who are the elect

[hermanodaniel]

Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.
If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.
2 Timothy 2:19-21

 

[seed_time_harvest]

This was Excellent, Great Job.

Blessings

you should always know that anything that is not freewill is not just,and we know that GOD is just.its true that GOD knows everything its up to the person to choose the world or to choose GOD.
if you are born into wealth.at some point you can( choose the world)saying in your heart----i live in a wonderful house,1).do i want to leave this and be like those the world doesn't want to be like,or2). trust in what GOD likes and say i want to be like GOD and what GOD has chosen,and give my wordly money to help the kingdom advance,and have heavenly treasure.
Romans 9
13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
14 What shall we say then? [Is there] unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16 So then [it is] not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

The real question is whether we strive to make our election sure. 2 Peter 1:10
I know many will say but what about our freewill? The truth is that although we have a will (that is a choice) it isn't free (that means it is bound or limited) to do as we please. I can make plans but since I am not God and not Sovereign I can not guarantee that I will be here tomorrow to accomplish what I will. God calls and draws and we submit to his grace and OBEY. We are called and then drawn by the Father because no one can come to God unless He calls and draws us. God said Danny, and drew me and I said here am I. Now for our understanding (and I mean our understanding because we are stuck in time) it seems that we choose whether to say yes or no to God. Let say someone says yes to God (I have!) and the individual is set apart living for God went through his bouts but ultimately was victorious in Christ when that individual hears well done faithful and good servant HE OR SHE WILL TRULY UNDERSTAND THAT THEY DID NOT CHOOSE GOD BUT GOD CHOSE THEM! Now what does that mean??? Well God is God and if we think that we can choose God first we are mistaken because if that were possible God would immediately not be God anymore! How can we choose someone who is eternal and out of time??? When the word says God foreknew us it doesn't mean foreknowledge (knowing what we will choose) but that He actually knew us completely inside and out and how we are going to be. I remembered when I first stumbled upon that verse in Romans "Jacob I loved and Esau I hated" and I ask God why over and over. I prayed for understanding and God led me to a book in the Bible I haven't visited at the time and a short book at that... I was led to Obadiah and when I read Obadiah God showed me the pride Esau harbored in his heart. When the Bible says God knows us it is to an extent that baffles us because we are stuck in time but this is why God is God in the first place. We reap what we sow and we can deceive man but we can't deceive God...This is a profound mystery but nonetheless the truth. However, we should avoid asking who is the elect because to be frank no one knows and thus we must preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ and make our election sure by abiding in Christ till the end. Moreover, rest assure that those who want to seek God and inherit eternal life as the scripture states "and everyone who calls upon the Lord shall be saved." Romans 10:13 are the elect! No one can seek God truthfully from the heart and be disqualified simply because they were not the elect! This is not how the election works! The elect are those who surrendered their life to God and the those who perish are those who refused the Gospel and have trampled the Son of God and insulted the Spirit of Grace not wanting NOTHING to do with God.

you should always know that anything that is not freewill is not just,and we know that GOD is just.its true that GOD knows everything its up to the person to choose the world or to choose GOD.
if you are born into wealth.at some point you can( choose the world)saying in your heart----i live in a wonderful house,1).do i want to leave this and be like those the world doesn't want to be like,or2). trust in what GOD likes and say i want to be like GOD and what GOD has chosen,and give my wordly money to help the kingdom advance,and have heavenly treasure.
Romans 9
13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
14 What shall we say then? [Is there] unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16 So then [it is] not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

 

[hermanodaniel]

you should always know that anything that is not freewill is not just,and we know that GOD is just.its true that GOD knows everything its up to the person to choose the world or to choose GOD.
if you are born into wealth.at some point you can( choose the world)saying in your heart----i live in a wonderful house,1).do i want to leave this and be like those the world doesn't want to be like,or2). trust in what GOD likes and say i want to be like GOD and what GOD has chosen,and give my wordly money to help the kingdom advance,and have heavenly treasure.
Romans 9
13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
14 What shall we say then? [Is there] unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16 So then [it is] not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

What is unjust in our eyes is a lack of understanding of what is just in God's eyes... the explanation I gave through God's wisdom is biblical and not at all unjust and I see you were quoting Romans 9 but stopped at verse 17. Here's the rest...
18 So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills.

19 You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?” 20 But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?” 21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? 22 What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, 23 in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— 24 even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles? 25 As indeed he says in Hosea,

“Those who were not my people I will call ‘my people,’
and her who was not beloved I will call ‘beloved.’”
26 “And in the very place where it was said to them, ‘You are not my people,’
there they will be called ‘sons of the living God.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

What is unjust in our eyes is a lack of understanding of what is just in God's eyes... the explanation I gave through God's wisdom is biblical and not at all unjust and I see you were quoting Romans 9 but stopped at verse 17. Here's the rest...
18 So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills.

19 You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?” 20 But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?” 21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? 22 What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, 23 in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— 24 even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles? 25 As indeed he says in Hosea,

“Those who were not my people I will call ‘my people,’
and her who was not beloved I will call ‘beloved.’”
26 “And in the very place where it was said to them, ‘You are not my people,’
there they will be called ‘sons of the living God.

hermanodaniel said

What is unjust in our eyes is a lack of understanding of what is just in God's eyes

i agree with what you are saying brother,the scriptures used,but i am not sure we see the scripture the same,you made your case and i don't know if you are agreeing with me or not.
i think vessels of honor or dishonor are like(Romans 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. i think this would be a vessel of dishonor.the pharaoh chose not to do things according to the way GOD had elected,and GOD knew this is the choice he would make.

 

[Grandpa]

Exactly, they cannot.

And how about the election of Jacob? Was he chosen because he was less evil than Esau?

Jacob wasn't less sinful than Esau. But he did have a different nature than Esau.

Esau relied on his own strength and flesh. Esau was a strong hunter and only worried about his flesh and the satiation of that flesh.

Jacob had to rely on something else. Something the Lord prizes. Jacob relied on wisdom. His nature was not to immediately satisfy the flesh but to walk with wisdom.

The Lord knew what Jacob could become by walking in the ways of wisdom.
And He knew what Esau would become by walking in the ways of the flesh.

 

[tribesman]

Jacob wasn't less sinful than Esau. But he did have a different nature than Esau.

Esau relied on his own strength and flesh. Esau was a strong hunter and only worried about his flesh and the satiation of that flesh.

Jacob had to rely on something else. Something the Lord prizes. Jacob relied on wisdom. His nature was not to immediately satisfy the flesh but to walk with wisdom.

The Lord knew what Jacob could become by walking in the ways of wisdom.
And He knew what Esau would become by walking in the ways of the flesh.

Do you believe that God choose Jacob because of His foreknowledge that he would be walking in the ways of wisdom?

 

[ForestGreenCook]

we know that GO

My view on election is traditional, conservative reformed and so is my affiliation. Unconditional election, that the election is not in any wise conditioned on the sinner, is a very important tenet in reformed tradition with solid biblical foundation. PBs would actually agree with it. Where we differ is on the issue of justification, where you hold to eternal justification.

Eph 2:8 - The word "faith" in this verse is not man's faith, but is Christs faith. Gal 2:16 - Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith "OF" Christ. The word "OF" in the KJV has been changed in some other versions of the bible to "IN" with the intention to make faith to be man's faith instead of Christs faith.
D knows all things.
are the elect,the elect because GOD chose them to be the elect before they were born or,are the elect,the elect because they chose to do what GOD wanted,and GOD knew they would choose to do what is pleasing to him before they were even naturally born into this world.

God chose his elect people before he laid the foundation of the world - Eph 1:4. The reason that God sent his Son into the world, as a man/God, was for the purpose of being a sacrifice to God in redeeming all of those that he gave to Jesus (His elect)) from their sins - John 6:37-40). All that Jesus died for has the promise of an inheritance of heaven by his statement, "I will lose nothing, but will raise them up at the last day". Christ did not die to save all of mankind.- John 10:26-30.

My view on election is traditional, conservative reformed and so is my affiliation. Unconditional election, that the election is not in any wise conditioned on the sinner, is a very important tenet in reformed tradition with solid biblical foundation. PBs would actually agree with it. Where we differ is on the issue of justification, where you hold to eternal justification.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Primitive baptists. Basically a hypercalvinistic group. Google for more infos.

The PB does not agree with all of John Calvin's beliefs. You may have to more accurately investigate the difference between PB's doctrine and Calvin's doctrine. The PB was never a part of the Roman Catholic church as was John Calvin when he withdrew from them in the 1500's reformation period.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

What is a PB? Pentecostal Baptist??

Primitive Baptist. According to church history, The PB was never a part of the Roman Catholic church and therefore did not withdraw from the RCC in the 1500's reformation period, as all of the different denomination churches did.