"You will be as gods"

[homwardbound]

According to the context starting at John 10:30 Jesus says, "I and the Father are one." So how are they one? Some say and teach that the Father and the Son are one in purpose. It is true that they are one in purpose but that is not what Jesus was saying. At vs31, "The Jews took up stones again to stone Him." Being one in purpose is not a stoning crime and at vs32 Jesus says, "I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?"

Vs33, "The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a a man, make Yourself out God." Going back to John 10:30 Jesus asserted the essential unity of the Father and the Son in the word "one" (hen). It is a neuter number to indicate equality of essence/nature, attributes, design, will, and work. Jesus distinguishes the "I" from the "Father" and uses the plural verb "are" denoting "we are." Thus, these words separate the persons within the Godhead, but "one" asserts their unity or essence or nature AS IDENTICAL.

So why does Jesus at John 10:34 bring up the subject of "gods?" Has it not been written in your Law, "I said you are Gods?" Vs35, "If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken), vs36, "do you say of Him whom the Father sanctified and sent into the word, You are blaspheming, because I said, "I am the Son of God?"

What Jesus is simply doing is taking the Jew's statement about Him blaspheming to its logical conclusion to show that they are being inconsistent. In effect, Jesus is saying, "If you say that I am blaspheming, you must also hold that God is blaspheming because He said to those by whom the word of God came, 'ye are gods." Of course the judges at Psalm 82:6 are not real gods but were commissioned to judge righteously, which they were not doing and God says you will die like the men that your are. In short, Jesus is "NOT" a god but the God of the Bible.

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

To me, the way, the truth and the new life offered us. in his being risen from the dead. Where the new life (Born again) begins in each person God accepts as his, that believe God in Son for them, all those that will not give up, will eventually see through it all and be new without sin anymore besetting them nor will pride be in the way anymore either. Dead to the flesh nature, Alive forever in God's given nature as new, thanking God forever, too busy to get caught up under Law again, too busy praising God for what Son has done completed for them, just loving all. in the same mercy and truth given them

 

[TiggerTwo]

In answer to the statement in #17 above:
"And one more thing! John 10:30 or the other references have nothing to do with your following statement:

"Wisdom” (BWF), we may have gender irregularities when someone is described figuratively (“metaphorically”) such as “he is a Rock” or “Jesus is the Lamb,” but when he is being literally described we must have gender agreement."
.....................................................................
Here is footnote #13 from my BWF study:

13. There is another argument attempted by a few trinitarians concerning this scripture. It goes like this: “Since ‘Wisdom’ is in the feminine gender in biblical Hebrew, anyone who tries to interpret it as being Christ has created a female Messiah!” (If this were true, it would certainly make a devastating statement about the scholarship of all those respected trinitarian sources quoted above who support the “Jesus is Wisdom” concept!)

Any student of foreign languages knows that many (if not most) of them apply gender to nouns. In Spanish, for instance, “table” (la mesa) is a feminine noun. “Hat” (el sombrero) is a masculine noun. Other nonpersonal nouns are also assigned masculine, feminine, or neuter gender.

It is the same in biblical Hebrew and Greek. In Greek (as in Hebrew) “wisdom” just happens to have a feminine gender. Notice how it is used at 1 Cor. 1:24: Jesus is the wisdom (feminine) of God! Jesus himself says: “I am the resurrection (feminine) and the life (feminine).” - John 11:25, and “I am the door (feminine).” - Jn 10:9. Also examine Rev. 5:6 - 6:16 where John repeatedly calls Jesus “the Lamb.” “The Lamb” is neuter here, but, since Jesus had to be a perfect, unblemished sacrifice for us, we know absolutely that he could not have suffered a terrible accident during his circumcision! ;^)

In short, when a Bible writer figuratively applies a term to a person, he is stuck with whatever gender that term happens to have. If he figuratively calls a lady a wall and “wall” happens to be a masculine noun in that Bible language, then that’s how it is going to be written: the woman is called a wall (masculine)!

So calling Jesus “Wisdom” (feminine) as Paul does at 1 Cor. 1:24 (and as Prov. 8:22-30 does) is absolutely meaningless as far as the masculinity of the Messiah is concerned. No mature student of Bible languages could possibly be ignorant of this very basic concept!

 

[TiggerTwo]

In answer to the statement in #17 above:
"And one more thing! John 10:30 or the other references have nothing to do with your following statement:

"Wisdom” (BWF), we may have gender irregularities when someone is described figuratively (“metaphorically”) such as “he is a Rock” or “Jesus is the Lamb,” but when he is being literally described we must have gender agreement."
.....................................................................
Here is footnote #13 from my BWF study:

13. There is another argument attempted by a few trinitarians concerning this scripture. It goes like this: “Since ‘Wisdom’ is in the feminine gender in biblical Hebrew, anyone who tries to interpret it as being Christ has created a female Messiah!” (If this were true, it would certainly make a devastating statement about the scholarship of all those respected trinitarian sources quoted above who support the “Jesus is Wisdom” concept!)

Any student of foreign languages knows that many (if not most) of them apply gender to nouns. In Spanish, for instance, “table” (la mesa) is a feminine noun. “Hat” (el sombrero) is a masculine noun. Other nonpersonal nouns are also assigned masculine, feminine, or neuter gender.

It is the same in biblical Hebrew and Greek. In Greek (as in Hebrew) “wisdom” just happens to have a feminine gender. Notice how it is used at 1 Cor. 1:24: Jesus is the wisdom (feminine) of God! Jesus himself says: “I am the resurrection (feminine) and the life (feminine).” - John 11:25, and “I am the door (feminine).” - Jn 10:9. Also examine Rev. 5:6 - 6:16 where John repeatedly calls Jesus “the Lamb.” “The Lamb” is neuter here, but, since Jesus had to be a perfect, unblemished sacrifice for us, we know absolutely that he could not have suffered a terrible accident during his circumcision! ;^)

In short, when a Bible writer figuratively applies a term to a person, he is stuck with whatever gender that term happens to have. If he figuratively calls a lady a wall and “wall” happens to be a masculine noun in that Bible language, then that’s how it is going to be written: the woman is called a wall (masculine)!

So calling Jesus “Wisdom” (feminine) as Paul does at 1 Cor. 1:24 (and as Prov. 8:22-30 does) is absolutely meaningless as far as the masculinity of the Messiah is concerned. No mature student of Bible languages could possibly be ignorant of this very basic concept!

 

[Blade]

"and you will be like God, knowing good and evil "

Hi you keep saying " boundaries " What your saying is nothing more then speculation as for why Gods angels followed Satan. It started because sin was found in him. What Satan said was a lie. The fact Adam & Eve never once encountered lying cheating stealing murder. So what something with in the garden talked they had no thought it was a lie they would not have understood a lie. Today this is not seeing today were blind. What Adam & Eve could see we can not any more.

There is no such thing where God is as in " boundaries ". God can not do evil. God mad man in His image that is far more then a look alike. So much of what we know hear feel see is based on twisted with sin. So until that which is perfect is come....then and only then will we truly see and truly know.

 

[glf]

Jn 10: 34-36:
Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken; Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?

 

[ValleyAnt]

"and you will be like God, knowing good and evil "

Hi you keep saying " boundaries " What your saying is nothing more then speculation as for why Gods angels followed Satan. It started because sin was found in him. What Satan said was a lie. The fact Adam & Eve never once encountered lying cheating stealing murder. So what something with in the garden talked they had no thought it was a lie they would not have understood a lie. Today this is not seeing today were blind. What Adam & Eve could see we can not any more.

There is no such thing where God is as in " boundaries ". God can not do evil. God mad man in His image that is far more then a look alike. So much of what we know hear feel see is based on twisted with sin. So until that which is perfect is come....then and only then will we truly see and truly know.

I haven't been on this thread for a while. Is this responding to me or to someone else?