Understanding God’s election

[Magenta]

Does scripture actually say that we all are going to be judged by our deeds and works ?

Our works get judged, yes, but then again if we are actually in Christ Jesus we have already passed from death to life, and

Romans 8:1-2; 5:57 + 58b

 

[Magenta]

“But because of your stubbornness ( not you sister but the person who’s being stubborn ) and your unrepentant heart,
you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed.

Yes, this is the heart of the natural man, no doubt about it. I can be pretty stubborn too (still) but once my heart
was changed and after God had revealed Himself to me in a number of ways over quite a few years my resistance
was worn down to nothing, hallelujah! So many complain about God forcing people when what Scripture actually
says is that we are enabled. And to tell you the truth as I have already said, if in truth God did force me I praise
Him for loving me so much He overrode the natural man's hostility in me so I could love Him. Tho as I have
also already said, I do not believe I was forced, and I think it mostly a deliberate misrepresentation for
people to present being enabled as being coerced against one's will, kidnapped as one despicably said.

 

[Magenta]

But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger.
There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile;

Ephesians 2:1-3 You were dead in your trespasses and sins, in which you used to walk when you conformed to the ways of this world and of the ruler of the power of the air, the spirit who is now at work in the sons of disobedience. All of us also lived among them at one time, fulfilling the cravings of our flesh and indulging its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature children of wrath.

 

[rogerg]

The definition of God's elect is correct. What specific part of this definition do you disagree with?

I disagree all of your definition of election, but as for verse 29, verse 28 defines who is represented by "whom he did foreknow"; that is, only those God "called according to his purpose", not based upon a person's actions nor choices, but God's - the "For" of V29 makes V29 a continuation V28.

 

[Cranberry]

The illuminating power of the word of is the Spirit. We are born again by water and the Spirit. The Spirit is pretty easy. Water there is the word of God according to 1 Peter 1:23.
Jesus is the word and the Spirit is the spirit of Christ.

I think there are enough verses in the Bible to show we as ones it says are separated from God cannot then understand the things of God unless he makes it so.

Isaiah 6 shows God insures there to be no understanding if he wills it so.

Jesus in Matthew 13 told us why he teaches in parables.

For me my experience with conversations with unbelievers shows there to be a wall against the teachings of God.

And this world and what occurs as crime against one another is a symptom of fallen nature.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Our works get judged, yes, but then again if we are actually in Christ Jesus we have already passed from death to life, and

Romans 8:1-2; 5:57 + 58b

right but both the dead and living will be judged

“I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; and they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.”
‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭4:1-4‬ ‭

“And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and dead.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭10:42‬ ‭

it’s the whole remission of sins thing sis the very next line look what happens after we learn that part and acknolwedge it

“And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and dead. To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.

While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭10:42-44‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Peter summarized it all of course but these gentiles had already been hearing the gospel as well

“Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: but in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him. The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭10:34-36‬ ‭KJV‬‬

He goes on to summarize his ministry death and resurrection and then also says

“that word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judæa, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭10:37‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We see that Jesus fame and glory began to spread immediately even before his death people had heard about Jesus other gentiles actually and came to see about him.

Jesus himself and the gospel that’s all about him is what God has done to save and enable mankind part of the process of grace is learning repentance and obedience which also is found in the gospel and epistles so that our works are reformed and we don’t have to be punished for them

 

[Magenta]

I think there are enough verses in the Bible to show we as ones it says are separated from God cannot then understand the things of God unless he makes it so.

Isaiah 6 shows God insures there to be no understanding if he wills it so.

Jesus in Matthew 13 told us why he teaches in parables.

For me my experience with conversations with unbelievers shows there to be a wall against the teachings of God.

And this world and what occurs as crime against one another is a symptom of fallen nature.

Many here outright deny that God enables/makes it possible, which they call
instead being forced, or coerced, or even kidnapped against one's "free" will.

They make no distinction between the natural man and the spiritual man, and ascribe to the former what only the latter can do.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Ephesians 2:1-3 You were dead in your trespasses and sins, in which you used to walk when you conformed to the ways of this world and of the ruler of the power of the air, the spirit who is now at work in the sons of disobedience. All of us also lived among them at one time, fulfilling the cravings of our flesh and indulging its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature children of wrath.

I have a few things I need to do dear sister I will be back later . I hope you enjoy your coffee lol I’m out to buy a cup myself if I can find a normal cup of coffee out there without some fr each name or itslian style latte this or that Cappachino yadda I don’t like that stuff

 

[Magenta]

I have a few things I need to do dear sister I will be back later . I hope you enjoy your coffee lol I’m out to buy a cup myself if I can find a normal cup of coffee out there without some fr each name or itslian style latte this or that Cappachino yadda I don’t like that stuff

Ugh, no, I don't want that fancy schmancy stuff either, just coffee! Good luck, bro, and enjoy!

Uh, coffee with cream and sweetener, that is

 

[Intersection]

I disagree all of your definition of election, but as for verse 29, verse 28 defines who is represented by "whom he did foreknow"; that is, only those God "called according to his purpose", not based upon a person's actions nor choices, but God's - the "For" of V29 makes V29 a continuation V28.

Sine the definition of God's elect has the Trinity, you deny the Trinity.

Matthew 10:33
But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

 

[cv5]

They make no distinction between the natural man and the spiritual man, and ascribe to the former what only the latter can do.

There you go again, like a broken record.
You do NOT rightly comprehend this concept.

Then follows the entire Calvinite dogma, most of it likewise folly.

 

[rogerg]

Sine the definition of God's elect has the Trinity, you deny the Trinity.

Matthew 10:33
But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

Not to be rude, but that makes no sense whatsoever. I do not deny the Trinity. God's elect are those He chose before the
foundation of the world unto salvation

[1Pe 1:2 KJV] 2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

[Luk 18:7 KJV] 7 And shall not God avenge his own elect, which cry day and night unto him, though he bear long with them?
[Rom 8:33 KJV] 33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? [It is] God that justifieth.
[Col 3:12 KJV] 12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;
[Tit 1:1 KJV] 1 Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

 

[Intersection]

Not to be rude, but that makes no sense whatsoever. I do not deny the Trinity. God's elect are those He chose before the
foundation of the world unto salvation

[1Pe 1:2 KJV] 2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

[Luk 18:7 KJV] 7 And shall not God avenge his own elect, which cry day and night unto him, though he bear long with them?
[Rom 8:33 KJV] 33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? [It is] God that justifieth.
[Col 3:12 KJV] 12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;
[Tit 1:1 KJV] 1 Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

The definition of God's elect is correct. What specific part of this definition do you disagree with?

The Elect of God Defined.

The elect of God are those who God foreknown would, as believers without willful unbelief, ultimately choose to cooperate with His grace within the sound doctrine of Jesus Christ and the promptings of the Holy Spirit.

 

[Rufus]

They are not the same. Executing someone? And, offering no room at your house???

The fact that you can equate the two is telling of your lack of capacity to reason sanely.



2 John 10-11

If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take them into your house
or welcome them. Anyone who welcomes them shares in their wicked work.

I didn't equate the two. YOU did! Evidently, 2Jn 10-11 inspired YOU to relate that story.

 

[rogerg]

The definition of God's elect is correct. What specific part of this definition do you disagree with?

That the elect are so not because of their actions or belief - they did not choose God, God chose them. They are solely the
recipients of that. Did you read 1 Pe 1:2, the "through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ", part?

 

[Cameron143]

Here is a thought. Unfathomable to the Calvinites? Perhaps. But not my problem.

[Jos 5:13 NIV]
Now when Joshua was near Jericho, he looked up and saw a man standing in front of him with a drawn sword in his hand. Joshua went up to him and asked, "Are you for us or for our enemies?"

[Jos 5:14 NIV]
"Neither," he replied, "but as commander of the army of the LORD I have now come." Then Joshua fell facedown to the ground in reverence, and asked him, "What message does my Lord have for his servant?"

[Jos 5:15 NIV]
The commander of the LORD's army replied, "Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is holy." And Joshua did so.

This isn't about salvation, but a change in leadership. Look at the similarities of this and God coming to Moses in the burning bush.

 

[Cameron143]

Oh and another thing:
There were TONS of unsaved Israelites.
And you thought God is saving them against their own will did you?

And there were also TONS of saved Israelites as well.

What pray tell was the cause of this DIVISION?

I've never said God saves anyone against their will. Another strawman argument from you. And God not saving all of Israel was to show that salvation is not through natural birth, but supernatural.

 

[Intersection]

That the elect are so not because of their actions or belief - they did not choose God, God chose them. They are solely the
recipients of that. Did you read 1 Pe 1:2, the "through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ", part?

Thank You!

 

[Cameron143]

Hyper-Calvinites have a penchant to humiliate, denigrate and despise the "non-chosenites".
This pattern of behavior is a "tell". Of the most ominous kind.

Can you give an example of this? I keep hearing this, but when I go through the threads asking for prayer and advice and help, I see them filled with those of the reformed faith offering help.

 

[Magenta]

I've never said God saves anyone against their will. Another strawman argument from you. And God
not saving all of Israel was to show that salvation is not through natural birth, but supernatural.

The truth is hard for some to accept so they make up lies instead.

They've exchanged the truth about God for a lie...