By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#941
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#941
EleventhHour said:
I disagree.

No one looses salvation if that is what you are stating since it is a bit unclear.
The bible never speaks of anyone being spiritually unjustified. .. eternal security is eternal not a temporal status.
Click to expand...
No one in the OT was born again or sealed by the Holy Spirit. Nor will a person during the Tribulation. They will not be saved if they take the Mark of the beast . That's clear.
No one loses salvation in the church age till the rapture .
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#942
#942
throughfaith said:
No one in the OT was born again or sealed by the Holy Spirit. Nor will a person during the Tribulation. They will not be saved if they take the Mark of the beast . That's clear.
Click to expand...
Abraham was justified by faith and stated justified by faith.
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#943
May 23, 2016
4,320
1,449
113
#943
Guojing said:
Yep, I recall a song that is still quite popular among churches, that attempted to use this Psalms and apply it to the church today, despite Paul telling us that we are sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise.

A scary song to sing for this age of grace :)

Click to expand...
A beautiful song giving direct Scripture and applying the Psalm to us today.

It is a beautiful song to sing in this age of grace.
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#944
May 23, 2016
4,320
1,449
113
#944
Guojing said:
1 Peter 4
12 Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened unto you:

13 But rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings; that, when his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with exceeding joy.

14 If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified.

15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters.

16 Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?

18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

Notice Peter even told Israel that the "righteous scarcely be saved"?

Doesn't that sound like trying to earn salvation?
Click to expand...
You asked "Doesn't that sound like trying to earn salvation?"

NO! (and yes, I am yelling! :eek:)
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

Senior Member
#947
Apr 7, 2014
25,574
13,551
113
58
#947
Chester said:
My "view" doesn't really matter in eternity's perspective. But I do know that James says that a faith without works is a dead faith. And I do not suppose that a dead faith will save a person.
Click to expand...
An empty profession of faith that merely “claims” to be genuine, yet produces no works at all (James 2:14) is certainly not going to save anyone. That is not genuine faith, but a “bare profession of faith.”
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#949
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
#949
Chester said:
You asked "Doesn't that sound like trying to earn salvation?"

NO! (and yes, I am yelling! :eek:)
Click to expand...
What do you think peter meant in 1 peter 4 when he stated the righteous scarcely be saved?
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#950
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
#950
Chester said:
A beautiful song giving direct Scripture and applying the Psalm to us today.

It is a beautiful song to sing in this age of grace.
Click to expand...
You believe the Holy Spirit can be taken away from you when you sin?
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#952
May 23, 2016
4,320
1,449
113
#952
Guojing said:
In that case, you also don't believe that faith, apart from works, can save you right?
Click to expand...
LOL! Now you are introducing another preposition you didn't use before (at least where I picked up the connversation).

I do not know what you mean by apart from works, so I cannot answer your question.
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#953
May 23, 2016
4,320
1,449
113
#953
throughfaith said:
No one in the OT was born again or sealed by the Holy Spirit. Nor will a person during the Tribulation. They will not be saved if they take the Mark of the beast . That's clear.
No one loses salvation in the church age till the rapture .
Click to expand...
Do you have a verse that says that people in church age are "once saved always saved"?
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#954
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
#954
Chester said:
LOL! Now you are introducing another preposition you didn't use before (at least where I picked up the connversation).

I do not know what you mean by apart from works, so I cannot answer your question.
Click to expand...
You were the one who tried to distinguish between these 2 in the first place correct?

I regard these 2 as the same, when it comes to salvation.
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#956
May 23, 2016
4,320
1,449
113
#956
Guojing said:
What do you think peter meant in 1 peter 4 when he stated the righteous scarcely be saved?
Click to expand...
It does not say they are scarcely saved because they are earning their salvation. That is your own "conclusion".
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#957
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
#957
Chester said:
It does not say they are scarcely saved because they are earning their salvation. That is your own "conclusion".
Click to expand...
So if one is righteous, according to peter, why is he scarcely saved?

Is he saved or not?
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#958
May 23, 2016
4,320
1,449
113
#958
Guojing said:
You believe the Holy Spirit can be taken away from you when you sin?
Click to expand...
Huh, ???!!!!! What I do know is that David cried out to God and said "take not thy Holy Spirit from me"
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#959
May 23, 2016
4,320
1,449
113
#959
Guojing said:
You were the one who tried to distinguish between these 2 in the first place correct?

I regard these 2 as the same, when it comes to salvation.
Click to expand...
LOL! Here is going back to our original conversation:

You said:
"You should address the other guy, I was asking him a question
And yes I agree with you there
But I am curious though, what do you think is the difference between without works and not of works?

I said:
""Without works" means that there are no works present.
Not of works" means that salvation is not caused by works."

The question was the difference between "without works" and "not of works"! Now you have introduced "apart from works"!
 
Chester

Chester

Senior Member
#960
May 23, 2016
4,320
1,449
113
#960
Guojing said:
So if one is righteous, according to peter, why is he scarcely saved?

Is he saved or not?
Click to expand...
The text says he is saved. That is Peter's words and not mine.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.