Works Complete Faith?

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you owe that poster you insulted an apology. but thanks for showing your works.
 
evyaniy said:
you owe that poster you insulted an apology. but thanks for showing your works.
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He owes everyone here an apology for his indefensible reprehensible stubborn rebellion against truth. The guy deserves to be banned.

And quit being off topic.
 
romans113336 said:
It is quite odd that you've apparently read my statements on Torah, and would still ask me whether I promote Torah observance. Is that what you're asking me?
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don't want to take the time to read through the mountain of your content to find it. don't need to know anything more at this point than what you said to that gentleman. and what you continue to say as in the post above.
 
evyaniy said:
don't want to take the time to read through the mountain of your content to find it. don't need to know anything more at this point than what you said to that gentleman. and what you continue to say as in the post above.
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I didn't say "go read it". I said "apparently you've read". Its odd the only post on the subject you've read is the one where I lambasted that liar, and, yet, in your ignorance, you've concluded I'm a bad man. Lol

No, I'm against "Torah observance".
 
Mem said:
Demons are used as examples of those that have dead faith.
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Demons believing doesn't refer to a "false" faith--Jesus never promised to save demons by faith, so there is no amount of faith that could save a demon, the point is they also have "faith alone", and they do not have WORKS.

James isn't talking about "true" and "false" faith--when comparing faith to a body, he never mentions a "mannequin", only an incomplete body (without its spirit--dead) and a complete one (with its spirit--living), corresponding to an incomplete faith (without works--dead) and a complete faith (with works--living).
 
evyaniy said:
Good works accompany Salvation by grace through faith. But those good works are not the means of attaining Salvation or retaining it. They are the work of the Holy Spirit inside true believers.

The Spirit can be grieved by a believer's behavior when one becomes unfruitful. The believer is disciplined and in some cases even removed but is not condemned.

We all go through very difficult periods in life that test our faith. We do not always respond appropriately, even on a daily basis. But He is still at work in us and we learn when we are willing.

We are growing in grace and the knowledge of Him. We still have sin but true believers confess their sin and are forgiven. We are still admonished and encouraged to prove our own Salvation and make our election sure by doing what is right as best we can as we learn.

None of us reach sinless perfection in this life. We are objects of His grace and mercy who look for our redemption to come in and through His Son.
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This "works flow naturally from faith" idea is only necessary for someone who believes in "faith alone" ... but then you read the Bible, and you find that the square peg doesn't fit in the round hole.

You have to do mental gymnastics, and maybe throw in a little mental tarot card reading, to continue holding to your stance in the face of James 2 ("Abraham was justified by works"), or Ro 14:5,23 (Christians who "sin" aren't "justified" but "condemned"), or 1 Co 9:27-1 Co 10 (salvation and the promise can be forfeited through sin).

The Corinthians, also, were living sinfully, but no one doubts they had "true" faith.

James 4 calls his audience "adulteresses" against "God"--on your view, this should not be possible!

James isn't talking about "true" and "false" faith--when comparing faith to a body, he never mentions a "mannequin", only an incomplete body (without its spirit--dead) and a complete one (with its spirit--living), corresponding to an incomplete faith (without works--dead) and a complete faith (with works--living).
Demons believing doesn't refer to a "false" faith--Jesus never promised to save demons by faith, so there is no amount of faith that could save a demon, the point is they also have "faith alone", and they do not have WORKS.
The man who "says he has faith": James is just comparing the persuasive power of his statement against the persuasive power of a life of good works, and asking which one actually glorifies God, so as to move the audience to works, because glorifying God is the point of Christianity.
 
evyaniy said:
don't care about your view. you already disproved it.
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"I disagree with you, but I can't prove why through Scriptures... so, youre a bad man."

Wow, where do I sign up for this belief system's DRIVEL!?

If I can find a single person who holds your view who I THINK has sinned, that disproves your point. Is that how it works? You'd have to be a sinless perfectionist to throw that stone. If not, you're in a glass home so you really oughtn't.
 
romans113336 said:
OK so please be on topic going forward. I invite your reasoned objections.
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Setting it straight as in still standing by the "detestable" things you said to him and reiterated again. You can't trash someone in one thread and then go back to your own and act like it never happened.
 
evyaniy said:
Setting it straight as in still standing by the "detestable" things you said to him and reiterated again. You can't trash someone in one thread and then go back to your own and act like it never happened.
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My word! Art thou casting such aspersions as "detestable"!?
:ROFL:

Make a point or keep moving. You've derailed this thread long enough.
 
romans113336 said:
Oops, Jesus says "You will know them by their fruit", and Mt 7 says those false prophets are lawless, so, yes, you will know them by their fruit, not "supernatural works".
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It was a response to someone who used the example of actions. Oops...you didn't pay attention to the reference.
 
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