Ukraine the bad guy?

[ZNP]

This is a funny debate. All those who are pushing for others to go fight in Ukraine don't actually want to go themselves, they just think other Americans should pay for it and also help fight it.

Meanwhile those who don't want to pay for this war or go and fight keep saying, no thanks, you be my guest.

I wonder how many ways you can tell others they should pay billions for this war and how many ways people can say no thanks?

 

[cv5]

That's not what I was meaning made no sense. the Kremlin is saying that the US and Ukraine attempted an assassination against Putin. If this were true then it would not have been by drone attack because it doesn't carry weapons that would penetrate something fortified like a bomb shelter(Kremlin). So the only outcome of a drone attack against Putin's home/Kremlin would be Zelensky now has a target on him and his family with vengeance. Kiev is now going to be the primary target and Zelensky. What about the US and Biden if this is true then the US has just committed an act of war by helping with the attempted assassination of the leader of Russia. And so the only outcome of this would be retaliation and a full declaration of war. I would not see that any military leader in the US nor Ukraine would suggest to attempt to strike the Kremlin/Putin unless they were fully prepared for war.

Maybe......but doubtful IMO.
The pathetic drone attack was a nothingburger. Was likely undertaken within Moscow by Ukrainian sympathizers and agents.

I do not see this conflict escalating for that reason. But I certainly could be mistaken.

 

[Susanna]

This is a funny debate. All those who are pushing for others to go fight in Ukraine don't actually want to go themselves, they just think other Americans should pay for it and also help fight it.

Meanwhile those who don't want to pay for this war or go and fight keep saying, no thanks, you be my guest.

I wonder how many ways you can tell others they should pay billions for this war and how many ways people can say no thanks?

It’s pretty clear that the people you’re mocking didn’t want this war. They’re not pushing others. Russia wanted the war. Maybe Ukraine should let the Russians roll in and “liberate” the country? Wouldn’t that sit well with you? Because that’s actually what you’re saying.

 

[ZNP]

It’s pretty clear that the people you’re mocking didn’t want this war. They’re not pushing others. Russia wanted the war. Maybe Ukraine should let the Russians roll in and “liberate” the country? Wouldn’t that sit well with you? Because that’s actually what you’re saying.

that is not what I am saying, no Susanna the US army is equitable, and so is the Ukraine army, they take women. I support your right to go to Ukraine and fight and die for what you feel is right.

 

[Fundaamental]

The reasons for wars are all a front to use humans as guinea pigs for satan and his army, who thirst bloodshed suffering depression poverty fear and division.
To rule the world by fear.
You'll probably find covid was also deliberate.


I don't buy into any of the reasons for war there all in it together.
it's alway same old stupid excuse,
that gets publicly promoted before the war starts.

The leaders of this world are all doing the work of satan there all in it together , where just the guinea pigs who buy into there deliberate plans to get a war started. They always have been and always will, they've all sold there souls to satan the leaders that is.
they all appeal to there homeland nation whilst providing weapons of mass destructions to further keep the war going

Its the same stupid excuse every single war.

Some group goes and plants a virus then the war starts,
Some dictator rises out of no where then a war starts.
Some group blows up somewhere then a war starts
Some nation is producing weapons of mass destruction then a war start.
Some group starts killing religious people then a war starts.

On an on an on.

 

[Susanna]

that is not what I am saying, no Susanna the US army is equitable, and so is the Ukraine army, they take women. I support your right to go to Ukraine and fight and die for what you feel is right.

You’re dodging my point. I wasted my time reading something completely unrelated to my post. Try again.

 

[SomeDisciple]

You’re dodging my point. I wasted my time reading something completely unrelated to my post. Try again.

He answered your question; you just didn't like the answer.

 

[cv5]

It’s pretty clear that the people you’re mocking didn’t want this war. They’re not pushing others. Russia wanted the war. Maybe Ukraine should let the Russians roll in and “liberate” the country? Wouldn’t that sit well with you? Because that’s actually what you’re saying.

So get off your keister and get down there and fight this righteous war. Seeing that you are so zealous and avid to promote it.
You, your kids, grandpa, nephews, nieces, brothers sisters whoever is available.

There is NO DOUBT whatsoever that you and yours could be earning $$$mega-bux$$$ as paid mercenaries.

Oh and do not be shy with $$$donations$$$. Zelensky and his pals are (always) looking to upgrade to the latest German autobahn burners.

But don't dare ask ME to engage in this debacle. Or offer a single solitary dime. I am much too much of a wise-guy in my old age to fall sway to smack talking warmongering nutters.

 

[ZNP]

You’re dodging my point. I wasted my time reading something completely unrelated to my post. Try again.

What is your point? You feel very strongly that Russia is in the wrong, so strongly in fact you want to fight with Russia and pay any cost. I support you, go for it.

However, I do not feel that strongly about it, doesn't mean I think that Russia is not in the wrong, it just means I am going to sit this war out. I also have better things to do with my money. I am not going to tell you what to do, you want to fight, that is your prerogative, you want to send all your money to Ukraine, again, it is your money, do with it as you please.

What kind of a coward would tell others they must go and fight and pay for a war if they aren't willing to do that themselves first? That is my point.

 

[JohnDB]

He answered your question; you just didn't like the answer.

The answer he gave was akin to snow white and the seven dwarves....a complete fairy tale.

So WHY does Russia have a right to invade Ukraine and take ALL their possessions including the Ukranians lives, children, and women.

 

[ZNP]

The answer he gave was akin to snow white and the seven dwarves....a complete fairy tale.

So WHY does Russia have a right to invade Ukraine and take ALL their possessions including the Ukranians lives, children, and women.

Oh, the question is a philosophical one? I thought it was about whether or not the US needs to go to war with Russia over the Ukraine.

But the reality is we are at war with Russia and we are at war with China and no one ever got to vote or debate or have any say in that. Russia has accused the US of twice trying to assassinate Putin, so in the eyes of the rest of the world if they attack us that will be self defense. Finland has 16% inflation, Poland has 18% inflation and that is largely due to sanctions on Russia, fighting in Ukraine instead of negotiated peace, and blowing up the Nordstream pipeline.

You got what you wanted, WWIII, congratulations. Just remember when your city goes up in flames that this is what you were calling for. This is the poisoned apple you have been trying to force down everyone's throat.

 

[Susanna]

The soil must be rich in here. So many straw men usually takes a lot of fertilizer.

I have not promoted the war. I’m saying that Russia is to blame for invading a sovereign country. It’s a waste of time posting here when some people just start attacking you for something not even uttered.

So please, next time, read the posts before responding. It looks incredibly stupid when people are creating straw men and actually believe no one will notice.

 

[Evmur]

Some seem to imagine that Russia is justified in waging war against Ukraine. I would like to know what nation is squeaky clean enough to point the finger at supposedly evil Ukraine. When I look at a country, my first thought is, would I like to live there? Would I prefer America to China? I've not visited China, but I know enough to say that I would rather live in America. It's far from perfect, but you can vote out the administration if you don't like it. Or can be bothered voting.

Would I prefer Russia to Ukraine? No. As has been said, absolute power corrupts absolutely. Putin has entrenched himself in power and who can dislodge him?

America has its own problems. If God is using Russia to punish Ukraine, then watch out Americans. You are no better than Ukraine. China is your nemesis. And Australia will be caught up in the conflict as well.

NATO is like an Al Capone protection racket, they tell a nation if you don't sign up something awful will happen [and they can arrange that something]

NATO is America

When a nation joins NATO it takes over that nation's defence policy, ultimately their foreign policy. America's friends become their friends, America's enemies become their enemies.

NATO is run by fat American generals who have a George S Paton fixation. He hated Russia and believed that sooner or later America must go to war with Russia.

Since the collapse of the USSR their has been NO CAUSE for NATO to creep ever eastwards to hem in Russia on all sides, setting up US military capabilities. Putin has been warning for 30 years that he will not have America on his doorstep.

When a nation joins the EU they take over that nation's trade policy and ultimately that nation's economic policy and the EU has been squeezing Russia trade since it's inception.

You add to that Crimea and the eastern border of Ukraine being ethnically Russian and pro Russia, then you add to that a coup de tat which overthrew the elected government in Kiev with the new government crying "death to the Russian rats" and "Nuke Russia"

You have the seeds of war.

Some of us have been warning about it for more than a decade.

 

[Susanna]

Didn’t Medvedev threaten to sink the UK in a wave of radioactive seawater?

 

[JohnDB]

NATO is like an Al Capone protection racket, they tell a nation if you don't sign up something awful will happen [and they can arrange that something]

NATO is America

When a nation joins NATO it takes over that nation's defence policy, ultimately their foreign policy. America's friends become their friends, America's enemies become their enemies.

NATO is run by fat American generals who have a George S Paton fixation. He hated Russia and believed that sooner or later America must go to war with Russia.

Since the collapse of the USSR their has been NO CAUSE for NATO to creep ever eastwards to hem in Russia on all sides, setting up US military capabilities. Putin has been warning for 30 years that he will not have America on his doorstep.

When a nation joins the EU they take over that nation's trade policy and ultimately that nation's economic policy and the EU has been squeezing Russia trade since it's inception.

You add to that Crimea and the eastern border of Ukraine being ethnically Russian and pro Russia, then you add to that a coup de tat which overthrew the elected government in Kiev with the new government crying "death to the Russian rats" and "Nuke Russia"

You have the seeds of war.

Some of us have been warning about it for more than a decade.

This is so far off the mark....where on earth are you getting your information?

NATO is a defensive treaty....pure and simple. Each member nation is obligated to come to the defense of the others and obligated to spend money on equipment for its own defense as well....and they cannot isolate themselves with equipment that won't coordinate with the other nations.

IOW it's not a way to cheapskate on military expenditures....(ahem France, Greece, Italy)

Currently we are having issues with Hungary....they only grudgingly are siding with NATO that they literally begged to be a part of. And I would be surprised if they weren't giving Russia NATO intelligence.

 

[HeIsHere]

Don’t be so hard on your pedagogical skills.

Yes, that is true my deprogramming skills are limited.

 

[Fundaamental]

NATO is like an Al Capone protection racket, they tell a nation if you don't sign up something awful will happen [and they can arrange that something]

NATO is America

When a nation joins NATO it takes over that nation's defence policy, ultimately their foreign policy. America's friends become their friends, America's enemies become their enemies.

NATO is run by fat American generals who have a George S Paton fixation. He hated Russia and believed that sooner or later America must go to war with Russia.

Since the collapse of the USSR their has been NO CAUSE for NATO to creep ever eastwards to hem in Russia on all sides, setting up US military capabilities. Putin has been warning for 30 years that he will not have America on his doorstep.

When a nation joins the EU they take over that nation's trade policy and ultimately that nation's economic policy and the EU has been squeezing Russia trade since it's inception.

You add to that Crimea and the eastern border of Ukraine being ethnically Russian and pro Russia, then you add to that a coup de tat which overthrew the elected government in Kiev with the new government crying "death to the Russian rats" and "Nuke Russia"

You have the seeds of war.

Some of us have been warning about it for more than a decade.

I agree with every word here apart from the fact that Russia and America will go to war against each other. It's never going to happen but what will happen is the suspicions that one day they will. It's the perception befor the deceptions which keeps the taxpayer believing there taxes are worthy all along, whilst Satan army get to show there glory of fighting wars in a public spectrum without being challenged l. displaying there skills to deceive the world whilst making a whole nation suffer further.

Where all feeding the machine in someway, which is more reason to believe we are in tribulation,
Which means are hard work to make ends meet is used to feed the desires of the rulers of this world satan.

 

[ZNP]

I agree with every word here apart from the fact that Russia and America will go to war against each other. It's never going to happen but what will happen is the suspicions that one day they will.

So in your opinion Russia is only bluffing?

Many other famous military minds were of similar opinion. Pearl harbor was given a warning from radar of the incoming Japanese bombers but decided it wasn't important. With a fifteen minute warning things would have been very different.

Likewise the French were warned of Germany coming through Belgium but ignored that. Many believe had they responded properly the war would have been over right then.

 

[Fundaamental]

So in your opinion Russia is only bluffing?

Many other famous military minds were of similar opinion. Pearl harbor was given a warning from radar of the incoming Japanese bombers but decided it wasn't important. With a fifteen minute warning things would have been very different.

Likewise the French were warned of Germany coming through Belgium but ignored that. Many believe had they responded properly the war would have been over right then.

In. My view Russia America NATO and every wàr has all been a bluff.

The reason for going to war that is was a fix.

It wasn't so long ago trump and Putin where shaking hands with each other.

 

[ZNP]

In. My view Russia America NATO and every wàr has all been a bluff.

The reason for going to war that is was a fix.

It wasn't so long ago trump and Putin where shaking hands with each other.

Oh, and the bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Were they also a bluff?