There will be no Rapture!!!

[Musicmaster]

The Death of humanity would have ended quickly but Noah still rode the through the torrential rain 40 days. Life ended in at worse 1 to 5 days but Noah had to endure the storm for 40 days before then waiting for the water to evaporate.

It's known that it wasn't the rain alone that flooded the entire earth, but that's all academic, and the Bible also says otherwise...again, academic.

Also, waiting for the water to...evaporate? Wow. You must not move about in scientific communities much...

MM

 

[Musicmaster]

Pre-Wrath because of:

Gospel of John we read that Jesus knew His HOUR would come and within 24 hours He was betrayed, Tried, Crucified, Buried.

We are told we will escape our HOUR of Temptation.

Our Hour of Temptation (24 hours) doesn't take place until the revelation of the AC and War on the Saints.

Our HOUR and Jesus HOUR in the Greek equal same time length.

No ONE is tempted until Mid-Tribulation.

This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever... How you make that connection...is anyone's guess.

You really can't expect others to take you seriously when you don't write out enough explanation for understanding.

MM

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

It's known that it wasn't the rain alone that flooded the entire earth, but that's all academic, and the Bible also says otherwise...again, academic.

Also, waiting for the water to...evaporate? Wow. You must not move about in scientific communities much...

MM

The storm is what matters because it's what did the killing not the scientific facts for where the water receded to. And yes, such a storm would have created the same torrential conditions the Ark would've went through but humans on land would have been succumbed to.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever... How you make that connection...is anyone's guess.

You really can't expect others to take you seriously when you don't write out enough explanation for understanding.

MM

Because the HOUR is spoken about several times throughout scripture and all times shows similar time length + Hebrew and Greek have same meaning for it. It's not going to change meaning suddenly so you can have your mythical doctrine even if you reply back with your own version of Greek explanation.

 

[Musicmaster]

The storm is what matters because it's what did the killing not the scientific facts for where the water receded to. And yes, such a storm would have created the same torrential conditions the Ark would've went through but humans on land would have been succumbed to.

I hope you don't mind my sense of skepticism about that, because we aren't told how much wind accompanied the rain and fountains of the deep gushing forth. That still calls into question that example in the way that you used it, all on the basis of pure assumption.

MM

 

[Musicmaster]

Because the HOUR is spoken about several times throughout scripture and all times shows similar time length + Hebrew and Greek have same meaning for it. It's not going to change meaning suddenly so you can have your mythical doctrine even if you reply back with your own version of Greek explanation.

Semantics.

Hermeneutics.

They're not the same thing.

MM

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

I hope you don't mind my sense of skepticism about that, because we aren't told how much wind accompanied the rain and fountains of the deep gushing forth. That still calls into question that example in the way that you used it, all on the basis of pure assumption.

MM

We know or have seen documentaries from Christian Geologist who show us the Grand Canyon and other like examples happened during the Flood. Noah would have been in those same rough seas slamming water by current everywhere.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Semantics.

Hermeneutics.

They're not the same thing.

MM

Only to You.

But to the Bible they are defined by the same word usage and meaning.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

^

Jhn 4:21
Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father.


Jhn 4:23
But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.




Okay, so according to your reasoning, "worship" of the Father lasted one "60-minute period" some time back in the first century.

Hmmm.



( )

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

^

1 John 2:18 using the same "G5610" word (2x):

"Children, it is the last hour; and just as you heard that antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared; from this we know that it is the last hour."




So, no other "hours" existed after this "last" 60-minute period that existed back in the first century (since it was "the last" of those)?





( )

 

[Cameron143]

At least give him an hour to think about it.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

The 144k follow the the Death and resurrection of the 2 Witnesses and the 144k are mentioned throughout 2nd half of Tribulation. That only leaves first half for the 2 Witnesses to be here for 3 1/2 years.

The parts I emphasized in your quote ^ are ASSUMPTIONS by you with no evidence.

For example:

--yes, the "2W" have "1260 days" associated with them (which end at the "6th Trumpet [events] / 2nd Woe"... when those are CONCLUDED);

--nowhere does it say that the "144,000" only have [/exist in] [the supposed] other "1260 days"--your imagination has supposed this (where you say, "that only leaves"... as though the two sets of persons under present discussion can only exist [doing their roles] in COMPLETELY SEPARATE time-frames with ZERO OVERLAP... but no passage even alludes to such a thing, it exists only in your mind );

You truly have to ignore these truths to commit to your reasoning.

I think you mean, I would have to ignore your faulty REASONINGS (which have no scriptural support, it's just something you have surmised).





[I believe the "bottomless pit" is only "opened" one time (Rev9:2), not multiple times...]

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

At least give him an hour to think about it.

Oh boy, that could take FOREVER!




( )

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

^

1 John 2:18 using the same "G5610" word (2x):

"Children, it is the last hour; and just as you heard that antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared; from this we know that it is the last hour."




So, no other "hours" existed after this "last" 60-minute period that existed back in the first century (since it was "the last" of those)?





( )

The hour for Jesus and Temptation is ὥρα

And what Bible translation are you using because it doesn't match the 2nd century Greek at all.

18 Little children, it is the last time, and as you heard that antichrist comes, even now many antichrists have risen: whence we know that it is the last time.

You must be using the kjv or TR versions from 16th century because strongs is made specifically for the kjv and doesn't match in a lot of places to the older Greek Texts.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

until the revelation of the AC

^ That takes place at SEAL #1 (at the START of the 7-yr period).






[It is not when he does the LATER "sitteth in the temple of God" thing (2Th2:4b), though many people repeat this as if it were true.]

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

^ @FollowerofShiloh 's question in Post #1934,

I was drawing from this LIST (page 2 of this Greek word [G5610], at BlueLetterBible):

https://www.blueletterbible.org/lexicon/g5610/kjv/tr/0-2/#lexResults





ὥρα
ōra
G5610
ὥρα
ōra
N-NSF



-- Jn4:21 - https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/jhn/4/21/p0/t_concif_1001021

-- Jn4:23 - https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/jhn/4/23/p0/t_concif_1001023

-- 1Jn2:18 - https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/1jo/2/18/p0/t_concif_1161018

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

The parts I emphasized in your quote ^ are ASSUMPTIONS by you with no evidence.

For example:

--yes, the "2W" have "1260 days" associated with them (which end at the "6th Trumpet [events] / 2nd Woe"... when those are CONCLUDED);

--nowhere does it say that the "144,000" only have [/exist in] [the supposed] other "1260 days"--your imagination has supposed this (where you say, "that only leaves"... as though the two sets of persons under present discussion can only exist [doing their roles] in COMPLETELY SEPARATE time-frames with ZERO OVERLAP... but no passage even alludes to such a thing, it exists only in your mind );



I think you mean, I would have to ignore your faulty REASONINGS (which have no scriptural support, it's just something you have surmised).





[I believe the "bottomless pit" is only "opened" one time (Rev9:2), not multiple times...]

The 2 Witnesses are killed by the AC but at the end of their witness. And the AC doesn't make war on the Saints until mid-trib. So the AC won't be attacking the 2 Witnesses until Mid-Trib at the end of their witness.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

^ @FollowerofShiloh 's question in Post #1934,

I was drawing from this LIST (page 2 of this Greek word [G5610], at BlueLetterBible):

https://www.blueletterbible.org/lexicon/g5610/kjv/tr/0-2/#lexResults

Which is TR.

It uses the faulty Septuagint for O.T. and Greek TR for N.T.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

The 2 Witnesses are killed by the AC but at the end of their witness. And the AC doesn't make war on the Saints until mid-trib. So the AC won't be attacking the 2 Witnesses until Mid-Trib at the end of their witness.

I already said (if you read my earlier post) that the "2W" will be killed (and ASCEND TO HEAVEN) at the when the "6th Trumpet [events] / 2nd Woe" have CONCLUDED (i.e. THEIR "1260 days" concludes then)... but the MID-TRIB point took place back at the "5th Trumpet / 1st WOE unto the earth" (i.e. PRIOR TO THAT)...

...so YES, the "2W" WILL EXIST (still in their role) INTO the early parts of the SECOND HALF (not in its entirety), because their "1260 days" STRADDLE the two halves somewhat (AS DO the "TRUMPETS"--the first FOUR Trumpets in the first half [with the SEALS preceding those]; 5th Trumpet [and its events] commencing at MID-trib+; and 6th & 7th Trumpets after those so in the SECOND HALF... [as are all 7 of the Vials which follow the Trumpets]).

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

I already said (if you read my earlier post) that the "2W" will be killed (and ASCEND TO HEAVEN) at the when the "6th Trumpet [events] / 2nd Woe" have CONCLUDED (i.e. THEIR "1260 days" concludes then)... but the MID-TRIB point took place back at the "5th Trumpet / 1st WOE unto the earth" (i.e. PRIOR TO THAT)...

...so YES, the "2W" WILL EXIST (still in their role) INTO the early parts of the SECOND HALF (not in its entirety), because their "1260 days" STRADDLE the two halves somewhat (AS DO the "TRUMPETS"--the first FOUR Trumpets in the first half [with the SEALS preceding those]; 5th Trumpet [and its events] commencing at MID-trib+; and 6th & 7th Trumpets after those so in the SECOND HALF... [as are all 7 of the Vials which follow the Trumpets]).

And I said it happens when the AC makes war on the Saints.
So we both are there and more so than that it proves nothing happens to the Saints before then which is the entire first half of Tribulation and no attacks on the Saints by the AC.