There will be no Rapture!!!

[cv5]

Just because (in this case) Christians are not specifically mentioned in Matthew 24 does not mean they will be around at the end of the world.

No need to get upset friend. Nope.....Matt 24 speaks ONLY to Israel and the 70th week. Some say "wars and rumors of war" are made to a time somewhat before the 70th week. I do not think so, but it hardly matters, as the audience is the same.....ISRAELITES. Obviously.

Mat 24:15
When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand (70th week!)

Mat 24:16
Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
Mat 24:20
But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

In fact, the Apostle Paul talked about this at 2 Thessalonians 1:6-7, when CHRISTIANS will get rest/relief when? Vs7, and give to you relief/rest who are afflicted and to us as well when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire."

Christians. Correct. Church age. Rest before the DOTL begins. Nothing in 1 or 2 Thes indicates wrath is appointed to Christians. Confirmed in Rev 3:10.
See my earlier posts.

Paul explains further at chapter 2 vs3-8. "For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains will do so until he is taken out of the way." Who's the restrainer cv5?

Here is the restrainer and how the restrainer......stops restraining. Not removed completely, yet allowing the enemy to attack.
A perfect example in terms of a Biblical precedent.

Lam 2:3
He hath cut off in his fierce anger all the horn of Israel: he hath drawn back his right hand from before the enemy, and he burned against Jacob like a flaming fire, which devoureth round about.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

But the similitude in Noah’s case was that Enoch was raptured before the wrath. Noah would represent those that were saved THROUGH the wrath.

Correct!

Noah and crew are not a "type" of the rapture;


Enoch [one man] was a "type" of our rapture... translated PRIOR TO... and kept entirely out-from the time of the flood-judgment unfolding upon the earth.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

let this sink into the minds of the pr-tribbers:

the Judeans [70 AD] were Christians like us [Jesus had died/resurrected/ascended] and they were not REMOVED but Commanded to HIDE!

I would PROPOSE THEY were better and TRUER Followers of Jesus than we have ever been and they were not Rapture'd!

They were not promised "rapture".





[Lk21:12-24a,b covers the events surrounding 70ad; It's a matter of "who" and of "when" (what happens when, in relation to what other thing / things)... NOTHING anywhere in the Olivet Discourse is covering the Subject of our "rapture"]

 

[presidente]

According to I Thessalonians 4 and II Thessalonians 2, tgese two things will happen at the coming (parousia) of Christ:

1. The rapture
2.. The destruction of the lawless one.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

Correct!

Noah and crew are not a "type" of the rapture;


Enoch [one man] was a "type" of our rapture... translated PRIOR TO... and kept entirely out-from the time of the flood-judgment unfolding upon the earth.

put the pipe down!

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

They were not promised "rapture".





[Lk21:12-24a,b covers the events surrounding 70ad; It's a matter of "who" and of "when" (what happens when, in relation to what other thing / things)... NOTHING anywhere in the Olivet Discourse is covering the Subject of our "rapture"]

the 70 AD Judeans would have had known about Paul and his Views..

You act like these people did not know what we do.

And they had it better, because it was explained to them. Where here, some like You are just guessing.

They HID, because [Jesus told them to hide] + the Rapture, happens at the Second Coming, and they knew that was not happening soon.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

Enoch was Rapture'd then another 1,200 years go by before the 120 years it takes Noah to build the Ark.

Enoch's Rapture [[literally had NOTHING]] to do with the Flood.

Enoch would not have outlived Methuselah [969], and then Noah's Dad + Noah.

Enoch would have been dead [had he lived and not taken up] 500 years BEFORE Noah ever built the Ark.

And claiming he was Rapture'd to escape the Flood.

the LIES are seriously REAL in this Doctrine!

 

[cv5]

Enoch was Rapture'd then another 1,200 years go by before the 120 years it takes Noah to build the Ark.

Enoch's Rapture [[literally had NOTHING]] to do with the Flood.

Enoch would not have outlived Methuselah [969], and then Noah's Dad + Noah.

Enoch would have been dead [had he lived and not taken up] 500 years BEFORE Noah ever built the Ark.

And claiming he was Rapture'd to escape the Flood.

the LIES are seriously REAL in this Doctrine!

Enoch: a biblical "type" bro.

Such "types" are everywhere.

Ruth.....a "type" of the Gentile Church. Who is seen at the feet of Boaz at the "threshing floor" scene.
A TYPE OF THE CHUCH RAPTURED AND WITH JESUS AT THE TIME OF THE TRIBULATION.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

And according to Scripture, our rapture is an absolute requirement BEFORE the DOTL can commence.

Yes, and this is why Paul REPEATS that sequence 3x in 2Th2:3b-8a,9a... which SEQUENCE agrees also with the SEQUENCE spelled out in 1Th4&5... and the SAME SEQUENCE also found in Rev4-5&6...

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Enoch's Rapture [[literally had NOTHING]] to do with the Flood.

Amen.

 

[DRobinson]

Ahhh look friend, I am endorsing the PRE-TRIB rapture. Because it is Biblical boilerplate doctrine.
These passages are absolutely clear as a bell.

1Th 5:2
For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.


1Th 5:3
For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; (BIRTH PANGS! SEALS!) and they shall not escape.

1Th 5:4
But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

1Th 5:9
For God hath NOT appointed US to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

This post is proof you do not understand Scripture.
You obviously do no know who THEY refers to.
And verse 4 states that the Saints are not in darkness and His coming will not be as a thief in the night.
YOU LOSE!

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

And verse 4 states that the Saints are not in darkness and His coming will not be as a thief in the night.

"The day of the Lord" (earthly-located time period consisting of "judgments" unfolding [AC being the first of those]) is what will arrive "as a thief in the night".

 

[DRobinson]

"The day of the Lord" (earthly-located time period consisting of "judgments" unfolding [AC being the first of those]) is what will arrive "as a thief in the night".

I may have to place your understanding down there with that poster that worships you after this post

 

[Gideon300]

Hello Gideon300,
Mass death does not equal the tribulation, and although these people may feel they
we’re in the great tribulation, we know they were not.
Where was the NWO during the deaths of these people? These people were not killed for refusing the mark of the beast… more importantly, the antichrist is coming to convert you, he comes in on the wings of an eagle… Remember when they say peace, peace…..

I'm not going to argue. There is more than enough of that. I've read plenty on this subject. It's open to interpretation. One brilliant scholar with a great grasp of Greek and Hebrew can come to an entirely different conclusion to an equally learned scholar. It will become clearer eventually.

 

[cv5]

Well......sorry to say that the red-X's are getting way out of hand.

Going to start reporting these abuses.

 

[DRobinson]

Well......sorry to say that the red-X's are getting way out of hand.

Going to start reporting these abuses.

So it is abusive for people to disagree with you now so you are going to report us.

 

[selahsays]

Regarding the Thief in the Night

1 Thessalonians 1:1
Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians which is in God the Father and in the LORD Jesus Christ: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and the LORD Jesus Christ.

1 Thessalonians 1:2
We give thanks to God always for you all, making mention of you in our prayers;

1 Thessalonians 1:3
Remembering without ceasing your work of faith, and labour of love, and patience of hope in our LORD Jesus Christ, in the sight of God and our Father;

1 Thessalonians 1:4
Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.

So we see that this is written to God's Elect.

1 Thessalonians 1:10
And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

1 Thessalonians 5:1
But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.

God's Elect/Christians know the times and the seasons when the LORD comes as a thief in the night—It's after the false Christ (Antichrist) comes.

1 Thessalonians 5:2
For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

1 Thessalonians 5:3
For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

It comes upon THEY and THEM (sudden destruction) not on us (God's Elect)
It comes upon those that worship Antichrist thinking he is Christ—to those the true Christ comes as a thief in the night.

1 Thessalonians 5:4
But ye, (Elect) brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

1 Thessalonians 5:5
Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.

Matthew 24:36
But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

Matthew 24:42
Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

Mark 13:32
But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.

Mark 13:33
Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.

No one knows the instant, but God's Elect know the season.

Daniel 12:9-10
And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

Revelation 3:2
Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die: for I have not found thy works perfect before God.

Revelation 3:3
Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt NOT WATCH, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.

Revelation 16:15
Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

You act like these people did not know what we do.

No, I think you are missing my point.

Just because scripture tells us that Jesus (in His first advent earthly ministry) did not know "the day and hour" (of His Second Coming to the earth, per context) does not mean that He was unaware of WHAT CENTURY!

He is the One who PROPHESIED (in His Olivet Discourse) of the "future events" of both the 70ad events and the events surrounding His Second Coming to the earth (FOR the promised and prophesied EARTHLY Millennial Kingdom age)... AND He deliberately spelled out the fact of the SEQUENCE being that the 70ad events take place "BEFORE ALL THESE" beginning of birth pangs (which BPs ARE the future-to-us SEALS of the "TRIB years," as we label it);

IOW, HE is the One Who prophesied the two distinct "SEE-then-FLEE" events He speaks of in His Olivet Discourse--one IN the 70ad events (Lk21:23,20), the other which comes just before the GREAT Trib (before second half of far-future Trib... that is, in its FIRST half--Matt24:15-21).


He wasn't as clueless as many make Him out to have been

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

1 Thessalonians 5:3
For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
It comes upon THEY and THEM (sudden destruction) not on us (God's Elect)

[I enlarged one phrase ^ so I can address this when I make my point, here]



The word "escape" (THEY shall "not escape") is the word "ekpheugo / ekphygōsin [G1628]" and means to "FLEE OUT OF [active]".

This verse is in CONTRAST to what is stated in Lk21:36, of those who WILL "[actively] FLEE OUT OF" (ALL of the things that will unfold upon the earth DURING THE TRIB YRS). IOW, Lk21:36 is NOT a "rapture [IN THE AIR]" passage. This is important, to understand the CONTRAST I'm pointing out.

Luke 21:36 (about the Trib yrs) about ppl, b/c they obey the instructions given in this passage... takes place in the same time period that 1Th5:3 is talking about (except this "THEY" in this Thess passage are those who refuse the truth).




The SAME GREEK WORD "ekpheugo [G1628]" (ACTIVELY-"flee out of") used in both passages, but one is saying they "SHALL NOT," and the other is a command for them to "watch" and pray always, "in order that" ye may have strength [some versions say, 'be accounted worthy...] to ACTIVELY FLEE OUT OF... each and every one of the events of the Tribulation period... "and to STAND BEFORE [in a judicial sense] the Son of man [His Second Coming to the earth designation]". Again, this is not a "Rapture" verse/passage... which event happens to us (we are "caught up"... passive recipients of Another's action ON us).


The CONTRAST... (both passages using the "ekpheugo" word)... is between believers (who come to faith in Christ and OBEY this instruction) and unbelievers IN THE TRIB YEARS.

 

[bluto]

No need to get upset friend. Nope.....Matt 24 speaks ONLY to Israel and the 70th week. Some say "wars and rumors of war" are made to a time somewhat before the 70th week. I do not think so, but it hardly matters, as the audience is the same.....ISRAELITES. Obviously.

Mat 24:15
When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand (70th week!)

Mat 24:16
Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
Mat 24:20
But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:


Christians. Correct. Church age. Rest before the DOTL begins. Nothing in 1 or 2 Thes indicates wrath is appointed to Christians. Confirmed in Rev 3:10.
See my earlier posts.

Here is the restrainer and how the restrainer......stops restraining. Not removed completely, yet allowing the enemy to attack.
A perfect example in terms of a Biblical precedent.

Lam 2:3
He hath cut off in his fierce anger all the horn of Israel: he hath drawn back his right hand from before the enemy, and he burned against Jacob like a flaming fire, which devoureth round about.

First of all I am "NOT" upset. You just don't know what your talking about and your not being logical. God is always logical and sometimes He is a-logical which means He goes beyond logic. There are two prophecies in Daniel. The first one was when Titus destroyed the temple and not one rock was upon another. If you want to see old Jerusalem it's 50 feet below.

At Daniel 9 is the second prophecy which is the coming of the Messiah which was 489 years later. This is the time when Jesus answered His disciples question about the end of the world. No mention of any so-called rapture is ever mentioned. Not by Jesus, not by Paul and not by John. As I stated before Paul and John back up Jesus.

Having said all of this I have another question? If there is a rapture of the church as you believe why would there be tribulation saints?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto