all I.I.L. contact with
Jesus ceased and she began referring to him as the absent one. Plus she
reported that the place of God in her soul was blank and there was no God in
her.

Well; again, had I been Teresa's designated spiritual counselor I would've
reminded her that the bodies of Christ's followers are God's habitation. He's
supposed to be in every believer; even the lowly ones who don't count for
much in the grand scheme of things.

"Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in
you, whom you have received from God?" (1Cor 6:19)

Now just because Christ's followers cannot sense God's presence in their
body, doesn't indicate He's not there. This is one of the supernatural
elements of Christianity that have to be taken on faith. Had Teresa's
counselors told her so they could've spared that poor woman literally
decades of anguish.

She also reported being instructed that God loved her; and yet the reality of
darkness & coldness & emptiness was so great that nothing touched her
soul. Well; again, as her designated spiritual counselor, I would've pointed to
Jesus' statement, which reads:

"The Father himself loves you, because you have loved me and have come
to believe that I came from God." (John 16:27)

Is Jesus' statement true? Well of course it is. So regardless of whether
Teresa felt anything touching her soul, she should've taken it on faith that
the Father loved her: and let it go at that.

Teresa's labeling Jesus as the absent one was horribly unjustified because he
promised:

"I will not abandon you as orphans; I will come to you." (John 14:18)

"Behold, I am with you always, until the end of the age.” (Matt 28:20)

Now, that brings me back to an earlier reference:

"Examine yourselves to see whether you are living in faith. Test yourselves.
Do you not realize that Jesus Christ is in you? --unless, of course, you fail
the test." (2Cor 13:5)

Teresa let her feelings override her knowledge; i.e. Teresa's feelings became
her faith rather than confidence in what the Bible says in print. That, in a
nutshell, is precisely where the poor woman ran aground and made
shipwreck of her spiritual condition.
_

 

[Webers.Home]

.

It says in the bible that faith without works is a dead faith.

Works without faith are dead works.

● Heb 6:1 . .Therefore, let us leave behind the basic teaching about Christ and
advance to maturity, without laying the foundation all over again:
repentance from dead works and faith in God.

● Heb 11:6 . .Without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone
who comes to Him must believe that He exists.
_

 

[tourist]

.



Works without faith are dead works.

● Heb 6:1 . .Therefore, let us leave behind the basic teaching about Christ and
advance to maturity, without laying the foundation all over again:
repentance from dead works and faith in God.

● Heb 11:6 . .Without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone
who comes to Him must believe that He exists.
_

Finally, we are in agreement on something.

 

[JamOn]

From the book..


This first selection, “I have come to love the darkness”, on the other hand, comes from the last third of the book. In this particular passage, Mother Teresa has not yet rejoiced in the darkness – that will happen a few pages later – but the instructor may want to be able to cite where she does. Most probably written on April, 11 1961 to her spiritual director,

Jesuit Father Joseph Neuner, Mother Teresa says:

“I can’t express in words – the gratitude I owe you for your kindness to me. – For the first time in this 11 years – I have come to love the darkness. – For I believe now that it is a part, a very, very small part of Jesus’ darkness & pain on earth. You have taught me to accept it [as] a “spiritual side of ‘your work’” as you wrote. – Today really I felt a deep joy – that Jesus can’t go anymore through the agony – but that He wants to go through it in me. – More than ever I surrender myself to Him. – Yes – more than ever I will be at His disposal (p. 214).

The impenetrable darkness of the first two thirds of the book does not cease, but Mother Teresa’s torment will now give way to an inner peace, even joy. The abandoned, unwanted, unloved poor reflects not only the sufferings of Jesus, but the very soul of Mother Teresa. She loves the darkness because through her sufferings she is united with the poor and Jesus himself.

 

[JamOn]

If I’m not mistaking her writings was from her early stages of her Christian transformation

 

[oldethennew]

how can corrupt 'preachers/priests' from any denomination,
reform sinners from their perverted ways???

 

[Guojing]

Finally, we are in agreement on something.

My impression is that he is disagreeing with your point

 

[dcontroversal]

She most assuredly is with Jesus right now.

It says in the bible that faith without works is a dead faith. Based on her lifetime of work with the least of the brothers or sisters of the Lord I would have to say that her faith was great. It far exceeds mine, that's for sure.

Her humble service to the Lord with love in her heart was exemplary and worth emulating. She tirelessly accomplished the work that her Heavenly Father had prepared for her beforehand. This was done by God's grace and at a great cost to herself.

She was an outstanding example of what being a Christian is all about.

You know I like you, but NO ONE can say what you said in your first line with 100% assurance......nor the last line because...

a. Good works do not prove salvation
b. Charity does not prove salvation
c. Moral, lost men and women do the same things she has done.

 

[maxwel]

Matthew 25:31 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. 33 And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; 36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? 38 When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? 39 Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40 And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.’

It is sad that after all she did to heal the sick, clothe the naked, feed the hungry, give water to the thirsty, and visit those imprisoned, people feel a need to tear her down by exposing her innermost thoughts in times of despair and weakness.

"It is sad that after all she did to heal the sick..."

It is debatable whether or not she really did all that much.

The way I understand it, she did personally suffer, but I'm not sure her suffering was really aimed at helping anyone.
I've seen old interviews with her where she said, point blank, that it was good for humans to suffer, and she had NO INTENTION of relieving the suffering of the poor lepers, or helping them to get well. She was just providing a bit of food and a quiet place for them to die.

Seriously.

Her actual words and ministry did not match up with all the press about her.

It is entirely possible she just got a lot of good press.

..

 

[maxwel]

My point in the above post was not to disparage all Catholics.

It's just that sometimes a particular person can have a public image which has little to do with reality.
It's best to examine the person through the lens of their own words... through their writings and interviews.

That's a biblical criteria.
Mat 12:34 "... out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks."


..

 

[maxwel]

I may not have time to jump back in here later, so I'll just wrap up all my thoughts and be done.

Mother Theresa - The Issues

1. I think it lacks prudence for ANY of us to defend ANYONE we don't really know that much about.

2. I'm going to recommend that my Catholic friends rethink this, and really slow down... instead of just having a knee jerk reaction.

3. It also lacks grace to tear into everyone in a denomination over one prominent person we feel is fraudulent.
a. I don't agree with many Catholic doctrines either.
b. I think there are some grave issues with their leadership, and with some of their beliefs... I'm no fan of the RCC.
c. However... it's simply ungracious, and even illogical, to smear everyone over the faults of one person.

4. So, I'm going to recommend that my Catholic friends really rethink things here... as a friend, I'm telling you... this whole thing about Mother Theresa, this just isn't a debate you're going to win... so lets all just be friends, calm down, and rethink things.
a. Mother Theresa was simply NOT what the Roman Catholic PR machine was claiming.
b. We can prove and verify this.
c. There is clear empirical evidence... it can all be verified.
d. It's not a debate you can win.
e. She had no desire to heal the lepers, or relieve their suffering; she was quite happy they were miserable and suffering... she says this in her own words. She was NOT trying to get them treatment, or even pain relief... she was doing NOTHING for them. Personally, I don't believe she was "saved".... but that's just my personal opinion.
f. So, to reiterate, there is empirical evidence for all of this... it's not a debate you can win.
g. If you cannot win the debate, then I see no reason to debate... just go look things up for yourself... I'm not mad at anyone.

5. I'm also going to recommend that my protestant friends remain gracious here.
a. We can disagree with the Catholic Church, or it's leadership, and still be kind toward our Catholic friends.
b. Example: Tourist knows full well we disagree on some doctrinal things, and we get along just fine. We're gracious toward each other. And whatever Mother Theresa was, or was not, he and I can still remain friends, and I'll still treat him respectfully.

6. The Real Lesson:
We should ALL be very careful of holding people up too highly, and we should ALL be willing to examine those who are held up.
a. This is a good rule, and it goes for everyone.
b. We are ALL probably victims to PR campaigns regarding one person or another... we live in a world FILLED with deception... deception makes money.
c. So, let's ALL rethink the people we hold up too highly. Let's all be very wary of this.
d. There is only person we can really be confident in lifting up.... Jesus.

..

 

[danja]

I may not have time to jump back in here later, so I'll just wrap up all my thoughts and be done.

Mother Theresa - The Issues

1. I think it lacks prudence for ANY of us to defend ANYONE we don't really know that much about.

2. I'm going to recommend that my Catholic friends rethink this, and really slow down... instead of just having a knee jerk reaction.

3. It also lacks grace to tear into everyone in a denomination over one prominent person we feel is fraudulent.
a. I don't agree with many Catholic doctrines either.
b. I think there are some grave issues with their leadership, and with some of their beliefs... I'm no fan of the RCC.
c. However... it's simply ungracious, and even illogical, to smear everyone over the faults of one person.

4. So, I'm going to recommend that my Catholic friends really rethink things here... as a friend, I'm telling you... this whole thing about Mother Theresa, this just isn't a debate you're going to win... so lets all just be friends, calm down, and rethink things.
a. Mother Theresa was simply NOT what the Roman Catholic PR machine was claiming.
b. We can prove and verify this.
c. There is clear empirical evidence... it can all be verified.
d. It's not a debate you can win.
e. She had no desire to heal the lepers, or relieve their suffering; she was quite happy they were miserable and suffering... she says this in her own words. She was NOT trying to get them treatment, or even pain relief... she was doing NOTHING for them. Personally, I don't believe she was "saved".... but that's just my personal opinion.
f. So, to reiterate, there is empirical evidence for all of this... it's not a debate you can win.
g. If you cannot win the debate, then I see no reason to debate... just go look things up for yourself... I'm not mad at anyone.

5. I'm also going to recommend that my protestant friends remain gracious here.
a. We can disagree with the Catholic Church, or it's leadership, and still be kind toward our Catholic friends.
b. Example: Tourist knows full well we disagree on some doctrinal things, and we get along just fine. We're gracious toward each other. And whatever Mother Theresa was, or was not, he and I can still remain friends, and I'll still treat him respectfully.

6. The Real Lesson:
We should ALL be very careful of holding people up too highly, and we should ALL be willing to examine those who are held up.
a. This is a good rule, and it goes for everyone.
b. We are ALL probably victims to PR campaigns regarding one person or another... we live in a world FILLED with deception... deception makes money.
c. So, let's ALL rethink the people we hold up too highly. Let's all be very wary of this.
d. There is only person we can really be confident in lifting up.... Jesus.

..

I am not catholic ,but I am thinking on your words now .I only heard good things about Mother Theresa in the media ,I don't know the whole truth on her faith .
But I still don't want to go to a place where i examine someone or their heart .
Thanks for your input on this topic brother

 

[Jackson123]

I read from some article about motherteresa

She make a Lot of money for vatican. Only little for her hospital. A Lot of witneses from Australia, usa etc that work volunter to her hospital, what realy happen there.

She not give pain killer to her patient, and say, when you in pain, mean Jesus kiss you. One of the patient yel and Said, ask Jesus stop kiss me.

When she have hearth problem, she went to the luxury hospital in new York, why not stay there and let Jesus kiss her?

Instead of alkohol, she use water to wash syringe, where all the do nation money goes?

Quote

former sister put the annual figures of the organisation’s income at around $50 million in New York alone, but there is little evidence of any expenditures. Locally, services largely rely on donations and the appalling state of care in Mother Teresa’s time makes it clear that very little money makes it back to those they are helping, and new missions set up across the world are expected to become self-sufficient. Her charity received money from known-fraudsters, and when they were convicted in a criminal court, she tried to use her large personal influence to change the outcome of the trial. Sources suggest that the majority of money she received was sent straight to the Vatican bank; an institution few will believe in more dire need of assistance than India’s most vulnerable citizens.

End quote

https://medium.com/@KittyWenham/mother-teresas-sainthood-is-a-fraud-just-like-she-was-eb395177572

 

[JamOn]

People can serve God just by doing their humble best in the place that God has placed them using the tools and resources that He has provided. There are many ways to serve the Lord besides being a pastor or a missionary. I feel sorry for those that feel that the only way that they can serve God is to lead a church or travel to foreign lands. Regarding being a missionary, you can do this in the area where you currently live ministering to those that God has brought your way.

Yes sure can, I like what you said.

I like some of her poems are quite remarkable in my opinion.

 

[JamOn]

I read from some article about motherteresa

She make a Lot of money for vatican. Only little for her hospital. A Lot of witneses from Australia, usa etc that work volunter to her hospital, what realy happen there.

She not give pain killer to her patient, and say, when you in pain, mean Jesus kiss you. One of the patient yel and Said, ask Jesus stop kiss me.

When she have hearth problem, she went to the luxury hospital in new York, why not stay there and let Jesus kiss her?

Instead of alkohol, she use water to wash syringe, where all the do nation money goes?

Quote

former sister put the annual figures of the organisation’s income at around $50 million in New York alone, but there is little evidence of any expenditures. Locally, services largely rely on donations and the appalling state of care in Mother Teresa’s time makes it clear that very little money makes it back to those they are helping, and new missions set up across the world are expected to become self-sufficient. Her charity received money from known-fraudsters, and when they were convicted in a criminal court, she tried to use her large personal influence to change the outcome of the trial. Sources suggest that the majority of money she received was sent straight to the Vatican bank; an institution few will believe in more dire need of assistance than India’s most vulnerable citizens.

End quote

https://medium.com/@KittyWenham/mother-teresas-sainthood-is-a-fraud-just-like-she-was-eb395177572

those YouTube vids don’t present much facts, nothing in the comments on links to want he said.

the money in the catholic stuff is appalling, no building on earth needs gold inlays on the floors.
I doubt she had much control over the money.

 

[Jackson123]

I am not judge, but base of what her own claim of emptiness, I believe, instead of work for the Lord, she work for Vatican.

Only people work for the Lord Jesus have the happiness.