Saved by Water

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FreeGrace2 said:
Are you claiming that Christ was saved by being baptized?????
peldom10 said:
Why do you insist on injecting new items in a trail of discussion... stick with the point if you wish to pursue this review further.
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How about we take a loo-see at why I asked this question.

You posted:
"Why was Christ baptized?
I have shown you where the Bible says it saves."

These 2 sentences are sequential, meaning the second one followed the first one immediately. It SURE implies that Christ was baptized for salvation. Why ELSE would you ask the question about Christ's baptism and immediately follow that with the second sentence?

And then you have the GALL to say this:
"LOL...you are need of Bible vetting or you would not ask the questions you are asking."

You seem to be the one who makes very illogical and irrational comments.

I can see that you fail to understand that Christ never sinned while on this earth and needed not repentance or baptism...but was as an example of what you and I must do. Why would you even suggest such?
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Because of WHAT you posted, which I have exposed above.

If you choose not answer my questions...we are finished here.
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OK, what is the question?
 
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peldom10 said:
I have shown you where the Bible says it saves. Now please show me where the Bible says it does not save?
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False. You edited a cherry picked verse and implied it had meaning other than what scripture intended.


You need more than me to just copy and paste a verse but to take your error and false understandings to God and pray for Him to show you truth and deliver you from your man made doctrines.



John 14:6
6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.


Titus 3
5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
 
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justbyfaith said:
Yes, baptism is likened unto circumcision in Colossians 2:11-12.

However, Paul taught that being circumcised would damn a person.

Whereas Peter taught that if anyone is baptized in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth for the remission of sins, that there is an absolute promise of the Holy Ghost that is in store for them (Acts 2:38-39).

If having the Holy Ghost means salvation; and it does (Romans 8:9), then baptism in Jesus' Name is a way of procuring salvation.

Another way is to receive Jesus into your heart (John 1:12). Since the Holy Ghost is the Spirit of Jesus, it follows that if I receive Jesus, I am receiving the Holy Ghost.

But if baptism is likened unto circumcision, then there is condemnation over being baptized in Jesus' Name.

So, I am condemned when I procure the promise of the Holy Ghost through fulfilling the condition of the promise found in Acts 2:38?

It does not logically follow.

In your understanding, a person will be condemned for receiving the Holy Ghost.

It follows that however you receive the Holy Ghost, it is unto condemnation, if your thesis has any kind of merit at all.
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No Paul did not likened unto circumcision. He showed how the circumcision by the hand of God wihtout the hands of man is accomplished. By the baptism of the spirit. not water baptism

Acts 2 does not say what you think you need to study it more.. No one is saved by a work of righteousness (titus 3) , Which is what water baptism is.
 
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eternally-gratefull said:
the jews had their circumcision pushers.

The gentiles have their baptism pushers.

Satan won great victories using these two great symbols of Gods power to add to the gospel of salvation and make it a false gospel of works.
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True, and just sad. I had a 90 year old Christian come to see me at our office (now closed for good) just to harangue me about baptisimal regeneration. No sign of life, no love for the Lord, no love for the brethren, just looking for an argument. I was happy to agree to disagree, but he went off in a huff.
 
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Gideon300 said:
True, and just sad. I had a 90 year old Christian come to see me at our office (now closed for good) just to harangue me about baptisimal regeneration. No sign of life, no love for the Lord, no love for the brethren, just looking for an argument. I was happy to agree to disagree, but he went off in a huff.
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Its like they are all the same..

They can;t see how much the resemble the religious in Jesus day in message and the way they act.

its sad
 
eternally-gratefull said:
Acts 2 does not say what you think you need to study it more..
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I know what the argument is (that it is baptism because of the remission of sins and not for them) but reject it.

I believe that the kjv is inspired and inerrant as concerning doctrine.

And it is your prerogative to reject this as a premise; however, I would say I believe that the premise in itself is an aspect of the narrow way that leads to life (Matthew 7:13-14).

And that you ought to consider this as a claim. For if it is a true claim, then rejecting the doctrine of the kjv would be tantamount to rejecting the testimony of the Holy Ghost concerning salvation.

And if a person does that, how shall he be saved?
 
justbyfaith said:
And that you ought to consider this as a claim. For if it is a true claim, then rejecting the doctrine of the kjv would be tantamount to rejecting the testimony of the Holy Ghost concerning salvation.
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Are you KJV only?
 
justbyfaith said:
I know what the argument is (that it is baptism because of the remission of sins and not for them) but reject it.
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Nope this is not my argument, You do not know anything

I believe that the kjv is inspired and inerrant as concerning doctrine.

And it is your prerogative to reject this as a premise; however, I would say I believe that the premise in itself is an aspect of the narrow way that leads to life (Matthew 7:13-14).

And that you ought to consider this as a claim. For if it is a true claim, then rejecting the doctrine of the kjv would be tantamount to rejecting the testimony of the Holy Ghost concerning salvation.

And if a person does that, how shall he be saved?
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so since you think the KJV is innerant and perfect.

You will risk going to hell and not check into the greek to see what is actually spoken of.

This is the danger of cult mentality
 
justbyfaith said:
I consider myself to be kjv-superior.

I consider that the NLT is good as an easy-to-read translation, and that one can gain added insight into the meaning of the word by reading it.
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You mean you consider the KJV to be superior?

I do not have the KJV as my main go to. I do delve into it to compare it to other versions that I have.
 
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justbyfaith said:
No, baptism is not a work; just like confessing Jesus with your mouth is not a work.
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Water baptism is a work of righteousness.

If it is done to earn salvation. It is self righteousness and will be rejected by God

You better pray for the baptism of the spirit my friend. For that is the only thing that will save you
 
eternally-gratefull said:
Nope this is not my argument, You do not know anything
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By all means declare unto us your argument then.

eternally-gratefull said:
so since you think the KJV is innerant and perfect.

You will risk going to hell and not check into the greek to see what is actually spoken of.

This is the danger of cult mentality
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It is a cult mentality to trust the amateur Greek and Hebrew scholar to tell a man what the scriptures REALLY MEAN.

I believe that God gave His unadulterated message to the common people; who receive Jesus gladly; in their own language.

While the "educated" scribe and Pharisees (Greek and Hebrew scholars) are mor inclined to reject Him.

eternally-gratefull said:
Water baptism is a work of righteousness.

If it is done to earn salvation. It is self righteousness and will be rejected by God
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Nope. it is a condition for a promise to receive remission of sins and the promise of the Holy Ghost. it is not done to earn salvation, there is no work involved in going underneath the water. The person doing so is completely passive. They merely surrender to God's method of bringing them the Holy Ghost.
 
justbyfaith said:
By all means declare unto us your argument then.



It is a cult mentality to trust the amateur Greek and Hebrew scholar to tell a man what the scriptures REALLY MEAN.

I believe that God gave His unadulterated message to the common people; who receive Jesus gladly; in their own language.

While the "educated" scribe and Pharisees (Greek and Hebrew scholars) are mor inclined to reject Him.



Nope. it is a condition for a promise to receive remission of sins and the promise of the Holy Ghost. it is not done to earn salvation, there is no work involved in going underneath the water. The person doing so is completely passive. They merely surrender to God's method of bringing them the Holy Ghost.
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So a person is not saved by being baptised?
 
justbyfaith said:
By all means declare unto us your argument then.



It is a cult mentality to trust the amateur Greek and Hebrew scholar to tell a man what the scriptures REALLY MEAN.

I believe that God gave His unadulterated message to the common people; who receive Jesus gladly; in their own language.

While the "educated" scribe and Pharisees (Greek and Hebrew scholars) are mor inclined to reject Him.



Nope. it is a condition for a promise to receive remission of sins and the promise of the Holy Ghost. it is not done to earn salvation, there is no work involved in going underneath the water. The person doing so is completely passive. They merely surrender to God's method of bringing them the Holy Ghost.
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Nope it is not.

In proper language it is done BECAUSE ONE HAS RECIEVED REMISSION OF SIN.

Even john the baptist taught a baptism of repentance. but demanded prove one has repented and reciewved it before he would baptise them.

Its not cult mentality. Your doing what God demanded and testing each spirit. If you want to blindly follow an english interpretation. thats on you
 
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