Are children born saved?

[ForestGreenCook]

All children are born under condemnation because they are the progeny of fallen Adam & Eve, have inherited Adam's original sin and have a sin nature. (This condemnation is actually a blessing because it means we are canidates for salvation.) But children who die before reaching the age of accountability are automatically saved because they never matured to the point of being able to choose for or against Christ. God's grace applies to them because Christ died for the sins of all mankind which includes of course Adam's original sin.

The trouble is with your theory is that Christ did not die for all mankind, only those he loves. Heb 12:6 - For whom the Lord loveth, he chasteneth, and scourgest every son whom he receiveth. If he chastens every one that he loves, why does he not chasten some? Ps 73:5 - They (the wicked) are not PLAGUED (= divinely punished, according to Strong's Greek interpretation.) like other men. Heb 12:8 - But if ye be without chastisement, wherefore all are partakers (a part, which is the elect), then are ye bastards (illegitimate), and not sons. In the case of Jacob and Esau to show that his election might stand. John 6:39 - All that Jesus died for will be with him in heaven, without the lose of even one, and we know that all mankind will not be in heaven. All mankind are not candidates for salvation.

 

[Lillywolf]

The trouble is with your theory is that Christ did not die for all mankind, only those he loves. Heb 12:6 - For whom the Lord loveth, he chasteneth, and scourgest every son whom he receiveth. If he chastens every one that he loves, why does he not chasten some? Ps 73:5 - They (the wicked) are not PLAGUED (= divinely punished, according to Strong's Greek interpretation.) like other men. Heb 12:8 - But if ye be without chastisement, wherefore all are partakers (a part, which is the elect), then are ye bastards (illegitimate), and not sons. In the case of Jacob and Esau to show that his election might stand. John 6:39 - All that Jesus died for will be with him in heaven, without the lose of even one, and we know that all mankind will not be in heaven. All mankind are not candidates for salvation.

That is a gross misrepresentation of what Hebrews 12:6 actually states. Proverbs 3:11-12 precedes the very same language. I didn't link those verses because John 3:16 refutes your gross misrepresentation first.

 

[Lillywolf]

Yes! People like us who have knowledge of good and evil, unlike babies, need to become as Little Children.

Jesus said so and that can only be done through HIS cleansing blood.

That's true. Babies are born innocent and without sin. Good post.

All children are born under condemnation because they are the progeny of fallen Adam & Eve, have inherited Adam's original sin and have a sin nature. (This condemnation is actually a blessing because it means we are canidates for salvation.) But children who die before reaching the age of accountability are automatically saved because they never matured to the point of being able to choose for or against Christ. God's grace applies to them because Christ died for the sins of all mankind which includes of course Adam's original sin.

That's not true of course. The bible tells us that sin is not inherited from the father. See Exodus 20 and Exodus 34.

I wonder if it occurs to people who promote the idea that children are born sinners what they're actually claiming?
For those children who have died in the womb, shortly after birth. Or as infants at home with their parent(s). A baby carries the soul God gave them. And there are those who think God then calls the baby out of this life and sends them to Hell. Which is the place sinners will go. That's an abysmal insult to the God of mercies.

 

[Lillywolf]

For some unknown reason to me, God has presented the gospel of Christ as a mystery to avoid some people from understanding it. I do believe that God will not allow the Holy Spirit to reveal that mystery to a person until the person rejects the notion that they can figure it out by their own intelligence. I had that mindset when I was 50 years old because, at that time, the scriptures, seemingly, contradicted each other, especially the salvation scriptures; such as, You are saved by grace, and that not of yourselves, compared to save yourselves from this untoward generation. I gave up that mindset, after 12 years of being stubborn, and not too long after that the Holy Spirit revealed the difference in the deliverance. Looking back, if he had revealed it sooner, I would have said "I knew I was smart enough to figure it out". I believe there are a lot of people on this forum that are depending upon themselves for their eternal deliverance, by taking credit for their eternal deliverance by thinking that their acceptance of God is the cause of their eternal deliverance.

Consider who first taught the truth. That we are not saved by our own doing but by grace.And then compare to who said we are to save ourselves from this untoward generation.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

That is a gross misrepresentation of what Hebrews 12:6 actually states. Proverbs 3:11-12 precedes the very same language. I didn't link those verses because John 3:16 refutes your gross misrepresentation first.

In reference to John 3:16 - The word "believeth" is in present tense, not "will believe" which is future tense. God so loved the "world of believers"

Consider who first taught the truth. That we are not saved by our own doing but by grace.And then compare to who said we are to save ourselves from this untoward generation.

Paul wrote the book of Ephesians and quoted what Jesus said. Peter recorded the phrase in Acts. 2 Tim 3:16 - All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine (Jesus's teachings), for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. If the scriptures are given by inspiration of God, it is as if God said it himself. The point that I am trying to make, is that in the words, salvation, saved, save, which is Greek translated as meaning "a deliverance". These salvation ( deliverance ) words are used in the scriptures as an eternal deliverance and, also, as deliverance we receive here on earth. There are far more deliverance (salvation) scriptures used as deliverance here on earth than there are that pertain to eternal deliverance.
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[Lillywolf]

In reference to John 3:16 - The word "believeth" is in present tense, not "will believe" which is future tense. God so loved the "world of believers"

Paul wrote the book of Ephesians and quoted what Jesus said. Peter recorded the phrase in Acts. 2 Tim 3:16 - All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine (Jesus's teachings), for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. If the scriptures are given by inspiration of God, it is as if God said it himself. The point that I am trying to make, is that in the words, salvation, saved, save, which is Greek translated as meaning "a deliverance". These salvation ( deliverance ) words are used in the scriptures as an eternal deliverance and, also, as deliverance we receive here on earth. There are far more deliverance (salvation) scriptures used as deliverance here on earth than there are that pertain to eternal deliverance.
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The trouble with your theory is that it is not in the least Biblical.
Quite frankly and to be very direct for the final time, I find your insistence that children are born damned savagely pathetic and unintelligent as pertains to the scriptures.
However, for whatever reason you have that insistence I do feel confident in one absolute. You are not a parent.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

The trouble with your theory is that it is not in the least Biblical.
Quite frankly and to be very direct for the final time, I find your insistence that children are born damned savagely pathetic and unintelligent as pertains to the scriptures.
However, for whatever reason you have that insistence I do feel confident in one absolute. You are not a parent.

Thank you for implying, I have two beautiful daughters that I have raised to produce me some absolutely wonderful grandchildren. It is my belief that the scriptures prove themselves when compared to each other. If you are having trouble with my interpretation of some of the scriptures I have given you, feel free to produce other scriptures that refute the scriptures that I have given you. I believe that is why we are on this forum, to discuss scriptures, comparing them on to another. I hope we can respond to each other and come to an agreement.