There will be no Rapture!!!

Webers.Home · Aug 12, 2024

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The rapture should be easily observed all 'round the world if it proceeds as
described in 1Thess 4:13-17 because 2,000 years of deceased believers
from all over the globe added to the world's current believers, will likely
construct a flash mob resembling a mini Oort Cloud when they all levitate
together at one time to rendezvous with the Lord up in the sky.

The mob is likely to get pretty noisy too what with all the cheering, laughing,
and shouting that's sure to take place when Jesus' followers receive their
new bodies; which of course will be forever 21, viz: thoroughly immune to
age. (1Cor 15:51-53)

But they'll be blessed with more than immortality. His raptured followers will
also be made incorruptible. Well; Adam failed to remain innocent, i.e. he
was corruptible; but no amount of temptation will be strong enough to take
Jesus' followers down because they will be empowered not with human
nature, rather; with divine nature (2Pet 1:2-4 )
_

sawdust · Aug 12, 2024

Evmur said:

"about" being the key word. The end times will see miraculous occurrences because, as I said, signs and wonders have their times and purpose.

Genez · Aug 12, 2024

Evmur said:

They agree to remove themselves on command from a false Christian.
Remove themself... Willingly!

For?

Its all done in the name of deception!

Jesus warned Satan, that when he begins casting out Satan?
What does it mean???

Matthew 12:26

If Satan drives out Satan, he is divided against himself.

How then can his kingdom stand?

Jesus knew what was coming up.
He knew that false Christians would be allegedly casting out demons.

Satan thinks he's clever and the master of deception.

But, Jesus smiled, and left Satan a little note under his tea cup.

If Satan drives out Satan, you are divided against yourself.

So how then can your kingdom stand?

Time is getting short, and by Satan's own actions, it reveals that the inevitable is going to happen!

............... Satan is being deceived in his own deception. He is being made to be his own worst omen!

Satan? So how then can your kingdom stand?

Rapture bound.... grace and peace!

Genez · Aug 12, 2024

Evmur said:

A demon that causes a person to be lame and confined to a wheel chair...
Can, by mutual agreement, remove itself from that body to make it look like its a healing from God.

Deception. That's how it works.

The one who appeared to be able to cast out demons then bombards his listeners with heresy and misleading teachings.
The dumb will always follow.
The wise will sense the evil, and keep away.

............

CS1 · Aug 12, 2024

FYI, there are many people who say there will be no Rapture, yet they are not ready today if they die. The worst thing is not being in the Rapture. It is the Lord Jesus saying, "I never knew you." Today can be your Rapture very well, and take a dirt nap. And those little sins you think God winks at and the area in your heart you never surrendered very well could cost you eternity in hell. WE as Christian are to do what?

2 Corinthians 13:5-9 The Message (MSG)
Test yourselves to make sure you are solid in the faith. Don’t drift along taking everything for granted. Give yourselves regular checkups. You need firsthand evidence, not mere hearsay, that Jesus Christ is in you. Test it out. If you fail the test, do something about it. I hope the test won’t show that we have failed. But if it comes to that, we’d rather the test showed our failure than yours. We’re rooting for the truth to win out in you. We couldn’t possibly do otherwise. We don’t just put up with our limitations; we celebrate them, and then go on to celebrate every strength, every triumph of the truth in you. We pray hard that it will all come together in your lives.

CS1 · Aug 12, 2024

Genez said:

LOL, you don't know healing, and you don't know demons. Sin causes sickness and disease. It is why we die a physical death and are spiritually dead. Jesus' salvation saves, heals, and delivers. Which SOZO means. 10 lepers were healed by Jesus, and only one came back. Jesus said if a house has been cleaned and is not filled, evil will return and bring seven more evil than him, and the condition will be far worse than it was before. Demon and devils don't heal. They kill, steal, and destroy. All healing is from God. If an issue is returned, it is because of sin and lack of obedience, or the body is dying. Which will happen to all until Jesus comes.

cv5 · Aug 12, 2024

McPhersonX said:

Are you a psychiatrist in training?

sawdust · Aug 13, 2024

CS1 said:

And you don't read very well.

Genez said:

Genez never said demons heal.

brmicke · Aug 13, 2024

Genez said:

Point 1 -

1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

Verse 14 shows that the sleepers will be resurrected just as Jesus was.

Well, Jesus was crucified and died on earth then He died and rose again on earth!

After that He ascended to Heaven.

If Jesus died on earth and was the brought back to life on earth then verse 14 shows that the sleepers die on earth and are brought back to life on earth.

Point 2 -

Paul and those that have remained awake join the sleepers and Jesus in the air.

1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The words caught up in this verse do not have to necessarily mean caught up to heaven.

If fact the verse tells us that they were caught up into the air.

We are in the air now during this lifetime. There is no mention of Heaven being filled with air in the Bible.

CS1 · Aug 13, 2024

sawdust said:

and you can't discern well :

"demon that causes a person to be lame and confined to a wheel chair...
Can, by mutual agreement, remove itself from that body to make it look like its a healing from God."

cv5 · Aug 13, 2024

brmicke said:

We are "caught up" and relocated to the Fathers house. Precisely as described as stage 9 of the Jewish wedding protocol, so noted in Matt 24:36. And the time of this snatching of the Bride is utterly unknown to anyone but the Trinity.....for strategic purposes.
Where pray tell is this house located?

Mat 24:36
But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

Yes, this intentionally inserted comment refers to the harpazo of the Church.
Which MUST occur before the remaining prophetic elements pertaining to Israel and end-time prophecy assert themselves.
That is why it is inserted in the Olivet discourse. Obviously.

Webers.Home · Aug 13, 2024

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Webers.Home said:

Back when I was a young twenty-something, it occurred to me that it would
be much easier to get along with God if I was more like Him than me. In
other words: it would be a huge advantage if sinless perfection were as
normal for me as it is for God.

It was along about that time that a friend urged me to get a Bible and read
it for myself. I did, and in due course ran across a passage in Ezekiel that
riveted my attention like no other. It goes like this:

"I will put My spirit within you, and bring it about that you will walk in My
statutes and you will keep My ordinances and do them."

That promise was given to God's people relevant to His plans to eventually
restore them to their homeland. Well; I had been brought up to believe that
all God ever did was make or-else demands on people. I would've never in a
million years imagined He might have something in mind like Ezek 36:27!
_

Genez · Aug 13, 2024

sawdust said:

Someone will always find a way to get a good point wrong.
Look at how the ones that wanted to crucify Him always found ways to distort the words of Jesus.
And, the student will be receiving the same as the teacher received.

That is how certain individuals will operate as a means to distract away from a good point that was being made,
and, in effect, by always playing stupid in hope of creating a new argument also needing correction. Its a means
to try to get others to forget something was said.

Leave him be.

Genez · Aug 13, 2024

CS1 said:

What happens when the demon that was causing a problem leaves?

Is the demon healing? Or removing the cause for an unexplained problem?

Genez · Aug 13, 2024

brmicke said:

Point 1 -

1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

Verse 14 shows that the sleepers will be resurrected just as Jesus was.

Well, Jesus was crucified and died on earth then He died and rose again on earth!

After that He ascended to Heaven.

If Jesus died on earth and was the brought back to life on earth then verse 14 shows that the sleepers die on earth and are brought back to life on earth.

Point 2 -

Paul and those that have remained awake join the sleepers and Jesus in the air.

1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The words caught up in this verse do not have to necessarily mean caught up to heaven.

If fact the verse tells us that they were caught up into the air.

We are in the air now during this lifetime. There is no mention of Heaven being filled with air in the Bible.

Funny how you found a way to distort that...

FollowerofShiloh · Aug 13, 2024

Genez said:

How about driving home at night.... stopping to turn onto the main road... and looking across the street where a monastery is located.
And, while looking seeing a ten story high statue standing in its yard that was not there a few hours earlier while heading to visit someone.

How did it get there?

And, when looking all the way up to see the face? You are shocked to see its alive! Living!
And, then watching it begin to instantly changing positions and location in a blinking of an eye...
while conveying supernaturally, a message to my mind.

Would that constitute being a miracle?

On my way driving home it made me realize that its not a game.
That heaven is real.
Hell is real...

And, some here think they are in creative writing class.
Creating fantasy scenarios to fit what is shown in Scripture that they do not yet properly understand.

Creating their own notions of the things in a way that they can understand, while being removed from the reality of the context.
Since they think no one really can understand it? It gives them license to make stuff up, since you have no way to prove them wrong because no one can understand what it really means.

I ask myself. What spirit is their tutor?

Its not a game.
Though, because of their obliviousness, they feel free to treat what they do as a game.

Heaven is real.
Hell is real.

Some are going to receive great rewards.
Some are going to be shamed to have it end, and realize they have lost forever their opportunity learn and grow to glorify Christ.

For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus

Christ. If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood,

hay or stubble their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light.

It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work.

If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward.

If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—

even though only as one escaping through the flames. 1 Cor 3:11-15

It feel anger and sadness to see believers thinking they are winning an argument by means of their cleverness,
to be knowing that they are sealing their fate to being a loser of the most precious reward one could ever desire.

To be told.... "Well done, good and faithful servant."

They despise corrections!

Whoever loves instruction loves knowledge,

But he who hates correction is stupid." Prov 12:1

God can not grant divine authority in the future to those who now mishandle their temporal authority given them today.
For now is the time for God to determine whom He will grant great reward and blessings,.
And to determine denial of such rewards for those choosing a negative path while in time, when they are not yet
too dangerous to impact life around them.

So, false teachings must be tossed into the arena, to see who will resort to using them for their defense and offense.
The ones who choose false doctrine are now making their bed out of wood, hay, and stubble.

Sleep tight.

grace and peace .......

I take you don't believe in the Gifts of the Holy Spirit because Discernment would easily have kept you aware of these things. I always use Discernment from a conversation to what I see or experience. You will immediately know what you're facing if your walk is true with God.

TheDivineWatermark · Aug 13, 2024

I don't disagree with your first point (I've been explaining the same... on that point: "resurrection [/shall RISE first]" means "to stand again [on the earth]")

But as for your second point...

brmicke said:

Key words in bold.

(IOW, the verb and adverb must be connected; these, combined with the word "with," the verb and adverb are saying: they and we will be "caught-up together AT THE SAME TIME / AT ONCE / IN ONE 'SNATCH-ACTION'"--rather than one group following the other, and meeting THEM there "in the air". NO!)

No, but in the CONTEXT ITSELF (Paul is covering the Subject in more than just these few verses you're pointing out)... Paul had already just mentioned, in 3:13, the "destination location" that "our Rapture [in the air]" will be taking us to (UP THERE): "...before [G1715 - émprosthen - IN THE PRESENCE OF] the God and Father of us, in the coming/parousia of our Lord Jesus Christ with/accompanied-with all His saints/holy ones" (see also Dan7:13 for similar language, regarding "the Son of man" [the LOCATION--UP THERE]).

Look at the wider context... the entire epistle, for starters.

So you're suggesting we've already be "caught-up TOGETHER WITH" the dead in Christ [as "resurrected" persons] (at the SAME TIME, which is what the verse actually states)?? How so?

Just because v.17 mentions "to the meeting of the Lord IN THE AIR" does not mean:

--that "Heaven" is mentioned IN THAT SAME VERSE (plz view the wider CONTEXT, and put your study glasses on);

--that "in the air" is where we STOP, as the intended [ultimate] "destination location," and we just "hang out there" (as if that's the PURPOSE). NO! That is only the "MEETING OF THE LORD IN THE AIR" part, not where He's taking us (ultimately--which is told about in the CONTEXT: 3:13! And all THAT is just until we return WITH HIM for "the wedding FEAST / SUPPER" [MK age / or MK inauguration at least, which is ON EARTH commencing upon His "RETURN" to the earth Rev19 time-slot);

--'nuther point... will have to wait...

Genez · Aug 13, 2024

TheDivineWatermark said:

I don't disagree with your first point (I've been explaining the same... on that point: "resurrection [/shall RISE first]" means "to stand again [on the earth]")

But as for your second point...

Key words in bold.

(IOW, the verb and adverb must be connected; these, combined with the word "with," the verb and adverb are saying: they and we will be "caught-up together AT THE SAME TIME / AT ONCE / IN ONE 'SNATCH-ACTION'"--rather than one group following the other, and meeting THEM there "in the air". NO!)

No, but in the CONTEXT ITSELF (Paul is covering the Subject in more than just these few verses you're pointing out)... Paul had already just mentioned, in 3:13, the "destination location" that "our Rapture [in the air]" will be taking us to (UP THERE): "...before [G1715 - émprosthen - IN THE PRESENCE OF] the God and Father of us, in the coming/parousia of our Lord Jesus Christ with/accompanied-with all His saints/holy ones" (see also Dan7:13 for similar language, regarding "the Son of man" [the LOCATION--UP THERE]).

Look at the wider context... the entire epistle, for starters.

So you're suggesting we've already be "caught-up TOGETHER WITH" the dead in Christ [as "resurrected" persons] (at the SAME TIME, which is what the verse actually states)?? How so?

Just because v.17 mentions "to the meeting of the Lord IN THE AIR" does not mean:

--that "Heaven" is mentioned IN THAT SAME VERSE (plz view the wider CONTEXT, and put your study glasses on);

--that "in the air" is where we STOP, as the intended [ultimate] "destination location," and we just "hang out there" (as if that's the PURPOSE). NO! That is only the "MEETING OF THE LORD IN THE AIR" part, not where He's taking us (ultimately--which is told about in the CONTEXT: 3:13! And all THAT is just until we return WITH HIM for "the wedding FEAST / SUPPER" [MK age / or MK inauguration at least, which is ON EARTH commencing upon His "RETURN" to the earth Rev19 time-slot);

--'nuther point... will have to wait...

Irony. Some people do not get the Rapture because their heads are in the clouds...

TheDivineWatermark · Aug 13, 2024

cv5 said:

Gotta say it... I must disagree (on this point).

This is why (way back, in our long-ago convos) I said that this is why I do not believe this verse is "an idiom" [or whatever] speaking of "the Feast of Trumpets" / Rosh Hashana (as indicating "rapture timing").

IOW, I do not believe Jesus "intentionally inserted" a comment about "our Rapture" into a CONTEXT which wasn't ABOUT that at all.
He's referring to His Second Coming to the earth, here (in this verse), IOW.

Sorry to disagree with you, brother, but I do believe this particular "take" on it causes confusion (regarding this text / context and what Jesus was covering here). I understand how the "reasoning" goes... that Jesus must have been referring to "our Rapture" because of His words "[day/hour] no man KNOWS" [but they WOULD if He meant His "Second Coming" to earth, the reasoning goes] ...but this isn't what He's saying here.

cv5 · Aug 13, 2024

TheDivineWatermark said:

I see your point believe me.
But understand, I do not believe that this statement is intended to link the Feast of Trumpets to the RAPTURE.
The reason being that this particular statement is unequivocally and intentionally invoking the 9th stage of the Jewish wedding ritual (key words "knoweth.....Father only"), which is of course....

The harpazo/snatch/rapture. And the rapture has no time stamp of any kind.

The Feast of Trumpets DOES fit in to end-time eschatology in all likelihood (see Joshua/Jericho). But it fits in POST RAPTURE. Furthermore, the Feast of Trumpets is appointed to Israel and its own unique eschatology, grouped with Atonement and Tabernacles.

On more point: given that verse 36 has been intentionally inserted into the prophetic steam of events (though not necessarily sequentially), one must conclude that the DOTL must follow on the heels of the rapture very closely.

There will be no Rapture!!!

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