All Of Israel, Or Just A Remnant?

[Pilgrimshope]

No one. I just believe they need to be made alive before they will exercise faith. You seem to believe they exercise faith and then receive life.

I believe they receive faith and then act upon it because they truly believe his word like for instance baptism

Peter preached a long message of the gospel then the people have heard faith and begin to respond

“Now when they heard this, ( they hear the gospel message now could have faith and it moves them ) they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? ( they believed what Peter was saying so thiers asking according to not what do we do ?)

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.( tbey heard a promise of faith ) For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Then they that gladly received his word ( receives and acted in faith ) were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:37-39, 41‬ ‭

If they hadn’t heard the word first nonone could have beloved anything or gotten baptized faith comes first and actions come from faith everyone jesus talked with wqs in the same boat those who hears and believes became born again later

 

[Pilgrimshope]

That is pure poetry and truth at its finest point!
I could feel that in the words as I read them, Brother!

Amen David’s writings are almost all like poetry I guess his writings show this to be true

“And when he had removed him, he raised up unto them David to be their king; to whom also he gave testimony, and said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after mine own heart, which shall fulfil all my will.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭13:22‬ ‭KJV‬‬

even though David sinned greatly at one point after he was chosen king God said this of him later after he died

“and rent the kingdom away from the house of David, and gave it thee: and yet thou hast not been as my servant David, who kept my commandments, and who followed me with all his heart, to do that only which was right in mine eyes;”
‭‭1 Kings‬ ‭14:8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

we know David sinned greatly and dealt at times repentance is so much at the center of our gospel it works hand in hand with his mercy to create new people not as they were not bound for n the same chains but also perseverance is needed

 

[HeIsHere]

exercise faith and then receive life.

Correct!! 👏 👏

 

[Cameron143]

So to simplify brother this group

“Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: for I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.

Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭25:41-46‬ ‭KJV‬‬

are they there because God decided they couldn’t be saved ? And arbitrarily chose another group that did nothing but be chosen ?

“Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

for I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.

Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭25:34-37, 40‬ ‭

Does God only will that some repent and are saved ? Does he will that some perish ?

“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”
‭‭2 Peter‬ ‭3:9‬ ‭KJV‬‬

it isn’t Gods Will for any one of his creatures to perish but for all of us to come to repentance and live with him forever

life and death is a choice we receive when we hear the gospel everyone is lost until that point everyone is a fallen natural man until they are born again that’s why we have to be born again

Do you believe God's will is ever thwarted?

Notice that it says they were to enter a kingdom prepared for them before the foundation of the world. What do you make of that?

Notice there are 2 groups: sheep and goats. What do you make of that?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

People are born under the wrath of God. They are condemned already...John 3:18. But men also bring about there own demise, in a sense, fitting themselves for destruction. They are at enmity against God and live their lives in rebellion against Him. And yet, Romans 1 says they should be able to know God exists from creation itself and from conscience, as eternity has been placed in their hearts. This makes them accountable.

I don't know why God chooses one and not another. I mean, I do...I realize that it redounds to His glory, and I understand and appreciate how it does so...but I don't understand why He chooses as He does. And I recognize that the justice of God verses the love of God tends to bring out emotional responses in people. So for some, the idea of a vengeful and wrathful God is anathema. They can only see God as loving and cuddly, even given the abundance of evidence against it biblically. Or else they believe it is incumbent upon God to first exercise love, and only after giving people every opportunity to then execute justice. I don't understand this to be necessary for a sovereign God who does as He purposes independently of all other considerations.

To some this will seem callous and uncaring and they will not entertain a discussion of such things because they believe it to be impugning God and inaccurately describing Him. I appreciate that view, but I don't find it biblical. I believe God does as He pleases, and operates always within His character. Sometimes that clearly manifests as love, while at other times as justice.

Ll dear brother are we just saying what each other are saying in different words haha ?

 

[Cameron143]

Correct!! 👏 👏

Very disingenuous to post my thoughts in this manner. Please post my entire posts so you don't misrepresent me, or please don't quote me.

 

[Cameron143]

Ll dear brother are we just saying what each other are saying in different words haha ?

Yes and no. So far as I can tell, our only point of contention is when in the process of salvation faith occurs.

 

[HeIsHere]

Very disingenuous to post my thoughts in this manner. Please post my entire posts so you don't misrepresent me, or please don't quote me.

I think we know it was not the full post since the full post is still there. Now if the post was erased yes that would be disingenuous.
I guess humor can only go so far.
Next time I will remember to put a smiley.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Do you believe God's will is ever thwarted?

Notice that it says they were to enter a kingdom prepared for them before the foundation of the world. What do you make of that?

Notice there are 2 groups: sheep and goats. What do you make of that?

Ever thwarted ?

brother is gods will that some are saved and some are damned ?

“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”
‭‭2 Peter‬ ‭3:9‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Can you see that Gods not dictating who repents but his Will is tbat none would perish but everyone would repent ?

versus “ God is willing tbat some perish and some repent and is going to force that on mankind rages less of thier pet in a covenant ?

 

[Cameron143]

I believe they receive faith and then act upon it because they truly believe his word like for instance baptism

Peter preached a long message of the gospel then the people have heard faith and begin to respond

“Now when they heard this, ( they hear the gospel message now could have faith and it moves them ) they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? ( they believed what Peter was saying so thiers asking according to not what do we do ?)

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.( tbey heard a promise of faith ) For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Then they that gladly received his word ( receives and acted in faith ) were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:37-39, 41‬ ‭

If they hadn’t heard the word first nonone could have beloved anything or gotten baptized faith comes first and actions come from faith everyone jesus talked with wqs in the same boat those who hears and believes became born again later

I guess what I'm saying is that there is a difference between natural hearing and spiritual hearing. Everyone present on the day of Pentecost heard physically what Peter said. Only 3,000 responded. Why? I contend that only 3,000 were given ears to hear.

 

[Cameron143]

I think we know it was not the full post since the full post is still there. Now if the post was erased yes that would be disingenuous.
I guess humor can only go so far.
Next time I will remember to put a smiley.

A little emoji goes a long way.

 

[HeIsHere]

A little emoji goes a long way.

Absolutely agree!
I better stayed focused on my work cause when I wander away is when I get in trouble ...lol

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Yes and no. So far as I can tell, our only point of contention is when in the process of salvation faith occurs.[/QUOTE

“So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭10:17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We don’t have faith until we hear the word and can’t act in faith until we have received faith

right ? That kind of all I’m saying we can’t have faith until we hear the word because faith comes from hearing and hearing by the word of God

hear faith , believe faith , act in faith

 

[Magenta]

Can I ask you a question based upon n this ? The people who end up damned in the end …. Are they there because God forced that and caused it didn’t give them belief and do all the work to save them but others he did ?

so this group of human beings

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

If a man ends up here is it because God didn’t do what was needed to save them ? Or because of what they did ?

“Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: for I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭25:41-43, 45-46‬ ‭KJV‬‬

did god not allow them and enable them that’s why they are lost ? Or is it because of how they treated other people ?

The Bible has much to say on this along the lines of seek and you will find, draw near to God and He will draw near to you, God resists the proud but gives grace to the humble, etc. Everyone knows that God exists, leaving man without an excuse to seek the truth of the matter. True that none seek Him... but in any earnest and sincere search for truth, more will be revealed, and God promises to reveal Himself...

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I guess what I'm saying is that there is a difference between natural hearing and spiritual hearing. Everyone present on the day of Pentecost heard physically what Peter said. Only 3,000 responded. Why? I contend that only 3,000 were given ears to hear.

But can you hear the gospel at all unless it’s actually preached ? It seems like this part is where it starts brother

“And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭28:1

mark summarizes it this way

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬

isnt the first requirement to hear the gospel ? I am saying acrually hear someone preaching the gospel or maybe read it n the Bible

how else soups I ever believe Jesus died for my sins unless I actually heard about it ?

 

[Pilgrimshope]

The Bible has much to say on this along the lines of seek and you will find, draw near to God and He will draw near to you, God resists the proud but gives grace to the humble, etc. Everyone knows that God exists,leaving man without an excuse to seek the truth. True that none seek Him... but in any earnest and sincere search for truth, more will be revealed, and God promises to reveal Himself...

Big fat Amen as usual sister

 

[Cameron143]

Ever thwarted ?

brother is gods will that some are saved and some are damned ?

“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”
‭‭2 Peter‬ ‭3:9‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Can you see that Gods not dictating who repents but his Will is tbat none would perish but everyone would repent ?

versus “ God is willing tbat some perish and some repent and is going to force that on mankind rages less of thier pet in a covenant ?

The reason I asked the question the way I did was because we know whatever God wills inevitably comes to pass. So if verses such as you posted means that God actually willed the salvation of all humanity, it would actually come to pass. God does His will in the army of heaven and among the inhabitants of earth, and none stay His hand or say unto Him what doest Thou...Daniel 4:35.
I can only conclude from the verse you shared that the phrase...God isn't willing that any should perish...to mean that God would rather people repent, and not that He decreed or purposed it to come to pass.

 

[Cameron143]

But can you hear the gospel at all unless it’s actually preached ? It seems like this part is where it starts brother

“And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭28:1

mark summarizes it this way

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬

isnt the first requirement to hear the gospel ? I am saying acrually hear someone preaching the gospel or maybe read it n the Bible

how else soups I ever believe Jesus died for my sins unless I actually heard about it ?

Part and parcel of salvation is that preachers be sent...Romans 10:14-15.
The reason I referenced Matthew 13:10-17 at the outset was because I believe the hearing is given, and where it is given, always leads to conversion.

 

[Magenta]

Big fat Amen as usual sister

In knowing there is a God, it becomes incumbent upon man to seek Him out and find his true purpose in life... 🥰

 

[Pilgrimshope]

In knowing there is a God, it becomes incumbent upon man to seek Him out and find his true purpose in life... 🥰

Amen that’s why this is the true requirement of salvstion

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;

but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

That covers us all and without the gospel no one could know the true God or his name in order to believe in him

“The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed ( not a long rules list but living and growing revelation as we follow him and learn from him personally ) from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭1:16-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭5:20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

In knowing the lord , the son begins to rise in our hearts the daystar begins to dawn and light of the world suddenly crests the horizon and then we have life everlasting Christ in us the hope of glory