Three Gods or one? Explain the Trinity.

[Diakonos]

I found the video i was looking for: Watch this one instead:

 

[biker]

Impressive video, I will admit. But what is to say that knowing how the Aramaic was used to write Matthew and translated into Greek was not part of God's plan?

After all, he does say only the Hebrew and Greek have this same number pattern per vowel and consonant. Aramaic is shorthand Hebrew.

 

[Diakonos]

Impressive video, I will admit. But what is to say that knowing how the Aramaic was used to write Matthew and translated into Greek was not part of God's plan?

After all, he does say only the Hebrew and Greek have this same number pattern per vowel and consonant. Aramaic is shorthand Hebrew.

They don’t have the same pattern, but a similar one.
If the Greek letters weren’t exactly arranged the way they were, all of those mathematical properties would not be there. He made the point that it’s literally impossible to reconstruct that, even if you had 1,000 super computers spotting out 400 sequences every second....it would take 4,000,000 years to find a pattern of letters.
It’s just not possible for it to have been man-made or be in another language.

By the way, the same mathematical thing is in the last 12 verses of Mark, same exact thing, thousands of multiples of 7, unexplainable without God’s hand in it
I’m baffled every time I see stuff like this. God is amazing

 

[jaybird88]

Why do you malign the word of God.

personal attacks doesnt help you, it only makes you look like your loosing your composure and thus credibility.

There is no ALTERNATE INTERPRETATION of those verses that say in clear English that all things are created by Jesus.
It may mess up your deal but it clearly, clearly says that.

im not aware of any translation that says Jesus created all things.

You need it to say something different huh?
Your doctrine is poorly thought out.
Systematic theology is scripture interpreting scripture.
You can not accept scripture.

what doctrine of mine are you referring to?

How in the world does like minded believers translate in your mind into "they do not think for themselves"?

thats what you sound like

You ,or me ,or anyone else do not have a single shread of any information that was not taught to you/us.
We all learned it.
You are not some isolated guru with the only correct revelation. Jesus has a body.
The body is connected.
You somehow see that as a very bad thing

i never said i knew all things, you threw an idea out there and i tested it. if i had a belief i believed to be true i would want it tested to determine how reliable it is.

Jay I never got an answer( that I can see).
Instead of a dodge ,where is your doctrine found?

i never presented a doctrine for anything. can you be more specific of what your referring to?

 

[jaybird88]

So you are a Trinitarian?
But you don't believe that there are 3 persons?
....because You don't believe the Holy Spirit is a person?
(short answers would be great)

whats the name of the Holy Spirit?

 

[jaybird88]

Just because something is older, that doesn't mean it's more true. There are thousands of ancient writings about the 1st century, none of which are Scripture. Only 66 books were God-breathed. The Hebrew manuscripts of the O.T.+ 5 chapters of Aramaic in Daniel, and The Greek manuscripts of the N.T.
There are no "original Aramaic inspired manuscripts". Yes some people spoke Aramaic, but the N.T. was written in Koine Greek.
Every New Testament author:
-Matthew
-Mark
-Luke
-John
-Paul
-(Hebrew writer)
-Peter
-James
-Jude
....All of their original scrolls were written in Greek. God chose Greek to be the language he conveys His Word to us in the New testament.

lots of evidence now suggest the gospel of Mathew was in Hebrew.
and i dont think there is anything in scripture that says only 66 books are breathed by the Most High

 

[CS1]

whats the name of the Holy Spirit?

I see in the Old Testament Spirit of the lord , Spirit of the Living God the New Testament Comforter, and Holy Spirit Spirit of God

 

[CS1]

lots of evidence now suggest the gospel of Mathew was in Hebrew.

hmm that is a tough one to agree with

 

[jaybird88]

hmm that is a tough one to agree with

Irenaeus, Against Heresies circa 180 ad -

“Matthew also issued a written Gospel among the Hebrews in their own dialect,”

Eusebius quoting the works of Origen -

“The first is written according to Matthew, the same that was once a tax collector, but afterwards an emissary of Yeshua the Messiah, who having published it for the Jewish believers, wrote it in Hebrew.”

 

[biker]

They don’t have the same pattern, but a similar one.
If the Greek letters weren’t exactly arranged the way they were, all of those mathematical properties would not be there. He made the point that it’s literally impossible to reconstruct that, even if you had 1,000 super computers spotting out 400 sequences every second....it would take 4,000,000 years to find a pattern of letters.
It’s just not possible for it to have been man-made or be in another language.

By the way, the same mathematical thing is in the last 12 verses of Mark, same exact thing, thousands of multiples of 7, unexplainable without God’s hand in it
I’m baffled every time I see stuff like this. God is amazing

And still, it is very possible that something as translating one language to the Greek could still align the Greek perfectly even if the other language was out of sequence. Mathematics is my second Major. You can do multiples of things quantumly than you could ever do through Trig, Calculus, Exponential Functions, logarithms, or more specifically Algorithms. As long as you can create a platform with a designed system to allow a Formula to break down, you are Golden!

 

[biker]

lots of evidence now suggest the gospel of Mathew was in Hebrew.
and i dont think there is anything in scripture that says only 66 books are breathed by the Most High

Since Aramaic is shorthand Hebrew, and we know Tanakh Books like Daniel were written in Aramaic, it's not a real shocker to think the Gospels were also written in that Language.

 

[jaybird88]

Since Aramaic is shorthand Hebrew, and we know Tanakh Books like Daniel were written in Aramaic, it's not a real shocker to think the Gospels were also written in that Language.

i think there is a bit of a disconnect today with the language back then. so many think Greek was the language across the board, but you go to the Qumran library and every text concerning spirituality was written in Hebrew, you have Greek text there but they are mostly letters being wrote and received by different Essene / Nazarene communities.

 

[biker]

I love studying the Essene's. Their Bible is called the "Bread." And who would have guessed they actually were a better format of the Pharisees. Of course, they are no fan of Paul. I can only imagine he riled on them good at some point during the 1st Century.

 

[CS1]

Irenaeus, Against Heresies circa 180 ad -

“Matthew also issued a written Gospel among the Hebrews in their own dialect,”

Eusebius quoting the works of Origen -

“The first is written according to Matthew, the same that was once a tax collector, but afterwards an emissary of Yeshua the Messiah, who having published it for the Jewish believers, wrote it in Hebrew.”

the issue is as you know Greek was the language of Roman who had been controlling that region many years The greek language was what the Septuagint was written in and we do know That Jesus read from it. Also that HE most likely did speak Aramaic yet understood Greek too. The Greek speaking Jewish was the norm at this time due to the many years they were in exile. how many generation were under the rule of another where the language was not kept? To suggest the Book of Matthew was write-in Hebrew when the manuscripts are in Greek. That is a hard one to take just saying I'm open to evidence

 

[jaybird88]

I love studying the Essene's. Their Bible is called the "Bread." And who would have guessed they actually were a better format of the Pharisees. Of course, they are no fan of Paul. I can only imagine he riled on them good at some point during the 1st Century.

i have studied their teachings for a few years now. it can get confusing when you dont understand the old Hebrew being as one expert will suggest Jesus was an Essene then you have another saying Jesus was an enemy of the Essenes. i read what i can and just try and make the most logical conclusion. i dont think Jesus was an Essene, but i think the Nazarenes and Essenes were more or less the same school of thought with each group having slightly different community rules. one group allowed marrage and drinking, the other did not, things like that.
you ever read the connections to Jesus and the Essenes when Jesus is talking to John (baptist) when He is in jail and John asks Jesus if He is the Christ or should we expect another?

 

[jaybird88]

the issue is as you know Greek was the language of Roman who had been controlling that region many years The greek language was what the Septuagint was written in and we do know That Jesus read from it. Also that HE most likely did speak Aramaic yet understood Greek too. The Greek speaking Jewish was the norm at this time due to the many years they were in exile. how many generation were under the rule of another where the language was not kept? To suggest the Book of Matthew was write-in Hebrew when the manuscripts are in Greek. That is a hard one to take just saying I'm open to evidence

im not suggesting they spoke Hebrew all the time, i believe that Greek more than likely was the common language, but i think Hebrew was still used for writings and temple rituals. all the scrolls at Qumran (related o spirituality) were in Hebrew but then again, they were incredibly strict and could have been an isolated thing. the Nazarenes do seemed to be a bit more relaxed.

 

[biker]

i have studied their teachings for a few years now. it can get confusing when you dont understand the old Hebrew being as one expert will suggest Jesus was an Essene then you have another saying Jesus was an enemy of the Essenes. i read what i can and just try and make the most logical conclusion. i dont think Jesus was an Essene, but i think the Nazarenes and Essenes were more or less the same school of thought with each group having slightly different community rules. one group allowed marrage and drinking, the other did not, things like that.
you ever read the connections to Jesus and the Essenes when Jesus is talking to John (baptist) when He is in jail and John asks Jesus if He is the Christ or should we expect another?

Agreed!
But what I found interesting, their Bible is literally 8 verses that show more history when Jesus actually arrived onto the scene, and what some of His message outside the kingdom was in terms of Jesus explaining the issue with "Sacrificing," Something else I found intriguing, their version of Matthew 24 from Jesus' standpoint and their claim that Jesus was a vegan. Not saying I am buying it or not buying it. But I do find it educating.

 

[biker]

im not suggesting they spoke Hebrew all the time, i believe that Greek more than likely was the common language, but i think Hebrew was still used for writings and temple rituals. all the scrolls at Qumran (related o spirituality) were in Hebrew but then again, they were incredibly strict and could have been an isolated thing. the Nazarenes do seemed to be a bit more relaxed.

Latin was around for a couple Centuries. I would not be shocked if the Romans spoke their own Language to spite the Greeks. Some Historians claim that Peter spoke Aramaic, Latin, and very little Greek and why he urged Paul to handle the Gentiles.

 

[biker]

What we do know for certain, while dying on the Cross, Jesus yelled out to the Father in Aramaic "Eli Eli Lama Sabachthani." And the Jews around Him knew exactly what He said because the Bible tells us they spoke of it.

 

[Diakonos]

whats the name of the Holy Spirit?

What is the name of the Father