Was Jesus a rich or poor man, when on earth?

[blueluna5]

Simple enough. Just show clear and convincing evidence from the scriptures that Jesus was rich. Not conjecture, but clear evidence. I can show you very many scriptures that indicate He wasn't rich. What have you got?

Okay, here it goes:

For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich. 2 Corinthians 8:9

Passage doesn't say he was rich in heaven. It says he was rich.

Vast caravans of camels will converge on you, the camels of Midian and Ephah. The people of Sheba will bring gold and frankincense and will come worshiping the LORD. Isaiah 60:6

The old testament told us he received treasures from a caravan of camels!

And when they had come into the house, they saw the young Child with Mary His mother, and fell down and worshiped Him. And when they had opened their treasures, they presented gifts to Him: gold, frankincense, and myrrh. Matthew 2:11

Jesus lived in a house (not a manger or homeless) and had treasures presented to him.

Then the soldiers, when they had crucified Jesus, took His garments and made four parts, to each soldier a part, and also the tunic. Now the tunic was without seam, woven from the top in one piece. They said therefore among themselves, “Let us not tear it, but cast lots for it, whose it shall be,” that the Scripture might be fulfilled which says: “They divided My garments among them, And for My clothing they cast lots.” Therefore the soldiers did these things. John 19:23-24

They divided Jesus's clothes, bc they must have been expensive.


John 12:6 judas didn’t say this because he cared about the poor but because he was a thief. He was in charge of the money-bag and would steal part of what was put in it.

Judas would steal from it and no one noticed... other than Jesus obviously knew.

What are your verses saying he was always poor. The key is always... he gave to the poor.

 

[Adstar]

We were told he was rich. It's man who is changing the words.

For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich. 2 Corinthians 8:9

It literally says he was rich... not rich in heaven, but rich. He gave it to others, but had it. It has a dual meaning, real and spiritual.

Here are more:

Then He called His twelve disciples together and gave them power and authority over all demons, and to cure diseases. He sent them to preach the kingdom of God and to heal the sick. And He said to them, “Take nothing for the journey, neither staffs nor bag nor bread nor money; and do not have two tunics apiece.” Luke 9:1-3

The people around him had money and were told not to bring it.

Then the soldiers, when they had crucified Jesus, took His garments and made four parts, to each soldier a part, and also the tunic. Now the tunic was without seam, woven from the top in one piece. They said therefore among themselves, “Let us not tear it, but cast lots for it, whose it shall be,” that the Scripture might be fulfilled which says: “They divided My garments among them, And for My clothing they cast lots.” Therefore the soldiers did these things. John 19:23-24

They divided his clothes for the wealth.

Speaking of Judas
John 12:6 He didn’t say this because he cared about the poor but because he was a thief. He was in charge of the money-bag and would steal part of what was put in it.

Jesus had so much money Judas was stealing from it and no one even noticed. I mean obviously Jesus knew.

I think about all the rich prophets of the old testament. How blessed would Mary and Joseph have been to raise God's son. I mean obviously it would have been pretty cool, but God would have paid them for it. Hence the caravans of camels.

I grew up never praying for money, became an adult never praying for money, to an adult struggling to pay bills never praying for money to stopping charity bc I couldn't afford it. So then I thought maybe I'll ask God for help financially. Which led me here. 🤔 I feel guilty not having the money to help others. I should mention the money seems to be coming in a lot more now too, and I have no guilt over it knowing it's from God.

Well you are clearly set on your doctrine that Jesus was a rich man.. Even though it is clearly false.. No further point discussing this with you..

 

[ResidentAlien]

Okay, here it goes:

For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich. 2 Corinthians 8:9

Passage doesn't say he was rich in heaven. It says he was rich.

Vast caravans of camels will converge on you, the camels of Midian and Ephah. The people of Sheba will bring gold and frankincense and will come worshiping the LORD. Isaiah 60:6

The old testament told us he received treasures from a caravan of camels!

And when they had come into the house, they saw the young Child with Mary His mother, and fell down and worshiped Him. And when they had opened their treasures, they presented gifts to Him: gold, frankincense, and myrrh. Matthew 2:11

Jesus lived in a house (not a manger or homeless) and had treasures presented to him.

Then the soldiers, when they had crucified Jesus, took His garments and made four parts, to each soldier a part, and also the tunic. Now the tunic was without seam, woven from the top in one piece. They said therefore among themselves, “Let us not tear it, but cast lots for it, whose it shall be,” that the Scripture might be fulfilled which says: “They divided My garments among them, And for My clothing they cast lots.” Therefore the soldiers did these things. John 19:23-24

They divided Jesus's clothes, bc they must have been expensive.

John 12:6 judas didn’t say this because he cared about the poor but because he was a thief. He was in charge of the money-bag and would steal part of what was put in it.

Judas would steal from it and no one noticed... other than Jesus obviously knew.

What are your verses saying he was always poor. The key is always... he gave to the poor.

I didn't say He was "poor," I said He wasn't rich. The fact that He wasn't wealthy in the prosperity gospel sense of wealthy is self-evident to anyone who's read the scriptures. All those scriptures you posted are nothing but conjecture; none of them say directly that Jesus was a filthy rich man like the prosperity preachers assert. You've chosen to believe them for some reason so don't let me get in the way of a good fantasy. Later.

 

[seekingthemindofChrist]

1. Mary was a descendent of king David and therefore had generational wealth.

Luke 2:21-24

"And when eight days were accomplished for the circumcising of the child, his name was called JESUS, which was so named of the angel before he was conceived in the womb. And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord; (As it is written in the law of the Lord, Every male that openeth the womb shall be called holy to the Lord) And to offer a sacrifice according to that which is said in the law of the Lord, A pair of turtledoves, or two young pigeons."

This is what it says "in the law of the Lord":

Leviticus 12:1-8

"And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a woman have conceived seed, and born a man child: then she shall be unclean seven days; according to the days of the separation for her infirmity shall she be unclean. And in the eighth day the flesh of his foreskin shall be circumcised. And she shall then continue in the blood of her purifying three and thirty days; she shall touch no hallowed thing, nor come into the sanctuary, until the days of her purifying be fulfilled. But if she bear a maid child, then she shall be unclean two weeks, as in her separation: and she shall continue in the blood of her purifying threescore and six days. And when the days of her purifying are fulfilled, for a son, or for a daughter, she shall bring a lamb of the first year for a burnt offering, and a young pigeon, or a turtledove, for a sin offering, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, unto the priest: Who shall offer it before the LORD, and make an atonement for her; and she shall be cleansed from the issue of her blood. This is the law for her that hath born a male or a female. And if she be not able to bring a lamb, then she shall bring two turtles, or two young pigeons; the one for the burnt offering, and the other for a sin offering: and the priest shall make an atonement for her, and she shall be clean."

Most Bible versions read "and if she cannot afford a lamb" in verse 8:

https://biblehub.com/leviticus/12-8.htm

Seeing how Mary did not bring a lamb, but brought two turtledoves or two pigeons instead, this seems to indicate that she was not wealthy at that time.

 

[seekingthemindofChrist]

3. Wise men brought his the best riches in those days.

Contrary to the many false depictions in idolatrous nativity scenes around the world, the Magi did not visit Jesus while he was lying in a manger. In reality, they did not arrive until Jesus was a young child and living in a house.

Matthew 2:11

"And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense, and myrrh."

Prior to receiving this gold, Mary was apparently too poor to afford a lamb for an offering as I documented in my previous post.

That does not sound like "generational wealth" to me.

 

[Webers.Home]

.

Psalm 50 for one example! verse 10-12

When the Word of John 1:1-3 came into the world as the flesh of John 1:14,
he didn't come as divine flesh; rather, he came as Jewish flesh (Rom 8:3 &
Heb 2:16) and brought no personal possessions with him, not even so much
as the swaddling clothes in which his mother wrapped him.

Jesus who owned his own home! (Mark 2:15)

The "his house" spoken of in verse 15 was probably Levi's (vs 14) seeing as Jesus
declared he had no place of his own to even spend the night. (Matt 8:20)

* One of the oldest creeds in Christendom is that Jesus was fully God and
fully Man. Well; many of the comments that I encounter on Christian forums
speak of him as if he were a demigod; which is a being who is half human
and half divine instead of completely human and completely divine. Well; if
the Word's flesh was completely human-- as many of us do believe --then we
cannot go about thinking of it as God all the time. There are times in our thinking
when we have take into account the Word's humanness or we'll end up with a very
confusing picture of Jesus.
_

 

[Webers.Home]

.

And when they had come into the house, they saw the young Child with
Mary His mother, and fell down and worshiped Him. And when they had
opened their treasures, they presented gifts to Him: gold, frankincense, and
myrrh. Matthew 2:11

Jesus lived in a house (not a manger or homeless)

The house spoken of in that passage was located in Bethlehem (Matt 2:1-6)
Jesus' home was in Nazareth. (Matt 2:23, et al)

The inn spoken of in Luke 2:27 wasn't a distinct structure like a motel. In
those days, inns were more like what we might call a B&B, bed and
breakfast, which usually consisted of spare rooms in a private home.
Travelers were in town only for the purpose of the taxation and likely
returned to their own homes when the registration was completed, thus
giving Joseph opportunity to move his family indoors as space became
available.
_

 

[blueluna5]

The items given Jesus as an infant were no doubt adequate to finance the
family's sojourn in Egypt, and possibly then some; but I seriously doubt it all
stretched enough to make them self sufficient for 30 years. The very fact
that Jesus' dad worked for a living tells us something about the family's
financial condition.

According to Ps 69:12 & Isa 53:3, Jesus wasn't all that respected in his
community, Had his family been wealthy, the good citizens of Nazareth
would've treated him much better. (Prov 14:20)



Jesus was on track to become a high priest. According to Heb 2:17, it's
important that high priests be able to identify with their constituents. Well;
in Jesus' case, the vast majority of his responsibility is focused upon
ordinary folk. (1Cor 1:26)

For example: I was a professional welder 40 years before retiring in 2006.
Myself a blue collar worker finds it much easier to relate to Jesus as blue
collar than had he been privileged.
_

God didn't say not to work for money if you're rich.

I'm not sure Jesus was hated when younger. He was invited to a wedding. In those days they didn't invite the poor to weddings hence.... this verse.

But when you give a banquet, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed. Although they cannot repay you, you will be repaid at the resurrection of the righteous.

The hate for Jesus came when he was crucified and from the Pharisees. The Pharisees brainwashed the jews like media does now. He had thousands of followers though and was very popular.

Did they have blue collar back then? I

.



The house spoken of in that passage was located in Bethlehem (Matt 2:1-6)
Jesus' home was in Nazareth. (Matt 2:23, et al)

The inn spoken of in Luke 2:27 wasn't a distinct structure like a motel. In
those days, inns were more like what we might call a B&B, bed and
breakfast, which usually consisted of spare rooms in a private home.
Travelers were in town only for the purpose of the taxation and likely
returned to their own homes when the registration was completed, thus
giving Joseph opportunity to move his family indoors as space became
available.
_

Yes because he was 2 they say when the wise men came to give treasures.

How did they afford a house being so poor? 🤔 Maybe being born in a manger had nothing to do with being poor and instead was symbolic of christ being the sacrificial lamb.

 

[blueluna5]

I'm wondering why you have to make Jesus rich to be rich. Is it because if he's rich you're entitled to be rich? But you're saying he's rich because he's a king as the op. Are you a king? Are you God's son who is God? I don't see that people are going to bring you gold frankenscense and mur. Maybe the preacher you heard gets too much money and fells guilty. Some people trust in fancy suits and rich preachers but the real Christian gives doesn't take. When Naman offered money to the prophet for his healing the prophet said it is not time to accept riches.

Because Jesus being rich changes literally everything. I grew up my whole life being told and believing Jesus was poor. Little baby born in a barn, poor, and then beaten and killed. I remember telling God why did you make him suffer so much?! That is not a God of blessing and life. What was the point of it all? Then I understood the point of the Crucifixion, but not the constant suffering. You see God allows evil for the greater good, but there was no good that came from Jesus being poor his whole life.

Why do the rich get richer and the poor pray to God while they perpetuate a lie? Jesus wasn't poor..... he gave a lot of his riches away by the end. But God had blessed him. God had blessed Mary and Joseph for listening to him! Mary had to go through labor and moving. Everything for God. Why make her poor for having faith?

So while it's true Satan makes people rich for his evil gain, it's also true that riches actually come from God!
"And the gold of that land is good" Genesis 2:12

God literally says wealth and abundance are "good."

Jesus having money means that God wants his children to have money in order to expand his kingdom for the greater good. To thrive and not just survive paying bills. We weren't created to be robots, but to be creative and make a difference.

 

[Webers.Home]

.
● Isa 52:13 . . Behold, My servant will prosper; he will be high and lifted up,
and greatly exalted.

The Word's flesh came into the world with limited acclaim, but departed the
world highly honored by means of the Father making that man His heir
apparent.

● John 3:35 . . The Father loves the Son and has placed everything in his
hands.

● Heb 1:1-2 . . In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets
at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to
us by His son, whom He appointed heir of all things

Now the benefit of this for us is nigh unto impossible to believe.

Christ's believing followers have been adopted into God's family, thus
making them eligible for an inheritance.

● Rom 8:14-17 . . For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear
again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry
out: Abba! Father! The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we
are children of God, and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs
with Christ. (cf. Gal 4:4-7, Eph 1:4-5)

The Greek word translated "fellow heirs" actually means joint heirs; a.k.a.
heirs in common. Here's how that plays out:

A joint-heir is different than a regular heir. Regular heirs are apportioned an
individual percentage of their benefactor's estate. But joint-heirs inherit, not
a percentage, but the entire estate, as community property, i.e. whatever
the Father bequeathed Christ, that He also bequeathed everyone unified
with Christ.

For example: supposing a benefactor's estate totals 60 acres of land, 18
gold bars, a fleet of antique cars, plus a hedge fund worth 12 million US
Dollars; and he left it all to six heirs in common. In that situation; the heirs
are corporately one beneficiary instead of six; viz: all six inherit all the land,
all the gold, all the cars, and the entire fund as if each one were the only
heir.

The extent of the Father's estate is astonishing. It encompasses not only all
that is in Heaven, but also all in the entire universe, plus whatever pertains
to the new cosmos spoken of in Isa 66:17, 2Pet 3:13, and Rev 21:1; and I
don't know what else.

● John 16:15 . . All things that the Father has are mine

Point being: folks stuck in perdition are wretched paupers in the afterlife,
whereas those unified with Christ are wealthy and privileged beyond
imagination.
_

 

[brighthouse98]

Webers.home The Word says his. Probably is not in there. LOL, we go by what the Word says, we do not add or subtract from it. Your reference to Matt 8:20 Where was Jesus at?? he sure was not near his home, and he was talking to a scribe verse 19 who stated he would be followed.

This is what happens when some take the Word and twist it to fit their ideology. To the world it looked like Jesus was in need, but the only need Jesus ever had was to be loved by us! Whoever has loved another and has been rejected? We also know how that feels. BUT!!! When are you loved back how great is that love?? SO GREAT is God's love for us!!

 

[Anni]

@blueluna5
I found this website about how detrimental it is for Christians to believe Jesus was poor.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/LIVING/wayoflife/12/25/RichJesus/index.html#:~:text=Anderson says Jesus couldn't,traveled in style, he says.[/QUOTE]

The website is CNN news.
The article is from 2009 about a prosperity teachers, Rev. C. Thomas Anderson in particular.
It also quotes other church leaders to give a balanced article.

In those days they didn't invite the poor to weddings hence.... this verse.
Weddings at this time were for close family, friends & guests poor or not.

As an older woman & your sister in Christ, I instruct you to learn about the history & customs of the time. Titus 2:3-4
Before you speak/post THINK, test the words you use to ensure Biblical truth...

Psalm 139:23-24 NIV
23 Search me, God, and know my heart;
test me and know my anxious thoughts.
24 See if there is any offensive way in me,
and lead me in the way everlasting.

You have a choice to make, you asked the question in the thread title, you have both sides of the debate so prayerfully consider your decision which way you will follow.
Our loving heavenly Father,
I ask that you would guide my young sister to choose wisely the way forward, bless her with much wisdom.
Help her learn & grow.
Search her heart & show her what is not right.
In Jesus Name, through the Holy Spirit.
Amen

 

[Webers.Home]

.
You gotta love unsolicited spiritual counseling. If it doesn't pan out, nobody
feels swindled because it's free; sort of like an opinion that's worth 2¢.
_

 

[Locoponydirtman]

Mary was a descendent of king David and therefore had generational wealth.

Not all the decendants of David would have generational wealth. She was in a small town known for not being special at all.

Staying in a manger was because there was no room, NOT no money.

And so what, a person rich could send someone ahead and procure a place or even just buy a house to stay in ahead of time, rather than make a trip and hope for a place to stay when ya get there.

Wise men brought his the best riches in those days.

Volume of the gifta are not told, maybe it supplied their stay in Egypt.

King Herod felt threatened because rumors of another rich king (aka Jesus) was born and he ordered to kill all babies under 2 for it. Makes way more sense if Jesus was rich.

All means all not just rich. The assumption of rich due to this is a non sequitor.

Mary was told at the wedding there was no more wine. Why go to her and Jesus? They didn't know he could turn water into wine as he had never done that. They would go to rich people who could afford to help.

Its not told as to why Mary was concerned abiut the wine. She may have beem serving. Also so knew who Jesus is and what He was capable of. Im sure she saw things prior. Notice she said do what He says. Also note He said my time has not yet come. Clearly she expected some miracle. Rather than Him to run to vintner and purchase wine. Context ....

Jesus had 12 disciples with families follow him. Would they just let their families starve?

Who said they had wives and children. Looks to me as though they were working for their fathers mostly except the tax collecter. Maybe he had money.

Joseph was a carpenter and it was a highly respected occupation back then. Plus he was "the" carpenter indicating he was very good at what he did.

Why would capenter be any more respected than any of the trades. Black smith, potter, etc. Also the carpenter, the black smith, the potter, the baker, all just trades. In a small town like Bethlehem why would there be many?

Jesus had a treasurer. Poor people don't need treasurers

To tend the the alms for the poor so He didnt have to tend it himself. Not an indication of being rich. Even very poor churches have treasurers.

Thousands of people would not follow someone poor. Knowing people, I just don't see this happening. How could he help them if he couldn't help himself?

Who said poor means cant help ones self? self sufficiency has been a hallmark of the poor for ages. Until modern times anyway.
Many people followed many poor teachers and philosophers through out the ages.

My poit is that none of this indicates poor or rich. Its a false assumption.

It seems to me what ever pastor this is peached a message to suit his agenda and used very flawed logic and scripture twisting to do it. I never listen to this guy again.

 

[Locoponydirtman]

Jesus and his disciples walked most places rather than ride animals or even wagons. There is a paticular passage where the disciples and Jesus are walking along and picking grain along the way. The edges of fields were left for the poor. Was Jesus allowing his disciples to steal what was left for the poor? Or where they following what was right and customary according to the law?
Jesus abandoned his working class life style to fulfill his ministry and found himself as he said "having no place to lay his head" at night. And they found themselves pulling grain from the edges of fields as they went.
This is not the life of a rich person, this is the life of a person relying on God to supply every need. Be it hospitality or self sufficiency or picking grain from fields as they went.
If one notice when need arose to feed the thousands. It wasnt going into towns to buy supplies, they said they would have enough to do that. Rather it was a miraculous working of Christ to feed the multitudes.

I think it is a serious error to assume Jesus was operating on earthly riches and relying on mamon rather than faith.

 

[selahsays]

I watched a pastor on YouTube explain how Jesus was actually very rich when on earth. He made a lot of valid points and basically I feel like I've been lied to again.

The reasons are as follow:

1. Mary was a descendent of king David and therefore had generational wealth.
2. Staying in a manger was because there was no room, NOT no money.
3. Wise men brought his the best riches in those days.
4. King Herod felt threatened because rumors of another rich king (aka Jesus) was born and he ordered to kill all babies under 2 for it. Makes way more sense if Jesus was rich.
5. Mary was told at the wedding there was no more wine. Why go to her and Jesus? They didn't know he could turn water into wine as he had never done that. They would go to rich people who could afford to help.
6. Jesus had 12 disciples with families follow him. Would they just let their families starve?
7. Joseph was a carpenter and it was a highly respected occupation back then. Plus he was "the" carpenter indicating he was very good at what he did.
8. Jesus had a treasurer. Poor people don't need treasurers.
9. The Roman soldiers cut the cloth of Jesus's clothes and divided it among themselves indicating value. They couldn't cut the outer coat bc it was seamless and made of 1 piece. It was designed for kings to wear.
10. Thousands of people would not follow someone poor. Knowing people, I just don't see this happening. How could he help them if he couldn't help himself?

What do you think? Is Jesus rich or poor?

Even deeper... if he was/is rich, why the big cover up? Why do they not want the children of God to know he was rich on earth?

Jesus is beyond rich! He paid an enormous price for us! He paid it ALL!

“Jesus paid it all
All to Him I owe
Sin had left a crimson stain
He washed it white as snow”

 

[Webers.Home]

.
In an entertaining movie called The Name Of The Rose, starring Sean
Connery; clergymen high up on the Church's hierarchy met to discuss a hot
button theological question that went something like this:

Did the Christ own the clothes that he wore or not?

(chuckle) That's right up there with Nero distracted with trifles while Rome
burned down around him. And sort of like the five silly girls who ran off to
buy oil for their lamps and thus missing out on the wedding party.
_

 

[Magenta]

Peter was married, at least at one time, since he had a mother-in-law who was healed by Jesus at
their home in Capernaum (Matthew 8:14–17, Mark 1:29–31, Luke 4:38); he could have been widowed.

 

[Magenta]

For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes
He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich. 2 Corinthians 8:9

This chocolate cake is very rich. Yes, that MUST mean it has a lotta lotta money .

 

[Cameron143]

This chocolate cake is very rich. Yes, that MUST mean it has a lotta lotta money .

View attachment 257010

It's obviously very valuable because everyone is trying to get it.