What did Jesus mean?

[Pilgrimshope]

People LACK common sense!

The word provides ALL we need to know without outside interpretations as you've said @Pilgrimshope .

I do believe in water baptism as an act of obedience for didn't Jesus tell John to let it be so that all righteousness be fulfilled?

There is so very much to still LEARN in God's word.

NOT ONE OF US IS COMPLETE AS YET!

Totally agree I was just offering my thought as to your question we really need to lack common sense lol and come to Jesus’ sense

I was just saying John had just come baptizing with water for remission and said Jesus would baptize with the spirit . And Jesus was saying we need to be born of water and spirit

I think his point was “ the water baptism you went through isn’t enough to save you nicodemus , you must also believe in me “

yes sister we all in every way are not yet complete even the old fogies like me but we are believers and in the end that’s going to save us !!! He already knows we’re not perfect of finished he just wants us to let him work on us and heal us up

 

[JohnDB]

So the Bible and scripture is a regurgitation of flat reading without common sense lol ? We should trust your logic rather than what the Bible says ?

it seems simple the Bible teaches us to believe the gospel and get baptized for remission of sins . Pretty basic common sense sometimes confuses the person who doesn’t believe what’s written

No... don't trust what I am saying.
Do actual study like you were taught in high school... meaning put away the commentaries and read some real anthropologists research papers. Read some real historians and ancient linguists...not the self appointed kind or highly dedicated to theological points of view.

There's a lot more to the scriptures than what comes out in the pulpits. That stuff is baby food by comparison. It is said by people who only will tell you what you want to hear instead of what you NEED to hear because their job depends on it.

Do real research and not the phoney kind.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

No... don't trust what I am saying.
Do actual study like you were taught in high school... meaning put away the commentaries and read some real anthropologists research papers. Read some real historians and ancient linguists...not the self appointed kind or highly dedicated to theological points of view.

There's a lot more to the scriptures than what comes out in the pulpits. That stuff is baby food by comparison. It is said by people who only will tell you what you want to hear instead of what you NEED to hear because their job depends on it.

Do real research and not the phoney kind.

“Do real research and not the phoney kind”

yes thank you I’ll do that God bless

 

[ResidentAlien]

Jesus just finished saying unless a person is born of water and the spirit they cannot enter the kingdom of heaven. Being born of the flesh has nothing to do with being born again. It goes without saying that if a person was never born they can't be born again; however, that's not what Jesus is talking about here.

I used to hold this belief when I hadn't really thought it through. Anything to avoid the unthinkable: that is, obedience is necessary.

Think about it: John came to prepare the way for Jesus. He didn't came preaching repentance only, but baptism too. If John came to prepare the way through repentance and baptism, why do some now say baptism is only a ritualistic formality that isn't really even necessary?? Even Jesus' disiples baptized! Why were they being trained to baptize?

 

[Magenta]

I agree with much of this. I'm glad we're on the same page that every person is born of water.
However, I find difficulty adopting the hendiadys interpretation for 2 main reasons:

1. Since the surrounding context indicates a conversation about 2 births, it appears contextually inconsistent
2. Jesus' elaboration of verse 5 (in verse 6) is contrastive.

I am not completely firm on this; I am still working out my position. But currently,
I believe remaining consistent with the context makes the most sense.

Good morning Diakonos I trust you are well this day the Lord has made

Thank you for your response. I did see it last night, but it was late...

As to the elaboration being contrastive, I agree, but not for the reason you do

Jesus is saying one must be born again, and He is not in any way speaking of a natural birth.

He reiterates the need to be born again to emphasize that the new birth is by water and Spirit.

He chides Nicodemus for thinking this new birth has anything to do with the natural world.

The water Jesus speaks of "will become in him a fountain of water springing up into everlasting life."

"Whoever believes in Me, as the Scripture has said: ‘Streams of living water
will flow from within him.’ ” He was speaking about the Spirit, ... (John 7:37-38a)

It is God's Holy Spirit that is the instrument of both the cleansing and the birth of the divine nature in us.

Here is another page (<= link ) that explains better than I can. I hope you benefit from it

 

[GaryA]

The word baptized means washed, ...

The word 'baptize' means "[to] immerse"...

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

op: What did Jesus mean? water baptism??

I'm amazed that water baptism being attached to salvation is quite common here.

No need to be; In ISRAEL, it WAS Required "For the remission of sins," Correct?
More below... ↓

I am not completely firm on this; I am still working out my position. But currently, I believe remaining consistent with the context makes the most sense.

Precious friend, have you yet Considered this Rightly Divided position, with
God's TWO Different "Contexts"? ie:

God's Context of:
Prophecy/Law for ISRAEL, under the gospel of the kingdom ("faith Without works
is DEAD!) = "he that believeth AND IS baptized shall be saved," Correct?

►►► The Twelve Were Sent to {water} baptize! ◄◄◄

The TWO Main (of 12) baptismS =

A) water, For remission of sins/induction into Israeli "priesthood!":
(Matthew_3:5-6; Mark_1:4; Luke_3:3; John_1:31; Especially Luke 7:29-30;
Acts_10:37; Matthew_28:19; Mark_16:16; Acts_2:38, 22:16; Ezekiel_36:25)
+
B) WITH The Holy Spirit, Poured Out By CHRIST, for power, signs And wonders!
(Isaiah_44:3; Matthew_3:11; Mark_1:8, 16:17-18;
Luke_24:49; Acts_2:17-18, 38, 8:15-17, 11:16)

"Remains Consistent with God's Context" of Prophecy/Law, Correct?

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That DIFFER!” {online}:

God's Other Context Of: Mystery/GRACE! =

our "apostle to the Gentiles" for The Body Of CHRIST, with
The Gospel Of The GRACE Of God! (Salvation = GRACE Through faith
Apart FROM all works) = Eph 2:8-9; Rom 3:24; Titus 3:5; And MERCY!

►►► Paul Was Not Sent to {water} baptize! Why Not?: ◄◄◄

Today: Only ONE Baptism = "BY" The ONE Spirit = God's OPERATION,
Spiritually Identifying members In (The ONE Body Of) CHRIST!!
(Ephesians 4:5; Colossians_2:12; Galatians_3:27;
Romans_6:3-4; ►►► 1 Corinthians 12:13 ◄◄◄)

"Remains Consistent with God's Context" of Mystery/GRACE, Correct?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Conclusion: God's ONE Baptism Today? = ONE

Is it not Possible That God's Answer Of "No water baptism, for
us Today," Under HIS Pure GRACE, absolutely vanquishes Satan's
{Many Severely DIVIDED denominations?} Confusion into oblivion!?

---------------------------------------------------

FULL "study" of ALL Bible baptisms is here:

12 baptisms vs ONE Baptism

 

[SomeDisciple]

Jesus says you have to be born again. Not born again twice. So, I feel like being born of water is natural birth- and being born of the spirit is... well, being born of the spirit.

 

[birdie]

The word 'baptize' means "[to] immerse"...

A quick check of the concordance: Baptizo

I: to dip repeatedly, to immerse, to submerge (of vessels sunk)

II: to cleanse by dipping or submerging, to wash, to make clean with water, to wash one's self, bathe

III: to overwhelm

 

[HillyBilly]

I am still trying to figure out how to post on here. There are two other questions I have about what Jesus said to Nicodemus and a woman at the well. Sorry for any inconvenience.

John 3: 8
8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

John 4: 23, 24
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

 

[Magenta]

He saved us, not by the righteous deeds we had done, but according to His mercy,
through the washing of new birth and renewal by the Holy Spirit. Titus 3:5

 

[HillyBilly]

I am still trying to figure out how to post on here. There are two other questions I have about what Jesus said to Nicodemus and a woman at the well. Sorry for any inconvenience.
John 3: 8
8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

John 3:8 I believe Jesus was talking about what was going to happen in the upper room on the day of Pentecost.
Acts 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.
Acts 2:2-4
2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

John 4: 23, 24
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

When Jesus was talking to the woman I believe he was telling her that there was going to come a new way to worship the Father. God was going to make a new covenant through Jesus and we would be able to worship God through the Spirit and the Truth of Jesus.

If I am not explaining this good enough please let me know and I will try to do better & be more specific.

 

[birdie]

John 3:8 I believe Jesus was talking about what was going to happen in the upper room on the day of Pentecost.
Acts 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.
Acts 2:2-4
2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.


When Jesus was talking to the woman I believe he was telling her that there was going to come a new way to worship the Father. God was going to make a new covenant through Jesus and we would be able to worship God through the Spirit and the Truth of Jesus.

If I am not explaining this good enough please let me know and I will try to do better & be more specific.

Jesus came to seek and to save the lost. God the father sent him to do that because he loved those he was coming to save. It was God's action and plan to go and save such and such a person. He saved them by giving them of his own Spirit. Because they have his Spirit they then believe on him unto salvation and are able to have a relationship with him, calling upon him as their father. It took God's action and was not done through such and such a person's ability or work or smartness or endeavor. God first initiated it because he desired to save such and such a person. Since God is a Spirit, which incidentally lives and endures forever, he gave of himself to that newly saved person. That person worships God correctly because they have the will and love of God in their hearts. In other words, they worship correctly and in line with the word of God, which is the Truth. Of course Jesus is the Word of God, the Truth. So we can say correctly that they worship in Spirit and in Truth.

"John 4: 23, 24
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. "

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

Jesus means Salvation, but also a cuss word. I prefer His original name, Yeshua.

 

[PennEd]

The context makes it very clear. Born of water = born of flesh (when your mommies water broke). The second birth is when you are born of the Holy Spirit (when you yield to Jesus at the moment of Salvation).

John
3:4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and [of] the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

This makes sense to me.

I'm assuming the aborted or stillbirths are covered by the Blood of Christ in your reasoning?

 

[Snacks]

Jesus means Salvation, but also a cuss word. I prefer His original name, Yeshua.

Jesus is not a cuss word.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

Jesus is not a cuss word.

Come on, you know what I mean. To those who blurt out his name as a cuss word, all this name means is a cuss word, nothing more.

 

[FlyingDove]

In John 3: 5 Jesus talks about being born of water and the Spirit, what does this mean? Also, why can't one enter into the kingdom of God because of this?
John 3: 5
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Like you, I read many views, I'll add mine as well.

John 3:
1 There was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:

2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.

3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
(MY NOTE: Every human is born physically, born AGAIN is speaking to a spiritual birth, No reference to water here)

4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
(MY NOTE: This man is a "Doctor of Jewish Law". Abd is clueless as to what Born again/spiritual birth is)

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
(MY NOTE: Water & Spirit, no mention of baptism. The key context FLESH comes in the next verse)

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
(MY NOTE: I see this verse as the key to answering the OP question. FLESH is FLESH, natural/fleshly birth begins in the womb (amniotic sac) with WATER bursting. Spiritual birth comes via the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Only Jesus preforms this baptism (Matt 3:11, Lk 3:16, Mk 1:8, Jn 1:33, Acts 1:4-5, 2:38, 10:45, 11:16). These verses eliminate salvation for fallen angels (spirit beings). One must be born FIRST in the flesh/physically in order to be born again-spiritually)

 

[CS1]

In John 3: 5 Jesus talks about being born of water and the Spirit, what does this mean? Also, why can't one enter into the kingdom of God because of this?
John 3: 5
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Jesus told "Nicodemus you must be born again" John chapter 3. Nicodemus did not understand this and said how can a man be born again when he is grown? Can he enter the second time into his mother's womb?

Jesus told Him do not to overthink or be surprised at what I said ( Marvel) You are born once(of water) as all are, now you must be born of the Spirit.

 

[Wansvic]

Jesus comment makes perfect sense upon review of every detailed NT conversion experience. They all involve water and Spirit. Not one single group of humanity was excluded from the need to submit to water baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus for the remission of sin and receive the Holy Ghost.

I have included each of the detailed experiences as confirmation of this truth:

Acts 2:38-39 (Jewish)
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

Acts 8:12-17 (Samaritans-half jewish-half gentile)
But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done.
Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:
Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:
(For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)
Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.

Acts 10:43-48 (Gentiles)
43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.
While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

Acts 11:13-14
And he shewed us how he had seen an angel in his house, which stood and said unto him, Send men to Joppa, and call for Simon, whose surname is Peter;
Who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved.

Acts 19:2-6 (Disciples who did not realize they had to water baptized in Jesus name)
He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.
And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.
Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

Acts 9:17-18
And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.
And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized.

Acts 22:14-16 (Paul's water baptism)
And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.
For thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard.
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.